What Will We Carry Into the Afterlife?

[Trailblazer]

Why create a false belief first and then try to find support or destroy it.
For what reason are you creating your Allah? If it is creation of universe or living beings, science has told us so many things. 'Goddidit' does not answer anything.

I did not create Allah. Allah is self-existent.
I never said that creation was a legitimate reason to believe in God.

Why do you think so? I would have had no hesitation to die for my country (I did not join Armed forces because of my physical disability - vision).

Obviously, not all atheists are the same.

No, you cannot live in any way which disturbs others in the society. You cannot blare music in the middle of night. You cannot throw rubbish on roads. There are regulations about things in society and you have to follow them.

I never said I can do anything I want to if it is against the law or if it bothers other people and I never said I should not try to contribute to society. I only ever said that society makes no demands upon me. I could live however I wanted to if I was not a believer in God, because I would have nobody to answer to now or at the end of the road.

 

[The Anointed]

Why create a false belief first and then try to find support or destroy it.
For what reason are you creating your Allah? If it is creation of universe or living beings, science has told us so many things. 'Goddidit' does not answer anything.
Why do you think so? I would have had no hesitation to die for my country (I did not join Armed forces because of my physical disability - vision).
No, you cannot live in any way which disturbs others in the society. You cannot blare music in the middle of night. You cannot throw rubbish on roads. There are regulations about things in society and you have to follow them.

Trailblazer, you are too immature. You do not know what you are writing. That is why I am able to find faults in what you write.

So, which of the many differing scientific theories as to the creation of the universe do you believe by faith and faith alone, because none of the many theories have been proven beyond any shadow of a doubt?

Cosmological theories are formulated by scientists, and theories by definition, are the unproven hypothesis, suppositions, and opinions of those scientists, who are prone to change their minds, leaving those who believed by faith alone, the original theory of those particular scientists, standing out on a shaky limb.

There are as many, if not more scientific theories as to the origin of our universe, as there are differing religious bodies, such as Christianity, Hindu, Abrahamic, Muslim, etc.

Here is but one of many theories as to the creation of our three-dimensional universe. This one is by Niayesh Afshordi, an astrophysicist with Perimeter Institute for Theoretical Physics in Canada, who proposes that our three-dimensional universe floats as a membrane in a “bulk universe” that has four dimensions and that the “Bulk Universe” has four dimensional stars, which go through the same life cycles as our three-dimensional stars.

The most massive ones explode as supernovae, and their central core collapses into a black hole, like in our universe---only in four-dimension. The four-dimensional black hole has its own four dimensional “Event Horizon,” the boundary between the inside and the outside of a black hole.

In a three-dimensional universe, the event horizon appears to be two dimensional. In a four-dimensional universe, it appears to be three dimensional. The four-dimensional black hole, then blows apart, with the leftover material forming a three-dimensional membrane surrounding a three dimensional event horizon, which expands---and is essentially our universe.

So, according to the theory proposed by Niayesh Afshordi, our universe is the vomited-up guts of a fourth dimensional black hole. The expansion of the event horizon explains our universe's expansion; the fact that its creation stems from another 4D universe explains the weird temperature uniformity.

Perhaps you believe the Big Bang theory, or the constant state theory. it would be interesting to know which of the scientific theories that you believe by faith and faith alone?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Take time to be alone. Meditate profoundly and pray daily. Focus on serving your community and contributing to the betterment of the world.
You are not a body with a soul. You are a soul that temporarily has an association with a body.............

I find that Adam too was a soul, a living soul according to Genesis 2:7.
At death Adam became a dead soul or a life-less soul because the soul ( person) that sins dies - Ezekiel 18:4,20.
Dead Adam simply ' returned ' to where he started, the dust of the ground - Genesis 3:19.
Due to inherited imperfection from father Adam we have association with our dying body.
If Adam had never broken God's law he would have had an eternal body, a forever healthy body, and so would we.
Since we are innocent of what Adam did is why God sent his Son to Earth to balance the Scales of Justice for us.
Meaning: God will undo all the damage Satan and Adam brought upon us.
The majority of people will have the same offer, the same opportunity that was originally offered to Adam before his downfall to live forever on Earth.
For ' enemy death ' will be No more on Earth according to 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8.

 

[Thief]

I received this article in my e-mail a few days ago and I loved the simplicity of it, so I wanted to share it.

Baha’u’llah further explained that “the soul is a sign of God, a heavenly gem whose reality the most learned of men hath failed to grasp, and whose mystery no mind, however acute, can ever hope to unravel. It is the first among all created things to declare the excellence of its Creator, the first to recognize His glory, to cleave to His truth, and to bow down in adoration before Him. If it be faithful to God, it will reflect His light, and will, eventually, return unto Him. If it fail, however, in its allegiance to its Creator, it will become a victim to self and passion, and will, in the end, sink in their depths.”

Take time to be alone. Meditate profoundly and pray daily. Focus on serving your community and contributing to the betterment of the world. You are not a body with a soul. You are a soul that temporarily has an association with a body.

https://bahaiteachings.org/what-will-we-carry-into-the-afterlife?

I like the post....

but answering to the title.....we take with us
the manner that we think and feel
the manner of which we dream

and end up alongside others who do likewise

 

[Thief]

"What Will We Carry Into the Afterlife?"

A clean slate.

a spiritual lobotomy?

I think not

 

[The Anointed]

I find that Adam too was a soul, a living soul according to Genesis 2:7.
At death Adam became a dead soul or a life-less soul because the soul ( person) that sins dies - Ezekiel 18:4,20.
Dead Adam simply ' returned ' to where he started, the dust of the ground - Genesis 3:19.
Due to inherited imperfection from father Adam we have association with our dying body.
If Adam had never broken God's law he would have had an eternal body, a forever healthy body, and so would we.
Since we are innocent of what Adam did is why God sent his Son to Earth to balance the Scales of Justice for us.
Meaning: God will undo all the damage Satan and Adam brought upon us.
The majority of people will have the same offer, the same opportunity that was originally offered to Adam before his downfall to live forever on Earth.
For ' enemy death ' will be No more on Earth according to 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8.

The majority of people will have the same offer, the same opportunity that was originally offered to Adam before his downfall to live forever in their new spiritual bodies.

For ' enemy death ' will be No more for those who inherit the new spiritual bodies, according to 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8.
​

1 Corinthians 15: 42; This is how it will be when the dead are raised to life. When the body is buried, it is mortal; when raised, it will be immortal. 43When buried, it is ugly and weak; when raised, it will be beautiful and strong. 44When buried, it is a physical body; when raised, it will be a spiritual body. There is, of course, a physical body, so there has to be a spiritual body.

45For the scripture says, “The first man, Adam, was created a living being”; but the last Adam is the life-giving Spirit. 46It is not the spiritual that comes first, but the physical, and then the spiritual. 47The first Adam, made of earth, came from the earth; the second Adam came from heaven. 48Those who belong to the earth are like the one who was made of earth; those who are of heaven are like the one who came from heaven. 49Just as we wear the likeness of the man made of earth, so we will wear the likeness of the Man from heaven.

50What I mean, brothers and sisters, is that what is made of flesh and blood cannot share in God's Kingdom, and what is mortal cannot possess immortality.

51-52 Listen to this secret truth: we shall not all die, but when the last trumpet sounds, we shall all be changed in an instant, as quickly as the blinking of an eye. For when the trumpet sounds, the dead will be raised, never to die again, and we shall all be changed. 53For what is mortal must be changed into what is immortal; what will die must be changed into what cannot die. 54So when this takes place, and the mortal has been changed into the immortal, then the scripture will come true: “Death is destroyed; victory is complete!”

55 “Where, Death, is your victory?
Where, Death, is your power to hurt?”
56Death gets its power to hurt from sin, and sin gets its power from the Law. 57But thanks be to God who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ!

Only after we have received our new incorruptible bodies of brilliant and blinding light, and enter into the promised kingdom of God, which flesh and blood cannot enter, will death, 'The Ruler of this World' be defeated.

Jesus said to his beloved disciple John in Revelation 3: 21; "To those who win the victory I will give the right to sit beside me on my throne, just as I have been victorious and now sit by my Father on his throne."

 

[Trailblazer]

I like the post....

but answering to the title.....we take with us
the manner that we think and feel
the manner of which we dream

and end up alongside others who do likewise

Yes, that is what Baha'is believe, that we will end up with others who think and feel as we do, those souls that are of the same grade and station.

“The people of Bahá, who are the inmates of the Ark of God, are, one and all, well aware of one another’s state and condition, and are united in the bonds of intimacy and fellowship. Such a state, however, must depend upon their faith and their conduct. They that are of the same grade and station are fully aware of one another’s capacity, character, accomplishments and merits. They that are of a lower grade, however, are incapable of comprehending adequately the station, or of estimating the merits, of those that rank above them. Each shall receive his share from thy Lord. Blessed is the man that hath turned his face towards God, and walked steadfastly in His love, until his soul hath winged its flight unto God, the Sovereign Lord of all, the Most Powerful, the Ever-Forgiving, the All-Merciful.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 170

 

[The Anointed]

Continued from post #66.

From the Dictionary of all Scripture and Myths.
“The Kabbala describes four Adams, the two highest of which are Celestial and spiritual.

The third Adam is the terrestrial Adam made of dust, and placed in the Garden of Edan. This Adam was also an androgene. . . . . It had, when first created a glorious simulacrum or Light body, and answers to the Yetzeeratic World”-----Ibid, p, 418.

The Fourth Adam was the Third Adam as he was after the fall, when he was clothed with animal skin, flesh, nerves, etc. This answers to the lower Nephesh and Guff, i.e. body united. He has the animal power of reproduction and continuous of species, and also answers to the Aseeyatic world, but in him is some of the light of all the preceding Adams----- ibid, p, 418.

The third Adam was an immortal spiritual being until his fall from grace, when he was cast down to the earth and clothed with animal skin, flesh, muscles, and nerves, etc. As a mortal physical being, but in him is some of the light of all the preceding Adams.​

 

[PearlSeeker]

Continued from post #66.

From the Dictionary of all Scripture and Myths.
“The Kabbala describes four Adams, the two highest of which are Celestial and spiritual.

The third Adam is the terrestrial Adam made of dust, and placed in the Garden of Edan. This Adam was also an androgene. . . . . It had, when first created a glorious simulacrum or Light body, and answers to the Yetzeeratic World”-----Ibid, p, 418.

The Fourth Adam was the Third Adam as he was after the fall, when he was clothed with animal skin, flesh, nerves, etc. This answers to the lower Nephesh and Guff, i.e. body united. He has the animal power of reproduction and continuous of species, and also answers to the Aseeyatic world, but in him is some of the light of all the preceding Adams----- ibid, p, 418.

The third Adam was an immortal spiritual being until his fall from grace, when he was cast down to the earth and clothed with animal skin, flesh, muscles, and nerves, etc. As a mortal physical being, but in him is some of the light of all the preceding Adams.​

As I understand first Adam is a concept.

Adam Kadmon - Wikipedia

 

[Thief]

As I understand first Adam is a concept.

Adam Kadmon - Wikipedia

I soooooo often post
Someone had to be First in mind and heart

not so often
Someone had to be first to walk with God

the first to walk this earth had no name that we know of
God created Man...male and female
no garden
no law
no names
go forth, be fruitful, multiply...….dominate all things

Man as a species.....Day Six

THEN Chapter Two
and Adam as a chosen son of God

 

[PearlSeeker]

That is also what my religion teaches, but it teaches that the most important knowledge we can have is the knowledge of God and knowledge of our inmost true self.

It's called gnosis in Christianity.

 

[PearlSeeker]

All that we can take with us, are our memories.

If reincarnation is true many memories are lost or veiled.

 

[The Anointed]

If reincarnation is true many memories are lost or veiled.

The operative word, being 'IF'

 

[viole]

Baha’u’llah further explained that “the soul is a sign of God, a heavenly gem whose reality the most learned of men hath failed to grasp, and whose mystery no mind, however acute, can ever hope to unravel. It is the first among all created things to declare the excellence of its Creator, the first to recognize His glory, to cleave to His truth, and to bow down in adoration before Him. If it be faithful to God, it will reflect His light, and will, eventually, return unto Him. If it fail, however, in its allegiance to its Creator, it will become a victim to self and passion, and will, in the end, sink in their depths.”

Except that this reasoning is circular, since it assumes the existence of souls in the premise. A bit like saying that cryptonite is a sign of Superman.

Ciao

- viole

 

[Trailblazer]

Except that this reasoning is circular, since it assumes the existence of souls in the premise. A bit like saying that cryptonite is a sign of Superman.

Ciao

- viole

The existence if souls cannot be proven, as it is a religious belief.
Do you know what you can do with your logic?

 

[URAVIP2ME]

The existence if souls cannot be proven, as it is a religious belief....................

Interesting ^ above ^ because the existence of souls is a religious belief, and that biblical Adam 'became a living soul' as per Genesis 2:7.
Adam did Not have a soul, Adam did Not possess a soul, rather all of Adam was a soul, a person.
Adam was formed, fashioned from the existing dust of the ground, and Not until his Creator breathed the 'breath of life' into life-less Adam did Adam come alive.
The ' breath of life ' was breathed into Adam, so No invisible soul was breathed into Adam.
Thus, at death Adam ' returned ' to the dust, 'returned ' to non-life - Genesis 3:19. Adam became a dead soul, a life-less soul.
No post-mortem penalty for dead Adam, No double jeopardy for dead Adam, just returning to where Adam started from: the dust of the ground.
A person, a soul, can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before. So, in Scripture, like Adam, souls are mortal persons and souls can die and return to dust.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

The majority of people will have the same offer, the same opportunity that was originally offered to Adam before his downfall to live forever in their new spiritual bodies.
For ' enemy death ' will be No more for those who inherit the new spiritual bodies, according to 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8.​

1 Corinthians 15: 42; This is how it will be when the dead are raised to life. When the body is buried, it is mortal; when raised, it will be immortal. 43When buried, it is ugly and weak; when raised, it will be beautiful and strong. 44When buried, it is a physical body; when raised, it will be a spiritual body. There is, of course, a physical body, so there has to be a spiritual body.
45For the scripture says, “The first man, Adam, was created a living being”; but the last Adam is the life-giving Spirit. 46It is not the spiritual that comes first, but the physical, and then the spiritual. 47The first Adam, made of earth, came from the earth; the second Adam came from heaven. 48Those who belong to the earth are like the one who was made of earth; those who are of heaven are like the one who came from heaven. 49Just as we wear the likeness of the man made of earth, so we will wear the likeness of the Man from heaven.
50What I mean, brothers and sisters, is that what is made of flesh and blood cannot share in God's Kingdom, and what is mortal cannot possess immortality.
51-52 Listen to this secret truth: we shall not all die, but when the last trumpet sounds, we shall all be changed in an instant, as quickly as the blinking of an eye. For when the trumpet sounds, the dead will be raised, never to die again, and we shall all be changed. 53For what is mortal must be changed into what is immortal; what will die must be changed into what cannot die. 54So when this takes place, and the mortal has been changed into the immortal, then the scripture will come true: “Death is destroyed; victory is complete!”
55 “Where, Death, is your victory?
Where, Death, is your power to hurt?”
56Death gets its power to hurt from sin, and sin gets its power from the Law. 57But thanks be to God who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ!
Only after we have received our new incorruptible bodies of brilliant and blinding light, and enter into the promised kingdom of God, which flesh and blood cannot enter, will death, 'The Ruler of this World' be defeated.
Jesus said to his beloved disciple John in Revelation 3: 21; "To those who win the victory I will give the right to sit beside me on my throne, just as I have been victorious and now sit by my Father on his throne."

I do Not disagree with chapter 15 of 1st Corinthians, what I find is 1st Corinthians is Not written to just everyone.
Both letters to the Corinthians are addressed to specific persons. Please notice 1 Corinthians 1:1 and 2 Corinthians 1:1.
Paul is writing to those brothers who are like the people of Daniel 7:18 the ' saints' or 'holy ones'.
These people are like the ones Jesus was addressing at Luke 22:28-30.

First, No one who died before Jesus died was offered Heaven (John 3:13). None who are listed in the 11th chapter of Hebrews.
They did Not know who Messiah would be, so there was No opportunity to put faith in Jesus.
So, they are Not part of the first or earlier resurrection of Revelation 20:6.
Rather, they have a future or later resurrection as Luke speaks about at Acts of the Apostles 24:15.

As for the living people who are judged as being ' sheep ' at the coming time of Matthew 25:31-33,37 they are living persons on Earth.
The figurative 'sheep' are Not Jesus' ' brothers' of Matthew 25:40.
The living do No go to Heaven, so those living 'sheep' humble meek people will inherit, Not Heaven, but inherit the Earth - Psalms 37:9-11.
The 'sheep' will be the foundation of living people staring with calendar Day One of Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.
The 'sheep' will be here to welcome back the resurrected dead who are Not called to Heaven, who are Not the saints or holy ones.
These people are offered 'everlasting life on a beautiful paradisical Earth' as was originally offered to Adam before his downfall.
The majority of people can gain eternal life right here on Earth.
This is why we are all invited to pray the invitation of Rev. 22:20 for Jesus to come!
Come and undo all the damage right here on Earth that Satan and Adam brought upon humanity.
Undo damage to the point that even ' enemy death ' will be No more on Earth - 1 Corinthians 15:26; Isaiah 25:8 ; Revelation 22:2.

 

[Trailblazer]

Interesting ^ above ^ because the existence of souls is a religious belief, and that biblical Adam 'became a living soul' as per Genesis 2:7.
Adam did Not have a soul, Adam did Not possess a soul, rather all of Adam was a soul, a person.
Adam was formed, fashioned from the existing dust of the ground, and Not until his Creator breathed the 'breath of life' into life-less Adam did Adam come alive.
The ' breath of life ' was breathed into Adam, so No invisible soul was breathed into Adam.
Thus, at death Adam ' returned ' to the dust, 'returned ' to non-life - Genesis 3:19. Adam became a dead soul, a life-less soul.
No post-mortem penalty for dead Adam, No double jeopardy for dead Adam, just returning to where Adam started from: the dust of the ground.
A person, a soul, can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before. So, in Scripture, like Adam, souls are mortal persons and souls can die and return to dust.

Like I said, the existence of souls is a religious belief and as such different religions have different beliefs about the soul, what it is, when it comes into existence, and what its functions are. Regarding the soul, I believe that the Bible has been misinterpreted by Christians, thus Christians do not understand what the soul is. In addition, more scriptures have been revealed by God since the Bible was written explaining what the soul is, when it comes into existence, and what its functions are. Below is what I believe about the soul according to the Baha'i Faith.

The soul comes into being at the moment of conception and it animates the human body. The body needs a soul or it cannot live, but the soul does not need a body, so it continues to exist after the body dies. The body is destructible and temporary so eventually it dies; the soul is indestructible and eternal so it lives forever in the spiritual world.

Let me try to explain what I meant about the soul’s functions as briefly as possible. The soul (spirit) cannot be perceived in the material world, except as it is expressed in outward signs and works. The human body is visible, the soul is invisible. Nevertheless, it is the soul that directs human faculties. As outer circumstances are communicated to the soul by the eyes, ears, and brain, the soul communicates its desires through the brain to the physical body, which thereby expresses itself.

The soul is the sum total of the personality so it is the person himself; the physical body is pure matter with no real identity. The person, after he dies and leaves his physical body behind remains the same person, and he goes to the spiritual world where he continues the life he conducted in the physical world. The soul takes on some kind of a spiritual form made up of elements that exist in the spiritual world.

What I believe happens to the body and soul (spirit) when we die was explained by this passage written by a Christian. He refers to the soul as the spirit, but the words soul and spirit have the same meaning in this context of this passage.:

421. When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world that correspond to the spirit’s thoughts and affections, which the spirit has from the spiritual world, man is said to die. This takes place when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease. But the man does not die; he is merely separated from the bodily part that was of use to him in the world, while the man himself continues to live. It is said that the man himself continues to live since man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life.
Heaven and Hell, p. 351

You said: "A person, a soul, can Not ' return ' to a place he never was before. So, in Scripture, like Adam, souls are mortal persons and souls can die and return to dust."

According to my beliefs the soul was given to us by God so when we die the soul returns to God. This is congruent with what it says in the Bible; although it says the spirit shall return unto God, spirit and soul are synonymous in the context of this verse.

Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

After the physical body dies, it ceases to exist and returns to dust because it has served its purpose. As the passage above says:

"man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life."

As such, it is the spirit (soul) that is resurrected to eternal life, not the physical body, for a body without a spirit (soul) cannot live and thus serves no function.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

According to my beliefs the soul was given to us by God so when we die the soul returns to God. This is congruent with what it says in the Bible; although it says the spirit shall return unto God, spirit and soul are synonymous in the context of this verse.
Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
After the physical body dies, it ceases to exist and returns to dust because it has served its purpose. As the passage above says:
"man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life."
As such, it is the spirit (soul) that is resurrected to eternal life, not the physical body, for a body without a spirit (soul) cannot live and thus serves no function.

In Scripture, the soul that sins dies (Ezekiel 18:4, 20) sinner Adam ( who was a living soul - Gen. 2:7) at death became a dead soul or life-less soul.
I read nothing at Ecclesiastes 12:7 that says the spirit travels up to Heaven.
Rather, one's spirit (IT) returns to God. So, just as a foreclosed house does Not move or go anywhere but simply ' returns ' to the hands of the owner.
So, any future life prospect now lies in God's hands via resurrection.
Thus, God's spirit (IT) has to added back to our human spirit (IT) and with breath in order to receive life again.
In this case God is the owner of "IT" our spirit.
I notice the spirit "IT" was given by God according to Ecc. 12:7 B (IT}
Spirit is a neuter "IT" and not a person.
So, it is No wonder Ecclesiastes 9:5 informs us that the dead know nothing.
Nothing but 'sleep' according to Jesus at John 11:11-14; and Isaiah 38:18; Psalms 115:17

 

[viole]

The existence if souls cannot be proven, as it is a religious belief.
Do you know what you can do with your logic?

i don’t know. Probably what you should do, too

ciao

- viole