• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

What was thought to be bible inconsistencies was really misunderstandings,I explain

God is love

Active Member
I started this project of investigating so called "bible inconsistencies" about a month ago and I finally finished it so now I can post my findings.

I address the issues, what appears to be "inconsistencies" that were on a website,
Donald Morgan's [www.infidels.org] and brought up in debate. The list is about 33 pages, so it would be too much to write here. It was a lot to print. Instead I just address the issues brought up in his list.

Donald Morgan said himself and I Quote "Please keep in mind that by "bible inconsistencies" I do not necessarily mean contradictions." Unquote.


If a person does not know how to interpret what is written, {for example} because of the language of the time that sometimes has a different meaning when compared to the language of today or doesn't read what is happening at the moment {what is written around the scripture, the verse above or below or other verses within the chapter},or isn't aware of verses in another chapters or books of the bible that would explain that verse, then possibly, a person would misinterpret because of a misunderstanding.

The best way to test rationalizations that explain what is written , to know they are correct, is to compare that rationalization with truth that is already apparent. It really only makes appropraiate sense to test whether a rational is true by what is already known to be true.

As he states "problems {in interpretation} may exist given {what you allow to be} assumptions."

Donald Morgan also says and I quote "It should be kept in mind that a perfect and omnipotent God could, should and likely would see to it that such problems did not exist in a book which s/he had inspired." That is true and that is why God has provided information within that chapter or another chapter or other book that would explain His rational. He has provided truths within the scriptures that are discernable either by reading and study or through the Holy Spirit which magnifies truth and reveals it to our understanding. Thereby helping us to discern it. These truths are given to enable us to discern other truth. They also help to discern what is false. These are what we measure truth by to see is it measures up. The only want you can confirm truth is through the Holy Spirit.

truth does not contradict itself. Truth is in agreement with other truths. Truths are by their nature harmonious with other truths. Truths in the spirit world are joined together into unified truth. Truth doesn't change due to time or circumstances, Truth continues.
However truths are discovered in time due to circumstances. For example, in our constitution, laws have been added as circumstances required.

I begin with Genesis and progress all the way to Revelation. That is how the list was organized and I like order.

There are some issues that involve the personality of God and I address those apart from those involving historical events in history. First I address the history then the personality of God. There are some issues about particular principles that are not just a part of histrory but principles that would relate to today so those also are addressed after history and God's personality.


On the first day He {God} caused a darkness to come upon the face of the deep {water vapor in the atmosphere}. Since He caused darkness to come upon an area of the universe {vast amount of space}, where there was a void, there must have been light before the darkness. The reason is because He had to cause a darkness in that void and because God lives in light and He radiates light. 2 Peter 1:5 "God is light"
James 1.17 " ...The Father of lights..." Acts 9:3 "...a light from heaven..."
Psalms 74:16 "The day is thine, the night also is thine, thou hast prepared the light and the sun." Revelation 22.5 "and there shall be no night there and they need no candle, neither light of the sun, for the Lord God giveth them light...."
2 Corinthiansr 4.6 "For God who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ."

God caused a darkness to come upon that area of space, where He planned to create this earth, so that there would be a nightime. It would be a way to measure time. Then He said let there be light. He didn't make the light, it already existed but having caused darkness to be for some time {night time}, He was 'letting" or allowing light to come for some time {day time}, during the 24 hours we call "a day". He said , let there be light here for some time during that 24 hour time. After darkness, He divided the light and day so there would be a measure of time.

On the fourth day He said "Let there be lights in the firmament to give light upon the earth." He made the moon and stars and sun to be the lights to shine on earth. These would be the source of light. that would divide day and night. He {in a way, the only way I know how to describe it without a astronomer's degree}, concentrated some of the light of heaven that already existed into a condensed form and made the "greater light", the sun with it. then he made the moon, the "lesser light", the moon, which merely reflects the light of the sun. He also made the stars and these are the signs that distinguish day and night time. The amount of sunlight upon the earth distinguish the seasons.

More about creation,
the issue about trees being created before or after Adam and other creation issues.

God is love

Active Member
Creation, trees and sea cretures, encouraging multiplication

Trees were created before Adam and after God created Adam, God planted a garden. After planting the garden, He placed Adam there. Planting {by definition, regarding a garden} is planting seeds in the ground. Seeds that are from plants that have produced them. These are plants that obviously have already been created. These seeds eventually developed plants that grew out of the ground. This issue on the list is really about semantics {language}, not about reasonability.

The sea creatures and land animals and those of the air were also created before Adam. God was saying in Genesis 2:19 that He formed {past tense} them and as mentioned in Genesis 1:24 "Let the earth bring forth the living creatures after their kind". In other words, He was letting them create themselves through multiplication, His design that he programmed into them. After creating adam, these creatures were already creating themselves. God was saying that these creatures were being mulitiplied of themselves and He was bringing them forth to Adam, to be named.

In Genesis 2:4 God is summarizing what He has done. The previous verse is "on the seventh day God ended His work." So His work was done. In the next verse, 4 He begins to summarize the work and tells more about the creation of Adam and Eve. This account of creatrion was given to Moses and Moses was elaborating , giving more detail, of what was already written.

God encourages humnan multiplication.

These are statements from "latterday prophets" who give insight into the mind of God.
1. Quote "Parenthood and particularly motherhood should be held as a sacred obligation. Without children or without believing that children are important, marriage is incomplete and unfulfilled."

2. Quote "Motherhood is the highest, holiest service to be assumed by mankind."

3. Quote "We are under divine comkmandment to multiply and replenish and to bring up our children in light and truth."

4. Quote "A mother's role is God ordained. Mother's are to conceive, bear, nourish, love and train"

5. Quote "The bearing and rearing of children is the highest of all human duties."

6. Quote "No loftier duty than this can be assumed by mortals"

7. Quote "Motherhood thus becomes a Holy calling, a sacred dedication, for carrying out the Lord's plans..."

Jesus speaks of treasures in heaven Matthew 6:20 "lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven..." A "latter day" prophet has said "Your sons and daughters that you have raised to honor God and keep His comandments will be treasures in heaven."

The purification rites following childbirth is not implying that the natural functions of the body such as child birth {which God designed} are inherently evil. This section of the Levitical law includes "the expulsion of fluids" {sorry, but Donald Morgan brought it up}
after birth. When a woman is menstuating there is blood being expelled. This has an unclean or unsanitary effect and therefore they were "unfit to do sacred ordinances". Remember they didn't have sanitary napkins then or tampons in those days. This Levitical law also applied to those who had infections.

Perhapps there was less of a waiting period after a male child because of the rite of circumcision that should be performed at a certain time at the Temple.. The woman would have to be at the Temple to present the the male infant at the Temple.

How Adam's transgression caused mortality, Why Abel's offering was preferred and Noah's pity over the wickness of his time.


Well-Known Member
As it was explained to me, traditionally, the laws regarding menstruation were in recognition of the missed chance of conception and the laws regarding the waiting period after birth were due to the woman need a period of rest. Before the birth, she was full of her life and that of her child. If the child was a girl, then there was also the potential for yet more life, and it is that abundance of life suddenly leaving that extends the amount of waiting and resting.

God is love

Active Member
How Adam's transgression caused mortality, Why Abel's offering was preferred and Noah's pity over the wickedness of his time

God said to Adam and Eve that "In the day thou eatest {the fuit of that tree} thou shalt surely die" By partaking of the fruit of that tree their bodies became mortal instead of as they were before, immortal, as the creator, God is. Being mortal Adam would eventually die but not at that very moment. He became subject to death. In other words disease or an accident could affect his body, cause death. How could a body be immortal? You may ask.
God has an immortal body and He can create that for others. That is the body we will have when we are resurrected as Jesus was. A resurrected body is made of a substance that is resilient to damage that would otherwise result in an accident and it is resilient to disease.
In making Adam mortal, God removed the defenses.

God did not say that it is wrong to be able to tell good from evil. He was saying that if Adam ate the fruit, he would be mortal. This condition of death is because they would not be ignorant {as a child} as to what is right and what is wrong. Therefore if they did wrong they wouldn't be innoscent when they did it. They would be doing wrong knowingly, knowing it was wrong.

God preferred abel's offering because he brought the firstlings {the first} of his flock and the fat {the extra}. God did not regard Cain's because Cain did not bring the first fruit of the ground." Exodus 23:19 "the first of the first fruits of thy land thou shalt bring into the house of the Lord thy God." This would also apply to flocks. It is a law to offer the first of what you produce to give the best to God. Some of you may be thinking that the law wasn't written till way after Cain and Abel. True, but I'm sure God revealed it to them, Cain and Abel through Adam, otherwise, why would they be making an offering unto God. They must have known the rules then, the rules that would eventually be written in Moses time.

God asking Cain, where his brother is, was to test whether he would be honest.
God knew where Abel was because Abel, {having died} was in the spirit world where God is. God sees all and knows all.

Cain went away from the presence of the Lord. God's Spirit, Holy Spirit, fills heaven and earth. That is how His presence can be felt everwhere. However you have to be worthy to be in His presence and have a desire for good to feel His Spirit.

God is not afar off to those who seek Him, to know Him.

Nobody can hide so as God doesn't see him because God sees all and knows all. Cain thought he could.

Noah's time

God was pleased with His creation but during the time of Noah, "God saw wickedness of man" Genesis 6:5

God is omniscient, all knowing and He doesn't lie. He speaks truth. However, humans are translating, sometimes in ignorance or sometimes careless in transcribing and sometimes it may be intentional to deceive. But God has a way to correct human error and that is through the Holy Spirit, who I would like to call,at this time, our magnifying glass.

The was an error in translation Genesis 6:6 that was corrected in a book that was publised that reveals that proper translations of the King James bible.

The verse should read "It moved Noah to pity the wicked."

the giants in Genesis, Noah's business of bring animals into the ark and the tower of babel that evenyually caused individual langauges.

God is love

Active Member
Who are the Giants, animals embarking the ark, the tower of Babel

The giants in Genesis 6:4 were mighty men. The giants in Numbers 13:33 were sons of Anak. They were not the same giants because those that were in Noah's day were washed away.

Noah was instructed to take two of each kind of unclean animal and to take seven of each clean animal.

As Noah was bringing animals into the ark because God said that after seven days He would cause rain upon the earth and there would be a flood. As Noah brought animals in to the ark, he {Noah} went out of the ark to bring more in. He may have been bringing more animals or supplies in as the rain began to fall and since the rain may have been falling in torrents, there may have been water already accumulated. After seven days the waters of the flood were upon the earth and Noah went into the ark for the final time.

At the time of the tower of Babel, every person had the same language and they had the same desire to build the tower to reach God or heaven which {obvious to us} was impossible. They were a mighty nation. There were many people capable of building so they would continue to build until the tower was destroyed by an act of God, who {i would like to add} was sparing them this futility. God knew they couldn't reach His kingdom that way. He was just stopping the building of an impractical building {tower}. Otherwise they would not cease building it.

About "confounding" the language. If they couldn't communicate they wouldn't attempt to build it again. Eventually they would migrate to other parts of the earth, thereby populating other areas. This was better than having everybody crowded together.

As a result, this dispersion created the diversity of culture that so fasinates me.
I love Europe.

God was not sowing discord. The Lord hates discord.
Proverbs 6:16-19
Verse 16 "These six things doth the Lord hate..."
Verse 19 " he that soweth discord among brethren"
One of the definitions of confound at "Dictionary.Com" is to "mix up"
It was not to cause contention. Contention did not happen. There wasn't a massive war following the mix up, they just scattered.
Genesis 11:8 "So the Lord scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth and they left off {ceased} building the city."

It is better that their language be mixed up then they be mixed up about god.

I Corinthians 14:33 "For God is not the author of confusion but of peace as in all churchs of the saints."

Ephesians 4:3 and 5-6
"Endeavoring to keep the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace. One Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is above all and through all {with His Holy Spirit}."

It says in Genesis 10:3
"Everyone after the same tongue {dialect}"
This does not mean that not having the same language, they can't have or keep a unity of God's Spirit or have a bond of peace.

You can have unity, one heart and mind {that is the same thoughts and feelings, understandings and intentions} and have peace with those of other races and nationalities, those that share the same doctrines and faith and live the same principles. In addition, we are able to have peace and keep the peace with those who don't share the same doctrines but live the same principles. We should be able to live peaceably with those who don't share either but they have to live at least the "Golden Principle" of doing unto others as you would want done unto you. A society would not be able to be civil if it didn't live at least that principle.

After all, that is why the United Nations was established, to keep the peace.

Some issues about Abraham, God's Covenant with Abraham, Abraham's sacrifice was a similtude of the savior.

I will try to answer any questions on this post {as I have said before} next week. I will respond to those within this thread.

God is love

Active Member
Abraham marries half sister, Abraham's two sons, God's Covenant with Abraham. more

Abraham marries his half sister

Abraham says that Sarah is the daughter of my father but not my mother. Sarah became Abraham's wife.

In Genesis 14:14 Lot, Abraham's nephew is called his brother. In those days, the words brother and sister were often used for other blood relatives. Abraham and Sarah's father, Haran were brothers. Therefore Sarah was Abraham's niece. In Levitical law it mentions "taking" It doesn't use the word marriage. Taking was like "knowing, in the biblical sense" but not marrying before "knowing". Abraham married Sarah. Marrying your half sister was accepted in those days. Matthew 22:24 "Moses said, if a man die, having no children, his brother shall marry his wife and raise up seed unto his brother."

Abraham had two sons. One named Ishmael through the bond maid and another Isaac through his wife Sarah. Isaac was his only begotten through his wife Sarah.

Heavenly Father offered up His only begotten Son as he was asking Abraham to do as a similtude but Heavenly Father would not approve of Abraham killing his son in reality. Heavenly Father just was asking if he would be willing to. This was symbolic of what Heavenly Father would eventually do, that is offer up His only begotten Son to save the world.

John 3:16 " God {Heavenly Father, in this case} so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should have everlasting life."
Heavenly Father was willing to offer His beloved Son, Jesus Christ as a sacrifice, to make an atonement for everbody's sins, to make it possible, with repentance, to live
with Him. He was giving up His Son, {in a manner of speaking} to gain us.
Jesus agreed to do this. Abraham's willingness to make this sacrifice was a similtude of Heavenly Father's.

The covenant is everlasting but circumcision as a sign of the covenant was discontinued. The prime purpose of the token was to serve as a reminder of God's covenant.

God's covenant with Abraham and his seed after him, in their generations, is to be a God unto him and his descendants. God also made a covenant to multiply his descendants. Abraham would be a father of many nations.

Following the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ, the gospel and it's blessing was for all, not just the Jews. In other words, God is a God unto the gentiles, all the house of Israel, and all humanity.

The personal covenant that God made with Abraham was that the land of Caanan
{which includes Jerusalem} would be Abraham's descendant's everlasting possession.
God promised Abraham the land of Canaan as an everlasting possession to him and his descendants. At that time as this time, it was already partially occupied by others. God said to Abraham that He would give a land wherein thou art a stranger. Abraham was
in the land of Israel and close to Jerusalem when, he {Abraham} was directed by God to the dome of the rock. This place is on the Temple mount in Jerusalem. Although now as then, Abraham's descendents are strangers there. There will be a time they will not be strangers in the land of Israel. The land will be as promised to Abraham their land forever.

God did not tempt Abraham. The proper translation of Genesis 22:1 is
"and it came to pass after these things that God did try Abraham and said unto him,
Abraham and Abraham said, Behold, here I am."

God did not tempt Moses. The scriptures say in Deuteronomy 8:2
"and thou shalt remember all the way which the Lord thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee and to prove thee, to know what is in thine heart, whether thou wouldst keep His commandments or not."

The same was said in Judges 2:22
"That through them I may prove Israel, whether they will keep the way of the Lord to walk therein as their fathers did keep it or not"

1 Corinthians 10:13 says
"God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able {to resist}
but will...make a way to escape..."

It is not God that is tempting, it is the adversary that is tempting people through lust or greed, etc.

James 1:13
"Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God for God cannot be tempted with evil neither He tempteth he any man."

Lot and his near sighted daughters, David and wine, a Nazarite's way of life

God is love

Active Member
Lot and his daughters, David and wine, a Nazarite's life

I overlooked an Abraham issue.

1. Terah lived 70 years and begat Abram {renamed Abraham}. Terah died at 205 years.
Abram left Heran {where his mother died} at 75 before his mother died.

The proper translation of Genesis 18:20-21 is
"and I will send you and ye shall go down now and see their iniquities..."

Lot and his daughters
After Sodom and Gomarrah had been destroyed, Lot dwelt with his daughters in a cave in the mountain. The daughters thought that Lot, their father was the only source of children. The account in the bible says that the firstborn said to the younger "Our father has become old and we have not a man on earth. Therefore let us make our father drink wine..." And they did wickedly and made their father drunk that night and the first born went in and lay with her father...

2 Peter 2:7 says that Lot was just. That is because they sinned against him and {as it is written in scripture} he unknowingly. He was drunk and percieved not they were his daughters. Lot would not have thought in that drunken state or sober that his daughters would have thought of such a thing let alone desire such as was done.

I don't know what kind of wine David was drinking {if what they called wine then was as it is today} but the wine in Genesis and Deuteronomy was a form of fermented grape juice. It wasn't {as i have read} like wine today with alcohole added to it. Some forms were obviously intoxicating as to make Lot drunk but the form that was approved and daily consumed would not have been intoxicating as it would not have been permitted to be drunk. Priests serving in the Temple were not permitted to drink strong {intoxicating} drink.

Lot was decived by his daughters when he drank the wine, thinking it was the approved kind. However it teaches the lesson that he should not have continued to drink because he drank to excess and lost his faculties. His experience shows others who drink to excess and make themselves drunk, cloud their mind and weaken their body. They are making their body vulnerable to accidents and to transgression.

Leviticus 10:9 says "Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou nor thy sons with thee when ye go into the tabernacle..." and Ezekiel 44:21 "Neither shall any priest drink wine when they enter into the inner court"

A Nazarite, a man or woman who seperates themselves onto the Lord to vow a vow.
Jesus was a Nazarite. He made wine but did not drink it at the wedding feast. At the Passover meal, He did not drink, He gave to them to drink and I quote Matthew 26:27 "and He took the cup and GAVE THANKS and GAVE IT TO THEM."
Luke 22:18 "For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until the kingdom of God shall come" In Matthew 26:29 He says "...until the day when I drink it new {not old, not fermented} with you in my Father's Kingdom."
Mark 14:23,25 gives same account as well as Luke 22:17,20 John's record does not the meal itself just what happened afterwards, Jesus washed the apostles feet. The only mention of food was the sop handed to judas.
Numbers 6:3 description of a Nazarene
"He shall seperate himself from wine and strong drink, neither shall he drink any liquor of grape..."

Deuteronomy 32:33 says
"Their wine is the poison of dragons"

Wine is like poison if it intoxicates.

Daniel 1:8
"Daniel purposed in his heart that he would not defile himself with the wine {which the king drank}."

It says in Joel 3:18
"It shall come to pass in that day that the mountains shall drop down new wine and the hills shall flow with milk" Mountains don't produce fermented wine of themselves. Fermented wine is manmade. Therefore this wine is from grapes growing on the mountains, the kind of wine Jesus would drink if He hadn't consecrated himself to be a Nazarite. Jesus had set Himself apart, He had vowed a vow unto His Father, That vow propbably had to do with being a perfect example and making the atonement. As a Nazarite He had to seperate Himself from wine {fruit of the vine} and strong drink {the kind that makes you drunk}.

In Luke 1:15 it reads
"For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb." This is describing John the Baptist, who was also a Nazarite.

Exodus, the token on the houses, the two cherubim of gold on the ark of the covenant,
the high priest that rent his clothes

God is love

Active Member
Exodus begins, the token on the houses, the two cherubim of gold on the ark of the covenant and the high priest that rents his clothes.

I overlooked on more Genesis scripture, Genesis 46:2
God is speaking onto Israel calling him Jacob. Previously God said Jacob's name was to be Israel. God called him him by either name. However he was to be called by others "Israel" and his children, the children of Israel.


First of all, Genesis is the first book of Moses. God was, the Lord, Jehovah was revealing to Moses how He {the Lord, Jehovah} created the earth and so forth. In Exodus 6:2
The Lord is saying to identifu Himself to Moses that " I am the Lord " God also asked a question "and was not my name known unto them"" The question being made a statement is in error, another mistranslation.

Exodus 12:13 It says that the mark on their houses shall be to them a token that God shall see. God doesn't need to see it but the Israelites needed to be obedient and display their obedience. It is also symbolic, a type of the Redeemer, Savior. Those that were obedient were saved by the life giving atoning blood.

God gave the law directly to Moses. The law was added because of transgressions. The proper translation is "The law given to Moses who was ordeained by the hand of angels to be a mediator between God and the children of Israel just like Jesus, the messiah is the mediator now between us and Heavenly Father.

Exodus 20:4-5
"Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above or that is in the earth beneath or that is in the water and shalt not bow down to them."

In Exodus 25:18 God instructs that two cherubims of gold be made which were placed on the lid or covering for the ark of the covenant.

It was also called the "kapporeth" {seat of atonement or mercy seat}. The word cherubim
usually refers to guardians of sacred things. Most scholars agree that these cherubim represented "glorified saints" like angels. The wings represent the power to move and act. In heaven, angels stand as sentinels, guarding the presence of God. It's not that God needs proptection. It's that unworthy people {those that don't believe in Him or those who rebel against Him} are not permitted to near His presence.

These cherubim were made but not worshipped. God did not want any graven image to be made to be worshipped.

Why would man worship a thing he made as if the thing he made were greater than himself. It couldn't be because he made it.

It says in Leviticus 21:10 that the high priest that is consecrated to put on the garments of a high priest shall not rend his clothes.

Matthew 26:65
"Then the high priest rent his clothes saying, He {Jesus}, hath spoken blasphemy, what further need have we of witnesses" A verse before this, verse 63 they ask Jesus to tell them whether He be the Christ {Savior, Messiah, Moshiach, Hebrew word}

The fact that the high priest was breaking a commandment {rule} by rending his sacred garment at the moment he was accusing Jesus, shows that the high priest himself did not have regard for the law or that which was sacred, yet he was accusing Jesus of blasphemy because He wouldn't deny that He was the Messiah.

Levitical law regarding if a soul sin through ignorence, Eunuchs

God is love

Active Member
A soul that sins through ignorence and Eunuchs.

Numbers 15:24-28
"If any soul sin through ignorence then he shall bring a she goat of the first year for a sin offering. The priest shall make an atonement for the soul that sinneth ignorantly to make an atonement for him and it shall be forgiven "

Hebrews 10:11 is talking about priests who offer sacrifices for thier own sins and then for the people. The high priest represents the people and when he sins and makes an atonement he is also making an atonement for their sins. The high priest is symbolic of Jesus the Christ, in that He represented us when He made the atonement. The difference is that He didn't have to make an atonement for himself because Jesus lived a sinless life.
He was and is perfect. Therefore He did not have to offer up a sacrifice for sin.

The statement that these sacrifices which can never take away sin is saying that sacrifices {the shedding of blood} can never take away sin anymore. Jesus Christ has done that for evermore.


Eunuchs were not permitted into the Temple because the Temple sacrifices represented spiritual wholeness. The Temple was to represent spiritual perfection. What we should want to attain.

When a person sinned they blemished themselves spiritually or damaged themselves.
Having to sacrifice an innoscent animal was symbolic {in a way} of killing your own innoscence, goodness. That is why the animal had to be physically whole and without defect or blemish. Those that performed the sacrifices {as written in the law of the time} has to be physically whole as well. This was in keeping with the "spiritual wholeness" symbolism of the temple at that time in history. It was not that a person who was physically damaged was also spiritually damaged. That is absolutely not true. There are many physically damaged people that are more spiritually good than those that are physically whole. For the sake of example, in these latter days, people that have physically imperfect bodies who are spiritually worthy serve in Temples of the Church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints. The Temple ordinances are not the same as those of the old covenant Temple {old testement times}.

I was always bothered by the killing of an innoscent animal because of a person's sins. I love animals, especially those that are harmless and lovable as lambs are. This was God's intention that people would not want to sin if they knew an innoscent animal would have to be harmed because of their sin. They would look upon sin with abhorrence. This should deter people who value life. Those that don't value life would continue to sin But Jesus Christ volunteered to be the everlasting atonement so that no more innoscent animals would be killed because of people's sins.

In Isaiah 56:4-5 Jesus Christ made the final atonement so that animal sacrifices would not have to be made anymore.

No more innoscent lives should be killed. There is no reason to kill an innoscent life.

Eunuchs after the atonement

Eunuchs and strangers, those that are not of the house of Israel, those who had been excluded from Temple service, now will be given as spoken in Isaiah 56:5
within the walls of the Temple, all the blessings of God during the age of restoration which began in 1800's. If they will keep the Sabbath Day holy.

The House of God will be a "House of prayer" for all people.

As mentioned in Isaiah 56:5 "Within the walls of the Temple, all the blessings of God..." Those that were unable to have children will be blessed with them at a future time, if not in this life than in the millenium when all will be made physically whole.

It reads in Matthew 19:12
"That there be eunuchs that made themselves eunuchs for the Kingdom's sake"

God did not tell them to do this nor to cut off a hand if it offends. That is how the writing sounded but it is not what God wants us to literally do.

They made themselves eunuchs because they thought they wouldn't be able to restrain themselves if they lusted. How pathetic ! I think self disciple would be best. Character development.

The medieval knights had a code of conduct that they were able to adhere to and they are a good example of self restraint and respect of women that men can live up to.

More to come next week, Goodnight for now

God is love

Active Member
Starting 2 Samuel

2 Samuel 6:23
The issue was, whose children are whose?

Mereb married Adriel

It says in 2 Samuel 6:23
"Michal brought up for Adriel"

Michal brought up for Adriel {Adriel's} five sons. Perhapps Mereb {the birth mother}
died and Michal {a woman} was like a surragate mother.

2 Samuel 1.2-10,12

Saul was in anguish and wanted to finish his life so he wouldn't feel the agony, the pain he was in. He was probably wounded and the wound caused agonizing pain. When the Amalekite found him, Saul was leaning upon his sword to kill himself. He asked the Amalekite to slay him because he may have been too weak or lacked courage to do it himself although it appeared he had been trying. The Amalekite said that he slew him because he "was sure that Saul could not live after he was fallen which must mean wounded in battle which causes a person to fall.

It says in 1 Chronicles 10:13-14 that Saul died for his transgression which he committed against the Lord, even against the word of God, which he kept not and also asking counsel of one that had an unclean spirit.

God did not kill him, he was killed in the battlefield as a result of his own transgressions that brought him to battle.

1 Samuel 31:3 says
"and the battle went sore against Saul and the archers hit him and he was sore wounded of the archers. The Philistines caused a wound that was fatal. He would have died eventually because of the wound but he was in agony and did not want to die a slow death so he wanted to quicken the time. The Philistines killed saul but the Amalekite made it sooner.

1 Samuel 15:3
"go and smite Amalek and utterly destroy all that they have..."
Earlier in 1 Samuel 15:2 God said
"I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt."

Perhapps God wanted them {the Amelikites} destroyed because they were trying to destroy the Israelites. The Amelikites attacked the Israelites, killing those that were weak and feeble.

To explain how Saul died for his transgression, I'll quote 1 Samuel 15:9

In 1 Samuel 15:9, Saul spared Agag and the best animals. He should not have killed to get gain. God in 15:11 says {with the proper translation} "I have set up Saul to be a king and he repenteth not that he hath sinned..." Saul was willing to sacrifice the animals unto God but God said through the prophet Samuel "Hath the Lord as great delight in burnt offerings as in obeying the voice the voice of the lord? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice and to hearken than the fat of rams." and "Because thou hast rejected the word of the Lord, He hath rejected you from being king." Therefore Saul did not have God's protection in battle. Eventually Saul wanted to slay God's priests and told his servants to slay them. "Fourscore and five were slain."

1 Samuel 26:9 reads
"david said, Furthermore, as the Lord liveth, the Lord shall smite him {Saul} or his day shall come to die or he shall descend into battle and perish." Because of Saul slaying God's priests Saul was not protected by God in battle.

Therefore God did not kill Saul, Saul brought about his own demise, physically and spiritually.

God is love

Active Member
David and Solomon


2 Samuel 24:1

The proper translation of this verse is
"and again the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel and satan moved david against them to say, number Israel and Judah."
God would not be angry with David because he numbered Israel if God moved him to do it. That's not logical. If a person asks you to do something why would they be angry if you did it. Therefore the sense of it is that because God was angry with David, David was moved
to number Israel. Probably he wanted to know whether he had enough fighting men in his empire to sufficiently defend in battle. He was more dependent upon the fighting men since he thought he couldn'r rely on God's protection.

David in verse 10 felt bad in his spirit and said to God
"I have sinned greatly in what I have"
Perhapps he wondered if he could extend his dominion with these fighting men, risk their lives for gain, for David's vain ambition.


God made Solomon wise
1 kings 3:11-12
"God said unto him, Because thou hast asked this thing {asked for wisdom}
and hast not asked for thyself long life, neither has asked riches for thyself, nor hast asked the life of thine enemies but hast asked for thyself understanding to discern judgement, Behold, I have done according to thy words, lo, I have given thee a wise and understanding heart so that there was none like thee before thee..."

It says in 1 kings 11:1-3 that Solomon loved foreign women who turned him to other gods.
Although a man is intelligent and wise, sometimes a man doesn't think about that wisdom when he sees a woman and lusts after her. Sometimes a man isn't thinking with his head. He is lusting...

In 1 Kings 11:2 God said
"Ye shall not go in to them neither shall they come in unto you for surely they will turn your heart after their gods." but in another verse "Solomon clave unto these
{foreign women}"

Solomon turned his wise and understanding heart away from God. He had 700 wives and his wives turned away his heart after other gods and his heart was not perfect with the Lord.

With 700 wives you wonder when hefound the time to think let alone write Proverbs.

As it says in Kings 4:29 God gave Solomon wisdom and understanding, exceeding much and in 1 Kings 10:23-24 "King Solomon exceeded all the kings of the earth for wisdom."
"and all the earth sought Solomon to hear his wisdom, which God put in his heart."
2 Chronicles 9:22-23 "and Solomon passed all the kings of the earth in wisdom."

In Matthew 12:42 Jesus says
"The queen of the south {the queen of Sheba 1 Kings 10:1} shall rise up in judgement with this generation and shall condemn it for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon and behold, a greater than Solomon is here
{greater in righteousness}."

Solomon builds a Temple

God is love

Active Member
Solomon builds a Temple

Solomon built God's Temple saying "I have surely built thee an house to dwell in, a settled place {instead of the moveable house while wandering in the wilderness} for thee to abide in..."

The Temple is like God's home away from home, a place to visit when He wants to commune face to face with the high priest or in modern day Temples, He wants to commune with a prophet.

In Acts 7:47-49 Solomon's Temple is mentioned. Further it reads that the most High {God}
dwelleth not in Temples made with hands, Heaven is His throne {home}."
God says "Hath not my hand made all these things?" In other words God made the earth and therefore the bricks with which to make a home. God doesn't need man to make a house for Him to dwell in permenently. However God wanted a house built for Him to dwell a while when He visits the earth. When He wanted to commune with a high priest or wants to commune with a prophet there should be a sacred place within which to do that. A place where people are serving the Lord should be a place where they can feel His Spirit while serving.

That's all I have time for today, enjoy, farewell

God is love

Active Member
Asa and Jehoshaphat removed the idols on the high places

1 Kings 15:14 reads
"But the high places {places where people worshipped idols} were not removed, neverthe less Asa's heart was perfect with the Lord all his days." Earlier, verse 11 says, "Asa did that which is right in the eyes of the Lord..." Verse 12, "He took away the Sodomites out of the land and removed all the idols..." Verse 13, "Maachah, his mother, even her, he removed from being queen because sha had made an idol in a grave and Asa destroyed her idol...."

1 Kings 15:23 says "The rest of the acts of Asa and all his might and all that he did and the cities which he built, are they not written in the book of the Chronicles of the kings of Judah?" In other words, they are written in Chronicles so they don't need to be repeated in Kings.

In 2 Chronicles 14:2-3 "And asa did that which was good and right in the eyes of the Lord his God, for he took away the altars of the strange gods and the high places and brake down the images and cut down the groves." So eventually he did remove the high places.

1 Kings 22:42-43 Jehoshaphat did not remove the high places but in
2 Chronicles 17:5-6, he did. As in the case of Asa.

1 Kings 22.45 reads "Now the rest of the acts of Jehoshaphat and his might that he shewed and how he warred are they not written in the Book of the Chronicles of the kings of Judah?" 2 Chronicles 17:5-6 reads "His heart was lifted up in the ways of the Lord, moreover he took away the high places."

2 Kings 16:5 The king of Syria and the son of the king of Israel did not conquer Ahaz.
2 Chronicles 28:5-6, they did
It seems that at the time 2 Kings was written they hadn't. Some time after more history was recorded in the Chronicles and in that record it states that Ahaz was delivered into the hand of the king of Israel who smote him. "Pekah the son of Remaliah slew in Judah 20,000 in one day...because they had forsaken the Lord...."

Next Elijah caught up to heaven and Enoch was translated

God is love

Active Member
Elijah went up to heaven and Enoch was translated


Elijah went up to heaven
2 Kings 2:11
And it came to pass as they still went on and talked, Behold, there appeared a chariot of fire and horses of fire and Elijah went up by a whirl wind into heaven." Elijah went to spiritual paradise, the second degree of heaven's glory, called a terrestial glory.


Enoch was translated
Hebrews 11:5
"By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death...for before his translation he had this testimony that he pleased God."

Enoch and his entire city was so righteous that they were taken away from the earth to a place where they could "dwell in safety forever." God reserved Enoch that he should not die at that time and appointed him to minister unto those in the terrestial realm, spirit paradise, to those who died not knowing the gospel and the Lord's plan of salvation.

John 3:13
"And no man ascended up to heaven but He that came down from heaven, even the Son of Man {another name for Jesus Christ}, which is in heaven."

Jesus Christ ascended all the way to the highest degree of glory in heaven, the celestial kingdom of Heavenly Father. There He sits at the right hand of God, Heavenly Father.

Acts 7:55
"He being full of the Holy Ghost looked steadfastly into heaven and saw the glory of God and Jesus standing at the right hand of God."

I thought I would add Elisha here {not Elijah} before I get into the Psalms and Proverbs.

2 Kings 4:32-37
Elisha came into a house where a child was dead and revived the child.

Matthew 9:18-25
Jesus came into a ruler's house who had requested that Jesus come and lay His hand upon her so she would live. "Jesus took her by the hand and the maid {young girl, maiden} arose.

John 11:38-44
"Jesus said, Take ye away the stone. Martha, the sister of him that was dead, saith unto Him, Lord, by this time he stinketh for he hath been dead four days. Jesus saith unto her, said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?...He cried with a loud voice, Lazarus come forth. And he that was dead came forth."

Acts 26:23
"that he should be the first that should rise from the dead."

Jesus Christ was the first and only to resurrect Himself from death.

Pslams and Proverbs

God is love

Active Member
Psalms and Proverbs

Proverbs 12:21
"There shall no evil happen to the just but the wicked shall be filled with mischief."

Proverbs 12:2
"A good man obtaineth favour of the Lord but a man of wicked devices will He condemn."

Proverbs 3:27-31
"Withold not good from them to whom it is due, when it is in power of thine hand to do it."

Verses 33-34
"The curse of the Lord is in the house of the wicked but he blesseth the habitation of the just. Surely he scorneth the scorners but He giveth grace unto the lowly."

Psalms 92:14-14
"The righteous shall flourish like a palm tree. he shall grow like a cedar in Lebanon. Those that be planted in the house of the Lord shall flourish in the courts of our God. They shall still bring forth fruit in their old age."

2 Timothy 3:12
"and all that live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution"
{By the adversary, lucifer and those under his influence}

Hebrews 12:6 {pertains to sinning}
"For whom the Lord loveth, He {corrects}..."

the other part of the verse reads
"and scourgeth every son he receiveth"

Scourging is what was done {by humans} in his day to correct, discipline. Paul choose to describe chastening that way because of how discipline was done {by humans} in his time. However that is not literally how God chastens. God chastens by stricking the conscience. Paul was comparing physical discipline on the body to spiritual discipline in the conscience. Scourging in the physical sense or emotional sense would be abuse and not in God's character. Therefore Paul was not being literal.

Probably the persecution of the time was on his mind when he wrote it and he was thinking how people were scorged because of their belief in Jesus Christ as Christ had been scourged. Perhapps he thought he would be too. The persecuters were scourging thinking they were correcting his beliefs. God wasn't the person doing the scourging.

Proverbs 13:24
"He that spareth his rod hateth his son but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes."

Proverbs 29:15
"The rod and reproof give wisdom but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame."

In those days that is how they disciplined but we know proper ways now. Those should be used and not a rod of affliction. Physical punishment does not teach the child's mind why the wrong was wrong, That should be taught and if that is taught that will develope a conscience and when a wrong is done with a conscience, the conscience will be stricken. That causes remorse and that leads repentance and that leads to improved behavior.

Proverbs 26:3
"A whip for the horse...a rod for the fool's back"
I guess he is saying that those who are not wise and do not want to be wise, they don't want to be taught to learn, have to be whipped or physically punished because it is the only way {they thought of in that time} to deter repeating wrong.

I don't think there should be a whip for the horse either but that is another subject.

Some people in present society have to be incarcertated because of the fear they will repeat their wrongs but there are rehabilitation programs. Some however refuse being rehabilitated.

I think whipping people or other physical abuse such as what happened in the prison in Iraq is wrong. It would make them more violent or if they weren't violent, after that abuse, they may become violent.

This is true of children who have been physically punished, they would think it's
justified to punish their brothers and sisters the same way when they think they have done wrong to them such as in a sibling dispute over a toy.

In 1 Nephi 11:25 {Another Testement of Jesus Christ}
"And it came to pass that I beheld that the rod of iron, which my father had seen {in a vision} was the word of God which led to the fountain of living waters or to the tree of life, which waters are a representation of the love of God and I also beheld that the tree of life was a representation of the love of God."

We should discipline our children with the word of God by teaching them the principles that relate to the rules we want to uphold.

A latterday prophet, Gordon B. Hinckley has said that spanking was never necessary."

It is necessary to discipline but spanking is NOT a necessary form of discipline nor any other forms of physical affliction. Recently I have seen on the "Nanny 911" show and a similar show, the time out method. Sometimes they have to give up something.
For example if two children are fighting over a toy tugging on it, about to destroy it. The toy would be removed, therefore they giveup what they were contending over.
It is better that the punishment be related to the crime because it teaches the cause and effect relationship of bad behavior. It isn't right to deprive a child of a meal {for example} that the child needs for his/her health.

I've heard on a news report about 3-4 years ago that studies have been done that support not spanking. As a matter of fact the studies revealed that spanking was harmful to a child's psychological makeup.

I thought of the daycare workers that are not allowed to discipline children by spanking. They have more children to discipline than parents. If they are capable of disciplining children another way, parents are as well.

There is also positive reinforcement as an incentive, rewarding good behavior. This is what Heavenly father does. He gives blessing for good behavior.

In bible history there have been times in the past when adults {not children} were very wicked and wanted to destroy the righteous or demoralize them. Some lived together,
{for example} in the city of Sodom and Gommorah. They were warned by 3 angels before the city was destroyed. God gave them a chance to repent. He also gave the righeous a chance to leave the city.

Genesis 18:20-33
Verse 32
Abraham is speaking to God "Oh, let not the Lord be angry and I will speak yet but this once, Peradventure ten {righteous} shall be found there. And He {the Lord } said,
I will not destroy it for ten's {ten righteous} sake."

Genesis 19:12-13
"And {the angels} said unto Lot {who lived in Sodom and Gommorah}, Hast thou here any besides, son in law, and thy sons and thy daughters, whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place. For we will destroy this place, because the cry of them {the children that were being abused} is waxen great before the face of the Lord and the Lord hath sent us {angels} to destroy it."

Noah warned the wicked people about the flood, they had forty years to repent before the flood.

the Lord is close to those who call upon Him and the baptism of the earth, the earth's change mentioned in Psalms

God is love

Active Member
The Lord is close to those who call upon Him,
The baptism of the earth and the other earth change mentioned in Psalms.

Psalms 145:18
"The Lord is nigh unto all them that call upon Him, to all that call upon Him in truth."

Psalms 46:1
"God is a refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble."

Psalms 10:1
"Why standeth thou afar off, Oh Lord?..."
David sinned {caused murder}. He caused his own trouble. God permitts the negative consequences of sin as it's own form of punishment. It teaches {the hard way} not to commit the sin again."

Proverbs 15:29
"The Lord is far from the wicked"

New subject

"The day of the Lord {Second Comming} will come as a thief in the night, in the which the heavens shall {disperse} with a great noise and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works therein shall be burned up."
2 Peter 3:10

Verse 13
"Never the less, we, according to His promise, look forward for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness."

Those who are righteous will be protected at this time. The new heaven and new earth will be this earth transformed into it's paradisical state like it was in the garden of Eden.

The flood at the time of Noah was a real physical event. It also had a symbolic significance. The flood washed all the wickedness from the earth. It was like baptism that washes away our past sins and then we promise to not repeat them. The flood was like a baptism of the earth.

I have thought of the similarity of the planets revolving around the sun and the molecules revolving around an atom. It seems that God has created on a small scale a similarity to what He has created on a large scale. With that in mind, as there is baptism for humans there was a similar baptism of the earth itself. During the flood the earth was completely immersed under water.

There is a baptism of fire which is symbolic of receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost.
The Holy Spirit purifies {cleanses, sanitizes} our spirits, sterilizing what is left after wasing just like a flame sterilizes something that just washing it would not clean, what is not seen {germs}. The Holy Spirit is like a flame in another way in that He warms our spirits like a warm fire.

So too, the earth, will receive a baptism of the Holy spirit, a purification like that of fire {I don't know how it will be} and afterwards this earth will be as the garden of Eden was.

Those that have been righteous while on earth
1. Those who have passed {died} shall be resurrected

2. Those that are living at the time of His 2nd comming in the clouds that are righteous and ready to meet the Lord are caught up like Elijah to meet Him in the clouds}

these shall return to earth in it's paradiscial, terrestial phase.

We will live upon the earth.

Hebrews 1:10-11
"the earth will someday perish"
Eventually, after a thousand years, the earth will be renewed again, what will perish is what is terrestial and what will be established is a celestial kind of glory for those who have progressed to a higher degree of glory.

Psalms 102:25
"Of old thou hast laid the foundation of the earth and the heavens are the work of thy hands"

Verse 26
"As a vesture thou shalt change them and they shall be changed."

Therefore this is a change in the nature of the earth not that the earth will perish {not exist}. It will continue to exist but in a purified form.

New subject

Proverbs 24:16-18
"Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth. Lest the Lord see it and it displease Him..."
We shouldn't rejoice when an enemy is physically hurt in a stumble or spiritually damages himself through his own sin.

Proverbs 11:5
"the wicked shall fall by his own wickedness"

Psalms 58:10-11
"The righteous shall rejoice when he seeth the vengeance..."
We should rejoice in the righteous judgement of God and justice upon the wicked.

Proverbs 29:2
"When the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn"

I heard the saying "Wickedness prospers when good men do nothing."

The wisdom of the world, sign seeking, wisdom of God

God is love

Active Member
Wisdom of the world, sign seeking, wisdom of God.

1 Corinthians 1:19-25
"hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?"

The wisdom of this world is limited. During Columbus time, people thought the world was flat although in Isaiah 40:22 it says,
"the circle of the earth..."

God's wisdom is greater than man's because He made the earth. So in revealing His wisdom "he destroys
{what they believe to be wisdom which is subject to error,fallible}
the {believed to be} wisdom of men" also "God makes foolish the wisdom of the world."

Sign Seeking

1 Corinthians 1:22-23

"For the Jews require a sign and the Greeks seek after wisdom. But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumbling block {some will reject} and unto the greeks foolishness {the gospel will seem foolish}."

Verse 21 "it pleased God by {what they think is foolish preaching} to save them that believe."

Isaiah 44:25
"...that maketh diviners mad, that turneth wise men backward and maketh their knowledge foolish."

Isaiah 11:2
"The {what they believe to be} wisdom of their wise men shall perish and the understanding of their prudent men shall be hid."
What they believe to be wisdom causes them to believe the gospel is foolish.

1 Corinthians 2:5
"Your faith should not stand in the wisdom of man but in the power of God."

1 Corinthians 3:18-20
"Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become as a child {realizing that he/she is ignorant of some things} that he may be wise {Learn wisdom, be teachable}."

Psalms 14:1
"the fool hath said in his heart, There is not God."

1 Corinthians 3:19
"For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God."

The so called wisdom of man is foolishness with God when it says, There is no God.

Proverbs 3:13
"Happy is the man that getteth understanding."

Proverbs 4:7

"Wisdom is the principal thing therefore get wisdom and with all thy getting, get understanding."

James 1:5
If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God that giveth to all men liberally...and it shall be given you."

As regarding previous post {disciplining}

Todays standards for parenting {discipline}
would consider physical punishment child abuse. At the very least social workers may be called to investigate allegations of such discipline {if it it is seen}.

In John 2:15 is a describes a scrourge. it is made of small cords.

I don't know what kind of whipping is done with a rod as mentioned in Proverbs, however I don't believe any whipping is appropriate. That is my opinion which I won't retract. I feel that strongly about it.

As far as it being symbolic of spiritual scourging, the only thing I'm able to imagine is when there is a correction that is brought to the person's attention, in other words the person is told what the person did was wrong and why or the person's conscience is stricken, suddenly made aware. Then there may be pain in the spirit such as when you feel guilty after doing wrong. This is pain that the person inflicted upon himself.

I'll answer any questions when I get to them next week. I will answer within this thread.

Your Heavenly Father knows what you have needs some we can provide for ourselves,
The importance of being prudant, and
Children tossed to and fro and carried about by every wind of doctrine...

God is love

Active Member
Your Heavenly Father knows that you have needs and He knows what your needs are.
Some needs we can provide for ourselves.
The importance od being Prudant
Children tossed to and fro and carried about by every wind of doctrine...

Because I am doing the list {of issues} in order, before I get to these, I'll address Proverbs 12:2 and Romans 2:8

Proverbs 12:2
"A good man obtaineth favor of the Lord but a man of wicked devices will he condemn."

Romans 2:8
"Unto them that are contentious and do not obey the truth...indignation and wrath."

Verse 9
"Tribulation and anguish upon every soul of man that doeth evil..."

I think this speaks for itself. This is the usual case that those that tribulation is upon those that do evil because wickedness causes bad to happen, not just to others {victims} but eventually to those who do evil. It may be self inflicted physically or emotionally or it may be afflicted by others, the victims or law officers or perhapps other wicked people. There isn't any brotherhood amongst the wicked, if they have a need or desire, some reason, they will betray and afflict their own, whether that be family as in the mafia or members of gangs like the mafia. There isn't a true loyalty because at the heart of the group is the purpose to gain unlimited by laws. If they manage to escape harm in this life, they will fall into the hands of an awesome God who will judge their acts and sentence them to spirit prison where they will reside till they trully repent. They will experience the anguish they have caused others to experience. They will understand why it wasn't worth the harm they've done.

It is always the case that a righteous person is blessed at some time in life and in the life to come.

New subject

Matthew 6:25-34
"Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat or what ye shall drink nor... what ye shall put on."

Verse 26
"Behold, the fowls of the air for they sow not, neither do they reap nor gather into barns, yet your Father in heaven feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?"

Verse 30
"Wherefore if God so clothe the grass of the field... shall He not much more clothe you?"

Verse 31
"Therefore take no thought saying "What shall we eat? or what shall we drink? or wherewithal shall we drink? or wherewithal shall we be clothed?"

Verse 32
"For your Heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things."

Verse 34
"Take therefore no thought for the morrow for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself."

This portion of the Sermon on the Mount was delivered to the apostles and disciples that were called to carry the message of Salvation to the world. This applies to those who are called to go into the world and preach the gospel for the time of their missionary service. Their whole attention and strength should be on the work of the ministry and they have the father's promise thet He will look after their daily needs.

Proverbs 14:8
"The wisdom { true wisdom} of the prudant is to understand his way."

"Dictionary.Com" defined Prudence as attentiveness to possible hazards, caution or circumspection as to danger or risks, avoiding distress and discretion in practical affairs.

Proverbs 4:14-15
"Enter not into the path of the wicked and go not in the way of evil men. Avoid it,
pass not by it, turn from it..."
Verse 26 "Ponder the path of thy feet..."

We should provide what we are capable of providing for ourselves and what we are not able to provide, we should seek the Heavenly Father's help in prayer. He will provide for us or help us provide for ourselves.

Husbands should provide for their wives and children.

1 Timothy 5:8
"But if any provide not for his own {family} and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith and is worse than an infidel."

New subject

1 Corinthians 1:20,27
"But hath chosen the {poor of this world that are rich in faith} to confound the wise men {wise in their own mind and carnal minded}."

Those that only think of the physical world, physical appetites, think the spiritual is foolish {non sense} because it can't be seen to be examined, to be determined that it exists. They believe that nothing is spiritual, that God and His Son don't exist or the Holy Spirit doesn't exist because they aren't in touch with them.
Therefore they don't recognize what's good for the spirit, that God is good,
Jesus Christ is good, the Holy Spirit is good and good for us, that the Holy Spirit helps us be good, that the gospel principles are good for our lives to live.

They are confounded and confused that some are confident that Heavenly Father Exists and His son Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit. Those that are confident have had a personal experience that tesifies of the existence of God, His Son and the Holy Spirit, that proves they exist. That may be a feeling of the Holy Spirit or more dramatically as some have experienced, a vision of Jesus Christ or a vision of Him and His Father, our Heavenly Father. It may be the effect of prayer, such as being healed, recieving an answer or request or more dramatically a miracle.

There are various evidences of God's existence to be found if people want to seek to know.

Proverbs 14:15-18
"The simple believe every word but the prudant man looketh well to his going"

Again, the prudant are wise in what they choose to believe. This may seem contradictory but it's not. God is not saying to believe every thing a person says, whatever a person says to believ. God is saying to be carfeull when thinking, desciding what to believe. However assuming that God doesn't exist and not investigating the claims of His existenece is foolish. People should investigate to know and then determine what to believe.

"A wise man feareth evil and departeth from evil but the fool rageth and is confident."
Those that are foolish put their trust in man or they are confident in their own abilities. They don't see a need for God and don't worry about evil until they are in trouble but some believe they don't need God to deliver them.

Ephesians 4:14
" That ye henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine by the sleight of men and cunning craftiness whereby they lie in wait to deceive."

We should be prudent when evaluating doctrines and if we don't know how to discern, we should ask for wisdom in prayer from Heavenly Father to discern truth. He will send the Holy spirit to us to be that magnifying glass of truth.

Matthew 15:9
"But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men."

1 Timothy 4:1
"Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils."

Hebrews 13:9
"Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines..."

Matthew 18:4
"Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child..."

what is hidden from the wicked,speaking in parables, a reverance for the Lord

When a person as an adult can humble themselves as a child, that is be teachable as a child, be willing to be taught, they will be able to humble themselves enough to kneel down, bow their head and ask God the questions that they want answered. My avatar is an example of the humbleness of a child. He recognizes that he doesn't have all the answers and recognizes a superior being does.

God is love

Active Member
What is hidden from the wicked,
the Lord speaking in parables and reverance for the Lord

Matthew 11:25 and Mark 4:11-12

Matthew 11:25
"At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of Heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise {wise in their own estimation}...and hast revealed them unto babes
{those that have humbled themselves as a little child}."

Jesus said, "thou hast hid these things from the wise {wise in their own eyes}."
Some spiritual truths were hidden from those that were around mocking and criticizing when Jesus was teaching those who wanted to learn. Some were in their own spiritual blindness.

Mark 4:11-12
"And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables."

Jesus didn't want the mockers to mock in the presence of those who wanted to learn.
He realized that they were hanging around listening not trying to understand, they were just trying to find fault.

Matthew 11:25
The explaination of this is in Matthew 13:10
The disciples came and said unto Him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?"

Verse 11
"He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven."
Some were able to understand but others were not able to understand because it wasn't what they wanted to learn. If they wanted to learn they would have questioned our Lord to know. That is what children do when they want to know, to understand, they ask.

Mark 4:22
"For there is nothing hid, which shall not be manifested..."

Jesus is saying whatever is hid will be made known to those who want to know.

James 1:5
"If any of you lack wisdom let him ask of God, that giveth liberally and upbraideth {witholdeth} not and it shall be given him."

Isaiah spoke of their time and that is paraphrased in Matthew 13:14
"in them is fulfilled the prophesy of Isaiah which saith, By hearing ye shall hear and shall not understand and seeing ye shall see and shall not perceive."

Verse 14
"For this people's heart is waxed gross and their ears are dull of hearing and their eyes have they closed lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears and should understand with their heart and should be converted."

Isaiah's quote that is being paraphrased in verse 14 is found in Isaiah 6:9-10
"And he said, Go and tell this people, hear ye indeed but understand not and see ye indeed but perceive not. Make the heart of this people fat and make their ears heavy and shut their eyes, lest they see with their eyes and hear with their ears and understand with their heart and convert."

If they felt obligated to convert when they did not feel a desire they would not be truelly converted. They wouldn't live the principles and they would be causing their own spiritual imprisonment.

The mockers and the criticizers of that time did not want to understand because if they did, their conscience would cause them to feel obligated to accept the principles and convert. In doing so they would be accepting the responsibility to live the principles. It's the same with people who don't want to live God's principles, they don't want to know that God exists. They would prefer He didn't. Their skepticism is convenient for their lifestyle.

Matthew 11:21 jesus says "If the mighty works which were done in you {Chorazin} had been done in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago."

If the people who witnessed the miracles of Jesus that were done amongst them, did not want to repent, they wouldn't repent after hearing Jesus' teachings. If they don't accept the miracles that benefit them, they propbably wouldn't accept principles that seem to just benefit God. They wouldn't think God's principles hold much benefit to them and therefore wouldn't accept them. They would have to make some adjustments in their lifestyle to do so, repent of wrongs. They would think it is better to remain in ignorance than to know the truth and reject it.

God recognized that some were not ready to know the truth because they wouldn't accept the truth.

The "Parable of the Sower" in Matthew 13:18-23 is explained
This parable symbolizes those who are not prepared for the gospel and those who are.
Verse 19
"When anyone heareth the word of the kingdom {the gospel} and understandeth it not,
then cometh the wicked one and catcheth away that which was sown {the truths of the gospel} in the heart."

Verses 20-22
"He that received the seed {truth} in stoney places, the same is he that heareth the word and with joy receives it. Yet {the truth} hath not root in himself but endureth for awhile for when persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
He also that received {truth} among the thorns is he that heareth the word and the care of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word {truth} and he becometh unfruitful {unproductive}."

Verses 23
"But he that received seed {the truth} in good ground {good heart} and understandeth
it, which also beareth fruit..."


Proverbs 8:13
Properly interpreted is
"The reverence of the Lord is to hate evil, pride and arrogancy."

Proverbs 16:6
"By mercy and truth, iniquity is purged and by the reverence of the Lord, men depart from evil."

1 John 4:18
"There is no fear in love, perfect love casteth out fear."
If you feel love, you aren't worried about the things of this world, other than what affects what you love. A mother will put herself in harm's way to save her child. She loves her child so much she doesn't fear being hurt in the process of saving her child.

1 John 5:2
"By this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments and His commandments are not grievous."

Proverbs 16:4
"God made the wicked for the day of judgement."
This is understood to be God made the day of Judgement for the wicked.

The time of Noah's flood is an example of what this verse is saying.
Heavenly Father knows how spirits that he has made will behave on earth in situations just as parents after awhile can anticipate their children's actions in situations.
Heavenly Father knows their potential capabilities, their strengths and weaknesses,
their tendencies. At the time of Noah before the flood, Heavnely Father sent many of the spiritually weak spirits to earth at the same time in history. He sent only a few righteous spirits, Noah and his family. God knew that the weak spirits would behave badly and ultimately they would bring destruction so sending just a few of those that would be righteous, Noah and his family, was prudent because there would only be Noah and his family that would be worthy to be saved and that would be accomplished in buiding an ark, an ark that couldn't accomodate all those that were on the earth.
However Noah had warned them of the impending flood and they had forty years to prepare an ark for themselves but instead they mocked him.

Some would say why would God send spirits to earth who would choose to do bad instead of good, knowing that evetually He would have to destroy them before they completely overwelm the righteous. God has to allow them their freedom to choose.
God is fair and wantes to give them the option to choose to do bad or choose to do good. Although He knows how they will choose. He provides them the right to make that those choices.

So that flood which I believe symbolizes the baptism of the earth was made for that time, that generation that was spiritually weak and that made them susceptible to being wicked.

That's all for now.

God is love

Active Member

John 1:1
"In the beginning was the word {the messenger of the covenant, Jesus Christ}
and the word was with God and the word was God."

Verse 2
"The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by Him and without Him, was not anything made..." Jesus was the creator.

Isaiah 44:24
"Thus saith the Lord, thy redeemer and He that formed thee from the womb, I am the Lord that maketh all things, that stretcheth forth the heavens alone, that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself." Jesus was the creator that created the sky and the earth and bodies for our spirits, the spirits that Hevenly Father created.

The Lord says "Thy...redeemer" The redeemer is another name or title for Jesus Christ. He redeemed, saved us.

There aren't any inconsistencies here.

Isaiah 53:9

A part of Jesus Christ's mission is described
"to bear men's griefs and carry their sorrows"

Jesus Christ spoke of this
"For behold, I, God..."
Jesus Christ is saying that He is a God as Heavenly Father has bestowed that upon Him. Jesus Christ has earned that right haven taking on the reponsibility of craeting the world and all living upon it and to be a perfect example of His Father's principles and to take upon Himself the sins of the world. He has inhertied this world from Heavenly Father and He will return to be it's king.

This is the rest of the verse
"For behold, I, God, have suffered these things for all, that they might not suffer if they would repent."

Isaiah 53:4-5
"Surely He hath born our griefs and carried our sorrows, yet we did esteem Him stricken, smitten of God and afflicted. BUT He was wounded for our transgressions.
He was bruised for our iniquities, the chastisement of our peace was upon Him and with His stripes we are healed."

Some of the people at that time thought Heavenly Father was stricking, smitting, and afflicting Him because He didn't approve of Him instead of thinking that the people were in error and were afflicting Him because they didn't approve of Him. In truth He was wounded NOT because any transgression against Heavenly Father, NO. He was wounded for our transgressions and bruised for our iniquities.

Isaiah 53:9
"And He made His grave {dIed} with the wicked..."
He was crucified between two thieves.

Luke 23:32-33
"And there were also two other malefactors {criminals} led with Him to be put to death. And when they were come to the place, which is called calvary, there they crucified Him and the malefactors, one on the right hand and the other on the left."

Matthew 27:58-60
Verses 59-60
"And when Joseph {Joseph of Arimathea} had taken the body, he wrapped it in a clean linen cloth. And laid it in his own new tomb which he had hewn out in the rock and he rolled a great stone to the door of the sepulchre and departed."

He was not buried with others.

Nebuchadnezzar and the city of Tyre and Alexander the Great and the city of Tyre
30 pieces of silver
That will conclude the Old Testement issues as regarding it's history or prophesy.