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What is the Jewish Understanding of Exodus 6:3, YHWH, G-d, and Hashem?

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
As you can seen below the Name of Hashem is in the Hebrew text. Nothing was changed there.

Jewish Torah Scroll

View attachment 64837

Samaritan Torah

View attachment 64838
Yes, thank you. As I understand it, not to push the issue, but it is there in the (Hebrew) Tanach thousands of times. Not sure of the Samaritan Torah. I can read the letters somewhat in Hebrew, but I don't know much about the Samaritan Torah. But thanks.
 

David Davidovich

Well-Known Member
At this point, I thank you for answering my questions and look forward to a wonderful future, promised, foretold, and established by the Almighty God whose name I am privileged to know and to put faith in the one true God whose name is YHWH, Yahweh, Jehovah, or however He is accurately and lovingly represented by those who love Him. Psalm 83:18, a good translation.)

The name that you are privileged to know? See post #41.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
6828 times

Edit to add: for comparison, Elohim occurs 1179 times in the Tanach.
So let's say that's true. (I didn't take a personal count, but I'm figuring from what I learned that your assessment is likely correct.) Therefore, since Moses himself and others wrote the name down so many times and it was transmitted by copyists so many times, I figure it was (is) very important to God to have His name spoken. Please don't tell me about pronunciation, because we know the original Hebrew language for starters is very likely not like the modern pronunciation but that DOESN'T MATTER. Because the transmission is there.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
Again, we don't have proof either way and it doesn't matter because.....DRUM ROLL.....According to halakha once a Jew takes on ideas, like those found in the NT, they are no longer considered Jewish. Besides, most Jews who go the NT route, or other routes like it, they are normally working hard to seperate themselves from the Torath Mosheh Jewish community. The original Jewish christians did this, seperate themselves out, and they dissappeared 2 generations later.



Again, the word was known outside of the Jewish community by the time revelations is beleived to have been written. It isn't relevant to a Torath Mosheh Jew. The author wrote in Greek and discussed non-Torah based concepts.



That is what you say. We Torath Mosheh Jews have a different opinion. We can also claim books written by non-Roman authors are Jewish using that criteria. Maybe even those who performed the Spanish Inquisition were Jewish because they wrote about Jewish topics. As far as Torath Mosheh Jews are concerned the minute that the author of revelations took out his pen/feather/stick to write he was doing so as someone who was not Jewish. The fact that he wrote in Greek also makes it clear who his audience was.



As a Torath Mosheh Jew, all theories about revelation come back to the same point. It isn't relevant to Torath Mosheh Jews. It never was and it never will be. We go on for days speculating about why the author wrote what he/she did and why. It winds back at the same spot of - who cares? The author was living as a Torath Mosheh, the author wrote in a language that was not relevant to any Torath Mosheh Jew, and the authors intention has been lost to history. Lastly, the author did not produce a generation of Jews after himself/herself to keep his/her ideas going so. There you have it. ;)
After reading many of your posts because I am interested, here is what I gleaned from them about your beliefs: you believe that Israel will be established and run by Tanach and Talmud believing Jews, Is that correct about your belief?
 

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
I figure it was (is) very important to God to have His name spoken.

The statement you made is not found anywhere in the Torah. In fact, the word (שם) doesn't mean "name" as you are claiming. I.e. the word in ancient Hebrew doesn't mean a "pronuciation." Thus, there is no mitzvah, for Torath Mosheh Jews, to attempt to pronounce Hashem's name in the way you are talking about.

Please don't tell me about pronunciation

Please excuse my frankness but let's be very clear that no one is telling you, personally, to do anything. You are not a part of the Torath Mosheh Jewish community. You are a JW. Thus, you can do as you please in this area.

because we know the original Hebrew language for starters

Please again excuse my frankness but last I remember by your own admission you don't know the Hebrew language.

is very likely not like the modern pronunciation but that DOESN'T MATTER. Because the transmission is there.

Again, I hate to be frank again but your statement here is one of the less cognizant ones I have seen in a while. You know, you can always just accept the religion you have to come to and just think that we Torath Mosheh Jews have no idea at all what we are talking about. That could just make things easier for you.
 
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Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
After reading many of your posts because I am interested, here is what I gleaned from them about your beliefs: you believe that Israel will be established and run by Tanach and Talmud believing Jews, Is that correct about your belief?

Excuse for saying, but I beleive we already discussed this exact thing in several in other threads before. If you don't mind me asking, is this a question or are you wanting to make a statement?
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
Excuse for saying, but I beleive we already discussed this exact thing in several in other threads before. If you don't mind me asking, is this a question or are you wanting to make a statement?
I don't recall having finally understood your premise or basis for final outcome so it is a question in wanting to know how you consider the establishment or eventual outcome. It is a question.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
The statement you made is not found anywhere in the Torah. In fact, the word (שם) doesn't mean "name" as you are claiming. I.e. the word in ancient Hebrew doesn't mean a "pronuciation." Thus, there is no mitzvah, for Torath Mosheh Jews, to attempt to pronounce Hashem's name in the way you are talking about.



Please excuse my frankness but let's be very clear that no one is telling you, personally, to do anything. You are not a part of the Torath Mosheh Jewish community. You are a JW. Thus, you can do as you please in this area.



Please again excuse my frankness but last I remember by your own admission you don't know the Hebrew language.



Again, I hate to be frank again but your statement here is one of the less cognizant ones I have seen in a while. You know, you can always just accept the religion you have to come to and just think that we Torath Mosheh Jews have no idea at all what we are talking about. That could just make things easier for.
OK I understand that I don't understand your answer. Be that as it may. I mean in reference to your response, you might as well say Hindus and Muslims and Christians know what they are talking about also.
 

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
I don't recall having finally understood your premise or basis for final outcome so it is a question in wanting to know how you consider the establishment or eventual outcome. It is a question.

If you like I can restate with the following again.



 

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
OK I understand that I don't understand your answer. Be that as it may. I mean in reference to your response, you might as well say Hindus and Muslims and Christians know what they are talking about also.

I don't have to comment on what Hindus and Muslims and Christians know. That isn't relevant to me. I am quite certain that there are some topics of the reality we all live in that all human beings know what they are talking about on. According to Torath Mosheh all humans have value and all humans have specialities that they are well informed about as well as some things they are not informed about.

When it comes to Torath Mosheh, that is the specialty of Torath Mosheh Jews. ;)
 

David Davidovich

Well-Known Member
OK I understand that I don't understand your answer. Be that as it may. I mean in reference to your response, you might as well say Hindus and Muslims and Christians know what they are talking about also.

One of things that I found interesting in my conversations with @Ehav4Ever and other Jews here at RF is that they have claimed that Jewish commentaries go back as far as when the Torah itself was written and how Jews have had a custom of orally transmitting their data for thousands of years. Also, there was a thread from several months ago, which I just spent about 30 minutes looking for, but couldn't find ;) where a Jehovah's Witness (she has a horse as an avatar) shut me down in a discussion where I thought I had proof that 2 Peter and the book of Jude quoted the book of Enoch after she said that she was raised Jewish and that she knows from firsthand experience how Jews pass on oral information from generation to generation and that those verses in 2 Peter and Jude were more likely to have been passed down orally rather than quoted from a Apocryphal source. Therefore, if you are sincere, then you might want to take that into consideration.

P.S Plus, because I had heard about how there were Jewish sages from the Middles Ages, etc., I was always under the impression that Jewish commentaries originated years and years past the time when the Torah was written and that Jewish ideas were just made up far beyond the time when the Hebrew text was written and that the Jews were so detached from the Hebrew text (i.e. The Old Testament) that they don't have any idea as to what the content and meaning of those texts are. Plus, Jehovah's Witnesses articles didn't help in that regard either:

The Third Commandment

Evidently, during the first and second centuries C.E., a superstition regarding the use of God’s name took hold among the Jews. The Mishnah (a collection of rabbinic commentaries that became the foundation of the Talmud) states that “one who pronounces the divine name as it is spelt” has no portion in the future earthly Paradise promised by God.

What was the origin of such a prohibition? Some claim that the Jews considered the name of God too sacred for imperfect humans to pronounce. Eventually, there was a hesitancy even to write the name. According to one source, that fear arose because of a concern that the document in which the name was written might later end up in the trash, resulting in a desecration of the divine name.

The Encyclopaedia Judaica says that “the avoidance of pronouncing the name YHWH . . . was caused by a misunderstanding of the Third Commandment.” The third of the Ten Commandments given by God to the Israelites states: “You must not take up the name of Jehovah your God in a worthless way, for Jehovah will not leave the one unpunished who takes up his name in a worthless way.” (Exodus 20:7) Hence, God’s decree against the improper use of his name was twisted into a superstition.

click here: The Fight Against God’s Name — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY (jw.org)
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
I don't have to comment on what Hindus and Muslims and Christians know. That isn't relevant to me. I am quite certain that there are some topics of the reality we all live in that all human beings know what they are talking about on. According to Torath Mosheh all humans have value and all humans have specialities that they are well informed about as well as some things they are not informed about.

When it comes to Torath Mosheh, that is the specialty of Torath Mosheh Jews. ;)
Excuse please, I understand about moshiach, anointed, my question is about what you think happens when and if all Jews go back to Israel.
 

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
Excuse please, I understand about moshiach, anointed, my question is about what you think happens when and if all Jews go back to Israel.

Those videos explain what happens. A Torath Mosheh System of government and social life, from top to bottom, in the land of Israel. That was detailed in all three videos. Again, we have discussed this in detail in at least 4 or more threads in the past. ;)
 
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YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
Those videos explain what happens. A Torath Mosheh System of government and social life, from top to bottom, in the land of Israel. That was detailed in all three videos. Again, we have discussed this in detail in at least 4 or more threads. ;)
OK thank you, now you said it.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
FYI, here are some other places where I described it.

About Judaism and the Messiah question

Davidic King/Mashiahh according to Torath Mosheh Sources

Same question answered here in post #102
About Judaism and the Messiah question
I'm not even asking about the "Messiah question." I'm asking what form of government do you say will be instituted when and if Moshiach appears and all the Jews go back to Israel. (as if that's ever going to happen...) And from my understanding of your posts, it's a form of applying the Moshe Torah and Oral Torah and the Talmud. Keeping it brief, because I don't have too much time to read everything, maybe you can answer briefly. But if not, my sign off -- have a good evening. And thanks for conversation.
 

Ehav4Ever

Well-Known Member
I'm not even asking about the "Messiah question."

I am not not talking about a "messiah." That English term can cause confusion. I am talking about one of the catalysts/factors of a return to a Torath Mosheh nation/government/etc. and a return of Jewish people to Israel and Torah based. I.e a Davidic King. Again, this is one of the catalysts/factors of such an event which of course all starts with all Jews in Israel and the decisions that are made here.

I'm asking what form of government do you say will be instituted when and if Moshiach appears and all the Jews go back to Israel.

We have covered that before. I gave the places where I detailed that exactly as you just asked it.

At this link below I described exactly how the government would work.
Davidic King/Mashiahh according to Torath Mosheh Sources

What is not clear about the description given in the above link? Are you looking for how city governments will be run?

And from my understanding of your posts, it's a form of applying the Moshe Torah and Oral Torah and the Talmud.

Yes, and no. It would be a system of government and society that is based on:
  1. Torath Mosheh
  2. The leadership of the Beith Din Hagadol/Sanehdrin/Mosaic Court
but w/o the Talmud. When there is a Beith Din Hagadol/Sanhedrin/Mosaic Court the Talmud is not relevent anymore. Essentially, the Beith Din Hagadol/Sanhedrin/Mosaic court becomes the Talmud. I.e. they will be the source of the Oral Torah.

Keeping it brief, because I don't have too much time to read everything, maybe you can answer briefly.

I have kept it very breif in this and other threads. Are there some terms you don't understand? Torath Mosheh, Davdic King, Sanhedrin/Mosaic Court, land of Israel, desire of Jews in the land of Israel to return to Torah, etc.

But if not, my sign off -- have a good evening. And thanks for conversation.

No problem.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
It's My Birthday!
I am not not talking about a "messiah." That English term can cause confusion. I am talking about one of the catalysts/factors of a return to a Torath Mosheh nation/government/etc. and a return of Jewish people to Israel and Torah based. I.e a Davidic King. Again, this is one of the catalysts/factors of such an event which of course all starts with all Jews in Israel and the decisions that are made here.



We have covered that before. I gave the places where I detailed that exactly as you just asked it.

At this link below I described exactly how the government would work.
Davidic King/Mashiahh according to Torath Mosheh Sources

What is not clear about the description given in the above link? Are you looking for how city governments will be run?



Yes, and no. It would be a system of government and society that is based on:
  1. Torath Mosheh
  2. The leadership of the Beith Din Hagadol/Sanehdrin/Mosaic Court
but w/o the Talmud. When there is a Beith Din Hagadol/Sanhedrin/Mosaic Court the Talmud is not relevent anymore. Essentially, the Beith Din Hagadol/Sanhedrin/Mosaic court becomes the Talmud. I.e. they will be the source of the Oral Torah.



I have kept it very breif in this and other threads. Are there some terms you don't understand? Torath Mosheh, Davdic King, Sanhedrin/Mosaic Court, land of Israel, desire of Jews in the land of Israel to return to Torah, etc.



No problem.
Just so you don't think I do not want to respond to your post, but for me the case is closed, and thank you, you've helped to explain your views the best you can, I doubt I have any more questions and comments about this right now. Thanks, and have a good day.
 
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