What is the Jewish Understanding of Exodus 6:3, YHWH, G-d, and Hashem?

[YoursTrue]

Yes, there are but you brought up your non-Christian family for a reason, I assume, so I am offering to speak to the ones who are not Christian.

You don't have to put me in contact with them if you don't want to.

I brought up my Jewish family in part because of the answers received before and after I studied the Bible.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

I brought up my Jewish family in part because of the answers received before and after I studied the Bible.

That's fine. If they are willing to make the connection let me know.

 

[David Davidovich]

I have an interesting question about the Tetragrammaton: What exactly do Torath Mosheh Jews teach their children about the Tetragrammaton when they teach their children the Torah? Do they pronounce the Tetragrammaton when they come across it in the Torah, or do they just use the word Lord or the Hebrew word Adonai?

 

[rosends]

I have an interesting question about the Tetragrammaton: What exactly do Torath Mosheh Jews teach their children about the Tetragrammaton when they teach their children the Torah? Do they pronounce the Tetragrammaton when they come across it in the Torah, or do they just use the word Lord or the Hebrew word Adonai?

If the context is prayer or some other sacred situation we use adonai. If it is not, we use hashem and we explain why.

 

[David Davidovich]

If the context is prayer or some other sacred situation we use adonai. If it is not, we use hashem and we explain why.

No, I meant that when Jews are reciting or reading the Torah to their children and when they come across a scripture such as Exodus 3:15.

וַיֹּ֩אמֶר֩ ע֨וֹד אֱלֹהִ֜ים אֶל־מֹשֶׁ֗ה כֹּֽה־תֹאמַר֮ אֶל־בְּנֵ֣י יִשְׂרָאֵל֒ יְהֹוָ֞ה אֱלֹהֵ֣י אֲבֹתֵיכֶ֗ם אֱלֹהֵ֨י אַבְרָהָ֜ם אֱלֹהֵ֥י יִצְחָ֛ק וֵאלֹהֵ֥י יַעֲקֹ֖ב שְׁלָחַ֣נִי אֲלֵיכֶ֑ם זֶה־שְּׁמִ֣י לְעֹלָ֔ם וְזֶ֥ה זִכְרִ֖י לְדֹ֥ר דֹּֽר׃ And God said further to Moses, “Thus shall you speak to the Israelites: יהוה,*יהוה This name (y-h-w-h; traditionally read Adonai “the Lord”) is here associated with the verb hayah “to be.” the God of your fathers’ [house]—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you:
This shall be My name forever,
This My appellation for all eternity.

click here: Exodus 3:15 with Connections (sefaria.org)

Therefore, what do Jews say for יהוה?

 

[rosends]

No, I meant that when Jews are reciting or reading the Torah to their children and when they come across a scripture such as Exodus 3:15.

If one is reading simply to explain, we say Hashem. If one is reading to teach how to chant for religious ritual, we use the word adonai.

 

[YoursTrue]

If one is reading simply to explain, we say Hashem. If one is reading to teach how to chant for religious ritual, we use the word adonai.

Except they mean two different things literally. Hashem is the Name, isn't it? And adonai is Lord. Even IF adonai covers up the tetragrammton in many translations of the scriptures, right?

 

[rosends]

Except they mean two different things literally. Hashem is the Name, isn't it? And adonai is Lord. Even IF adonai covers up the tetragrammton in many translations of the scriptures, right?

Hashem means "the name" so we use it to point out that what is there is the four letter name without sayi g the name. Adonai is a special vo strict which we use to inficate the 4 letter name in sacred Contexts. It isn't about covering anything up.

 

[YoursTrue]

Hashem means "the name" so we use it to point out that what is there is the four letter name without sayi g the name. Adonai is a special vo strict which we use to inficate the 4 letter name in sacred Contexts. It isn't about covering anything up.

I see it as covering up because Lord (adonai) is not what is there in the texts as written in Hebrew when the divine name of God is written out in Hebrew letters. Adonai is a different word and means lord. And many non-Jewish translations go along with the practice of not even writing out the letters of the Tetragrammaton but instead put in the Lord (usually in capital letters signifying it to be a really bad translation anyway, misleading).

 

[David Davidovich]

Hashem means "the name" so we use it to point out that what is there is the four letter name without sayi g the name. Adonai is a special vo strict which we use to inficate the 4 letter name in sacred Contexts. It isn't about covering anything up.

So, when teaching your children the Torah, are they explained that יהוה is substituted for the word Hashem?

 

[David Davidovich]

I have another related question for Torath Mosheh Jews/Orthodox Jews concerning Jesus' usage of the Tetragrammaton. And I think that it is a very logical question: Since Jesus was a practicing Torah-observing Jew, as a Torath Mosheh Jew/Orthodox Jew, do you think that Jesus would not have literally pronounced יהוה as it was the custom of Jews during that time not to have?

In this the English versions are following an ancient tradition, which was also observed by the writers of the New Testament. Long before the birth of Christ it had become customary among Jews to avoid pronouncing the sacred Name by substituting אֲדֹנָי (Adonai, meaning “Lord”) for יהוה when the Hebrew text was read aloud, and the Greek equivalent to this is κύριος. And so we find in the Greek New Testament κύριος used in quotations from the Old Testament, where the Hebrew has יהוה.

Why did the Jews avoid saying the Name? Many have described this as a kind of superstitious taboo, but the custom probably sprung from a proper and salutary instinct of reverence. In all times and places, people have used titles rather than names when speaking of persons in authority. Every child knows better than to call his father by his name. Another consideration is that, during the Exile, the Jews had to live among Gentiles who might speak disrespectfully about the Holy One of Israel, and it would have been especially hard for the Jews to tolerate such blasphemy if the very Name of God were used. So it would be best if the Gentiles did not even know it. Another problem was the opposite tendency of some to invoke the Name presumptuously in magical spells, as if they could control God by uttering his name. We know that this was very commonly done with the names of deities in ancient times. There was also an entirely legitimate concern to keep people from violating the commandment against “taking the name of the Lord in vain” in oaths and curses. The prohibition of speaking the Name would have served all these good purposes.

click here: The Translation of the Tetragrammaton (bible-researcher.com)

 

[rosends]

I see it as covering up because Lord (adonai) is not what is there in the texts as written in Hebrew when the divine name of God is written out in Hebrew letters. Adonai is a different word and means lord. And many non-Jewish translations go along with the practice of not even writing out the letters of the Tetragrammaton but instead put in the Lord (usually in capital letters signifying it to be a really bad translation anyway, misleading).

We don't see it as covering up anything because the written text still has the 4 letter name. It is simply a function of respect in our speech.

 

[rosends]

So, when teaching your children the Torah, are they explained that יהוה is substituted for the word Hashem?

Hashem is substituted for the 4 letter name. Some people use adoshem which combines part of the adonai and part of hashem. But yes, we explain as part of the education.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

I have another related question for Torath Mosheh Jews/Orthodox Jews concerning Jesus' usage of the Tetragrammaton. And I think that it is a very logical question: Since Jesus was a practicing Torah-observing Jew, as a Torath Mosheh Jew/Orthodox Jew, do you think that Jesus would not have literally pronounced יהוה as it was the custom of Jews during that time not to have?

The problem with the question is that there is evidence that the "historical" jesus or the Jewish indivitual who inspired the jesus story was a "Torath Mosheh Jews." There are some sources that state that "initially" the "historical" Jew that the jesus character of the NT was based on "may have" kept the Torah - potentially in his youth. Yet, according to accounts of his later life he was not considered a Torath Mosheh Jew. According to Jewish accounts, near the end of his life he was considered what we call a (מין) or a (אפיקורס) both of these are Jews who go against a foundation of the Torah, in one way or another, in a way where they have no place in the world to come.

This is assuming that the jesus stories of the NT were created around one individual rather than several of them that later christians combined into one story.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

So, when teaching your children the Torah, are they explained that יהוה is substituted for the word Hashem?

They are taught the following:

1. How the Hebrew langauge works.
2. The proper pronuciation of the text.
3. In terms Yod-Hey-Waw-Hey they are taught to state Adonai when reading it. See the below video.
4. They are taught to say Hashem in regular conversation with the following caviats.
   • In regular conversations besides Hashem there are other terms that are used such as HaQadosh Baruch Hu which means "The setapart One Blessed is He."

Even bigger than the above, Torath Mosheh Jewish children are taught why we don't "attempt" to "pronounce" Yod-Hey-Waw-Hey for the reasons given earlier that a) the Name of Hashem is not simple a pronounciation of letters and vowels, b) because Torath Mosheh Jews have accepted a higher standard of respect and treatment of the Torah that our ancestors were given, and c) the knowledge that currently no one can prove unquivically how is "correctly" pronounced.

 

[YoursTrue]

We don't see it as covering up anything because the written text still has the 4 letter name. It is simply a function of respect in our speech.

You see it your way, I see it as another way and disrespect when substitutions are there. But that's me and just as God made the decision in the wilderness with Korah and Dathan, and also approaching Moses, you have your ways and they are not the way I go with about the name of God. So in the end, God will make HIS will decisively decided.

 

[YoursTrue]

They are taught the following:

1. How the Hebrew langauge works.
2. The proper pronuciation of the text.
3. In terms Yod-Hey-Waw-Hey they are taught to state Adonai when reading it. See the below video.
4. They are taught to say Hashem in regular conversation with the following caviats.
   • In regular conversations besides Hashem there are other terms that are used such as HaQadosh Baruch Hu which means "The setapart One Blessed is He."

Even bigger than the above, Torath Mosheh Jewish children are taught why we don't "attempt" to "pronounce" Yod-Hey-Waw-Hey for the reasons given earlier that a) the Name of Hashem is not simple a pronounciation of letters and vowels, b) because Torath Mosheh Jews have accepted a higher standard of respect and treatment of the Torah that our ancestors were given, and c) the knowledge that currently no one can prove unquivically how is "correctly" pronounced.

It's not respect. That is, even to say adonai is in a similar vein if one knows who is being referred to. Psalm 83 verse 18 makes this also clear, depending which arrangement of scripture one uses. Anyway, have a good one.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

It's not respect. That is, even to say adonai is in a similar vein if one knows who is being referred to. Psalm 83 verse 18 makes this also clear, depending which arrangement of scripture one uses. Anyway, have a good one.

Your interpretation is one you learned from JW leaders and not from the reading the actual Hebrew text. You are free to have the one you learned from JW leaders and I am free to have the instruction that Mosheh ben-Amram taught to Torath Mosheh Jews.

 

[rosends]

You see it your way, I see it as another way and disrespect when substitutions are there. But that's me and just as God made the decision in the wilderness with Korah and Dathan, and also approaching Moses, you have your ways and they are not the way I go with about the name of God. So in the end, God will make HIS will decisively decided.

But if you accept all the rest (the events in the Torah and its laws), then you should accept the Jewish law and tradition about this. But since you are not Jewish, what you decide to do with the name is irrelevant.

 

[YoursTrue]

But if you accept all the rest (the events in the Torah and its laws), then you should accept the Jewish law and tradition about this. But since you are not Jewish, what you decide to do with the name is irrelevant.

Regardless of who I am, it is apparent from the Bible that the name of God is important to Him. Accordingly, Psalm 83:18 or 19 depending on translation, brings out:

King James Bible
That men may know that thou, whose name alone is JEHOVAH, art the most high over all the earth.
(a better translation than most)

As you likely know, LORD (adonai) in Hebrew is not written as YHWH, and YHWH is not properly translated as LORD. "That men may know"

וְיֵדְעוּ-- כִּי-אַתָּה שִׁמְךָ יְהוָה לְבַדֶּךָ:
עֶלְיוֹן, עַל-כָּל-הָאָרֶץ.