What is Perfect?

[Exaltist Ethan]

This should be quite an interesting topic to discuss. As you may know by now I believe in Exaltism, and try to raise the honor of my family and friends. It seems like every time I talk about God, however, I throw in the word perfect. Why? Because it seems like every religion admits that God is perfect. According to Christianity, they say Jesus is perfect. According to Muslims, God is perfect, and not Muhammad, but Muhammad was the last prophet of a perfect God.

So where does that leave atheists and agnostics? If we apply the same logic, is it then impossible for an atheist to believe in perfection? And how about agnostics? Do agnostics believe that what is perfect is unknowable to themselves and others? And how about the anti-theists? Are they against perfection? I surely know what's perfect for myself. I've spent my entire life trying to make my life more perfect than it was in the past. And while I don't have the standard typical family, car or job I've taken what I've could, built up the most capital I've been able to while being on welfare and did the most things I could due to my mental illness.

I view theology like a perfect Spotify playlist. Some people have one perfect playlist they listen to over and over. Others have many. Some playlists have a thousand songs, others have ten. So while I view divinity as completely subjective in the needs and hands of others, I sincerely believe that things can improve and get better. I spend a lot of time creating Spotify playlists, making them perfect to listen to, publicize them and then I'll put them on shuffle. I'll spend hours crafting playlists and then spend hours listening to my creations.

Is there a perfect Spotify playlist? There are certain playlists that are perfect for me at almost any time of day, and I listen to them routinely. But for other people their perfect Spotify playlist would contain different music or be on a different service, like Deezer or Apple Music. And some people don't listen to music at all or are deaf.

To me what is perfect isn't necessarily the person but the environment they exist in. I live in poverty but I did my best to advocate for myself to put me in the best place I could thrive in: the suburbs. Most people I know in my complex are old and poor, but they're good people nonetheless trying to make their lives better before they pass away. There is low crime where I live, but I still live in an area which allows me access to my basic needs and healthcare when I need it.

If God is perfection, and what that perfection means to people can be different, then people are going to have different views of what God is. The atheist tends to be unassuming of what perfection means, or rather not to believe in perfection at all. And in Christianity there are "born again experiences" and "entire sanctification" moments that appear to me to be sacrilegious from a Christian standpoint because if you are entirely sanctified then why does that person still need Jesus? That's always confused me.

And yes, I recently changed my religious status from "Exaltism" to "Perfectionism", mostly because I was reading up what a perfectionist is, from a psychological standpoint and if it matches up with me very well from a theological standpoint as well. I want things to be perfect. And I'm trying my best to achieve those results for me in my life currently. I've learned things even recently, like drinking caffeine just before going to sleep is awful not because I can't sleep, but because the quality of sleep diminishes.

I believe that life is one big moment happening right now, weaving in and out of the good and the bad. Somethings get better, somethings get worse but it's up to all of us to find what works best for our current situations. Is my life perfect? No, far from it, but I know my limitations and how much I'm able to do as well. I know for a fact that if I go back to college now because my local community college now offers free tuition, I will fail miserably so I avoid taking it up. I prefer to be autodidactic anyways and learn what is important to me.

The atheist comedians and scientists that have been around for a long time, people like the late Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin, seem to be very negative to me and can't imagine anything the might be perfect. Whether it's a perfect past, present or future. I have a bias against atheism because I see them as pessimistic and nihilistic. I have an antitheist friend who brings himself down constantly because he can't imagine anything worth any amount of value to himself. But at the same time the way Christians view perfection, it's only accruable towards their own self-interest.

So where does that leave me and my theology? Maybe the Gods in various religions aren't perfect. Maybe the Abrahamic model is flawed and the God of these religions actually do more harm than good. In fact, according to the Bible, God killed millions of people. I don't see a consistent logical argument from that standpoint that also believes that God is perfect.

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Is anything truly perfect? I would argue that perfection does exist - but is always changing. And is completely subjective at the same time. I might listen to Pandora or Sirius XM, find the new killer song that I like, and then add it to my perfect Spotify playlists. But to say that perfection doesn't exist shows that there's nothing to strive for throughout our lives. I sincerely and deeply hope that whatever your theological view points are, you look for something that is better than what you currently have right now and you obtain it. Whether that is seeking a perfect being, being perfect yourself or finding a perfect environment for you to live in.

How would you answer this question? To you, what is perfect and how do we achieve it? Is looking for perfection in ourselves, in our environments and others fruitful or a waste of time? Let me know what you think below.

P.S.

I always strive for perfect communication, especially on thread starters such as this one. I read many of my posts before I finish them and edit them accordingly. While there may not be a perfect thread or topic there are certainly ones that have longer or more fruitful discussions than others, wouldn't you agree? That's why I think about what I write typically before I write it rather than just post whatever is on my mind. And also: people can have favorites too. And who knows, with enough discussion this thread could be your favorite thread some day in the near future. But is this thread perfect? That's up for you decide.

 

[We Never Know]

This should be quite an interesting topic to discuss. As you may know by now I believe in Exaltism, and try to raise the honor of my family and friends. It seems like every time I talk about God, however, I throw in the word perfect. Why? Because it seems like every religion admits that God is perfect. According to Christianity, they say Jesus is perfect. According to Muslims, God is perfect, and not Muhammad, but Muhammad was the last prophet of a perfect God.

So where does that leave atheists and agnostics? If we apply the same logic, is it then impossible for an atheist to believe in perfection? And how about agnostics? Do agnostics believe that what is perfect is unknowable to themselves and others? And how about the anti-theists? Are they against perfection? I surely know what's perfect for myself. I've spent my entire life trying to make my life more perfect than it was in the past. And while I don't have the standard typical family, car or job I've taken what I've could, built up the most capital I've been able to while being on welfare and did the most things I could due to my mental illness.

I view theology like a perfect Spotify playlist. Some people have one perfect playlist they listen to over and over. Others have many. Some playlists have a thousand songs, others have ten. So while I view divinity as completely subjective in the needs and hands of others, I sincerely believe that things can improve and get better. I spend a lot of time creating Spotify playlists, making them perfect to listen to, publicize them and then I'll put them on shuffle. I'll spend hours crafting playlists and then spend hours listening to my creations.

Is there a perfect Spotify playlist? There are certain playlists that are perfect for me at almost any time of day, and I listen to them routinely. But for other people their perfect Spotify playlist would contain different music or be on a different service, like Deezer or Apple Music. And some people don't listen to music at all or are deaf.

To me what is perfect isn't necessarily the person but the environment they exist in. I live in poverty but I did my best to advocate for myself to put me in the best place I could thrive in: the suburbs. Most people I know in my complex are old and poor, but they're good people nonetheless trying to make their lives better before they pass away. There is low crime where I live, but I still live in an area which allows me access to my basic needs and healthcare when I need it.

If God is perfection, and what that perfection means to people can be different, then people are going to have different views of what God is. The atheist tends to be unassuming of what perfection means, or rather not to believe in perfection at all. And in Christianity there are "born again experiences" and "entire sanctification" moments that appear to me to be sacrilegious from a Christian standpoint because if you are entirely sanctified then why does that person still need Jesus? That's always confused me.

And yes, I recently changed my religious status from "Exaltism" to "Perfectionism", mostly because I was reading up what a perfectionist is, from a psychological standpoint and if it matches up with me very well from a theological standpoint as well. I want things to be perfect. And I'm trying my best to achieve those results for me in my life currently. I've learned things even recently, like drinking caffeine just before going to sleep is awful not because I can't sleep, but because the quality of sleep diminishes.

I believe that life is one big moment happening right now, weaving in and out of the good and the bad. Somethings get better, somethings get worse but it's up to all of us to find what works best for our current situations. Is my life perfect? No, far from it, but I know my limitations and how much I'm able to do as well. I know for a fact that if I go back to college now because my local community college now offers free tuition, I will fail miserably so I avoid taking it up. I prefer to be autodidactic anyways and learn what is important to me.

The atheist comedians and scientists that have been around for a long time, people like the late Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin, seem to be very negative to me and can't imagine anything the might be perfect. Whether it's a perfect past, present or future. I have a bias against atheism because I see them as pessimistic and nihilistic. I have an antitheist friend who brings himself down constantly because he can't imagine anything worth any amount of value to himself. But at the same time the way Christians view perfection, it's only accruable towards their own self-interest.

So where does that leave me and my theology? Maybe the Gods in various religions aren't perfect. Maybe the Abrahamic model is flawed and the God of these religions actually do more harm than good. In fact, according to the Bible, God killed millions of people. I don't see a consistent logical argument from that standpoint that also believes that God is perfect.

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Is anything truly perfect? I would argue that perfection does exist - but is always changing. And is completely subjective at the same time. I might listen to Pandora or Sirius XM, find the new killer song that I like, and then add it to my perfect Spotify playlists. But to say that perfection doesn't exist shows that there's nothing to strive for throughout our lives. I sincerely and deeply hope that whatever your theological view points are, you look for something that is better than what you currently have right now and you obtain it. Whether that is seeking a perfect being, being perfect yourself or finding a perfect environment for you to live in.

How would you answer this question? To you, what is perfect and how do we achieve it? Is looking for perfection in ourselves, in our environments and others fruitful or a waste of time? Let me know what you think below.

P.S.

I always strive for perfect communication, especially on thread starters such as this one. I read many of my posts before I finish them and edit them accordingly. While there may not be a perfect thread or topic there are certainly ones that have longer or more fruitful discussions than others, wouldn't you agree? That's why I think about what I write typically before I write it rather than just post whatever is on my mind. And also: people can have favorites too. And who knows, with enough discussion this thread could be your favorite thread some day in the near future. But is this thread perfect? That's up for you decide.

Perfection is in the eye of the beholder, IOW,, it is a matter of personal opinion

 

[JustGeorge]

Cats and cake.

 

[We Never Know]

Cats and cake.

Dogs and brownies

 

[JustGeorge]

Dogs and brownies

Those are nice, too.

 

[Stevicus]

This should be quite an interesting topic to discuss. As you may know by now I believe in Exaltism, and try to raise the honor of my family and friends. It seems like every time I talk about God, however, I throw in the word perfect. Why? Because it seems like every religion admits that God is perfect. According to Christianity, they say Jesus is perfect. According to Muslims, God is perfect, and not Muhammad, but Muhammad was the last prophet of a perfect God.

So where does that leave atheists and agnostics? If we apply the same logic, is it then impossible for an atheist to believe in perfection? And how about agnostics? Do agnostics believe that what is perfect is unknowable to themselves and others? And how about the anti-theists? Are they against perfection? I surely know what's perfect for myself. I've spent my entire life trying to make my life more perfect than it was in the past. And while I don't have the standard typical family, car or job I've taken what I've could, built up the most capital I've been able to while being on welfare and did the most things I could due to my mental illness.

I view theology like a perfect Spotify playlist. Some people have one perfect playlist they listen to over and over. Others have many. Some playlists have a thousand songs, others have ten. So while I view divinity as completely subjective in the needs and hands of others, I sincerely believe that things can improve and get better. I spend a lot of time creating Spotify playlists, making them perfect to listen to, publicize them and then I'll put them on shuffle. I'll spend hours crafting playlists and then spend hours listening to my creations.

Is there a perfect Spotify playlist? There are certain playlists that are perfect for me at almost any time of day, and I listen to them routinely. But for other people their perfect Spotify playlist would contain different music or be on a different service, like Deezer or Apple Music. And some people don't listen to music at all or are deaf.

To me what is perfect isn't necessarily the person but the environment they exist in. I live in poverty but I did my best to advocate for myself to put me in the best place I could thrive in: the suburbs. Most people I know in my complex are old and poor, but they're good people nonetheless trying to make their lives better before they pass away. There is low crime where I live, but I still live in an area which allows me access to my basic needs and healthcare when I need it.

If God is perfection, and what that perfection means to people can be different, then people are going to have different views of what God is. The atheist tends to be unassuming of what perfection means, or rather not to believe in perfection at all. And in Christianity there are "born again experiences" and "entire sanctification" moments that appear to me to be sacrilegious from a Christian standpoint because if you are entirely sanctified then why does that person still need Jesus? That's always confused me.

And yes, I recently changed my religious status from "Exaltism" to "Perfectionism", mostly because I was reading up what a perfectionist is, from a psychological standpoint and if it matches up with me very well from a theological standpoint as well. I want things to be perfect. And I'm trying my best to achieve those results for me in my life currently. I've learned things even recently, like drinking caffeine just before going to sleep is awful not because I can't sleep, but because the quality of sleep diminishes.

I believe that life is one big moment happening right now, weaving in and out of the good and the bad. Somethings get better, somethings get worse but it's up to all of us to find what works best for our current situations. Is my life perfect? No, far from it, but I know my limitations and how much I'm able to do as well. I know for a fact that if I go back to college now because my local community college now offers free tuition, I will fail miserably so I avoid taking it up. I prefer to be autodidactic anyways and learn what is important to me.

The atheist comedians and scientists that have been around for a long time, people like the late Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin, seem to be very negative to me and can't imagine anything the might be perfect. Whether it's a perfect past, present or future. I have a bias against atheism because I see them as pessimistic and nihilistic. I have an antitheist friend who brings himself down constantly because he can't imagine anything worth any amount of value to himself. But at the same time the way Christians view perfection, it's only accruable towards their own self-interest.

So where does that leave me and my theology? Maybe the Gods in various religions aren't perfect. Maybe the Abrahamic model is flawed and the God of these religions actually do more harm than good. In fact, according to the Bible, God killed millions of people. I don't see a consistent logical argument from that standpoint that also believes that God is perfect.

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Is anything truly perfect? I would argue that perfection does exist - but is always changing. And is completely subjective at the same time. I might listen to Pandora or Sirius XM, find the new killer song that I like, and then add it to my perfect Spotify playlists. But to say that perfection doesn't exist shows that there's nothing to strive for throughout our lives. I sincerely and deeply hope that whatever your theological view points are, you look for something that is better than what you currently have right now and you obtain it. Whether that is seeking a perfect being, being perfect yourself or finding a perfect environment for you to live in.

How would you answer this question? To you, what is perfect and how do we achieve it? Is looking for perfection in ourselves, in our environments and others fruitful or a waste of time? Let me know what you think below.

P.S.

I always strive for perfect communication, especially on thread starters such as this one. I read many of my posts before I finish them and edit them accordingly. While there may not be a perfect thread or topic there are certainly ones that have longer or more fruitful discussions than others, wouldn't you agree? That's why I think about what I write typically before I write it rather than just post whatever is on my mind. And also: people can have favorites too. And who knows, with enough discussion this thread could be your favorite thread some day in the near future. But is this thread perfect? That's up for you decide.

I suppose perfection would entail no flaws or errors of any kind. A perfect score on a test. A perfect game in baseball.

Of course, you can't go through an entire life perfectly. You might spill a cup of water or get some food on your shirt; "nobody's perfect," as they say. Make a typo or a grammatical error, and a life of perfection has gone totally down the drain.

 

[Balthazzar]

This should be quite an interesting topic to discuss. As you may know by now I believe in Exaltism, and try to raise the honor of my family and friends. It seems like every time I talk about God, however, I throw in the word perfect. Why? Because it seems like every religion admits that God is perfect. According to Christianity, they say Jesus is perfect. According to Muslims, God is perfect, and not Muhammad, but Muhammad was the last prophet of a perfect God.

So where does that leave atheists and agnostics? If we apply the same logic, is it then impossible for an atheist to believe in perfection? And how about agnostics? Do agnostics believe that what is perfect is unknowable to themselves and others? And how about the anti-theists? Are they against perfection? I surely know what's perfect for myself. I've spent my entire life trying to make my life more perfect than it was in the past. And while I don't have the standard typical family, car or job I've taken what I've could, built up the most capital I've been able to while being on welfare and did the most things I could due to my mental illness.

I view theology like a perfect Spotify playlist. Some people have one perfect playlist they listen to over and over. Others have many. Some playlists have a thousand songs, others have ten. So while I view divinity as completely subjective in the needs and hands of others, I sincerely believe that things can improve and get better. I spend a lot of time creating Spotify playlists, making them perfect to listen to, publicize them and then I'll put them on shuffle. I'll spend hours crafting playlists and then spend hours listening to my creations.

Is there a perfect Spotify playlist? There are certain playlists that are perfect for me at almost any time of day, and I listen to them routinely. But for other people their perfect Spotify playlist would contain different music or be on a different service, like Deezer or Apple Music. And some people don't listen to music at all or are deaf.

To me what is perfect isn't necessarily the person but the environment they exist in. I live in poverty but I did my best to advocate for myself to put me in the best place I could thrive in: the suburbs. Most people I know in my complex are old and poor, but they're good people nonetheless trying to make their lives better before they pass away. There is low crime where I live, but I still live in an area which allows me access to my basic needs and healthcare when I need it.

If God is perfection, and what that perfection means to people can be different, then people are going to have different views of what God is. The atheist tends to be unassuming of what perfection means, or rather not to believe in perfection at all. And in Christianity there are "born again experiences" and "entire sanctification" moments that appear to me to be sacrilegious from a Christian standpoint because if you are entirely sanctified then why does that person still need Jesus? That's always confused me.

And yes, I recently changed my religious status from "Exaltism" to "Perfectionism", mostly because I was reading up what a perfectionist is, from a psychological standpoint and if it matches up with me very well from a theological standpoint as well. I want things to be perfect. And I'm trying my best to achieve those results for me in my life currently. I've learned things even recently, like drinking caffeine just before going to sleep is awful not because I can't sleep, but because the quality of sleep diminishes.

I believe that life is one big moment happening right now, weaving in and out of the good and the bad. Somethings get better, somethings get worse but it's up to all of us to find what works best for our current situations. Is my life perfect? No, far from it, but I know my limitations and how much I'm able to do as well. I know for a fact that if I go back to college now because my local community college now offers free tuition, I will fail miserably so I avoid taking it up. I prefer to be autodidactic anyways and learn what is important to me.

The atheist comedians and scientists that have been around for a long time, people like the late Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin, seem to be very negative to me and can't imagine anything the might be perfect. Whether it's a perfect past, present or future. I have a bias against atheism because I see them as pessimistic and nihilistic. I have an antitheist friend who brings himself down constantly because he can't imagine anything worth any amount of value to himself. But at the same time the way Christians view perfection, it's only accruable towards their own self-interest.

So where does that leave me and my theology? Maybe the Gods in various religions aren't perfect. Maybe the Abrahamic model is flawed and the God of these religions actually do more harm than good. In fact, according to the Bible, God killed millions of people. I don't see a consistent logical argument from that standpoint that also believes that God is perfect.

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Is anything truly perfect? I would argue that perfection does exist - but is always changing. And is completely subjective at the same time. I might listen to Pandora or Sirius XM, find the new killer song that I like, and then add it to my perfect Spotify playlists. But to say that perfection doesn't exist shows that there's nothing to strive for throughout our lives. I sincerely and deeply hope that whatever your theological view points are, you look for something that is better than what you currently have right now and you obtain it. Whether that is seeking a perfect being, being perfect yourself or finding a perfect environment for you to live in.

How would you answer this question? To you, what is perfect and how do we achieve it? Is looking for perfection in ourselves, in our environments and others fruitful or a waste of time? Let me know what you think below.

P.S.

I always strive for perfect communication, especially on thread starters such as this one. I read many of my posts before I finish them and edit them accordingly. While there may not be a perfect thread or topic there are certainly ones that have longer or more fruitful discussions than others, wouldn't you agree? That's why I think about what I write typically before I write it rather than just post whatever is on my mind. And also: people can have favorites too. And who knows, with enough discussion this thread could be your favorite thread some day in the near future. But is this thread perfect? That's up for you decide.

If I suggested that the mechanics of life are perfect, would you agree? Trial and error, success and progression, a constant reaching and effort to better our quality of life is typically how I understand the mechanics to work. In this sense, it's already perfect, just not always satisfactory in terms of quality. Individually speaking, I'm a loner who craves social interaction. Comfort zones are nice, but are they always beneficial for progress? How about stepping too far from those "comfort" zones and into much more turbulent waters? I guess we learn a different type of comfort in such cases. Also, life goals are appealing until our comfort zones get too depleted, then they become more about desperation and/or a source of failure, or a sense of. Is quitting an option? How about failure? No, we learn as we go and we end up where we need to be - if we have the opportunity to do so, and if not ... we survive. Somehow.

Beyond this, I couldn't comment on achievement and perfection. What's achievement anyway? I managed to pull myself out of bed this morning just to end up laying back down and sleeping all day. I achieved a nice "comfortable" day of rest, but then ... that's about all i was able to achieve - and sometimes that's more of an achievement (to some people) than banking a couple hundred thousand at the car lot within the same span of time. It's personal, as you suggested, and it changes as things change for us personally. Perfection I mean.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

This should be quite an interesting topic to discuss. As you may know by now I believe in Exaltism, and try to raise the honor of my family and friends. It seems like every time I talk about God, however, I throw in the word perfect. Why? Because it seems like every religion admits that God is perfect. According to Christianity, they say Jesus is perfect. According to Muslims, God is perfect, and not Muhammad, but Muhammad was the last prophet of a perfect God.

So where does that leave atheists and agnostics? If we apply the same logic, is it then impossible for an atheist to believe in perfection? And how about agnostics? Do agnostics believe that what is perfect is unknowable to themselves and others? And how about the anti-theists? Are they against perfection? I surely know what's perfect for myself. I've spent my entire life trying to make my life more perfect than it was in the past. And while I don't have the standard typical family, car or job I've taken what I've could, built up the most capital I've been able to while being on welfare and did the most things I could due to my mental illness.

I view theology like a perfect Spotify playlist. Some people have one perfect playlist they listen to over and over. Others have many. Some playlists have a thousand songs, others have ten. So while I view divinity as completely subjective in the needs and hands of others, I sincerely believe that things can improve and get better. I spend a lot of time creating Spotify playlists, making them perfect to listen to, publicize them and then I'll put them on shuffle. I'll spend hours crafting playlists and then spend hours listening to my creations.

Is there a perfect Spotify playlist? There are certain playlists that are perfect for me at almost any time of day, and I listen to them routinely. But for other people their perfect Spotify playlist would contain different music or be on a different service, like Deezer or Apple Music. And some people don't listen to music at all or are deaf.

To me what is perfect isn't necessarily the person but the environment they exist in. I live in poverty but I did my best to advocate for myself to put me in the best place I could thrive in: the suburbs. Most people I know in my complex are old and poor, but they're good people nonetheless trying to make their lives better before they pass away. There is low crime where I live, but I still live in an area which allows me access to my basic needs and healthcare when I need it.

If God is perfection, and what that perfection means to people can be different, then people are going to have different views of what God is. The atheist tends to be unassuming of what perfection means, or rather not to believe in perfection at all. And in Christianity there are "born again experiences" and "entire sanctification" moments that appear to me to be sacrilegious from a Christian standpoint because if you are entirely sanctified then why does that person still need Jesus? That's always confused me.

And yes, I recently changed my religious status from "Exaltism" to "Perfectionism", mostly because I was reading up what a perfectionist is, from a psychological standpoint and if it matches up with me very well from a theological standpoint as well. I want things to be perfect. And I'm trying my best to achieve those results for me in my life currently. I've learned things even recently, like drinking caffeine just before going to sleep is awful not because I can't sleep, but because the quality of sleep diminishes.

I believe that life is one big moment happening right now, weaving in and out of the good and the bad. Somethings get better, somethings get worse but it's up to all of us to find what works best for our current situations. Is my life perfect? No, far from it, but I know my limitations and how much I'm able to do as well. I know for a fact that if I go back to college now because my local community college now offers free tuition, I will fail miserably so I avoid taking it up. I prefer to be autodidactic anyways and learn what is important to me.

The atheist comedians and scientists that have been around for a long time, people like the late Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin, seem to be very negative to me and can't imagine anything the might be perfect. Whether it's a perfect past, present or future. I have a bias against atheism because I see them as pessimistic and nihilistic. I have an antitheist friend who brings himself down constantly because he can't imagine anything worth any amount of value to himself. But at the same time the way Christians view perfection, it's only accruable towards their own self-interest.

So where does that leave me and my theology? Maybe the Gods in various religions aren't perfect. Maybe the Abrahamic model is flawed and the God of these religions actually do more harm than good. In fact, according to the Bible, God killed millions of people. I don't see a consistent logical argument from that standpoint that also believes that God is perfect.

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Is anything truly perfect? I would argue that perfection does exist - but is always changing. And is completely subjective at the same time. I might listen to Pandora or Sirius XM, find the new killer song that I like, and then add it to my perfect Spotify playlists. But to say that perfection doesn't exist shows that there's nothing to strive for throughout our lives. I sincerely and deeply hope that whatever your theological view points are, you look for something that is better than what you currently have right now and you obtain it. Whether that is seeking a perfect being, being perfect yourself or finding a perfect environment for you to live in.

How would you answer this question? To you, what is perfect and how do we achieve it? Is looking for perfection in ourselves, in our environments and others fruitful or a waste of time? Let me know what you think below.

P.S.

I always strive for perfect communication, especially on thread starters such as this one. I read many of my posts before I finish them and edit them accordingly. While there may not be a perfect thread or topic there are certainly ones that have longer or more fruitful discussions than others, wouldn't you agree? That's why I think about what I write typically before I write it rather than just post whatever is on my mind. And also: people can have favorites too. And who knows, with enough discussion this thread could be your favorite thread some day in the near future. But is this thread perfect? That's up for you decide.

Obviously to become one with God would bring about perfection. God is perfect and has taught mankind they can become one with God if they love God with all their heart, all their mind, and all their soul.

I loved God so persistently,
I finally became God.
Little by little God drew nearer,
Slowly but slowly I passed away. - Sufi saying

 

[exchemist]

Cats and cake.

Just for you, one I made myself (Victoria sponge with raspberry jam):

P.S. Sorry about the Star Trek soft focus effect. I'm not trying to be romantic, it's just all the dust in my ancient iPhone.

 

[Brian2]

This should be quite an interesting topic to discuss. As you may know by now I believe in Exaltism, and try to raise the honor of my family and friends. It seems like every time I talk about God, however, I throw in the word perfect. Why? Because it seems like every religion admits that God is perfect. According to Christianity, they say Jesus is perfect. According to Muslims, God is perfect, and not Muhammad, but Muhammad was the last prophet of a perfect God.

So where does that leave atheists and agnostics? If we apply the same logic, is it then impossible for an atheist to believe in perfection? And how about agnostics? Do agnostics believe that what is perfect is unknowable to themselves and others? And how about the anti-theists? Are they against perfection? I surely know what's perfect for myself. I've spent my entire life trying to make my life more perfect than it was in the past. And while I don't have the standard typical family, car or job I've taken what I've could, built up the most capital I've been able to while being on welfare and did the most things I could due to my mental illness.

I view theology like a perfect Spotify playlist. Some people have one perfect playlist they listen to over and over. Others have many. Some playlists have a thousand songs, others have ten. So while I view divinity as completely subjective in the needs and hands of others, I sincerely believe that things can improve and get better. I spend a lot of time creating Spotify playlists, making them perfect to listen to, publicize them and then I'll put them on shuffle. I'll spend hours crafting playlists and then spend hours listening to my creations.

Is there a perfect Spotify playlist? There are certain playlists that are perfect for me at almost any time of day, and I listen to them routinely. But for other people their perfect Spotify playlist would contain different music or be on a different service, like Deezer or Apple Music. And some people don't listen to music at all or are deaf.

To me what is perfect isn't necessarily the person but the environment they exist in. I live in poverty but I did my best to advocate for myself to put me in the best place I could thrive in: the suburbs. Most people I know in my complex are old and poor, but they're good people nonetheless trying to make their lives better before they pass away. There is low crime where I live, but I still live in an area which allows me access to my basic needs and healthcare when I need it.

If God is perfection, and what that perfection means to people can be different, then people are going to have different views of what God is. The atheist tends to be unassuming of what perfection means, or rather not to believe in perfection at all. And in Christianity there are "born again experiences" and "entire sanctification" moments that appear to me to be sacrilegious from a Christian standpoint because if you are entirely sanctified then why does that person still need Jesus? That's always confused me.

And yes, I recently changed my religious status from "Exaltism" to "Perfectionism", mostly because I was reading up what a perfectionist is, from a psychological standpoint and if it matches up with me very well from a theological standpoint as well. I want things to be perfect. And I'm trying my best to achieve those results for me in my life currently. I've learned things even recently, like drinking caffeine just before going to sleep is awful not because I can't sleep, but because the quality of sleep diminishes.

I believe that life is one big moment happening right now, weaving in and out of the good and the bad. Somethings get better, somethings get worse but it's up to all of us to find what works best for our current situations. Is my life perfect? No, far from it, but I know my limitations and how much I'm able to do as well. I know for a fact that if I go back to college now because my local community college now offers free tuition, I will fail miserably so I avoid taking it up. I prefer to be autodidactic anyways and learn what is important to me.

The atheist comedians and scientists that have been around for a long time, people like the late Christopher Hitchens and George Carlin, seem to be very negative to me and can't imagine anything the might be perfect. Whether it's a perfect past, present or future. I have a bias against atheism because I see them as pessimistic and nihilistic. I have an antitheist friend who brings himself down constantly because he can't imagine anything worth any amount of value to himself. But at the same time the way Christians view perfection, it's only accruable towards their own self-interest.

So where does that leave me and my theology? Maybe the Gods in various religions aren't perfect. Maybe the Abrahamic model is flawed and the God of these religions actually do more harm than good. In fact, according to the Bible, God killed millions of people. I don't see a consistent logical argument from that standpoint that also believes that God is perfect.

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Is anything truly perfect? I would argue that perfection does exist - but is always changing. And is completely subjective at the same time. I might listen to Pandora or Sirius XM, find the new killer song that I like, and then add it to my perfect Spotify playlists. But to say that perfection doesn't exist shows that there's nothing to strive for throughout our lives. I sincerely and deeply hope that whatever your theological view points are, you look for something that is better than what you currently have right now and you obtain it. Whether that is seeking a perfect being, being perfect yourself or finding a perfect environment for you to live in.

How would you answer this question? To you, what is perfect and how do we achieve it? Is looking for perfection in ourselves, in our environments and others fruitful or a waste of time? Let me know what you think below.

P.S.

I always strive for perfect communication, especially on thread starters such as this one. I read many of my posts before I finish them and edit them accordingly. While there may not be a perfect thread or topic there are certainly ones that have longer or more fruitful discussions than others, wouldn't you agree? That's why I think about what I write typically before I write it rather than just post whatever is on my mind. And also: people can have favorites too. And who knows, with enough discussion this thread could be your favorite thread some day in the near future. But is this thread perfect? That's up for you decide.

Christians are sanctified, as in set apart as God's holy people but at the same time a Christian's whole life is spent being sanctified by God, and that sanctification is a process of being changed to be more like Jesus in our character.

 

[Balthazzar]

Christians are sanctified, as in set apart as God's holy people but at the same time a Christian's whole life is spent being sanctified by God, and that sanctification is a process of being changed to be more like Jesus in our character.

More like how? Like being honest?

 

[Balthazzar]

Obviously to become one with God would bring about perfection. God is perfect and has taught mankind they can become one with God if they love God with all their heart, all their mind, and all their soul.

I loved God so persistently,
I finally became God.
Little by little God drew nearer,
Slowly but slowly I passed away. - Sufi saying

No, not so obviously, being we already are one with God - Have you ever looked at something knowing you knew what was inside? Anything really - then go about your every day knowing what you knew and acting according to that knowing, just to later realize that what you knew wasn't knowing at all, but rather something you were told that you believed to be true, to later find out it wasn't and that you were either lied to or the ones who told you were wrong? That's how it works I think - It's not a necessarily bad thing, but rather it is a process of becoming more knowledgeable, and gaining an ability to divide facts from fiction, truth from lies. We will live blindly until the light of truth is sought over the darkness of misinformation and falsehoods. Truth is a much better guide than lies - that I view to be obvious, but not so much becoming one with God bringing about perfection. What is is and what isn't isn't -

Unawareness, unlearned, uneducated, unknowing to becoming aware, learned, educated, and knowledgeable. From boys to men - or maybe from babes to adults - Then again, I can never know perfectly. I can only be that persistent student, much like the one you quoted above in your post.

 

[syo]

Icecream.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

No, not so obviously, being we already are one with God - Have you ever looked at something knowing you knew what was inside? Anything really - then go about your every day knowing what you knew and acting according to that knowing, just to later realize that what you knew wasn't knowing at all, but rather something you were told that you believed to be true, to later find out it wasn't and that you were either lied to or the ones who told you were wrong? That's how it works I think - It's not a necessarily bad thing, but rather it is a process of becoming more knowledgeable, and gaining an ability to divide facts from fiction, truth from lies. We will live blindly until the light of truth is sought over the darkness of misinformation and falsehoods. Truth is a much better guide than lies - that I view to be obvious, but not so much becoming one with God bringing about perfection. What is is and what isn't isn't -

Unawareness, unlearned, uneducated, unknowing to becoming aware, learned, educated, and knowledgeable. From boys to men - or maybe from babes to adults - Then again, I can never know perfectly. I can only be that persistent student, much like the one you quoted above in your post.

It is true we and everything that exists in the universe is an expression of God, but you who identify with your body are not God, you must disappear in the experience of becoming one with God. In God there is no duality, no you and God, just God. Either God disappears or you do in union, we know which one does not disappear!

 

[Balthazzar]

It is true we and everything that exists in the universe is an expression of God, but you who identify with your body are not God, you must disappear in the experience of becoming one with God. In God there is no duality, no you and God, just God. Either God disappears or you do in union, we know which one does not disappear!

Interesting pov, duality and oneness, expressions and parts. It's all the same, one substance, one reality. Even so, as part of the whole, with specific function as that part or piece, I can no more give up my identity as - than I can deny belonging to. Temporal as I am, I exist as I am for a specific reason with specific duty, inherent only to myself as a uniquely functioning part of that whole. It's a personal relationship with life as I know it, with God as God is and as I am existing as a part of. I could follow your road map, but your roadmap is specific to you, just as my road mad is specific to me.

 

[ChristineM]

If we apply the same logic

But we don't. Atheiem does not have any truck with bronze age "i don't know so god" superstition so attempting to apply the believers ideas is a false dichotomy.

And trust me , i find plenty of perfection in a flower, a tree, an uninterrupted vista, good cooking, the human body. I dont need a god idea to ignore reality

 

[Brian2]

More like how? Like being honest?

In every way which is related to our moral character and getting to know Him better.
God does this in many ways through living in a Christian and allowing us to go through experiences through which He can teach us things about ourselves and about Himself.

 

[pearl]

But what I do see throughout my life is that humans, if they work together, find ways to make their lives and their loved ones lives better. From satisfying the basic needs for each other to finding new ways to enhance the experience of life we as humans are always looking for what is and can be perfect.

Isn't that what Jesus' teaching was all about, how to be perfectly human, not perfectly human?

 

[JustGeorge]

Just for you, one I made myself (Victoria sponge with raspberry jam):

View attachment 66283

P.S. Sorry about the Star Trek soft focus effect. I'm not trying to be romantic, it's just all the dust in my ancient iPhone.

That looks delicious! I hope you saved me a piece!

My camera on my phone is so blurry you can't take pictures at all with in anymore... but, between the two of us, my husband is more of the picture taker, so I don't worry about it.

 

[exchemist]

That looks delicious! I hope you saved me a piece!

My camera on my phone is so blurry you can't take pictures at all with in anymore... but, between the two of us, my husband is more of the picture taker, so I don't worry about it.

I cut it into slices which I wrap in pairs, nose to tail, and take to my father every week. He has it with his tea in the afternoons. I make one every week so I can easily save you some. Not sure how to get it to you, though. Perhaps when you come over for that wine drinking and peeing contest.............