What Is Jesus Waiting For?

[Subduction Zone]

Truthfully, although Danny1988 no doubt sees himself as one of god's favored few, I"m betting he'll end up right next us on god's late night . . . .

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LOL! Nothing infuriates a holier than thou Christian more than the fact that at best he will end up with the people that he hates.

 

[Danny1988]

You just said that God has already preordained who will repent and be saved, so their actions therefore are meaningless.


But who is obedient and who isn't is already pre-ordained by God, and those who rebel will never change. You just said that.


Except those people are preordained, so it's not a matter of choice. It's about whether God decided you should go to begin with, regardless of anything else.


They didn't choose to be predordained by God to be doomed to hell. So no, you're flat wrong there.

Either God preordains who goes to heaven or hell, or else it is a matter of choice. You cannot have it both ways.

No, you're trying to twist scripture to accuse God of being unjust.

All of humanity are wicked sinners, God chose to save some. Even though all deserve to go to hell He choose to save some, now how does that make God unfair. He didn't have to save any, for all had sinned and deserved judgement. So you should praise God for saving anyone, it shows His love and mercy.

The other thing is God never created anyone to commit sin and to deserve hell, they choose to sin in rebellion to God. They know it wrong but the make the choice to rebel against God and they choose to commit acts of evil in rebellion so they deserve everything they get.
God never forced them to sin they did it because they are wicked and the wicked must be cast into hell.

 

[RabbiO]

*this post was removed by the RF staff**

Now might be a good time for you to sit down and read the rules of the forum.

Have a glass of hot tea and a prune danish while you're reviewing them. Hopefully the tea and the pastry will calm you down.

You are on a debate forum. If you cannot handle the give and take on that kind of forum without immediately lashing out at members who disagree with you, without instantly calling the wrath of heaven down upon those whose ideas differ from your own, maybe this forum is not the best place for you.

 

[Danny1988]

Now might be a good time for you to sit down and read the rules of the forum.

Have a glass of hot tea and a prune danish while you're reviewing them. Hopefully the tea and the pastry will calm you down.

You are on a debate forum. If you cannot handle the give and take on that kind of forum without immediately lashing out at members who disagree with you, without instantly calling the wrath of heaven down upon those whose ideas differ from your own, maybe this forum is not the best place for you.

Excuse me Sir, have you taken the time to read what that gentleman said about my God. So according to you, it's OK for him to rubbish my God and I'm not allowed to defend Him using Bible truth. This is just further proof that Christ was right all along, that only a few will make it. The rest are you know what.

 

[Danny1988]

There is no need for me to lie. Why should I when the facts support me?

I am not the one that hates here.. You keep claiming that your God is an unjust and incompetent monster. Perhaps you should work on your logic skills a tad.

My God is an unjust and incompetent monster according to you, but thank God you're no authority on anything and you are only a self made expert on everything. You know everything about nothing, if you knew the truth you would speak the truth.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Excuse me Sir, have you taken the time to read what that gentleman said about my God. So according to you, it's OK for him to rubbish my God and I'm not allowed to defend Him using Bible truth. This is just further proof that Christ was right all along, that only a few will make it. The rest are you know what.

I have not "rubbished" your God. I have pointed out where you have done that. Once again you need to reason out your posts.

You can defend your posts, you can't claim that others are liars.

 

[Subduction Zone]

My God is an unjust and incompetent monster according to you, but thank God you're no authority on anything and you are only a self made expert on everything. You know everything about nothing, if you knew the truth you would speak the truth.

No, no, no, according to you. A being that tortures another forever for a very limited "crime" is a monster. A being that makes a flawed creation and then blames the beings he created and tortures them for his errors is an incompetent monster.

And no, I am not an expert. I could link the work of others to explain this to you, but it is rather self evident to anyone that can reason logically.

If I write computer program that crashes because of an error that I left in it, I am at fault. Not the program. If I make a car that fails under normal usage I am at fault, not the car. If something is "created" by a God and that creation fails due to an oversight by the creator then the creator is to blame and not the creation.

 

[Danny1988]

No, no, no, according to you. A being that tortures another forever for a very limited "crime" is a monster. A being that makes a flawed creation and then blames the beings he created and tortures them for his errors is an incompetent monster.

And no, I am not an expert. I could link the work of others to explain this to you, but it is rather self evident to anyone that can reason logically.

If I write computer program that crashes because of an error that I left in it, I am at fault. Not the program. If I make a car that fails under normal usage I am at fault, not the car. If something is "created" by a God and that creation fails due to an oversight by the creator then the creator is to blame and not the creation.

Your reasoning is fundamentally flawed, you fail to take into consideration that the car that God made is capable of going fast and the driver can abuse it's power and lose control and cause death or injury to himself and others.

Can we blame God for making the car capable of being used to commit acts of terror and running down people an killing them. You are blaming God for creating people with bodies which they can use to commit evil acts, you simply can't get away with such false accusations. You will be held accountable for what you did with your body, God judges everyone according to what they did.

God never created anyone to sin against Him, they chose to rebel against Him of their own volition so they will pay for their own crimes in hell. Nobody is forced to do anything, everyone chooses to do as they please, so they will suffer the penalty for their choice to commit crimes against God.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Your reasoning is fundamentally flawed, you fail to take into consideration that the car that God made is capable of going fast and the driver can abuse it's power and lose control and cause death or injury to himself and others.

Nope, you can't change analogies after the fact. God screwed up in your myth. He made man without the knowledge of right and wrong and then he punished them when they did wrong. In case you forgot the myth Adam and Eve instantly knew what they did wrong after the fact. That is a design error on your God's part. He was incompetent and then he punished his creation for his error.

Can we blame God for making the car capable of being used to commit acts of terror and running down people an killing them. You are blaming God for creating people with bodies which they can use to commit evil acts, you simply can't get away with such false accusations. You will be held accountable for what you did with your body, God judges everyone according to what they did.

Nope, I am blaming God for not putting in the proper sensors to tell the people when they were going to fast. Your God still fails.

God never created anyone to sin against Him, they chose to rebel against Him of their own volition so they will pay for their own crimes in hell. Nobody is forced to do anything, everyone chooses to do as they please, so they will suffer the penalty for their choice to commit crimes against God.

It is his fault that he did not think through his creation in the myth. In the law what he made was an attractive nuisance. He was at fault for his wrong doing.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Next you should learn why you call your version of God a liar.

 

[Danny1988]

Nope, you can't change analogies after the fact. God screwed up in your myth. He made man without the knowledge of right and wrong and then he punished them when they did wrong. In case you forgot the myth Adam and Eve instantly knew what they did wrong after the fact. That is a design error on your God's part. He was incompetent and then he punished his creation for his error.



Nope, I am blaming God for not putting in the proper sensors to tell the people when they were going to fast. Your God still fails.



It is his fault that he did not think through his creation in the myth. In the law what he made was an attractive nuisance. He was at fault for his wrong doing.

You forgot one small fact, God did not create robots. You're saying He should have created us all like robots, how pathetic is that idea?

 

[Subduction Zone]

You forgot one small fact, God did not create robots. You're saying He should have created us all like robots, how pathetic is that idea?

I am not saying that God had to create robots. The fact is that your version of God screwed up. He did not give Adam and Eve the ability to know right from wrong and then he punished them when they did wrong. That was a major error on his part.

Worse yet he punished their descendants when they had done nothing wrong.

The good news for you is that the Adam and Eve story is a myth. Your God, if he exists, is not as wicked as you claim that he is.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

No, you're trying to twist scripture to accuse God of being unjust.

I've done nothing other than repeat what YOU said.

All of humanity are wicked sinners, God chose to save some. Even though all deserve to go to hell He choose to save some, now how does that make God unfair.

Because God could easily choose to save all without any effort whatsoever, or make people not "deserve" to go to hell, or eliminate the concept of "sin" altogether, or not have created something that is inherently sinful.

He didn't have to save any, for all had sinned and deserved judgement. So you should praise God for saving anyone, it shows His love and mercy.

No, it show the madness of his concept.

The other thing is God never created anyone to commit sin and to deserve hell, they choose to sin in rebellion to God.

So God has no control or foresight over his creation?

They know it wrong but the make the choice to rebel against God and they choose to commit acts of evil in rebellion so they deserve everything they get.

According to you, whether or not they rebel is not up to them but is pre-ordained by God. There is no choice being made other than Gods. God decides who will rebel, and who will repent.

God never forced them to sin they did it because they are wicked and the wicked must be cast into hell.

Now you're contradicting yourself. Either God pre-ordained who will rebel and who will be saved, or else God does not pre-ordain any such thing. Which is it? You can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Desert Snake]

Seems to me you should be praying that Jesus doesn't return.

 

[viole]

I am happier just saying we don't know everything.

Including what God, if any, is there. However, evolution of man has lots evidence, any flavor of God does not have any. It is randomly selected depending on where people are born and where.

So, what is the rational thing to do?

Ciao

- viole

 

[ChanaR]

There is nothing more irritating than people who obsess about the hour of Yeshua's return when the sacred texts clearly state that even Yeshua doesn't know the day or the hour.

 

[The Anointed]

Including what God, if any, is there. However, evolution of man has lots evidence, any flavor of God does not have any. It is randomly selected depending on where people are born and where.

So, what is the rational thing to do?

Ciao

- viole

The space station and all its complex and intricate ground support systems, has evolved from the wheel, but only a fool would not realise that the billions of creations that followed the wheel leading up to the creation of the space station, were merely expressions of the height to which the mind of the creator of the wheel and the space station had evolved with each and every subsequent creation.

Would you deny that the space station that evolved from the wheel was created by intelligent design?

 

[viole]

The space station and all its complex and intricate ground support systems, has evolved from the wheel, but only a fool would not realise that the billions of creations that followed the wheel leading up to the creation of the space station, were merely expressions of the height to which the mind of the creator of the wheel and the space station had evolved with each and every subsequent creation.

Would you deny that the space station that evolved from the wheel was created by intelligent design?

Yes, but the space station is not designed to be safe from other space stations trying to eat it.

Consider a lion. If designed, then it is designed to be more effective than the design of the antelope. The latter being designed to escape the predator design of the lion.

So, your designer seems to like to play against Himself. Like those people playing chess against themselves.

Taken as a whole, we can conclude that if all this is really designed, then stupid design (SD) would be more appropriate than intelligent design (ID).

Don't you think so?

Ciao

- viole

 

[The Anointed]

Yes, but the space station is not designed to be safe from other space stations trying to eat it.

Consider a lion. If designed, then it is designed to be more effective than the design of the antelope. The latter being designed to escape the predator design of the lion.

So, your designer seems to like to play against Himself. Like those loons playing chess against themselves.

Taken as a whole, we can conclude that if all this is really designed, then stupid design (SD) would be more appropriate than intelligent design (ID).

Don't you think so?

Ciao

- viole

And I suppose you believe that a universe of mindless matter has produced beings on this earth, with intrinsic ends, self- replication capabilities, and “coded chemistry” in just 4.6 billion years.

And I bet that you believe this cosmos of today evolved over just one period of universal activity, and in a mere 14 billion years since the last event that is called the Big Bang.

But then you are entitled to believe whatsoever you choose to believe.

 

[viole]

And I suppose you believe that a universe of mindless matter has produced beings on this earth, with intrinsic ends, self- replication capabilities, and “coded chemistry” in just 4.6 billion years.

Of course I do not believe that. You need to believe things when you have no evidence.

And by the way, 4.6 billion years is very long. The low entropy energy injected by the sun could have allowed to run the whole course of evolution in a much shorter time.

And I bet that you believe this cosmos of today evolved over just one period of universal activity, and in a mere 14 billion years since the last event that is called the Big Bang.

Same thing. I do not believe it. I know it.

But then you are entitled to believe whatsoever you choose to believe.

Sure, but in this case it is not applicable. Since I don't choose facts.

Ciao

- viole