1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

What happens to us when we die, what is the afterlife?

Discussion in 'Theological Concepts' started by savethedreams, Feb 5, 2011.

  1. opuntia

    opuntia Religion is Law

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2006
    Messages:
    189
    Ratings:
    +15
    Whenever anyone passes on to the next life, they are shedding their physical clothes, i.e. the flesh. This human body acts as a shield or veil to that spiritual world. At times some do view that other world for their benefit or for others.

    I can say it is like this: We are conscious of our existence here and now, we can communicate with each other and acknowledge each other. That same alertness or consciousness will not go out like a flame of a candle at death but will actually increase in power and intensity simply because of our casting off of this fleshly veil. This body is subject to many ills such as hearing loss, muscle fatigue, memory impairment and so forth, but when we do not have the flesh to block our consciousness our awareness increases many-fold. Some people fear this idea because their lives may not have been exemplary or even good, that fear may be justified as we will be much more conscious of our memories at that place.
     
  2. ImmortalPhoenix

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2011
    Messages:
    170
    Ratings:
    +7
    If you read Near Death Experiencers (people who have died and come back to life) some mention meeting Being of light, and experiencing immense bliss and love. Others, mention some type of limbo darkness in which they are with other people in limbo pondering the cause and effect of their existence on earth. Others still, deep in darkness mention being attacked by dark humanoid figures that scratch, bite, and beat them.
    Very few (like two) mention fire and flames.

    Since these are accounts of people who have died and come back to life, I would take them seriously.
     
  3. AfterGlow

    AfterGlow Invisible Puffle

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2011
    Messages:
    403
    Ratings:
    +33
    I'm of the same opinion.

    Some people say that if there is an afterlife, then those who don't do the correct ritual, act the correct way or believe the correct thing won't get a good one. Which is all well and good, but since there are innumerable ideas on exactly what the afterlife is and how to get there, you might as well just be the best person you can be in this life and for this life, and not worry about the next (if there is one) because even if you do choose a set of religious beliefs to follow to get you into heaven (or whatever you call it), chances are they're the wrong ones anyway.
     
  4. ellenjanuary

    ellenjanuary Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Messages:
    2,245
    Ratings:
    +115
    Beyond the threshold of eternity is beauty for all...

    And I know, it ain't sitting well with those who feel the need for judgement - but hey! Dark Ages/Ended, we all tech-savvy now. And there is valid science to consider - for instance, Relativity. The freedom of motion allowed in "space" dimension is taxed by restriction in "time" dimension; the faster you go, the slower you know. This results in a phenomenon known as time dilation. And if you're not a techie, there is a more accessible facet to the consider - the difference between sixty minutes and an hour, like so:

    Which is longer? Sixty minutes with your peeps tossing suds playing left4dead, or an hour in line at the DMV? See? It's a matter of mass... when the senses are engaged, the wait has no weight. And the heavier your step towards the threshold, the more eternity looms.

    This is where sense gets uncommon. A person sees a dead body, and tries to run the sims without all the hardware! Tries to run an XP type operating system on an abacus, and wonders why all roads lead to fear... how about, we're animals? Animals survive, for when they know nothing else, they know fear; and that's the only result that can be derived from the mechanics! Diagnose my internet connection without my Hawking - and I ain't got no internet connection! Oh noes! Purgatory!

    But here's one. Where am I when you stop reading these words? In fact, where am I now? And where will I be, come thirteen thousand and three? Right here! This is us, this is we, this is life, afterlife, and death; and nowhere else. It is easy to forget, with all of our imagery, that the pigment of our simulations is bound to the canvas of being.

    Run the sims of non-being, see what kinda reports yer diagnostics spools; and if you are like nearly everyone I ever met, you'll get a senseless sense of things like - peace. Stillness. Love. Interconnectivity. And a whole lotta not-needing.

    And if that is too far meta from your physical, consider: the universe. Began with a bang? Made up of finite stuff? Finite space/finite time? Yet... we fear death... :D In itself, a clue to life; if one knew, adding to two would only produce three, then why the we? Why such an investment of entropy, life? Why such an investment of life, human? Why such a direction less path, evolution?

    Because every path in a finite universe - ends.

    Just the facts, Ma'am; no super in my natural... however, I did run some fly sims. As for NDEs; taken at face value they are worse than useless. They are, well, not natural. Debunker 1: On what equipment was the simulation run, if the body was dead? Debunker 2: And suppose one's "soul" was set to "record;" on what living equipment does run the file NDE.spooky? Someone wants to lie to me about death, all I gotta hear is, I remember... And I know this because I have my own NDEs... and the minute I "remembered," I corrupted the data set by running it on meatware. Besides, scope 'em out and compare; and all there is, is innuendo and agenda. The best test I have for a solid NDE is how the hardware responds to the NextDE... ten years back I got the first nine words, the three next - zero - cause there ain't no death.

    Death is an animal thing; while we still do not know, what is ellen, it ain't animal. :D
     
  5. St Giordano Bruno

    St Giordano Bruno Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,375
    Ratings:
    +73
    I subscribe to the concept that the brain is necessary for our sense of self, but it need not be necessarily be Jones's brain or Brown's brain, just a the brain in a generic sense. I think the self is an emergent property hightened complexity as the universe reaches a critical phase and the brain just happens to be the most complex known entity in the universe at its emergent anthropic phase in a spacio temporal locality 13.7 billion years after the big bang.

    So what do I think happens when one dies? I have a theory that although the memories of that person is permanantly extinguished, the principle which caused them to be born in the first place as the genetic informational software for the blueprint of the brain witin the universe's anthropic phase. So totally oblivious that you have already spent a life you switch to another brain and begin again exactly as if it is a first life experience. This will continue until you personally experience in life of every person that ever lived so in effect there is only the one self in the entire universe. Any more would only create unecessary complications in violation of Ochham's Razor.
     
  6. denodram

    denodram Level 1 Rogue

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    6
    Ratings:
    +0

    Near death experiences are hallucinations caused by the brain releasing DMT when it thinks its dying. If one uses the drug, they can have very similar experiences to talking to others in limbo or being attacked by dark figures.
     
  7. St Giordano Bruno

    St Giordano Bruno Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,375
    Ratings:
    +73
    Oh those tales of near death experiences I keep hearing. Boooorrrring!!!
     
  8. arun

    arun Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2010
    Messages:
    79
    Ratings:
    +4
    The website www.victorzammit.com has a lot of information on afterlife and also a million dollar challenge to disprove the evidence presented there.
    Here is a link from it >> VICTOR ZAMMIT -- The Book - 29. What happens When we Die?

    Another one is a site is about the different levels in afterlife >>New Maps of Heaven: The Conditions of Life on the Spirit Planes
     
  9. JamesYaqub

    JamesYaqub Nobody Special

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2010
    Messages:
    76
    Ratings:
    +9

    It is normal and common for us to view ourselves and to think of ourselves as human beings who have souls. We consider our identities to be body and personality only who, by the way, have souls. We are taught that the soul is the bit of us which lives on after death. Is a soul just a part in our body? No. Our souls have eternal lives on their own plane of existence and are only connected to bodies while incarnated. Further in most religions we are taught that reincarnation is a false doctrine. The fact is that Adam and Eve were created as souls. Were we taught that they sinned and had to come to Earth? False. They had to come here as part of the plan in the first place. The man who wrote that Biblical passage did not understand. God's purpose was, and still is, that they grow and mature by acquiring knowledge and experience until they finally possessed the degree of wisdom that God desired for them. The next is a key element. The spiritual universe is a not like the Earth. When there, in between physical lives, we may study and assimilate but only here on Earth can we be immersed in conflict and hardships which allow us to overcome through adversity. The Earth is a classroom. A temporary home to us in which we live in conditions which allow us to grow spiritually. The Earth is a place of opposites, of conflict. The spiritual universe is not. So the soul is created purposefully. It is ordained for us that we grow and eventually become "as gods" in our own rights. Eventually we achieve. Christianity refers to esoteric truth in exoteric terms by saying that we are eventually "saved". No matter.

    Before a lifetime on Earth we determine what things we want to learn and select parents and settings accordingly. We may well agree with our fellows to help each other. This is why we sometimes find a "soul mate" while here. This is literally true. Maybe a spouse, sibling or best friend. Rarely a parent. We connect with the unborn baby when the brain of the fetus is fully developed, not before. This is because each body has it's own personality which is a product of genetics and conditioning. The soul is nothing to do with the Earthly personality. The soul has to sync it's energies with the new brain. Usually this is fully achieved just before birth. Does a small child have "invisible an invisible friend"? Often. It often takes up to eight years for the soul and the personality to become "one". But what about the soul mind later during the rest of the personality's life? It is still there but in the background for the ordinary person. The only time the average human is aware of his/her soul is when moments of clear, intuitive thinking take place or when a "voice of conscience" makes itself known. These are times when we know about our souls. Our brains do the ordinary thinking. Abstract thought though is soul mind at work. This is not a product of the brain but only connects to it through certain areas like the pineal gland. We have grey matter wherein advanced memories which allow higher thinking are stored but those do not originate there. The brain does not originate higher thinking but only is aware of and stores results of it. A man/woman may interfere with soul purpose while here on Earth but there is nothing, absolutely nothing, a personality can do that will result in the eternal damnation of a soul. Nothing. Not even the soul that was Adolph Hitler is lost forever. Religions may say otherwise but they do not know any better. Even that soul will eventually be cleansed and returned to God's all forgiving presence.

    OK this's a little off topic. The post is about what happens after death. I wanted to give a little background first before addressing that.

    After death we return to our spiritual, soul, homes. The "place" we came from. We are reunited with our soul groups, our friends and guides. We continue with living. Specifically what happens at death depends on several things. Are we beginner souls with little experience or are we senior souls, tens of thousands of Earth years old with thousands of lifetimes behind us? Did we die peacefully in our sleep or in a sudden accident? Did we die in an act of violence such as in wartime? All these are germane.

    Mostly what happens is that we go to an area where we are met by past friends and our guide. They comfort us and reassure us that all is well. We feel a sublime sense of peace. This is because we have left the life of conflict behind. In our soul homes such things as anger and violence are impossible. Unlike on Earth it is impossible for us to associate with others with whom we are incompatible. Only on Earth can that happen. After we give in to the fact of it all we are taken, by our guides, to a place of cleansing. Here we are literally washed of all the negative vibes of the Earth. Now we continue on to the place in spirit where our soul group waits for us.

    We re-assume our living the eternal life. Next is that we review and judge ourselves. How did we do during the past life? In what areas did we succeed and where did we not do so well? God does not judge us. Each of us judges ourselves. We are much more judgmental and critical than God could ever be. Also, judging ourselves is good training on the road to wisdom. Remember that wisdom is the goal. It cannot be achieved by simply believing and being obedient to God. We have to learn the hard way or it all means nothing. A beginner soul may remain in spirit for several hundred Earth years before daring to come back to Earth. An advanced soul who wants to quicken it's pace returns right away most of the time. An interesting side note here is the relativity of time between the Earth plane and the soul plane. The soul plane, although a level in the spiritual universe, is not the highest. Far from it. At the highest plane there is no sensation of time at all. "God is". At the lowest, the physical, time rules our lives. From the vantage point of the Earth one hour is only a few seconds on the soul plane. Between the two, in the astral/emotional, that same hour is only about 45 minutes. The soul plane is kind of in between the Earth and the Divine. This is a workable way to think of it.

    Review... We live as souls and decide on what we must learn when we come to Earth for a lifetime. We are born. We live. We may or may not become aware of others whom we feel strangely bonded to. We don't know why. We may or may not have a strong conscience that keeps us "to the right" as the Christian hymn admonishes us to do. In these lives we experience all that the Earth has to offer. We live lives as all racial groups, male and female, short, tall, ugly, good looking, fat, skinny, smart, stupid, red neck, hippy, politician, bus driver, junk man, super rich banker, gay, straight....everything. Life is not unfair. Are we unlucky? Do we wonder why so much happens to us while others seem to have it so good? We set it all up so it would be that way. We did it to ourselves, not God. Is it tough? Yes it is. What will we do? Cave in and feel sorry for ourselves or will we get strong and overcome? Each of us has our own burden but remember that it is temporary only. The Earth is only where we come to get kicked around. When we have learned all the lessons we go home and never again have to come here. Note: advanced souls who have experienced the "salvation" of the Christian faith are those who have moved on from Earthly requirements. Some of them choose to stay on to help the rest of us still fighting it out on this planet. Jesus is one of these. So is Abraham, Moses and Muhammad. They are all advanced souls trying to help the rest of us.

    One last thought. We are not personalities. We are souls that use personalities for explicit purpose. When we die we take only the memory of the personality with us back to spirit. When in our soul homes we are able to remember all of the past lives and personalities that we have used but a soul does not "have" a personality like a body does. In this sense Christianity is correct. Personalities are not reborn. We, as personalities, do not reincarnate. It is the soul that projects itself time and again into personalities. When we can understand that the whole thing starts to make more sense. At some time we have to quit thinking of ourselves as personalities, stop identifying with the lower, and begin to live as souls. Holy men and women around the world have been doing just this since time began. We, too, will at some point make the move "towards the light".

    OK I'm going to stop here. I get a little long winded sometimes.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. JosephThomas

    JosephThomas Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    139
    Ratings:
    +3
    I have been down a tunnel. and at the end was all of eternity laid out before me. In that, I have concluded, that delusions are not worth burdening your time with, but instead trust in God and All things are possible int he elapse existence of Gods eternal presence, apart from any grief of over-joy or becoming numb with over-existing. Just trust.

    ALL things are made possible through God.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. Eliab ben Benjamin

    Eliab ben Benjamin Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2014
    Messages:
    1,000
    Ratings:
    +704
    Religion:
    Jewish
    Well visitor, Here is my life's most important experience, first the events leading up to it, my parents report of occurences while i was away, my NDE, and finally how i feel about it.

    [​IMG]
    Scene : 24/02/82, Newcastle Australia, 6;00 pm, Leaving my optical instrument repair firm to go home to Raymond Terrace, Raining after 3 months Dry, I was driving along the Industrial Highway and slowing to stop at lights where exit road from BHP crosses highway, memory ends.
    Reported by (my ex partner): As we approached the lights they changed to green, as we went into the crossing the car aquaplaned, speed 43 kph, we hit the large industrial power pole just after the intersection, Stuart, who was laying on the mattress in the back of the panel van, was thrown forward into the back of René's head, driving René into the steering wheel.

    Medical Info: Stuart's spine was broken T7,
    I suffered Fractures Basal area, Frontal Lobe, Right eye socket, Right Zygoma, all depressed, 6 holes in dura, also spokes of steering wheel and indicator entered throat up into roof of mouth, right upper and lower thorax. Miles suffered a small seat belt bruise.

    My Mother Reported that: In the afternoon of 25/02/82 they were in the office of Professor Buchalille (Professor of Neurosurgery) where the prof. was reporting my death and that they should be grateful, as i would have been a vegetable had i survived, during this conversation a young frightened Nurse came rushing into the office, blurting out "René is alive, it sat up and spoke!",
    the prof. chastised her for interrupting them 3 times before taking her outside and lecturing her about "dead bodies" moving and making noises, the Nurse was emphatic, "René sat up and said "Dont give me any more Drugs!"", at this point my mother took the prof. by one elbow, my father by his and marched them down the corridor to see, they found me in a back corridor where i had apparently been placed so the nurse could remove equipment prior to my transfer to the Morgue, i was in deep coma and breathing, I remained in coma for a further 10 days.

    [​IMG]
    My NDE: I don't know when in the above events my experience took place. I have no memory of the process of dying or leaving my body. I was moving head first thru a dark maelstrom of what looked like black boiling clouds, feeling that i was being beckoned to the sides which frightened me, ahead was a tiny dot of bright light which steadily grew and brightened as i drew nearer, i became aware that i must be dead and was concerned for Mum & Dad and my Sister, and somewhat upset with myself as i thought "they will soon get over it" like it was in passing just a fleeting thought as i rushed greedily forward towards this light.

    I arrived in an explosion of glorious light into a room with insubstantial walls, standing before a man about in his 30's about 6 foot tall, reddish brown shoulder length hair and an incredibly neat, short beard & mo., He wore a simple white robe, light seemed to emanate from Him and i felt He had great age and wisdom. He welcomed me with great Love, tranquillity, Peace (undescribable), no words, I felt " I can sit at your feet forever and be content", which struck me as a strange thing to think/say/feel, i became fascinated by the fabric of His robe, trying to figure out how light could be woven!

    He stood beside me and directed me to look to my left, where i was replaying my life's less complementary moments, i re-lived those moments and felt not only what i had done but also the hurt i had caused, some of the things i would have never imagined could have caused pain, i was surprised that some things i may have worried about, like shoplifting a chocolate as a child, were not there whilst casual remarks which caused hurt unknown to me at the time were counted, when i became burdened with guilt i was directed to other events which gave joy to others, although i felt unworthy it seemed the balance was in my favour, i received great Love.

    I was led further into the room, which became a hall and there coming towards me was my Grandfather, he looked younger than i remembered and was without his Hare lip or cleft pallet, but undoubtedly my grandfather, we hugged, he spoke to me and welcomed me, i was moved to forgive him for dying when i was 14 and making me break my promise, to become a Doctor and find a cure for his heart condition, until that moment i had not realized i had been angry at him!

    Grandad told me that Grandma was coming soon and he was looking forward to her arrival, i enquired why she was coming soon as she had been travelling from her home in Manchester, to NZ, To Miami for continual summer for a number of years! Grandad told me she had Cancer of the Bowel and was coming soon, Grandad seemed to have no grasp of time when i pressed for how soon. (Grandma was diagnosed 3 months later and died in August, I had upset my mother by telling her about it when i regained consciousness.), after Grandad and i had talked a while he took me further into the room which became a hall again, we approached a group of people whom i started to recognize.

    The Person who first welcomed me came and placed his hand on my shoulder and turned me towards Him, He said " You must return, you have a task to perform.", i wanted to argue, i wanted to stay, i glanced back at Grandad and was propelled quickly towards the entrance, at the threshold all became blackness, nothing, no awareness.

    After: I awoke from my coma slowly, over several days, half dreamed memories of familiar voices and glimpses of faces. The clearest moments were several occasions where i would awake from deep sleep to find a nurse with a syringe and refuse any Drugs, i have no idea why! I had three lots of surgery to repair my face, skull, eye socket.
    Left hospital with Pain, double vision, anosmia, and damage to 8th cranial nerve left me with nausea and disturbed balance. I was for two years angry at G-d, for sending me back in such torment, with a task to do with no clues or instructions, only one thing a clear message i have no idea how to pass on, which is :
    " It is time to live according to your Beliefs, whatever they may be, to put you House in order, For the End Times are upon us!" this can't be my task, there was no booming voice, or any way i know the message got there. I am also unsure of the identity of the gatekeeper, no name tag, no introduction!

    It took me 5 years as a zombie, before i was able to rehabilitate myself, I have gainful employment, formed the Head Injury Society NZ. in 1987, and am paraded as the example of how well it is possible to recover from Acquired Brain Damage. I still don't know my task, still have pain, anosmia, diplopia, etc.

    Thats about it, except to say that the memory of the NDE is more real than what i did yesterday.

    Shalom....
    Peace & Love
     
    • Like Like x 3
  12. Paranoid Android

    Paranoid Android Active Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2015
    Messages:
    942
    Ratings:
    +122
    Religion:
    Dementheologist


    I, unfortunately, have not. According to Dementheologist teachings, it is an eternal Now. The Now is what we experience when we meditate and preparatory to being in Heaven. In the Now, the future does not exist nor the past only the Now. For a short period, we can experience Heaven in the Now.
     
  13. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2009
    Messages:
    22,808
    Ratings:
    +8,445
    Religion:
    Zen Buddhism
    I'm not privy to coming back to a life of pain and suffering but I suppose it can't ever be helped. At least there is an equal chance of pleasant and calm experiences as well to be had in reasonable measure.
     
  14. Altfish

    Altfish Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2014
    Messages:
    7,736
    Ratings:
    +6,116
    Religion:
    Humanist
    I was born in 1955; when I die it'll be like it was 1954 with one difference; hopefully my family and friends will fondly remember me and smile when they think of me.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  15. savethedreams

    savethedreams Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2010
    Messages:
    645
    Ratings:
    +44
    I'm never highly interested in this question. I believe people should be concern with doing good deeds, growing spiritually within themselves, and enjoying their time here on earth (even in the 'now) without vanity. With Knowledge, Good Deeds, Devotion and Enjoying Life there little worry about what the afterlife is to be.
     
    • Like Like x 1
Loading...