What happened to the non-Muslims in Arabia?

[sooda]

Obviously Americans that are Muslim will want to go for Hajj. I would like to see it as a non-Muslim as I have an interest in history thus historical sites.

Its not a tourist destination.. which is what it was before Islam. They want to guard against that. I lived there for many years and I like visiting historic places. but have no interest in going to Mecca.

 

[sooda]

Like renouncing Islam and then proselytizing Christianity...



Right...but you mentioned expat Christians, right? My point has nothing to do with expats, but only ex-Muslims, and KSA citizens.

You seem to think all Muslims are zealous.. They aren't.

 

[Shad]

Its not a tourist destination.. which is what it was before Islam.

It still is. The only difference is Islam created a monopoly of religious tourism in Mecca.Look up religious tourism.

They want to guard against that.

No they want to guard against non-Muslims being in their holy cities even as workers. Part religious supremacy, part religious intolerance.

I lived there for many years and I like visiting historic places. but have no interest in going to Mecca.

So?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

You seem to think all Muslims are zealous.. They aren't.

I don't think that in the least. I work with several Muslims, and another married a friend of mine. Those people are uniformly nice people.

My opinion of the KSA ruling authorities is not so charitable.

 

[Shad]

An apostate is a traitor..

Thought crime

Apostate is a label tacked on a criminal conviction.

For a thought crime

It means the person has committed a crime serious enough to betray the community and the faith.

For a thought crime

All you established that at the core Islam can not tolerate free thinking.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Wahhabis aren't extremists. Look to nationalists for that. They aren't well documented.. These writers quote each other and have never been to the kingdom or their "expertise" is a week-end.

Why would you need to go to the kingdom, to find out what they are doing outside of the kingdom?
Perhaps it's you who needs to leave the kingdom once in a while....

And wahhabism most definatly is a fundamentalist version of islam.

You seem in either extreme denial or in sheer ignorance.
I'm guessing it's the latter.

Again, the fact that SA spends billions upon billions of dollars, sends wahhabist religious attaches to embassies meant for lobbying and preaching, fund and send out imams to go preach their fundamentalist version of the religion in mosques around the world,.... all this is well know an well documented.

Denial isn't going to change the facts.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

You might ask some of the 40,000 Americans who live and work in Arabia instead of believing a lot of propaganda.

For the 10th time.......

The point being made is not about what goes inside the country, but what the country does with tis petrol dollars OUTSIDE of the country.

Billions upon billions being poured into the spread of fundamentalist islam around the world.

 

[sooda]

It still is. The only difference is Islam created a monopoly of religious tourism in Mecca.Look up religious tourism.



No they want to guard against non-Muslims being in their holy cities even as workers. Part religious supremacy, part religious intolerance.

So?

I know what the Haj is, but I am speaking of additional tourism for NON Muslims.

 

[sooda]

For the 10th time.......

The point being made is not about what goes inside the country, but what the country does with tis petrol dollars OUTSIDE of the country.

Billions upon billions being poured into the spread of fundamentalist islam around the world.

ALL Islam is fundamental.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I know what the Haj is, but I am speaking of additional tourism for NON Muslims.

If the Vatican would decide tomorrow that only christians are allowed in and the roads in Italy have lanes for christians and lanes for non-christians, everybody would scream about how scandalous it is.

And rightfully so.

 

[sooda]

I don't think that in the least. I work with several Muslims, and another married a friend of mine. Those people are uniformly nice people.

My opinion of the KSA ruling authorities is not so charitable.

I have known the Sudeiri Seven since the mid 1950s and I admire them and their track record. They are steadfastly committed to the welbeing of the Saudi people now and in the future .. and they have come a long, long way into modernity.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

ALL Islam is fundamental.

No, it's not.

Hi, I'm an atheist son of a christian mother and muslim dad.
Half my family are moderate muslims.

/wave

 

[sooda]

No, it's not.

Hi, I'm an atheist son of a christian mother and muslim dad.
Half my family are moderate muslims.

/wave

Fundamental doesn't mean the same thing in Islam as it means in Christianity.. The Five Pillars of Islam are fundamental.

 

[ronki23]

I am asking what happened to the non-Muslims during Muhammad's time because there used to be a range of religions in Arabia; if the non Muslims were forced to convert then how can Muhammad be someone I believe in like Guru Nanak, Buddha and Jesus?

 

[sooda]

I am asking what happened to the non-Muslims during Muhammad's time because there used to be a range of religions in Arabia; if the non Muslims were forced to convert then how can Muhammad be someone I believe in like Guru Nanak, Buddha and Jesus?

Arabia was pagan for the most part with a few Jewish tribes and a few Nestorian Christians in Tarut Island and Najran.

You don't have to believe in Muhammed. His message was: "Save yourselves, I cannot save you. Return to the God of Abraham".

 

[Shad]

I know what the Haj is, but I am speaking of additional tourism for NON Muslims.

Which is like I said. Intolerance and supremacy. After all the clearing out of Mecca was that of competing religions not people visiting Mecca as if it were Disney world.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Wahhabis aren't extremists. Look to nationalists for that.

Say what? The Wahhabis consider atheism a crime punishable by death. They practice crucifixion; they practice stoning to death, for crying out loud. They don't tolerate non-Muslim religions being practised in Saudi Arabia to the point the religious police will raid peoples' homes to arrest house churches. If you raise a voice against Islam then your life is forfeit. If you're a non-Muslim you're not allowed anywhere near Mecca & Medina. Wahhabism is one of the most hostile & intolerant toward other belief systems, and that's saying something.

Now I'm curious: what behaviour has to be exhibited for you to consider someone a Muslim extremist?

 

[ronki23]

Why would you need to go to the kingdom, to find out what they are doing outside of the kingdom?
Perhaps it's you who needs to leave the kingdom once in a while....

And wahhabism most definatly is a fundamentalist version of islam.

You seem in either extreme denial or in sheer ignorance.
I'm guessing it's the latter.

Again, the fact that SA spends billions upon billions of dollars, sends wahhabist religious attaches to embassies meant for lobbying and preaching, fund and send out imams to go preach their fundamentalist version of the religion in mosques around the world,.... all this is well know an well documented.

Denial isn't going to change the facts.

Arabia was pagan for the most part with a few Jewish tribes and a few Nestorian Christians in Tarut Island and Najran.

You don't have to believe in Muhammed. His message was: "Save yourselves, I cannot save you. Return to the God of Abraham".

Which is like I said. Intolerance and supremacy. After all the clearing out of Mecca was that of competing religions not people visiting Mecca as if it were Disney world.

Say what? The Wahhabis consider atheism a crime punishable by death. They practice crucifixion; they practice stoning to death, for crying out loud. They don't tolerate non-Muslim religions being practised in Saudi Arabia to the point the religious police will raid peoples' homes to arrest house churches. If you raise a voice against Islam then your life is forfeit. If you're a non-Muslim you're not allowed anywhere near Mecca & Medina. Wahhabism is one of the most hostile & intolerant toward other belief systems, and that's saying something.

Now I'm curious: what behaviour has to be exhibited for you to consider someone a Muslim extremist?

Can we shed some light on the differences between Wahhabi and Salafi Islam? They're used interchangably but our allies are Saudi Arabia and they're Wahhabi while our enemy ISIS is Salafi. Also Al Qaeda is Qutb even though the only difference between ISIS and Al Qaeda is whom should be leader. Taliban are Deobandi.

Prince Muhammad bin Salman says he wants to open Saudi Arabia up to all faiths

 

[Shad]

Can we shed some light on the differences between Wahhabi and Salafi Islam? They're used interchangably but our allies are Saudi Arabia and they're Wahhabi while our enemy ISIS is Salafi. Also Al Qaeda is Qutb even though the only difference between ISIS and Al Qaeda is whom should be leader. Taliban are Deobandi.

Prince Muhammad bin Salman says he wants to open Saudi Arabia up to all faiths

My point was just about Mecca not the sectarian divides in Islam.

 

[sooda]

Can we shed some light on the differences between Wahhabi and Salafi Islam? They're used interchangably but our allies are Saudi Arabia and they're Wahhabi while our enemy ISIS is Salafi. Also Al Qaeda is Qutb even though the only difference between ISIS and Al Qaeda is whom should be leader. Taliban are Deobandi.

Prince Muhammad bin Salman says he wants to open Saudi Arabia up to all faiths

There is NO stoning in Arabia,