What doesn't make sense to me about Christianity

[PoetPhilosopher]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc.

Then comes the New Testament. Jesus comes, and his message is different enough that to me, it must be a new covenant. I interpret certain verses as going against the Old Testament, or at least changing things. You can now eat unclean animals as far as I can tell. And at some point in history, the Sabbath seems to become Sunday instead of Saturday.

Make sense? Well, I'm not done yet...

So you've got all these Christians now who seem to more follow how they perceive the Old Testament stuff was. Following Jesus' teachings is actually quite liberal, perhaps even socialist. Which as far as I can tell, isn't really compatible with the evangelism movement. In fact, I think the evangelism movement went even further in the opposite direction.

Then you've got the prophecies. Supposedly in the last days, there will be anti-Christs, AN anti-Christ, false prophets, and "A" false prophet.

And if it so happens that modern Christianity as a whole isn't very much following Jesus, if it just so happens, how do we know they aren't doomed to be the false prophet or the anti-Christ of prophecy?

Or worse? What if modern-day Christianity is Babylon?

And taking out all of the religious doctrine and dogma of modern Christianity in such a hypothetical scenario, and just looking at the ideas of Jesus.... Jesus was mostly loving, in my opinion. A bit angry too. But getting down to it.... without all the scare-tactics and conversion attempts from modern Christianity.... does Jesus really expect everyone to follow him? Wouldn't love trump forcing someone to be obedient?

Note: I think I've touched on some sensitive subjects with these what-ifs. But they're just that - what-ifs.

Before you think that a situation like this isn't possible historically, of thinking you're the heroes but being the villains, well two recent wars would like a word with you.

So as a recap, modern Christianity isn't necessarily the anti-Christ, the false prophet, or Babylon.

But what is?

And Christians may want to make sure even if they follow the Christian crowd, that they're on the right side, due to the message about lukewarm people and also people that say "Haven't I done many great things in your name?" and Jesus says "Depart. I know you not."

Then add to that that if I'm not mistaken, Revelation is a prophecy book, but doesn't it start by addressing the churches? *Grabs book to see*

All this assumes, of course, Jesus exists.

But it'd still create problems if he didn't. It'd then simply make modern Christians look like they're doing some strange parody, perhaps, of being Jewish. As far as I can tell.

So, can of worms. I think I may have opened a huge one.

Note: Hopefully I've gotten *most* of the fine details correct, but if not, heaven knows you'll kindly correct me and hopefully will also research my statements as well.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Well, strip away all but the core. Be a good human.

Now then we all need the Absolute Truth about what that is and we are set to go.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc.

I'm not sure why some people think the God of the Tanakh (OT) is only fear. He is also a God of mercy, who desires to forgive us when we repent. It's like you are taking one ingredient and saying that one ingredient is the cake. Sorry, that's not the God I know.

And yes, the God of the Tanakh is about right behavior. The Torah contains 613 laws for the children of Israel to keep. But it can all be summed up as Rabbi Hillel once said, "What is hateful to you, don't do to others. That is the whole Torah. All the rest is commentary. Now go study the commentary."

 

[stvdv]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc

I don't fear God (well, He can change that in 1 sec of course)

Truth, Righteousness, unconditional Love is my view and experience of God (the Divine). These I Love

 

[Brickjectivity]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc.

In the story humans were already wiping ourselves out. At the end of the story appears the covenant of the rainbow which forbids murder. These laws hold back destruction of the world, according to this story. The flood comes because of human violence, and if human violence again fills the world then the world will be destroyed. That is the gist of the story. It is not a story about the LORD destroying everything but of people doing so: a lesson against violence.

What if every child were born into a life whose point was domination and submission, a world where no one felt their value? What if life was all about violence? Noah's story brings this question up. Would such a world be worthwhile?

 

[nPeace]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc.

Then comes the New Testament. Jesus comes, and his message is different enough that to me, it must be a new covenant. I interpret certain verses as going against the Old Testament, or at least changing things. You can now eat unclean animals as far as I can tell. And at some point in history, the Sabbath seems to become Sunday instead of Saturday.

Make sense? Well, I'm not done yet...

So you've got all these Christians now who seem to more follow how they perceive the Old Testament stuff was. Following Jesus' teachings is actually quite liberal, perhaps even socialist. Which as far as I can tell, isn't really compatible with the evangelism movement. In fact, I think the evangelism movement went even further in the opposite direction.

Then you've got the prophecies. Supposedly in the last days, there will be anti-Christs, AN anti-Christ, false prophets, and "A" false prophet.

And if it so happens that modern Christianity as a whole isn't very much following Jesus, if it just so happens, how do we know they aren't doomed to be the false prophet or the anti-Christ of prophecy?

Or worse? What if modern-day Christianity is Babylon?

And taking out all of the religious doctrine and dogma of modern Christianity in such a hypothetical scenario, and just looking at the ideas of Jesus.... Jesus was mostly loving, in my opinion. A bit angry too. But getting down to it.... without all the scare-tactics and conversion attempts from modern Christianity.... does Jesus really expect everyone to follow him? Wouldn't love trump forcing someone to be obedient?

Note: I think I've touched on some sensitive subjects with these what-ifs. But they're just that - what-ifs.

Before you think that a situation like this isn't possible historically, of thinking you're the heroes but being the villains, well two recent wars would like a word with you.

So as a recap, modern Christianity isn't necessarily the anti-Christ, the false prophet, or Babylon.

But if it's not - what is?

And Christians may want to make sure even if they follow the Christian crowd, that they're on the right side, due to Jesus' message about lukewarm people and also people that say "Haven't I done many great things in your name?" and Jesus says "Depart. I know you not."

Then add to that that if I'm not mistaken, Revelation is a prophecy book, but doesn't it start by addressing the churches? *Grabs book*

All this assumes, of course, Jesus exists.

But it'd still create problems if he didn't. It'd then simply make modern Christians look like they're doing some strange parody, perhaps, of being Jewish. As far as I can tell.

So, can of worms. I think I may have opened a huge one.

Note: Hopefully I've gotten *most* of the fine details correct, but if not, heaven knows you'll kindly correct me and hopefully will also research my statements as well.

It's good you asked these questions... at least, I hope they are question. They are good questions, with simple, clear, satisfying answers in the same book.

Starting from the top... Galatians 3 explains why the Mosaic law was given to Israel. Basically, it served as a tutor, leading to the Messiah. Once the faith arrived, there was no longer a need for the tutor.

Since It is God's plan. In other words, since God knew that the laws he gave Moses was temporary, and would serve a temporary purpose, he expected those things to fade away, like the shadow (Hebrews 10), and he expects persons to follow the law of the Messiah, which fulfills the law of Moses. Romans 13:8-10; Galatians 5:14

The focus, is really the fulfilling of the Abrahamic covenant, which involves the realities that would come... starting from the Messiah's work. (Please be sure to read Galatians 3 and Colossians 2:13-19 This is a lot to take in at one go.)

To summarize...
The law served a temperary purpose as God chose a nation... not based on anything good about them, but rather, because of his purpose to fulfil his promise, as stated at Genesis 3:15, which involves the covenant he made with Abraham, which in turn included a promise that would only be fulfilled through involvement of the nation of Israel.
Sorry if that sounds garbled. I'm trying to make this as concise as possible.

So, the way God dealt with the nation of Israel was different to how he dealt with the nations.
For example, God wiped out a world of ungodly people in a flood.
He didn't do that to the nation of rebellious Israelites... although he could have.
(Exodus 32:10) . . .So now let me be, and I will exterminate them in my burning anger, and let me make a great nation from you instead.”

...but that would have involved another change. God could fulfill his promise any way he chose. It would be fulfilled any which way.

Long story short. Eating certain food, and not eating certain food; sacrifices, etc, were all required... for a time - until Messiah.
Until then, this was the case...
(Romans 9:22-24) [God] tolerated with much patience vessels of wrath made fit for destruction...
(Romans 3:25) . . .God in his forbearance was forgiving the sins that occurred in the past.

Regarding prophecy and antichrists etc.
Because the Messiah was the one to fulfill God's purpose, those who oppose that purpose, would reject God's annointed one... and this is not new. This is actually tied up in the first and key prophecy - Genesis 3:15

There is an ongoing war, which will end when the Messiah completes his work. 1 Corinthians 15:24-28

This is where Revelation comes in.
Actually, all prophecies are linked to the key prophecy of Genesis 3:15, and Revelation is the completion.
Revelation 12, is actually the start of the end of the first phrase of the last sentence of that prophecy... "He will crush your head..."

That's it, in the smallest nutshell I could put it in.
I hope I covered everything. I didn't want to write a book.

What it shows though, is the overall harmony of the Christian 'book', and verifies not only its authorship being from God, but identifies his people today.

 

[nPeace]

@Snow White PS
Fear of God is not a morbid fear, but a wholesome fear. That is, a fear of displeasing him.
I can go into detail on that later, but for now, I have run... not literally.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

@Snow White PS
Fear of God is not a morbid fear, but a wholesome fear. That is, a fear of displeasing him.
I can go into detail on that later, but for now, I have run... not literally.

Well, if it works for you, you can't take for granted it works for someone else. That would by blind faith,

 

[Koldo]

I'm not sure why some people think the God of the Tanakh (OT) is only fear. He is also a God of mercy, who desires to forgive us when we repent. It's like you are taking one ingredient and saying that one ingredient is the cake. Sorry, that's not the God I know.

And yes, the God of the Tanakh is about right behavior. The Torah contains 613 laws for the children of Israel to keep. But it can all be summed up as Rabbi Hillel once said, "What is hateful to you, don't do to others. That is the whole Torah. All the rest is commentary. Now go study the commentary."

He didn't do that though. Perhaps you should read the OP one more time.

 

[Kenny]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc.

Then comes the New Testament. Jesus comes, and his message is different enough that to me, it must be a new covenant. I interpret certain verses as going against the Old Testament, or at least changing things. You can now eat unclean animals as far as I can tell. And at some point in history, the Sabbath seems to become Sunday instead of Saturday.

Make sense? Well, I'm not done yet...

So you've got all these Christians now who seem to more follow how they perceive the Old Testament stuff was. Following Jesus' teachings is actually quite liberal, perhaps even socialist. Which as far as I can tell, isn't really compatible with the evangelism movement. In fact, I think the evangelism movement went even further in the opposite direction.

Then you've got the prophecies. Supposedly in the last days, there will be anti-Christs, AN anti-Christ, false prophets, and "A" false prophet.

And if it so happens that modern Christianity as a whole isn't very much following Jesus, if it just so happens, how do we know they aren't doomed to be the false prophet or the anti-Christ of prophecy?

Or worse? What if modern-day Christianity is Babylon?

And taking out all of the religious doctrine and dogma of modern Christianity in such a hypothetical scenario, and just looking at the ideas of Jesus.... Jesus was mostly loving, in my opinion. A bit angry too. But getting down to it.... without all the scare-tactics and conversion attempts from modern Christianity.... does Jesus really expect everyone to follow him? Wouldn't love trump forcing someone to be obedient?

Note: I think I've touched on some sensitive subjects with these what-ifs. But they're just that - what-ifs.

Before you think that a situation like this isn't possible historically, of thinking you're the heroes but being the villains, well two recent wars would like a word with you.

So as a recap, modern Christianity isn't necessarily the anti-Christ, the false prophet, or Babylon.

But if it's not - what is?

And Christians may want to make sure even if they follow the Christian crowd, that they're on the right side, due to Jesus' message about lukewarm people and also people that say "Haven't I done many great things in your name?" and Jesus says "Depart. I know you not."

Then add to that that if I'm not mistaken, Revelation is a prophecy book, but doesn't it start by addressing the churches? *Grabs book*

All this assumes, of course, Jesus exists.

But it'd still create problems if he didn't. It'd then simply make modern Christians look like they're doing some strange parody, perhaps, of being Jewish. As far as I can tell.

So, can of worms. I think I may have opened a huge one.

Note: Hopefully I've gotten *most* of the fine details correct, but if not, heaven knows you'll kindly correct me and hopefully will also research my statements as well.

I think sometimes we concentrate so much on the forest that we can't see the clearing.

It is a New Testament and Jesus is the testator of the same. The NT actually started after the death of Jesus and not during His lifetime. He came to reveal the God of Love.

We are to work our own salvation out by following Jesus and not follow man when they don't.

His mercy and grace is far bigger than what we can imagine. We can denigrate the two, misrepresent the two, demean the two but we can never exaggerate the two.

So, don't be concerned about the prophetic, the lukewarmness, the Anti-Christ (s) et al... just follow Him, love God and love your neighbor.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

I think sometimes we concentrate so much on the forest that we can't see the clearing.

It is a New Testament and Jesus is the testator of the same. The NT actually started after the death of Jesus and not during His lifetime. He came to reveal the God of Love.

We are to work our own salvation out by following Jesus and not follow man when they don't.

His mercy and grace is far bigger than what we can imagine. We can denigrate the two, misrepresent the two, demean the two but we can never exaggerate the two.

So, don't be concerned about the prophetic, the lukewarmness, the Anti-Christ (s) et al... just follow Him, love God and love your neighbor.

Your neighbor in this world is also a human you never meet, because how we all interconnect. Have you ever heard of this weird fact?
Except for a few remote tribes, we are all today 7 to 8 encounters away from each other. I have met Queen Margrethe 2 of Denmark. She has met a lot of humans and then if you check you have met some who have met and so, so we end with that you and I are not that far away from each other.
The problem is that some people don't use God for love. They use Him for hate, revenge and power.

 

[Kenny]

Your neighbor in this world is also a human you never meet, because how we all interconnect. Have you ever heard of this weird fact?
Except for a few remote tribes, we are all today 7 to 8 encounters away from each other. I have met Queen Margrethe 2 of Denmark. She has met all of humans and then if you check you have met some who have met and we end with that you and I are not that far away from each other.
The problem is that some people don't use God for love. They use Him for hate, revenge and power.

Yes, it is something that happened throughout history as it is written:
Romans 2:23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you,

But i still must show the love of God to the best of my ability.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

Yes, it is something that happened throughout history as it is written:
Romans 2:23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you,

But i still must show the love of God to the best of my ability.

Yeah, just don't forget it is your ability and not our.

 

[Kenny]

Yeah, just don't forget it is your ability and not our.

???? Not sure what your point is.

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

???? Not sure what your point is.

How you come to God in your ability might not be the same as to me. There are many roads walked and yours is not the only one.

 

[Kenny]

How you come to God in your ability might not be the same as to me. There are many roads walked and yours is not the only one.

No, in our faith there is only one road, Jesus - the way, the truth and the life.

And we don't come to God in our ability but in His. (signature)

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

No, in our faith there is only one road, Jesus - the way, the truth and the life.

And we don't come to God in our ability but in His. (signature)

That is tied to your reading of the Bible. I am of another tradition.

 

[Kenny]

That is tied to your reading of the Bible. I am of another tradition.

In the Christian faith, we hold these truths:

Matthew 15:6 Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Can't change what Jesus said.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

You've got the Old Testament and the Abrahamic God. You start to know the Abrahamic God as someone to fear. He wipes out most humans with a flood. Then you've got laws about clean and unclean animals, etc.

Then comes the New Testament. Jesus comes, and his message is different enough that to me, it must be a new covenant. I interpret certain verses as going against the Old Testament, or at least changing things. You can now eat unclean animals as far as I can tell. And at some point in history, the Sabbath seems to become Sunday instead of Saturday.

Make sense? Well, I'm not done yet...

So you've got all these Christians now who seem to more follow how they perceive the Old Testament stuff was. Following Jesus' teachings is actually quite liberal, perhaps even socialist. Which as far as I can tell, isn't really compatible with the evangelism movement. In fact, I think the evangelism movement went even further in the opposite direction.

Then you've got the prophecies. Supposedly in the last days, there will be anti-Christs, AN anti-Christ, false prophets, and "A" false prophet.

And if it so happens that modern Christianity as a whole isn't very much following Jesus, if it just so happens, how do we know they aren't doomed to be the false prophet or the anti-Christ of prophecy?

Or worse? What if modern-day Christianity is Babylon?

And taking out all of the religious doctrine and dogma of modern Christianity in such a hypothetical scenario, and just looking at the ideas of Jesus.... Jesus was mostly loving, in my opinion. A bit angry too. But getting down to it.... without all the scare-tactics and conversion attempts from modern Christianity.... does Jesus really expect everyone to follow him? Wouldn't love trump forcing someone to be obedient?

Note: I think I've touched on some sensitive subjects with these what-ifs. But they're just that - what-ifs.

Before you think that a situation like this isn't possible historically, of thinking you're the heroes but being the villains, well two recent wars would like a word with you.

So as a recap, modern Christianity isn't necessarily the anti-Christ, the false prophet, or Babylon.

But if it's not - what is?

And Christians may want to make sure even if they follow the Christian crowd, that they're on the right side, due to Jesus' message about lukewarm people and also people that say "Haven't I done many great things in your name?" and Jesus says "Depart. I know you not."

Then add to that that if I'm not mistaken, Revelation is a prophecy book, but doesn't it start by addressing the churches? *Grabs book*

All this assumes, of course, Jesus exists.

But it'd still create problems if he didn't. It'd then simply make modern Christians look like they're doing some strange parody, perhaps, of being Jewish. As far as I can tell.

So, can of worms. I think I may have opened a huge one.

Note: Hopefully I've gotten *most* of the fine details correct, but if not, heaven knows you'll kindly correct me and hopefully will also research my statements as well.

Not sure if THIS helps at all, but it may give a less worldly perspective on it.

Humbly
Hermit

 

[RestlessSoul]

I would suggest to anyone interested in Christianity and The Bible, to read - and put - the Gospels first.

Whilst Genesis has, imo, possibly the best opening line in all of world literature, it gets a bit confusing after that. The Gospels aren’t really confusing, even if Jesus did talk in riddles a lot of the time.