What does the Day of Resurrection & the Day of Judgement mean to you?

[Samantha Rinne]

Who are they?

How do you think Jesus's era of peace is going to come to fruition?
What do you mean by NWO? Who are they?

You have not heard of the New World Order? Huh?!? It's like the CIA, they're an open secret. Despite ppl denying they exist, everyone is supposed to know about them.

Also it's on our money. We have a pyramid trying to pave over Providence (the pyramid is the Novus Ordo Seclorum, or New World Order, a group that wants totalitarian rule instead of God's Rule).

Basically, the New World Order is a group that may or may not exist, run by political types, actors, and the media. Basically it's a club of the powerful. And depraved. People who would like regular people to live population controlled (despite much of the world actually being unsettled) without power or running water. Don't mistake these for environmental types though, though some of them play that card. They'd prefer ppl dead or under control.

Basically they have a playbook:
-Reduce the population by 90% or so (whereupon they convince other ppl thet will be the chosen few if they go along with the plan, but they're the 1% for a reason)
-Rule over the rest with strict government, using slavery if necessary
-Possibly divvy the world into ten regions. Does this sound familiar? It should. The Antichrist wants the world in ten kingdoms. The Antichrist is not a person, it's made of people who want an authoritarian "utopia"

New World Order - Infogalactic: the planetary knowledge core

The Ten Kings - ten horns, prophecy, antichrist

 

[loverofhumanity]

"The Day of Resurrection" and "The Day of Judgment" are ideas from a particular culture, in this case the Greek influence on Christianity. If you read eg the >Myth of Er<, you'll get the idea ─ death, soul, judgment, consequence ─ whereas if you read the bible, you'll find it silent, or at best much vaguer, on all of those points.
No doubt you're right; but it remains the case that neither idea will withstand interrogation. Is the resurrection bodily or spiritual? How can there be any doubt which is correct? If there's such a thing as a soul, how does it exist, know, experience, give a dang about anything, without senses or the biochemistry of emotion? Who says so, and on the basis of what evidence?

Didn’t these concepts originate with Zoroaster and the Zoroastrian Faith?

The idea of a single god was not the only essentially Zoroastrian tenet to find its way into other major faiths, most notably the ‘big three’: Judaism, Christianity and Islam. The concepts of Heaven and Hell, Judgment Day and the final revelation of the world, and angels and demons all originated in the teachings of Zarathustra, as well as the later canon of Zoroastrian literature they inspired. Even the idea of Satan is a fundamentally Zoroastrian one;

cited at this link..

The obscure religion that shaped the West

 

[1213]

What if..... when Christ returned you rejected Him? Would that then be yourself judging yourself to not be a true believer in Jesus after being tested?

In any case, on that day righteousness, truth and love wins. If I am on the wrong side, it is only good if I also vanish.

And I don’t think it is about who is true believer, but about who is righteous, because:

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

And righteous person is:

He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

My understanding is that the Day of Judgement is when people’s beliefs will be tested by God asking themselves to believe in something new and that will be a very sore test for traditionalists

According to the Bible, God doesn’t change and His commandments are the same, “love your neighbor as yourself” and righteousness is still the key. But, maybe we have a test where it is tested are we loyal (faithful) to Bible God and His word or not.

… the righteous will live by faith. If he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.
Hebrews 10:38

 

[Neuropteron]

[QUOTE="loverofhumanity, post: 6461814, member: 59171"


Could we be living in these Days of Judgement and Resurrection now without knowing it? What do you think might be being resurrected? Science? I said religion but that’s just my opinion.

How are we judged? If God gave us free will to believe or disbelieve then judging us for not believing isn’t that taking away our free will to disbelieve? Or is it us who judge ourselves by our acceptance or denial of whatever God may offer to us? One man may be a liar another truthful so is it our actions that judge us to be either sinner or saint?[/QUOTE]

The NT expalins that there will be a specific future period when mankind, the the living and the dead, will individually be judged. (2Ti 4"1,2)
The possibility of a judgment that is not condemnatory is apparent from 2 Cor 5:10. About those in front of the judgment seat it says: "Each one will get his award...according to the things he has practiced, whether it is good or vile."

The judging mentioned in Revelation 20:13 evidently results in a favorable outcome for many, but not all.

The important point to discern is that they will be judged according to what they do "after" their resurrection, during the millenium reign of Christ, not before it, since death is the punishment for sin, and they already payed for those by dying (Ro 6:23). ( they cannot be sentenced for the same sins again). The rest will come through the judgment to a resurrection of life.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Thanks for your enlightening post. A lot of what you say makes sense to me and I mostly agree but just understand a couple of things differently.
To me the resurrection of the dead means to be resurrected from the death of unbelief to the life of faith for Christ when He said to one of His disciples ‘let the dead bury the dead’ meant for the spiritually dead to bury the physically dead so the term death and dead in the Gospels often refers to spiritual death. That is my understanding from the way Christ explained in the passage - Luke 9:60
King James Bible
Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury the dead but go thou and preach the kingdom of God.
New Living Translation
But Jesus told him, “Let the spiritually dead bury their own dead! Your duty is to go and preach about the Kingdom of God.
Another terminology used by Christ is ‘sheep and goats’. We are not sheep or goats so what will be separated then? To me it is saying that those who reject Christ’s return will be viewed as goats or unbelievers while those who accept Him in His new Name will become His new sheep or true believers.

Yes, in dealing with being ' resurrected from the death of unbelief ' it is about being spiritually dead to spiritual life.
However, I find the account found at Luke 9:59-60 is about a man who said 'let me first go and bury my father' does Not mean his father was dead at that time. If the father was dead the man would have Not been talking to Jesus but be at the burial. Remember they buried their dead on the day the dead person died, so the man was asking Jesus if he could become a follow later 'after' his father dies and Not while his father was still living.

Right, we are Not literal sheep or goats, just as Jesus is Not a literal shepherd, nor a door, nor a vine, etc.
Just as the genuine 'wheat' Christians are Not literal wheat and the fake 'weed/tares' are Not literal weed/tares.
So, the illustration of Matthew 25:31-33 is about figurative humble people and haughty goat-like people.
( Kind of like it is the literal animal goat that does all the butting )
Just as a literal shepherd would gather in his sheep, at this coming ' time of separation ' on Earth there will be an ingathering of Jesus' sheep (meek people) who will inherit the Earth - Matthew 25:37-40; 5:5; Psalms 37:9-11.
This final judgement on Earth. this Harvest Time, is thus based on the reaction of both the humble and haughty people as to how they had responded when they heard the good news message of Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8 .

 

[URAVIP2ME]

[QUOTE="loverofhumanity, post: 6461814, member: 59171".........................................

The NT explains that there will be a specific future period when mankind, the the living and the dead, will individually be judged. (2Ti 4:1,2)
The possibility of a judgment that is not condemnatory is apparent from 2 Cor 5:10. About those in front of the judgment seat it says: "Each one will get his award...according to the things he has practiced, whether it is good or vile."
The judging mentioned in Revelation 20:13 evidently results in a favorable outcome for many, but not all.
The important point to discern is that they will be judged according to what they do "after" their resurrection, during the millennium reign of Christ, not before it, since death is the punishment for sin, and they already payed for those by dying (Ro 6:23). ( they cannot be sentenced for the same sins again). The rest will come through the judgment to a resurrection of life.[/QUOTE]

I like that you mentioned ^ above ^ that 'they' (the dead) cannot be sentenced for the same sins again (or twice) because to me that would be double jeopardy.
Just as there was No post-mortem penalty for sinner Adam there is none for anyone dead.
The 'living' will be judged 'before' the start of Jesus' millennium-long day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.
The already dead will be judged on what they do ' after ' they have a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection back to live life on Earth will the opportunity to gain everlasting life to live forever on Earth as originally offered to Adam before his downfall.

 

[CG Didymus]

Didn’t these concepts originate with Zoroaster and the Zoroastrian Faith?

The idea of a single god was not the only essentially Zoroastrian tenet to find its way into other major faiths, most notably the ‘big three’: Judaism, Christianity and Islam. The concepts of Heaven and Hell, Judgment Day and the final revelation of the world, and angels and demons all originated in the teachings of Zarathustra, as well as the later canon of Zoroastrian literature they inspired. Even the idea of Satan is a fundamentally Zoroastrian one;

cited at this link..

The obscure religion that shaped the West

Where do Baha'is place the progression of religions then? Is Zoroastrianism older then Judaism and the first to beliefs in one supreme God? Except that I found this...

While Zoroastrians worship Ahura Mazda as the highest and supreme God, they also believe in the existence of a number of divinities who represent His good qualities and who assist Him in containing the evil in the material world. Highest among these are the six Immortal Beings or Amesha Spentas who personify His good qualities individually, followed by angels, lords or ahuras and other divinities.​

There was also some interesting stuff about the Judgement Day...

Followers of Ahura Mazda believe the birth of Zoroaster heralded the beginning the current cycle of creation, which would last for 3000 years. During this period a prophet would appear on earth at the end of each millennium to preserve the teachings and guide the humanity. The third prophet, will be a future son of Zoroaster, whose name would be Shoshyant, who would herald the Judgment Day and the eventual destruction of evil powers in the material world.​

 

[loverofhumanity]

Where do Baha'is place the progression of religions then? Is Zoroastrianism older then Judaism and the first to beliefs in one supreme God? Except that I found this...

While Zoroastrians worship Ahura Mazda as the highest and supreme God, they also believe in the existence of a number of divinities who represent His good qualities and who assist Him in containing the evil in the material world. Highest among these are the six Immortal Beings or Amesha Spentas who personify His good qualities individually, followed by angels, lords or ahuras and other divinities.​

There was also some interesting stuff about the Judgement Day...

Followers of Ahura Mazda believe the birth of Zoroaster heralded the beginning the current cycle of creation, which would last for 3000 years. During this period a prophet would appear on earth at the end of each millennium to preserve the teachings and guide the humanity. The third prophet, will be a future son of Zoroaster, whose name would be Shoshyant, who would herald the Judgment Day and the eventual destruction of evil powers in the material world.​

Regarding the beginning of the Zoroastrian Era...

“Regarding the beginning of the Zoroastrian era, in one of His Tablets ‘Abdu’l-Bahá states that Zoroaster lived about 750 years after Moses”.........


“Zoroaster lived about a thousand years before Christ. There is no exact date in the teachings regarding the beginning of His Dispensation.”

(Universal House of Justice May 13, 1979)


Zoroastrianism is the oldest of the revealed world-religions, and it has probably had more influence on mankind, directly and indirectly, than any other single faith." - Boyce, Zoroastrians, 1979, p. 1.

"Zoroaster was thus the first to teach the doctrines of an individual judgment, Heaven and Hell, the future resurrection of the body, the general Last Judgment, and life everlasting for the reunited soul and body. These doctrines were to become familiar articles of faith to much of mankind, through borrowings by Judaism, Christianity and Islam; yet it is in Zoroastrianism itself that they have their fullest logical coherence....” - Boyce, op. cit. p. 29.

the ancient Persians worshipped the deities of the old Irano-Aryan religion, a counterpart to the Indo-Aryan religion that would come to be known as Hinduism. Zarathustra, however, condemned this practice, and preached that God alone – Ahura Mazda, the Lord of Wisdom – should be worshipped. In doing so, he not only contributed to the great divide between the Iranian and Indian Aryans, but arguably introduced to mankind its first monotheistic faith.

http://www.bbc.com/culture/story/20170406-this-obscure-religion-shaped-the-west

So to my understanding the Zoroastrian Faith was one of the first religions to teach monotheism, heaven and hell, the day of judgement and resurrection and the concept of satan. As well it has prophecies predicting many Manifestations of God to come after it.

 

[wizanda]

Could we be living in these Days of Judgement and Resurrection now without knowing it?

Soon the sun Betelgeuse will blow up (Isaiah 13:10), when it does a wave of photons will hit our planet recharging it all, and breaking down the structure of reality for a day; where at that point many demons will fall into Hell (Isaiah 24:17-22), and the Enlightened Saints will return.

The Bible, Zoroastrian, Hindu, Islamic contexts all predict the prewarning signs of a Great Battle in the Middle East, and the sun being darkened in the Right Arm of Orion.

There is no way not to recognize this event globally according to the texts, this world will literally be washed with a Fire of some description; where 2/3's of humanity are removed in a day (Deuteronomy 29:19-27, Zechariah 13:9).

without superstitious interpretations?

If we read all the world's religious texts, this explains the details of what to expect.

Baha'u'llah predicted the Great Tribulation, and the one to come; the idea some have done the opposite of warning humanity, means they have sentenced billions to death.

In my opinion.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Soon the sun Betelgeuse will blow up (Isaiah 13:10), when it does a wave of photons will hit our planet recharging it all, and breaking down the structure of reality for a day; where at that point many demons will fall into Hell (Isaiah 24:17-22), and the Enlightened Saints will return.

The Bible, Zoroastrian, Hindu, Islamic contexts all predict the prewarning signs of a Great Battle in the Middle East, and the sun being darkened in the Right Arm of Orion.

There is no way not to recognize this event globally according to the texts, this world will literally be washed with a Fire of some description; where 2/3's of humanity are removed in a day (Deuteronomy 29:19-27, Zechariah 13:9).

If we read all the world's religious texts, rather than spending our time being against the world's religions; whilst pretending to be someone of God.

Baha'u'llah predicted the Great Tribulation, and the one to come; the idea you've done the opposite of warning humanity, means the Baha'i on here have sentenced billions to death.

Good luck on the Day of Judgement; as honestly from the ways the Baha'i have been on here, they deserve removing from reality.

In my opinion.

As far as a calamity to befall mankind, that is evident but as it cannot be averted because of unwillingness to unite then the best thing we can do is to continue calling upon humanity to put aside their differences and unite. No point dwelling on it.

 

[CG Didymus]

Regarding the beginning of the Zoroastrian Era...

“Regarding the beginning of the Zoroastrian era, in one of His Tablets ‘Abdu’l-Bahá states that Zoroaster lived about 750 years after Moses”.........


“Zoroaster lived about a thousand years before Christ. There is no exact date in the teachings regarding the beginning of His Dispensation.”

(Universal House of Justice May 13, 1979)


Zoroastrianism is the oldest of the revealed world-religions, and it has probably had more influence on mankind, directly and indirectly, than any other single faith." - Boyce, Zoroastrians, 1979, p. 1.

"Zoroaster was thus the first to teach the doctrines of an individual judgment, Heaven and Hell, the future resurrection of the body, the general Last Judgment, and life everlasting for the reunited soul and body. These doctrines were to become familiar articles of faith to much of mankind, through borrowings by Judaism, Christianity and Islam; yet it is in Zoroastrianism itself that they have their fullest logical coherence....” - Boyce, op. cit. p. 29.

the ancient Persians worshipped the deities of the old Irano-Aryan religion, a counterpart to the Indo-Aryan religion that would come to be known as Hinduism. Zarathustra, however, condemned this practice, and preached that God alone – Ahura Mazda, the Lord of Wisdom – should be worshipped. In doing so, he not only contributed to the great divide between the Iranian and Indian Aryans, but arguably introduced to mankind its first monotheistic faith.
http://www.bbc.com/culture/story/20170406-this-obscure-religion-shaped-the-west
The obscure religion that shaped the West

So to my understanding the Zoroastrian Faith was one of the first religions to teach monotheism, heaven and hell, the day of judgement and resurrection and the concept of satan. As well it has prophecies predicting many Manifestations of God to come after it.

Thanks, so 1000 years before Jesus still makes the 3000 year prophecy work for Baha'is then?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Thanks, so 1000 years before Jesus still makes the 3000 year prophecy work for Baha'is then?

No exact dates are known but by the mid 1800's the 3000 years was drawing to a close.

The new cycle is for 500,000 years and it will also have Many Messengers.

Regards Tony

 

[loverofhumanity]

Thanks, so 1000 years before Jesus still makes the 3000 year prophecy work for Baha'is then?

I haven’t gone into that in depth but it seems to. I am aware that Abdul- Baha quotes a Zoroastrian prophecy about the sun ‘standing still’ three times for 10, 20 and 30 days.
He interprets this as three dispensations of the Suns of Truth.Namely Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I haven’t gone into that in depth but it seems to. I am aware that Abdul- Baha quotes a Zoroastrian prophecy about the sun ‘standing still’ three times for 10, 20 and 30 days.
He interprets this as three dispensations of the Suns of Truth.Namely Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah.

This One;

"Thou hadst written that in the sacred texts of the followers of Zoroaster it is written that in the latter days, in three separate dispensations, the sun must needs be brought to a standstill. In the first dispensation, it is predicted, the sun will remain motionless for ten days; in the second for twice that time; in the third for no less than one whole month. The interpretation of this prophecy is this: the first Dispensation to which it refers is the Muhammadan Dispensation during which the Sun of Truth stood still for ten days. Each day is reckoned as one century. The Muhammadan Dispensation must have, therefore, lasted no less than one thousand years, which is precisely the period that has elapsed from the setting of the star of the Imamate to the advent of the Dispensation proclaimed by the Bab. The second Dispensation referred to in this prophecy is the one inaugurated by the Bab Himself, which began in the year 1260 A.H. and was brought to a close in the year 1280 A.H. As to the third Dispensation—the Revelation proclaimed by Bahá'u'lláh—inasmuch as the Sun of Truth when attaining that station shineth in the plenitude of its meridian splendor its duration hath been fixed for a period of one whole month, which is the maximum time taken by the sun to pass through a sign of the Zodiac. From this thou canst imagine the magnitude of the Bahá'í cycle—a cycle that must extend over a period of at least five hundred thousand years.'

Taken from this - Explanation of a Zoroastrian Prophecy
or - The Zoroastrian Prophecies about the Bab and Baha’u’llah

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I haven’t gone into that in depth but it seems to. I am aware that Abdul- Baha quotes a Zoroastrian prophecy about the sun ‘standing still’ three times for 10, 20 and 30 days.
He interprets this as three dispensations of the Suns of Truth.Namely Muhammad, the Bab and Baha’u’llah.

This is a good link - Zoroastrian Prophecies for the Coming of the Saoshyant

"When will the Saoshyant come?

The next three passages from various sources of Zoroastrian scriptural wisdom suggest that the Saoshyant arrive and emerge anytime now.

"Righteousness is so worthy and great and valuable, that in one place it is revealed that Zarathushtra asked God: 'How much time remains until the time of the making all things new and perfect, ... and the Future Body?' God said: '3,000 years'. Zarathushtra was afraid and said: 'A long time remains!' God said: 'Then do not let this time seem long to you'" - Based on Pahlavi Rivayat, ch 25. based on tr. of A.V. Williams, 1990

Though the exact date of Zoroaster is uncertain he is believed to have lived probably between 1200BC and 1000BC which would mean that the above passage refers to roughly the present time.

"When a thousand two hundred and some years have passed from the inception of the religion of the Arabian [Most probably Islam and the Coming of Muhammed] and the overthrow of the kingdom of Iran and the degradation of the followers of My religion, a descendant of the Iranian kings will be raised up as a Prophet." - ZOROASTER - Dinkird

Muhammad birth date was 570AD and the date of the first Hajj from which the Muslim Calendar begins is 632AD so this would mean that the coming of the Saoshyant is certainly due anytime.

"When the people of Iran will become wicked and do evils ... at that time a Man shall rise up from the Arabs, through whose disciples they will lose the crown, the throne, the land, and their religion, and be destroyed ... By the lapse of one thousand years, after the establishment of the Arabic Religion, His followers will have already spoiled their Faith so much by splitting up themselves into sects that, were it to be presented to its Founder, He would not recognize the same. Thus shalt thou see the Iranians that they shall not listen to any Wise Man. Were some one to say the Truth, they shall come out with weapons to fight with Him. The worst among the evil deeds of Iranians is that they have killed the One Who, though from amongst themselves, was the Sovereign Lord of all the Angelic Attributes." - Dasàstìr-Asmànì' (The Book of Heavenly Commandments)

This passage is similar to the last though suggesting an earlier date for the coming of the World Saviour. This would mean that the chosen one is due but a little late."

The article says that the Messiah may be a bit late

Imagine Zoroaster also had reference to the 1260 Prophecy.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

"When the people of Iran will become wicked and do evils ... at that time a Man shall rise up from the Arabs, through whose disciples they will lose the crown, the throne, the land, and their religion, and be destroyed ... By the lapse of one thousand years, after the establishment of the Arabic Religion, His followers will have already spoiled their Faith so much by splitting up themselves into sects that, were it to be presented to its Founder, He would not recognize the same. Thus shalt thou see the Iranians that they shall not listen to any Wise Man. Were some one to say the Truth, they shall come out with weapons to fight with Him. The worst among the evil deeds of Iranians is that they have killed the One Who, though from amongst themselves, was the Sovereign Lord of all the Angelic Attributes." - Dasàstìr-Asmànì' (The Book of Heavenly Commandments)

They did indeed fight with the Babi, Kill the Bab and Banish Baha'u'llah.

So much Prophecy, so much points to the fulfillment, in my opinion.

Regards Tony