What does Jesus say about who will go to heaven?

[Autodidact]

It's not hard for you to follow along, but I'm slow. Please don't make fun of me. I'll try to keep up with you.

O.K., sorry.

 

[Muffled]

Well, here's the passage:

31"When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. 32All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. 34"Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'
37"Then the righteous will answer him, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?'
40"The King will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'
41"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.'
44"They also will answer, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?'
45"He will reply, 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.'
46"Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."


Sounds to me like Jesus is saying that those who help the poor etc. get eternal life, and those who failed to do so get eternal punishment.

The problem is that this is an eschatological passage ie. it is about the last day. The Kingdom mentioned in v34 is not a kingdom in Heaven but one that is formed in the New Jerusalem and descends to the earth. Although the Kingdom is like Heaven that does not answer your question.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

"how to get to heaven," it looks like John 11 and Matthew 25 are the only verses that speak to that subject. And John 11 says believe in Jesus, and Matthew 25 says to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, take care of the sick, and visit those in prison. Where are you getting "follow all my commandments" from?

If you are still interested, I would like to offer the following.

• feed the hungry
• clothe the naked
• take care of the sick
• visit those in prison

I would like to point out something that most Christians, and certainly those that are not Christian miss. Most look at these and assume this is literal and our mission. While these are noble efforts, the bible in other places indicates each of these bullets is in fact the definition of SIN.

When we are not under the saving power of Jesus, we are starving, because we do not have the bread of life. We do not have to covering of Jesus's blood so we are naked. We are sick near to death, because we do not have the healing power of salvation to cover our sins, and finally we are in spiritual prison, not able to commune with God and Jesus.

With that in mind, the goal of the true child of God is not to go around clothing everyone, trying to heal the sick, visiting inmates, and feeding the hungry. While all those are nice, what good do they do a person if they do not know of the power of Jesus? Once the power of Jesus is attained, all those bullets spiritually speaking disappear. In other words, what good does it do to gain the world and lose your soul?

Then the writings of Paul become paramount, that we need not worry about our life here, or in other verses, we need not worry about where out next meal comes from.

So, there you go Auto, this is the best understanding I have been able to come up with. If you want verses to back all this up let me know, but I am not sure it is necessary.

 

[sojourner]

If you are still interested, I would like to offer the following.

• feed the hungry
• clothe the naked
• take care of the sick
• visit those in prison

I would like to point out something that most Christians, and certainly those that are not Christian miss. Most look at these and assume this is literal and our mission. While these are noble efforts, the bible in other places indicates each of these bullets is in fact the definition of SIN.

When we are not under the saving power of Jesus, we are starving, because we do not have the bread of life. We do not have to covering of Jesus's blood so we are naked. We are sick near to death, because we do not have the healing power of salvation to cover our sins, and finally we are in spiritual prison, not able to commune with God and Jesus.

With that in mind, the goal of the true child of God is not to go around clothing everyone, trying to heal the sick, visiting inmates, and feeding the hungry. While all those are nice, what good do they do a person if they do not know of the power of Jesus? Once the power of Jesus is attained, all those bullets spiritually speaking disappear. In other words, what good does it do to gain the world and lose your soul?

Then the writings of Paul become paramount, that we need not worry about our life here, or in other verses, we need not worry about where out next meal comes from.

So, there you go Auto, this is the best understanding I have been able to come up with. If you want verses to back all this up let me know, but I am not sure it is necessary.

It's an interesting take, and one I'm willing to explore, but we have to remember as we're doing that activity, that Jesus didn't mean these things "spiritually." He meant them literally.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

It's an interesting take, and one I'm willing to explore, but we have to remember as we're doing that activity, that Jesus didn't mean these things "spiritually." He meant them literally.

Why bother exploring if you are 100% certain they were not meant to be spiritual?

 

[George Campbell]

What does Jesus say about who will dwell with him in heaven, and who will suffer eternal punishment?

"I am the way, the truth and the life. No man will go to the father except through me"

Right now that cuts out about three of every four people.

"Wide is the path to destruction and many will enter therein"
"Narrow is the path to salvation and few will find it"


That gets most of the remainder.

I've read the new testament no less than ten times and anyone who harps on a couple of verses and thinks all they have to do is show up is in grave danger if they believe.

There are 162 mentions of hell in the new testament, 70 of them by Jesus himself. That should be enough to show any realist or logical thinker that it's all made up by men with a mission!

"The Son of Man shall send out His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and those who do iniquity, and shall cast them into a furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
(Mat 13:41-42)
​

"So it shall be at the end of the world. The angels shall come out and separate the wicked from among the just, and shall cast them into the furnace of fire. There shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
Mat 13:49-50 ​

​

​

"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Away from me, you that are under God's curse! Away to the eternal fire which has been prepared for the Devil and his angels!"
"These, then, will be sent off to eternal punishment, but the righteous will go to eternal life."
(Mat 25:41 & 46) ​

"And if your foot offends you, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life lame than to have two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched where
their worm (conscience) dies not, and the fire is not quenched."
(Mark 9:45-46)​

"And in hell he lifted up his eyes, being in torments, and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me and send Lazarus so that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am tormented in this flame."
(Luke 16:23-24)​

"He who believes on Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only-begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than the Light, because their deeds were evil."
(John 3:18-19)​

" - in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God and who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ, who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, ...."
(2Th 1:8-9)​

"And a third angel followed them, saying with a great voice, If anyone worships the beast and its image, and receives a mark in his forehead or in his hand, he also will drink of the wine of the anger of God, having been mixed undiluted in the cup of His wrath. And he will be tormented by fire and brimstone before the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever. And they have no rest day or night, those who worship the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name."
(Rev 14:9-11)​

"And if anyone was not found having been written in the Book of Life, he was cast into the Lake of Fire."
(Rev 20:15)​

"But the fearful, and the unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, will have their part in the Lake burning with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."
(Rev 21:8)​

​

​

 

[sandy whitelinger]

What if you shop at Walmart and other establisments
that take advantage of poor people for low wage (pittance) labor,
so you can have cheap stuff.
(and extra change to stick in the poor box at your church
once you've helped pay the mortgage on the church building.)

I suppose that this could be looked at as giving some poor oppresed schmuck in a third world country a job rather than shopping american where you give your money to some dumb schlub whose just going to blow it on beer and a lotto ticket.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

no one answered my walmart question.

Jesus never mentioned Walmart. Rainman said that K-Mart sucks though.

 

[George Campbell]

I suppose that this could be looked at as giving some poor oppresed schmuck in a third world country a job rather than shopping american where you give your money to some dumb schlub whose just going to blow it on beer and a lotto ticket.

I feel left out! I'm a NASCAR fan

 

[sandy whitelinger]

I really don't know, but it's not the message I hear in church.

Find a new church. :yes:

 

[sandy whitelinger]

I feel left out! I'm a NASCAR fan

So you shop at AutoZone?

 

[George Campbell]

I waste my money on transporation, lodging and race tickets!

 

[Autodidact]

The problem is that this is an eschatological passage ie. it is about the last day. The Kingdom mentioned in v34 is not a kingdom in Heaven but one that is formed in the New Jerusalem and descends to the earth. Although the Kingdom is like Heaven that does not answer your question.

I'm lost. What is this kingdom? Please explain your scriptural support for this interpretation.

What does Jesus say about how to get to heaven? Where? (Not what you say, but what Jesus says.)

 

[Autodidact]

If you are still interested, I would like to offer the following.

• feed the hungry
• clothe the naked
• take care of the sick
• visit those in prison

I would like to point out something that most Christians, and certainly those that are not Christian miss. Most look at these and assume this is literal and our mission. While these are noble efforts, the bible in other places indicates each of these bullets is in fact the definition of SIN.

When we are not under the saving power of Jesus, we are starving, because we do not have the bread of life. We do not have to covering of Jesus's blood so we are naked. We are sick near to death, because we do not have the healing power of salvation to cover our sins, and finally we are in spiritual prison, not able to commune with God and Jesus.

With that in mind, the goal of the true child of God is not to go around clothing everyone, trying to heal the sick, visiting inmates, and feeding the hungry. While all those are nice, what good do they do a person if they do not know of the power of Jesus? Once the power of Jesus is attained, all those bullets spiritually speaking disappear. In other words, what good does it do to gain the world and lose your soul?

Then the writings of Paul become paramount, that we need not worry about our life here, or in other verses, we need not worry about where out next meal comes from.

So, there you go Auto, this is the best understanding I have been able to come up with. If you want verses to back all this up let me know, but I am not sure it is necessary.

So basically, when you get through interpreting, you get the exact opposite of what Jesus actually said? So when, for example, Jesus says feed the hungry, He didn't mean to actually feed the actually hungry, but rather to go out and preach Christianity, even though He never says to do that?

And, for emphasis: the writings of Paul become paramount.
That is, like most modern Americans who call themselves Christian, you are in fact a Paulian, advocating doing the opposite of what Jesus asked you to, and instead making the writings of some guy named Paul paramount. Yet I bet you're confident that you get to heaven.

 

[Autodidact]

George: Thanks for the lengthy collection of scripture. Could you do the same for heaven as you did for hell--collect all the relevant passages? Thanks.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

So basically, when you get through interpreting, you get the exact opposite of what Jesus actually said? So when, for example, Jesus says feed the hungry, He didn't mean to actually feed the actually hungry, but rather to go out and preach Christianity, even though He never says to do that?

And, for emphasis: the writings of Paul become paramount.
That is, like most modern Americans who call themselves Christian, you are in fact a Paulian, advocating doing the opposite of what Jesus asked you to, and instead making the writings of some guy named Paul paramount. Yet I bet you're confident that you get to heaven.

Auto, you need to slow down a minute, that is if you want to actually dialog instead of judge me.

Look at Acts 1 8&9

8: But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.
9: And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.

This is suppose to be a direct quote from Jesus, and it is pretty straight forward. Let's work on this one before we look at another.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Also since you are fixated on the hunger part let's look at that a second.

Look here at John Ch 6

"32": Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
"33": For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
"34": Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
"35": And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.

If you can read this, and still think that Jesus was referring to physical bread, the conversation need not go any further. I can do the same with each bullet above, and how Jesus taught the spiritual side to each bullet, not the literal.

We know that food will not give us life, for today we live and eat, and tomorrow we die, so what good is it really? The very least to sustain us another day by chance we receive the true bread as above. I don't mean to preach, but I am trying to illustrate how the bullets are used by Jesus.

Does this make sense at all?

 

[Autodidact]

Auto, you need to slow down a minute, that is if you want to actually dialog instead of judge me.

Look at Acts 1 8&9
This is suppose to be a direct quote from Jesus, and it is pretty straight forward. Let's work on this one before we look at another.

It doesn't seem to be about heaven at all. I'm looking for what JESUS said about how to get to HEAVEN or what JESUS said about who goes to HEAVEN.

 

[Autodidact]

Also since you are fixated on the hunger part let's look at that a second.

Look here at John Ch 6
If you can read this, and still think that Jesus was referring to physical bread, the conversation need not go any further. I can do the same with each bullet above, and how Jesus taught the spiritual side to each bullet, not the literal.

We know that food will not give us life, for today we live and eat, and tomorrow we die, so what good is it really? The very least to sustain us another day by chance we receive the true bread as above. I don't mean to preach, but I am trying to illustrate how the bullets are used by Jesus.

Does this make sense at all?

This also seems not to be about heaven.

Yes, when Jesus said to feed the hungry and clothe the naked, to care for the sick and visit those in prison, I think he meant just that, not to go preach at them.

If so, it demonstrates once again that the gospels are so incoherent and unclear as to be useless. If when Jesus says "People who feed the hungry join me in heaven," and a sincere Christian can sincerely interpret that to mean "People who preach at other people join me in heaven," then there is no way whatsoever to tell what passages are literal and which allegorical.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

It doesn't seem to be about heaven at all. I'm looking for what JESUS said about how to get to HEAVEN or what JESUS said about who goes to HEAVEN.

My mistake, I derailed your thread a bit. I will relpy on topic. Sorry.