Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
So what happens when body dies? Spirit dies too?Sure there are. The ones that are occupying physical bodies.
As I see it, we are spiritual beings experiencing a human life.
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What does it mean to be "alive"
- Thread starter Spirit of Light
- Start date
My view is different. Prana gives life.
Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
It is good we not agree always
you have your understanding and Inhave mine, that said maybe both are right
I have an aversion to the term "spirit" because it has so many different meanings for different people. My view is different from some Vedantins, as most believe the subtle and causal bodies survive death of the physical body. In my understanding, the gross and subtle bodies fall away, and the causal body continues on in various forms (or even without form) until moksha (liberation) is achieved.
Even after moksha is achieved, the subtle body may continue to take form as jivanmukta (liberated physical being).
Heyo
Veteran Member
How do you decide whether something has a soul/spirit? Do bacteria have souls? Plants? Rocks? Viruses?
Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
Do you believe the universe as a body has life and consciousness?
In a sense. More accurately, it's an appearance in consciousness.
Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
In my understanding, everything that exist in the physical world has a spirit. Otherwise it can not exist. But I don't ask others to believe the way I do
Heyo
Veteran Member
So, having a soul is not a criterion to decide if something is alive. Computers exist in the physical world, so they have a soul. But you already excluded computers from being alive.
And "spiritual beings" do not exist in the physical world but you want them to be include in the "alive" set.
Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
The reason I said this is that in my understanding we are inter-dimensional beings so we exist in many places at once. So each object like a computer has a spirit in a different dimension. But the plastic in it self is not alive, as far as I understand
Perhaps, but I don't see many inorganic things multiplying - so rather a larger difference than between us and chimpanzees.
Heyo
Veteran Member
There is one criterion out of seven that viruses don't fullfil.
How many criteria do chimpanzees miss out of how many?
Blurring the lines isn't helpful.
I quite like this argument for such:
Are viruses alive?
The way that nature functions is not so black and white. For example, there are parasites, such as bacteria and fungi, that cannot reproduce on their own and need a host to complete their life cycles and survive. They are still considered to be alive. Also, if you take a seed, would you say that it is alive? It doesn’t show any sign of life, but when it is planted and has the right conditions then it germinates and grows. In this respect, viruses are very similar. They are inactive until they reach a host and then they reproduce. I would also argue that only things that are alive would be under the pressure to evolve and to survive. Viruses make copies of themselves by exploiting the environment. They can evolve and are very diverse. Viruses do show signs of life. They do not fit well with our definitions of life, and that is the main conflict in our confusion about how to classify viruses. Perhaps we need to rethink our definition of “life”.
But liking or not, I hardly can dispute what scientists/biologists/biochemists/etc. would define as alive - until that changes of course.
To be alive requires a complex network of energy exchange, including information processing about the environment.
Given what we know, the only matter allows this level of complexity and interaction. So, yes, it seems that only material things can be alive. There is no evidence of anything like 'pure energy', for example. Energy is always associated with matter.
Viruses are tricky when it comes to defining life. As has been pointed out, they reproduce and can be 'killed'. But they do not have an independent metabolism, no homeostasis, and no response to their environment (no sensitivity). The only way they can reproduce is by taking over the structures in something else that is alive.
Computers and robots are also interesting boundary cases. Again, though, they have no internal metabolism and don't reproduce. They *do* have sensitivity and strong information processing. There is also the *separate* question of whether computers and robots can potentially be *intelligent*, which should be distinguished from being 'alive'. These two questions are frequently conflated.
Given what we know, the only matter allows this level of complexity and interaction. So, yes, it seems that only material things can be alive. There is no evidence of anything like 'pure energy', for example. Energy is always associated with matter.
Viruses are tricky when it comes to defining life. As has been pointed out, they reproduce and can be 'killed'. But they do not have an independent metabolism, no homeostasis, and no response to their environment (no sensitivity). The only way they can reproduce is by taking over the structures in something else that is alive.
Computers and robots are also interesting boundary cases. Again, though, they have no internal metabolism and don't reproduce. They *do* have sensitivity and strong information processing. There is also the *separate* question of whether computers and robots can potentially be *intelligent*, which should be distinguished from being 'alive'. These two questions are frequently conflated.
Thief
Rogue Theologian
Spirit of Light
Be who ever you want
Tambourine
Well-Known Member
I believe there is no single thing that renders a collection of matter alive. It's a combination of many elements, such as a drive, ability to reproduce, to consume/transform matter into energy, growth etc.
Nobel science laureate Sir Paul Nurse comes up with a new definition of life
“Life on this planet is highly interacting, with viruses at one end and photosynthesising bacteria at the other – and we’re in the middle,” says Nurse.
What! Viruses are ALIVE? this will upset many - but perhaps a slip?
Firstly, a living thing must be able to evolve, developing through natural selection in the ongoing competition that ensures the survival of the fittest, according to the Nobel-winning geneticist Sir Paul Nurse. Second, it must be separate from its environment but connected to it, relying on it for food and other resources. And third, living entities must have the genes and other equipment needed to maintain themselves, grow and reproduce. “Together, three principles define life,” says Nurse. “Any entity which operates according to all three of them can be deemed to be alive – operating with purpose.”
“Life on this planet is highly interacting, with viruses at one end and photosynthesising bacteria at the other – and we’re in the middle,” says Nurse.
What! Viruses are ALIVE?
this will upset many - but perhaps a slip?Firstly, a living thing must be able to evolve, developing through natural selection in the ongoing competition that ensures the survival of the fittest, according to the Nobel-winning geneticist Sir Paul Nurse. Second, it must be separate from its environment but connected to it, relying on it for food and other resources. And third, living entities must have the genes and other equipment needed to maintain themselves, grow and reproduce. “Together, three principles define life,” says Nurse. “Any entity which operates according to all three of them can be deemed to be alive – operating with purpose.”
Nothing more than a biological process,. Consider, there is just as much life in a fly or an ant or a lowly bacterium as there is is any human