What does Belief, non belief, agnostisism have to do with anything at all?

[David T]

I am trying to get an understanding of what has been presented as three separate perceptions in disagreement. I only understand these three as a singular perception articulated in three different ways..
I am first an experiencalist. Whatever the ocean, clouds, nature, cosmos, does is totally independent of the intellect. No science no religion no human thought, no math, no words, nothing that prattles around in the tiny region of the brain self labeled "higher functioning" is causing it.

So please explain exactly what "belief" "non belief" " agnosticism" has to do with anything at all other than with itself.

Hiking out away in the wilderness from civilization makes all three absurdly urbane. Sorry all three, there actually is a larger than all three of you, that hides in the open, like a stick bug independent of all three of you.

Ps. The nicene creed is a disaster.. It placed all reality in the brain with two words "we believe" everything after that is thus rendered nonsense.

 

[YmirGF]

Beliefs are like different tinted glasses. Some will clarify your view, whereas others will make thinks blury, where still others will have no discernible effect. In short, beliefs directly affect our perception and experience due to how we have hard-wired ourselves to react. Remember, we don't believe things for no reason at all and that complicates experience.

 

[David T]

Beliefs are like different tinted glasses. Some will clarify your view, whereas others will make thinks blury, where still others will have no discernible effect. In short, beliefs directly affect our perception and experience due to how we have hard-wired ourselves to react. Remember, we don't believe things for no reason at all and that complicates experience.

if we take 20 people induce an experience chemically, they then give their interpretation of that experience and we end up with 20 different versions. Are they conveying the experience or are they conveying something else?

I can taste an orange. I convey that experience to three people who cannot taste is conveying it give them the experience of tasting the orange. The conversation i believe, i dont believe agnostic striles me as one person might have possibly tasted the orange slightly once, another person has no idea since they have no experience at all, and the third undecided is yaking a philosophical view of the other two.

I really dont understand all three and i do at the same time. i am not that

 

[DustyFeet]

i don't know if this will help or answer your question, so, try to be kind with your criticism...

some people need vacations especially in the cold dark months
some people need to avoid meat and animal products because otherwise they feel guilty

i need belief, it makes me feel good

it's not for everyone?

 

[Axe Elf]

Other than the single indisputable fact of our own existence, belief is all we have. All other facts are based in faith:

Faith in our own personal experiences.
Faith in the testimony of others regarding their own personal experiences.
Faith in the axioms of formal systems of reasoning.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

So please explain exactly what "belief" "non belief" " agnosticism" has to do with anything at all other than with itself.

Not a whole lot. The sorts of gods that people tend to believe in are gods that have very little bearing on... well... anything, really.

If not for the impact of religion on humanity, the question of whether gods exist would be an irrelevant question for philosophical musings and nothing more.

 

[WalterTrull]

So please explain exactly what "belief" "non belief" " agnosticism" has to do with anything at all other than with itself.

I'm pretty sure it has to do with T-shirts and teams. There have to be different teams to sell more T-shirts. Same sport, different teams, doesn't matter who wins 'cuz doesn't change anything, but we get to run around yelling "read my T-shirt you doof!" The T-shirt people are very happy.

 

[David T]

I'm pretty sure it has to do with T-shirts and teams. There have to be different teams to sell more T-shirts. Same sport, different teams, doesn't matter who wins 'cuz doesn't change anything, but we get to run around yelling "read my T-shirt you doof!" The T-shirt people are very happy.

I actually think that literally is it!!!

 

[David T]

Not a whole lot. The sorts of gods that people tend to believe in are gods that have very little bearing on... well... anything, really.

If not for the impact of religion on humanity, the question of whether gods exist would be an irrelevant question for philosophical musings and nothing more.

Really. I didnt think what i wrote was that difficult to understand.

 

[David T]

i don't know if this will help or answer your question, so, try to be kind with your criticism...

some people need vacations especially in the cold dark months
some people need to avoid meat and animal products because otherwise they feel guilty

i need belief, it makes me feel good

it's not for everyone?

I think at least i can understand that sort of. Ironically one post said if religion died out the topic would become irrelevant. Apparently their reading comprehension is so southern baptist poor they didnt understand what i wrote. But thats atheists!!!

Btw i am not knocking belief its very different than how i understand things.

 

[David T]

Other than the single indisputable fact of our own existence, belief is all we have. All other facts are based in faith:

Faith in our own personal experiences.
Faith in the testimony of others regarding their own personal experiences.
Faith in the axioms of formal systems of reasoning.

Well we certainly convince ourselves that is true here in modernity. A very theory hypothesis belief intellectualizing group for sure.

 

[HonestJoe]

So please explain exactly what "belief" "non belief" " agnosticism" has to do with anything at all other than with itself.

In general terms or specifically in reference to concepts of sentient deities? In either case, beliefs inspire actions and actions have consequences.

 

[David T]

In general terms or specifically in reference to concepts of sentient deities? In either case, beliefs inspire actions and actions have consequences.

So nature has nothing to do with it? Odd i have read muir a lot and his writings give another perspective that at times conflicts with both religion and science narratives as nature as dead innert random accidentalism. Which is btw very very christian historically since nothing is more random than literal miracles. .

 

[HonestJoe]

So nature has nothing to do with it?

Nothing much to do with the specific question you asked. It has more to do with much wider questions of life. Why can’t the questions of belief have significant without being the be-all and end-all of everything?

Odd i have read muir a lot and his writings give another perspective that at times conflicts with both religion and science narratives as nature as dead innert random accidentalism.

I doubt it. The idea of conflicting with either religion or science as generic concepts strikes me as ridiculous. It’s like saying something doesn’t look like colour. They might have had ideas that conflicted with specific religious and scientific ideas of their time and place (I’ve no idea who you’re referring to) but that’s an entirely different thing. I don’t see the need or benefit in approaching this kind of thing in such a combative manner.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Really. I didnt think what i wrote was that difficult to understand.

I have no idea what you were trying to express. I can only respond to what you write.

Edit: your OP - talking about belief and posted in the "Monotheism" forum - was about belief in God, no?

 

[David T]

Nothing much to do with the specific question you asked. It has more to do with much wider questions of life. Why can’t the questions of belief have significant without being the be-all and end-all of everything?

I doubt it. The idea of conflicting with either religion or science as generic concepts strikes me as ridiculous. It’s like saying something doesn’t look like colour. They might have had ideas that conflicted with specific religious and scientific ideas of their time and place (I’ve no idea who you’re referring to) but that’s an entirely different thing. I don’t see the need or benefit in approaching this kind of thing in such a combative manner.

Nothing ro do with nature. You have facinatinily deluded myths.

 

[David T]

I have no idea what you were trying to express. I can only respond to what you write.

Edit: your OP - talking about belief and posted in the "Monotheism" forum - was about belief in God, no?

You projected onto what i wrote you actually didnt read it. Religion does this constantly with its own text. Curious.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

You projected onto what i wrote you actually didnt read it. Religion does this constantly with its own text. Curious.

Is this your way of saying that your post in "Monotheism" has nothing to do with monotheism?

 

[syo]

s. The nicene creed is a disaster.. It placed all reality in the brain with two words "we believe"

you nailed it. one word; ''miracle''. ''miracle'' has nothing to do with nature. nature in the nicene creed is a huge idol. do you ''believe''?

 

[DustyFeet]

''miracle'' has nothing to do with nature

forgive the butt-in-ski, but i would be very worried if miracles started happening that operated in the open. i think they need to be obscured and cloaked in circumstance and naturally easily explained events.

the alternative would be like... the 10 plagues all over again, the events at mt. sinai maybe happening again,
some people's lives extended to 127, 900+ years. i imagine most people would be confused, scared and never leave their houses.

it would be like: madness... dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria