What do you think the biggest misunderstanding about Christmas is?

[URAVIP2ME]

Well, please tell the Religious Right to stop acting like OT Pharisees and start acting like Jesus! People might start respecting Christianity again.

'Christendom' (so-called Christians) will never stop acting as they act.
Jesus informs us that his genuine followers will be hated.- Matthew 10:22
Jesus and his 1st-century followers acted by remaining neutral in world affairs.
They did Not even get involved in the issues of their day between the Jews verses the Romans.
Christendom will never be politically neutral. Christendom even back political wars.
They have even used the pulpit as a recruiting station so parents will sacrifice their young on the Altar of War as if that is the same thing as the Altar of God which it isn't.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

That is not Christianity! Anyone involved in politics is not following the teachings of Jesus Christ. The 'marriage of Church and State' is a very unholy union.

The ^ above ^ reminds me about earth's 'kings' (rulers) being in ' bed ' with the religious ' queen ' of Revelation 18:7.
This harlot ' queen ' will try to remain a potent force in attempting to bend ' kings ' to her will.- Revelation 17:1-2.
This ' unholy marriage ' is a reason why Jesus and his followers would be politically neutral in world affairs.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

The mid-second century argument for December 25 was quite simple. The feast of the annunciation (when the angel appeared to Mary) would have been when Jesus was conceived. That feast was set on March 25. Nine months later is December 25.
Ambrose is one person, and he is speaking metaphorically. His words cannot be construed as to indicate the reason why December 25 was chosen. Not by a long shot.
Anyhow, I'm not sure why I'm even getting involved in this. As a Jew, I don't have a dog in this race. It's simply a topic I've read about over the years in different forums.

Thank you for your input.
Problem is: according to Scripture Jesus was 33 1/2 years old when he died on the Spring date of Nisan the 14th day.
So, Jesus would have turned 34 in the Fall or Autumn of the year. Thus, conceived in January (?)____________

 

[URAVIP2ME]

What is your evidence that there is a God, or that Jesus was his son, or that what Bible mentions is the truth?
Is there something going round and round?
Deeje said "It was mainstream Christianity that I left. I could not handle the hypocrisy .."

Wow, your inquiring mind wants to know.
Jesus too could Not handle the hypocrisy of the religious Pharisees of his day.
However, Jesus did Not say God was wrong, but the hypocritical Pharisees were wrong - Chapter 23 of Matthew.
To me what is going ' round and round ' is the growing worsening world conditions as described at 2 Timothy 3:1-5,13.
So, what the Bible mentions as ' religious truth ' this ties in with the truth of matters going on today.
We are in the last days of badness on Earth before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, involves himself into mankind's affairs.

 

[McBell]

What do you think the biggest misunderstanding about Christmas is?

That people give a cricket fart what other people think Christmas should be.

 

[Augustus]

Whats the evidence that "the nativity" was celebrated on the 25th December (By Christians) before the 3rd century if you are actually referring to aurelian.

Some evidence here regarding Hippolytus and Julius Africanus early 3rd C: Christmas 25 Dec: Scholarly views (Halfway through the 2nd post)

The evidence is not conclusive as it relies on inference and relates to dating the birth, not necessarily to a celebration of the birth. Even if Christmas has a date, it may have been many years before it became a feast day. There is no reason to assume that the original purpose of dating the nativity was to celebrate it as birthday celebrations were often criticised by early Christians.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Thank you for your input.
Problem is: according to Scripture Jesus was 33 1/2 years old when he died on the Spring date of Nisan the 14th day.
So, Jesus would have turned 34 in the Fall or Autumn of the year. Thus, conceived in January (?)____________

Perhaps I'm missing something. What chapter and verse says that Jesus was 33 1/2 when he died?

 

[Aupmanyav]

What convinces you that Hinduism is true? It’s called “faith” and that is what gives a person conviction....but it isn’t blind faith for me. The brilliance of Creation itself testifies to the existence of an Intelligent Designer......and the Bible stands up to scrutiny in historical accuracy and prophesy.

Yes.....there is. It’s called false worship, and I believe that a single entity in opposition to God has created all of it.

- And according to the Revelation in the Bible, we are deep into the time of the end, when God will bring all mankind to an accounting. If we have chosen our god and are confident about our choice, God will let us know if we have made the right choice.
- We can’t justify ourselves to God....he accepts no excuses.

I check my belief with science every Sunday. Perhaps you have not noted that I am a strong atheist apart from being an Advaitist Hindu (a believer in absolute non-duality, so no question of accepting God\Gods\Goddesses along with their paraphernalia).
Is there a creation or it is your illusion? Why would a God need to create anything? You hardly know about this man called Jesus, and you claim historical accuracy for Bible - with 6,000 years of Earth history, a flood, creation of humans from mud and creation of women from his ribs? You also believe in Nostradamus? I am told that many of his prophecies were correct.

There is one other thing going round and round:

- That is what you believe. Bible is a cooperatively produced and repeatedly edited fiction, but there is nothing in it which would make me take it as fact.
- But if anyone accepts his so-called son, then all sins are forgotten. Oh, what a God?

 

[Aupmanyav]

We are in the last days of badness on Earth before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, involves himself into mankind's affairs.

Even his disciples kept waiting and so do the Christians of today. Neither Jesus would return to the world nor evil will ever go away, the world will continue as it always has. Dead bodies disintegrate, decompose, their flesh is eaten by maggots if not immolated, the dead cannot be resurrected. Dont live in utopias.

 

[Sand Dancer]

That is not Christianity! Anyone involved in politics is not following the teachings of Jesus Christ. The marriage of Church and State is a very unholy union.

True, but sadly people judge all of Christianity by the Religious Right because they are so vocal. I wish the good Christians would stand up to these folks.

 

[Sand Dancer]

'Christendom' (so-called Christians) will never stop acting as they act.
Jesus informs us that his genuine followers will be hated.- Matthew 10:22
Jesus and his 1st-century followers acted by remaining neutral in world affairs.
They did Not even get involved in the issues of their day between the Jews verses the Romans.
Christendom will never be politically neutral. Christendom even back political wars.
They have even used the pulpit as a recruiting station so parents will sacrifice their young on the Altar of War as if that is the same thing as the Altar of God which it isn't.

I don't think he meant that they would be hated because they act like hypocrites (those were supposed to be the Pharisees/Sadducees) and not at all like Jesus. I don't think the Religious Right quite understands that.

 

[metis]

I was referring to the 'earlier' or the ' FIRST' census that Luke speaks about at Luke 2:2
The Smithsonian Channel is Not Scripture.
To which census is the Smithsonian referring: the first or the later one _____________

Again, since I'm certainly no expert on this, I tend to lean in the direction that they archaeologists and Roman historians tell us is most likely. If they're wrong, so be it, but I'm not going to lose any sleep over it.

Also, it's important for each of us to remember that scripture is subjective, not objective.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Perhaps I'm missing something. What chapter and verse says that Jesus was 33 1/2 when he died?

I'll start with Daniel 9:24-27. The length of Jesus' ministry and Jesus' death.
Jesus' death took place in the Spring month of Nisan (14th day 3 p.m.)
Jesus' ministry was 3 1/2 years long.
John the Baptist's ministry started in Tiberius' 15th year. That 15th year ran from 28 C.E. to August/ Sept. to 29 C.E.
Placing John's birth in the Spring of the year.- Luke 3:1-3
Jesus was born 6 months 'after' John was born. (aka Fall / Autumn)
Jesus begins his ministry at about age 30 as per Luke 3:21-23.
So, adding 3 1/2 years to age 30 places Jesus' age as being 33 1/2 years old at his springtime death.
For Jesus to die at Passover time would require four (4) Passovers.
Evidence for four (4) Passovers is found in John's account at John 2:13; John 5:1; John 6:4 and John 13:1.
The following day after Jesus' death was a Great Sabbath (Leviticus 23:5-7; John 19:31)

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I'll start with Daniel 9:24-27. The length of Jesus' ministry and Jesus' death.
Jesus' death took place in the Spring month of Nisan (14th day 3 p.m.)
Jesus' ministry was 3 1/2 years long.
John the Baptist's ministry started in Tiberius' 15th year. That 15th year ran from 28 C.E. to August/ Sept. to 29 C.E.
Placing John's birth in the Spring of the year.- Luke 3:1-3
Jesus was born 6 months 'after' John was born. (aka Fall / Autumn)
Jesus begins his ministry at about age 30 as per Luke 3:21-23.
So, adding 3 1/2 years to age 30 places Jesus' age as being 33 1/2 years old at his springtime death.
For Jesus to die at Passover time would require four (4) Passovers.
Evidence for four (4) Passovers is found in John's account at John 2:13; John 5:1; John 6:4 and John 13:1.
The following day after Jesus' death was a Great Sabbath (Leviticus 23:5-7; John 19:31)

This is all conjectural reasoning. YOu keep using the word "about." Admit that you don't actually know. It's an estimate. I asked for a verse that said his age when he died. Obviously you couldn't supply one.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

This is all conjectural reasoning. YOu keep using the word "about." Admit that you don't actually know. It's an estimate. I asked for a verse that said his age when he died. Obviously you couldn't supply one.

Ouch, just because there is No direct Scripture, does Not mean we can't reason on the Scriptures.
I find the word ' about ' as found at Luke 3:23. Just means Not an exact day or date but close to it.
Plus, in the old Hebrew Scriptures the word ' about ' or ' towards evening ' also appears at Genesis 3:8 meaning close to a time although Not an exact time of day.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Even his disciples kept waiting and so do the Christians of today. Neither Jesus would return to the world nor evil will ever go away, the world will continue as it always has. Dead bodies disintegrate, decompose, their flesh is eaten by maggots if not immolated, the dead cannot be resurrected. Dont live in utopias.

Yup, dead bodies do disintegrate, decompose and eaten by maggots/worms even as found at Isaiah 66:24.
There in verse 24 the symbolic ' fire ' shows there will be No contents left.
Even corpses left on battlefields are eaten by scavenger birds.
What the birds leave behind are consumed by worms or maggots.
So, the resurrection is Not dependent upon any fleshly remains.
The resurrection to take place is because of God's memory of that person.

Sure the disciples kept waiting and that is why Jesus gave the illustration as found at Luke 19:11-15.
First, Jesus (as the nobleman) would first go away to a 'far country' (Heaven) before later returning.
Thus, showing the Kingdom of God (Daniel 2:44) would Not be immediate or instantly in that 1st century.
Plus, Revelation was Not written until the very end of the first century.
The setting or time frame for Revelation is our day or time frame - Revelation 1:10.

Left on its own the world would continue as is with wicked men going from bad to worse and would bring ruin.
This is why God will bring to ruin those ruining the Earth - Revelation 11:18 B

 

[Aupmanyav]

Left on its own the world would continue as is with wicked men going from bad to worse and would bring ruin. This is why God will bring to ruin those ruining the Earth - Revelation 11:18 B

Earth has always been on its own. You can keep dreaming.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Earth has always been on its own. You can keep dreaming.

Of course Earth has always been on its own because God gifted Earth to us as per Psalms 115:16.
As a new car comes with a warranty it is only valid if maintenance is kept up.
Mankind was to maintain Earth as per Genesis 1:28
The paradisical Garden of Eden was a sample garden, or a blueprint for mankind to follow and expand that Garden.
Mankind's history has proven that man is Not keeping up with that ' warranty ' agreement.
So, before an un-maintained car completely breaks down the original owner might choose to fix it.
Before Earth is ruined - Revelation 11:18 B - God ( the original Owner ) will have Jesus step in to fix it.
We even see parts of the Earth today where pollution stops how fast Earth rebounds on its own.
So, once those ruining the Earth ( literal or moral ruin ) are brought to ruin, Earth will rebound on its own and remain on its own because those who will be left will follow the agreement as found at Genesis 1:28.

 

[rational experiences]

Paganism owned the end of year celebration as human reasoning.

Winter was given the title win....for the radiation conditions of the Sun in summer prove that if ICE did not exist on Earth being re created each year, we would own no life on Earth.

For we say the continuance of life and owning food and feasting with Nature is owned by the sacredness of ICE....a very simple sea son explanation...as told by males who say everything I think I own...which is their owned male problem.

Why a male says I said and named the conditions on Earth by a male applied thinking so I will say that + balances a positive story is my owned story, about self and harm of self and self reasoning.

So then you would ask that male self...so you harmed self then to tell a story in science about why End of Year ICE gain was a holy birth for God, the Earth?

O a planet.

Yes, it was the holy returned rebirthing of cold gases, the spirit of the heavens, and without that ICE being present, the spirit would change and we would be life sacrificed and we lose our food and our animals.

Oh, so that teaching was realistically a science teaching who everyone said took over the known Pagan idealism of festive praise in Nature...and said, no it should be taught as a science teaching and not spiritual natural praise...by the organization who says that they control everything, even how information is taught in a natural life.

Why Paganism was factually taken over by the science organization...when natural humans already realized why they celebrated natural life and natural life continuance in natural spiritual human reasoning.

 

[rational experiences]

No not that.. The manger probably was attached to a house. The part about the house with the marital apartment. Both Bethlehem's were tiny villages.

Luke 2:7 7and she gave birth to her firstborn, a son. She wrapped him in cloths and placed him in a manger, because there was no guest room available for them.

Human reasoning says that the spirit ICE gain brought new life into natural balances that is not just human owned, it is also bio animal life ownership.
Sacred ICE is reborn in the coldest months...a celebration against Summer, the hottest months...to own balanced Earth seasons, that supply our food growth in those balanced Earth sea sons.
You know the 4 sons + rational science information.
Space owned the presence of cold gases surrounding Earth. Science who irradiated Earth with UFO radiation killed and sacrificed both animal and human bio life.
So the spatial Mother womb had to give new birth to the gases by ICE being reborn in December every year as the same, same and same.
To see the star, means that an asteroid wandering star stone gas was being released for obviously the temple pyramid sciences of the past had heated up out of space.

And it was just a story told by science about how they nearly had life on Earth destroyed by attacking and sacrificing natural human life and removing the rebirth of ICE existing.