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What do you think happens when we die

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Be careful that your own words do not apply equally to yourself. Nuff said.
That does not apply to me because I individually investigated the Baha’i Faith in order to determine if it was the truth. I had no confirmation bias because I did not ever have a religion before that and I did not even believe in God. ;)

Since that time, I have looked at many other religions in order to determine how they fit in with Baha’i beliefs and I can see that their spiritual verities are the same... As such, I have no logical reason to go backwards in time and join an older religion.

Christians cannot say that they have investigated other religions, and if any have it is a rare few. They only look at what they want to confirm as truth. Only once, in five years of posting to Christians on a regular basis, have I encountered one humble Trinitarian Christian who was actually willing to look at what Baha’is believe in a serious fashion, including going over verses and comparing what he thought they meant vs. what I thought they meant. He has held to his beliefs but I respect him for that because at least he looked. I learned so much about the Bible from him and he is still my good friend. :)

There is no reason for Baha’is to become Christians because we already believe in Jesus. It is the Christians who should look at Baha’u’llah, but most won’t because they are so sure that ONLY they are right and everyone else who does not believe as they do is wrong... They are unwilling to look at anything else that others believe because they are so sure ONLY they are right... I call it like I see it. I have no reason to do otherwise. ;)
In the end all will be revealed one way or the other. In my beliefs, everyone will be where they have placed themselves by their own choices at the end of this present world system. God will judge all of by those choices.
I can certainly agree that we will be where we have placed ourselves.

“It is clear and evident that all men shall, after their physical death, estimate the worth of their deeds, and realize all that their hands have wrought. I swear by the Day Star that shineth above the horizon of Divine power! They that are the followers of the one true God shall, the moment they depart out of this life, experience such joy and gladness as would be impossible to describe, while they that live in error shall be seized with such fear and trembling, and shall be filled with such consternation, as nothing can exceed. Well is it with him that hath quaffed the choice and incorruptible wine of faith through the gracious favor and the manifold bounties of Him Who is the Lord of all Faiths…” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 169-171

I do not believe that there will be an end to this world, but there will be a New World Order that will replace the old world order, also known as the Kingdom of God on earth. Humans will build that Kingdom with the blueprint instructions laid out by Baha’u’llah.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
@Trailblazer,

You said: "...there is no way you or any Christian can ever know what Jesus and Baha’u’llah knew."

Well, I don't know what Baha'u'llah knew, I'll grant you that, but... "We do have the mind of Christ" available to us.- 1 Corinthians 2:16.

I have to ask, though: you freely (and honestly) admit that you're not familiar with the Bible....I appreciate your frankness about that.... but how can you then aver that Baha'u'llah knows what the God of the Bible knows? You'd have to know what the God of the Bible teaches, which is found in the Bible.

Or is it a different God?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
You said: "...there is no way you or any Christian can ever know what Jesus and Baha’u’llah knew."

Well, I don't know what Baha'u'llah knew, I'll grant you that, but... "We do have the mind of Christ" available to us.- 1 Corinthians 2:16.
What I meant is that without the mind of Christ (what Christ revealed to you via the NT scriptures) you could not know what God knew. Christ Jesus was the mediator.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

I have to ask, though: you freely (and honestly) admit that you're not familiar with the Bible....I appreciate your frankness about that.... but how can you then aver that Baha'u'llah knows what the God of the Bible knows? You'd have to know what the God of the Bible teaches, which is found in the Bible.

Or is it a different God?
No, I do not have to know everything that the Bible teaches in order to know that Baha'u'llah knew what the God of the Bible knows.

I believe that Baha’u’llah knew what the God of the Bible knows because the God of the Bible is the same God that Baha’u’llah knew, since there is only one God.

The reason I believe that Baha’u’llah knew what the God of the Bible knows is because God taught Baha’u’llah all knowledge, just as God revealed all knowledge to Christ.

“O KING! I was but a man like others, asleep upon My couch, when lo, the breezes of the All-Glorious were wafted over Me, and taught Me the knowledge of all that hath been. This thing is not from Me, but from One Who is Almighty and All-Knowing. And He bade Me lift up My voice between earth and heaven, and for this there befell Me what hath caused the tears of every man of understanding to flow. The learning current amongst men I studied not; their schools I entered not. Ask of the city wherein I dwelt, that thou mayest be well assured that I am not of them who speak falsely. This is but a leaf which the winds of the will of thy Lord, the Almighty, the All-Praised, have stirred.” Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 57

So both Christ and Baha’u’llah had the same knowledge as God. An important point is that we were not ready to hear everything that Christ knew 2000 years ago, which is why Christ said: John 16:12-14 I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot bear them now. Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

Baha’is believe that Baha’u’llah was the Spirit of truth who came to bring all truth, all the truth we are capable of understanding at this time in history. Just as Christ held back some of what He knew back in His day, Bahaullah held back some of what He knew in this day because we are not capable of comprehending it yet...

“Oh, would that the world could believe Me! Were all the things that lie enshrined within the heart of Bahá, and which the Lord, His God, the Lord of all names, hath taught Him, to be unveiled to mankind, every man on earth would be dumbfounded.......
Of these truths some can be disclosed only to the extent of the capacity of the repositories of the light of Our knowledge, and the recipients of Our hidden grace.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 176


In the future more of God’s truth will be revealed, more and more in each successive age.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
@Deeje

Acts 13:34-37 And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead, now no more to return to corruption, he said on this wise, I will give you the sure mercies of David. Wherefore he saith also in another psalm, Thou shalt not suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. For David, after he had served his own generation by the will of God, fell on sleep, and was laid unto his fathers, and saw corruption: But he, whom God raised again, saw no corruption.

Psalm 16:9-10 Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoiceth: my flesh also shall rest in hope. For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.


Deeje said: This is why I asked you about Jesus' tomb......he was resurrected and it was prophesied in the Psalms that his flesh would not be corrupted in the grave. His remains are not in a tomb. Your prophet's tomb no doubt has his remains in it. There is no way he can be the returned Christ.

Baha’u’llah’s flesh rested in hope. His soul did not go to hell, it went to heaven. Finally, Baha’u’llah did not see corruption.

That he will not “see corruption” has nothing to do with the flesh in the grave.
Baha’u’llah saw no corruption in the sense of the definition below.

1 a : dishonest or illegal behavior especially by powerful people (such as government officials or police officers) : depravity
b : inducement to wrong by improper or unlawful means (such as bribery)
c : a departure from the original or from what is pure or correct
Definition of CORRUPTION

Jesus fulfilled some of the Old Testament prophecies but not all of them and that is one reason why Jews rejected Jesus as being the Messiah they were waiting for. But for the sake of argument, let’s just say that Jesus could return as you believe He will.

A prophecy can be fulfilled by more than one person. Prophecies can have manifold meanings, but sometimes they are more specific. Let’s look at just one verse from Isaiah 53 for example.

Isaiah 53:10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

Jesus and Baha’u’llah both fulfilled the first part of this prophecy (Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin)

“Bahá’u’lláh was twice stoned, once scourged, thrice poisoned, scarred with hundred-pound chains which cut through his flesh and rested upon the bones of his shoulders. He lived a prisoner and an exile for nearly half a century.” Thief in the Night, p. 157

Baha’u’llah sacrificed 30 years of His life for our sins against God:

“May my life be laid down for the transgressions of such as transgress against Thee, for through them the breath of Thy grace and the fragrance of Thy loving-kindness are made known and diffused amongst men. May my inmost being be offered up for the sins of them that have sinned against Thee, for it is as a result of such sins that the Day Star of Thy manifold favors revealeth itself above the horizon of Thy bounty, and the clouds of Thy never-failing providence rain down their gifts upon the realities of all created things.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 311

Deeje said: The second coming of Christ was not to be in the flesh.

If the second coming was not to be in the flesh, then there is no way that Jesus can see His seed.
Jesus’ days were cut short, not prolonged.

Jesus did not and cannot ever fulfill all of this prophecy. (There are other prophecies that Jesus cannot possibly fulfill in this same chapter of Isaiah and other chapters, but I want to focus on this one verse for now, in order to show that all of it cannot apply to Jesus.)

The following happened to Baha’u’llah and as a result of His Coming: First He had a son and then He lived into old age, and then the pleasure of the LORD prospered as a result of His Coming. It all happened in the exact order stated in the verse: “he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.”

Jesus’ physical body is dead so Jesus can never see His seed. Baha’u’llah saw His seed.


“… he shall see his seed …” Isaiah 53:10.
  • Bahá’u’lláh did see his ‘seed’. He wrote a special document called the Book of the Covenant, in which he appointed his eldest son to be the Centre of his Faith after his own passing. This very event was also foretold in the prophecies of the Psalms that proclaim:
  • “Also I will make him my first-born higher than the kings of the earth … and my covenant shall stand fast with him.” Psalms 89:27, 28
  • The ‘first-born’ son of Bahá’u’lláh, was named ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, which means ‘the servant of Bahá’(‘u’lláh). Bahá’u’lláh appointed him as his own successor in his Will and Testament. He called ‘Abdu’l-Bahá the Centre of his Covenant.
Thief in the Night, p. 158

Jesus’ days were not prolonged; they were cut short by the crucifixion. Baha’u’llah’s days were prolonged because He lived into old age.

8. Isaiah’s prophecy continues:

“He (God) shall prolong his days …” Isaiah 53:10.

  • Bahá’u’lláh’s days were prolonged. He was born in 1817 and passed away in the Holy Land in 1892. In the last years of his life, Bahá’u’lláh was released from his prison cell. He came out of the prison-city of ‘Akká and walked on the sides of Mount Carmel. His followers came from afar to be with him, and to surround him with their love, fulfilling the words of the prayer of David spoken within a cave: “Bring my soul out of prison, that I may praise thy name: the righteous shall compass me about; for thou shalt deal bountifully with me.” Psalms 142:7.
  • These events in the valley of ‘Akká with its strong fortress prison had been foreshadowed in Ecclesiastes (4:14):
Thief in the Night, pp. 158-159
 

amorphous_constellation

Well-Known Member
It's a very simple question. What happens when we die?

Well then you get your life edited down to a 3rd person movie , cut down to all the most interesting scenes. Now arguably, some people might have "more interesting lives" than others, but not everyone's life is in the same genre, you must understand. Someone who thinks a lot, or anyone who has a interesting thought, might have that thought be expressed by a voice during various scenes. Now this movie would be connected on a grid to other movies in close proximity, ones that you are probably in. This movie or documentary can be shared with others, reviewed or edited by you, and probably will be presented to various judging entities in the meta-life space
 
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