What Do You Feel Is Wrong With Islam, Part 2

[!Fluffy!]

The original thread has gotten very long, and the debate has gone down several paths but I felt the OP asked a legitmate and honest question.

While I have several reasons for finding Islam personally unappealing, this post from Islam QA pretty much sums up the worst quandry of it for me:

Question:
Is it obligatory for every Muslim to go out for jihad? Or is jihad mustahabb and not obligatory?.

Answer:
"Praise be to Allaah.

Physical jihad is the pinnacle of Islam, and some scholars regarded it as the sixth pillar of Islam.

The Muslims have neglected jihad for a long time, so they deserve the punishment of Allaah, to be humiliated, belittled and defeated. ​

(*snip*)​

One of the strangest things to note is that we are living in a time when some of the Muslims are embarrassed to quote the verses and ahaadeeth on jihad in front of their kaafir friends. ​

Their faces turn red because they are too shy to mention the rulings on the jizyah, slavery and killing prisoners of war. They wish that they could erase these verses and ahaadeeth from the Qur’aan and Sunnah so that they would not be criticized by this world with its backward principles despite its claims to be civilized.​

If they cannot erase them then they try to misinterpret them and distort their meanings so that they suit the whims and desires of their masters. ​

I will not say so that they suit their whims and desires, for they are too weak to have their own whims and desires, and too ignorant. Rather it is the whims and desires of their masters and teachers among the missionaries and colonialists, the enemies of Islam.”
‘Umdat al-Tafseer, 1/46. ​

The result of that is that we hardly hear anything nowadays apart from the following phrases: world peace … peaceful coexistence … safe borders … a new world order … the calamities of war… ​

Those who proclaim the verses and ahaadeeth of jihad nowadays are subject to a number of accusations. They are called terrorists, extremists, enemies of peace and bloodthirsty, and are accused of wanting to destroy twentieth century civilization. ​

This is the unfortunate reality in which the Muslim ummah is living nowadays. That is because we have given up supporting our religion and doing the duties that Allaah has enjoined upon us. ​

Allaah has commanded us to support His religion and to wage jihad against His enemies.

There are so many verses that enjoin jihad against the mushrikeen and fighting them until all submission is for Allaah alone; they clearly state that it is obligatory and is prescribed and is compulsory. ​

Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Jihaadholy fighting in Allaah’s Cause) is ordained for you (Muslims) though you dislike it, and it may be that you dislike a thing which is good for you and that you like a thing which is bad for you. Allaah knows but you do not know”
[al-Baqarah 2:216]​

Rulings on jihad
The scholars (may Allaah have mercy on them) have mentioned the rulings on jihad and have stated that jihad is of two types:

1 – Taking the initiative in fighting

This means pursuing the kaafirs in their lands and calling them to Islam and fighting them if they do not agree to submit to the rule of Islam.
This kind of jihad is fard kifaayah (a communal obligation) upon the Muslims. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): ​

“And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and polytheism, i.e. worshipping others besides Allaah), and the religion (worship) will all be for Allaah Alone [in the whole of the world]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allaah), then certainly, Allaah is All-Seer of what they do”
[al-Anfaal 8:39] ​

“Then when the Sacred Months (the Ist, 7th, 11th, and 12th months of the Islamic calendar) have passed, then kill the Mushrikoon (see V.2:105) wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and lie in wait for them in each and every ambush. But if they repent [by rejecting Shirk (polytheism) and accept Islamic Monotheism] and perform As-Salaah (Iqaamat-as-Salaah), and give Zakaah, then leave their way free. Verily, Allaah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful”
[al-Tawbah 9:5] ​

“and fight against the Mushrikoon (polytheists, pagans, idolaters, disbelievers in the Oneness of Allaah) collectively as they fight against you collectively. But know that Allaah is with those who are Al-Muttaqoon (the pious”
[al-Tawbah 9:36] ​

“March forth, whether you are light (being healthy, young and wealthy) or heavy (being ill, old and poor), and strive hard with your wealth and your lives in the Cause of Allaah. This is better for you, if you but knew”
[al-Tawbah 9:41]"...​

(more in next post)...​

FROM:
Islam Question and Answer - Ruling on physical jihad

 

[!Fluffy!]

1. Taking the Initiative in Fighting, cont.
It was narrated from Ibn ‘Umar that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "I have been commanded to fight the people until they bear witness that there is no god but Allaah, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allaah, and establish regular prayer, and pay zakaah, If they do that then their blood and wealth is safe from me, except by the laws of Islam, and their reckoning will be with Allaah."
Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 24; Muslim, 29.
Muslim (3533) narrated from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: "Whoever dies without having fought or thought to himself about fighting has died following one of the branches of hypocrisy."
All of these texts – and many others in the Qur’aan and Sunnah – mean that it is obligatory for the Muslims to wage jihad against the kuffaar and take the initiative in that. The scholars are unanimously agreed that jihad against the kuffar, and seeking them in their own lands, and calling them to Islam, and waging jihad against them if they do not accept Islam or accept paying the jizyah, is obligatory and has not been abrogated.
Shaykh al-Islam (28/249) said:
Everyone who hears the call of the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) to the religion of Allaah with which he was sent and does not respond to it must be fought so that there will be no fitnah and so that submission will all be for Allaah.
Ibn ‘Atiyah said (2/43): There remains scholarly consensus that jihad is a communal obligation upon the ummah of Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), and if some of the Muslims undertake this duty the rest are absolved of responsibility.

(more...)

 

[!Fluffy!]

..."2 – Jihad in self-defence.
If the kuffaar attack and occupy a Muslim country, or they prepare to attack the Muslims, then it is obligatory for the Muslims to fight them so as to ward off their evil and foil their plots. Jihad in self-defence is fard ‘ayn (an individual obligation) upon the Muslims, according to scholarly consensus.

Al-Qurtubi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said in his Tafseer (8/15):
When jihad becomes inevitable because the enemy has overrun one of the (Muslim) regions, then it becomes obligatory for all the people of that region to mobilize and to go out to fight, whether they are light (being healthy, young and wealthy) or heavy (being ill, old and poor), each according to his abilities, with or without the permission of his parents. No one who is able to go out, warrior or helper, should stay behind. If the people of that country are unable to fight their enemy, then those in nearby and neighbouring countries have to go out to fight, in whatever numbers are required to show support, so that they will know that they have the strength to stand up to them and ward them off. Similarly everyone who knows of their weakness in the face of their enemies and knows that he can go and help them must also go out and fight. All of the Muslims should be united against their enemies.

If the people of the area where the enemy has invaded and occupied fight off the enemy themselves, then the others are relieved of that duty. If the enemy approaches the Muslim lands but does not enter, the Muslims must still go out to confront them so that the religion of Allaah will prevail and in order to protect the Muslim homeland and humiliate the enemy. There is no scholarly dispute on this point.
Shaykh al-Islam (28/358-359) said:

If the enemy wants to attack the Muslims then resisting becomes obligatory on all those who are under threat, and those who are not under threat are obliged to help them, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
"but if they seek your help in religion, it is your duty to help them except against a people with whom you have a treaty of mutual alliance"
[al-Anfaal 8:72]

And the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) also commanded us to help other Muslims. This is obligatory upon each person as much as possible, by fighting himself or by giving financial support, as was the case at the time of al-Khandaq, when Allaah did not grant any concession to anyone not to fight. Rather the Qur’aan condemns those who asked the Prophet for permission [not to fight] on the grounds that their houses were vulnerable when that was not the case, rather they just wanted to flee the battle. This fighting is in order to protect the relihion, and protect lives and honour, and this is absolutely essential.

This is the ruling on physical jihad in Islam, whether that is taking the initiative to call the kuffaar to enter this religion and subjugate them to the rule of Islam, or jihad to defend the religion and honour of the Muslims.
We ask Allaah to bring the Muslims back to their religion.
And Allaah knows best."


------------

So this pretty much sums up the main problem I and many others see with Islam, in that there seems to be so much support for physical jihaad, which is borne out in the news around the globe every day. And it is very difficult to understand how there can be TWO Islams, one which proclaims the other to be false, and both presenting verses and writings as proof, both of which we are told to accept, one at the point of a sword, the other at the expense of being called intolerant. Very confusing.


(...sorry about the big text, i'll try to clean it up...)

 

[Sahar]

One of the strangest things to note is that we are living in a time when some of the Muslims are embarrassed to quote the verses and ahaadeeth on jihad in front of their kaafir friends. ​

Their faces turn red because they are too shy to mention the rulings on the jizyah, slavery and killing prisoners of war. They wish that they could erase these verses and ahaadeeth from the Qur’aan and Sunnah so that they would not be criticized by this world with its backward principles despite its claims to be civilized.​

Well, i am not embarrassed to quote vesres or ahdeeth of Jihad, on the contrary, Jihad including physical Jihad is a very important aspect of my religion. But i don't know what impression the answer gives or i should have, does it say i should take my weapon to fight the mushrikeen right now? If this was true then i don't know what mushrikeen or kuffar it means. I hoped if the answer was specific and giving more details.
As for the third post, Jihad in self-defence, the only thing i could say is Ameen!

I don't think that God is punishing us because we left physical Jihad, i think what Muslims live is a consequence of their negativity inside their Muslim societies. I do think what the Muslims need to hear from the scholars of Islam (there are many who do this, Alhamdulillah) is how to provide the basic human rights to the Muslim individual. If many Muslims can not find clean food to eat or clean water to drink or proper place to live in or good education and health or freedom of thinking and movement or what they mostly find is corruption and injustice then i think this is where jihad is needed. All what Muslims need is development in the different aspects of life. I don't know what fighting the kuffar or mushrikeen will do for the starving children!!

 

[jamaesi]

I, as a Muslim, find that website ridiculous. Making an entire thread about it gives it far more attention that it deserves.


The first thing I love to look for in websites like that is what it says about women. Just in those answers I can find if that site is worth... well anything.


This is more of a rant and ramble than a well-thought out post, but I'll just type out my thoughts of why I think this website is so ridiculous.

In one of the answers it says that women should learn nothing except the Qur'an and in some cases learn how to be a teacher for children. I don't bloody think so. I'm a Political Science and Linguistics majour. If I just sat at home reading nothing but the Qur'an all day I'd go crazy. Right now I'm already suffering from cabin fever (yes, it's a real condition) just because I am so understimulated. I can't go back to school and I can't even make it to work some days because I am physically unable to do so until I have more surgeries- if was was able to but stopped because some man wanted to keep me stupid? I'd go crazier, I'd kill myself. It's possible for me to study religion, Islam and all others, while learning about other things.

Which brings me to another gem of a question on there, another man was asking about how his wife wanted a television. She was stuck home alone all day in a new house with very little furniture or decor or anything while he was at work and she wanted something to do all day. Their answer? Read the Qur'an all day and have a baby to occupy her time! While other more community service options were mentioned, those were the two big ones. What that poor girl needs is some options in her life. School, work, motherhood, other social outlets, a combination of them, whatever.


Another thing it said was "exercising at home."

That's because women couldn't go to a gym where there could be men! (All that is why obesity is becoming a huge problem in Saudi Arabia, women are shut up all the time.) That's another thing that ticks me off. I've had to take phsyical therapy for years, and while many of my therapists have been women, a lot of them have been men. That means a man has put his hands on my naked back as I was crying in pain and sweaty from all the exercises he was having me do to heal my back. I can tell you me in sweaty old clothes in a gym is the least sexually stimulating thing you will see.

I also will only exercise at the gym at the physical therapy center because of the trained therapists there who will guide me through exercises and make sure I won't hurt my back while strengthening it, man or not. I only do the simplest stretches and walking around the home.

I can tell you it's a good thing for someone to exercise with health care professionals around because, especially if they're just someone with a woman's brain who can only understand Islam, they can hurt themselves in the process. An added bonus of going to a gym that is centered around physical therapy aside from the safety is that... it's not a bunch of people who are just muscle and make you feel bad about your body. Where I go it's mostly disabled people like me or people who are looking just to get in shape to be healthy, not bodybuild. Honestly, they should be pushing women to go to places like this. It's safe and not about sex appeal, but health.


And this brings me to a whole new rant. This whole rabid separation of sexes at any cost... not at all how it used to be when Islam first formed. In fact, there used women who would teach from the minbar, not wearing a veil, and in front of men. Now women have to pray from behind a partition, a wall, or in a separate room from men. Sometimes we even have to go in through a separate entrance from men! That's the biggest reason I refuse to go to masjid. I am equal to men and not treated that why when I enter most masaajid. It went from women holding high positions of authourity in their communities to them not even being able to leave the house. It literally makes me psychically ill.

 

[jamaesi]

I just read something on that website that actually made me scream out loud.

"Men's brains are more perfect than women's, there are studies proving this."

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGH.


Fluffy, please do not take that website seriously. I BEG you.

 

[Smoke]

And this brings me to a whole new rant. This whole rabid separation of sexes at any cost... not at all how it used to be when Islam first formed. In fact, there used women who would teach from the minbar, not wearing a veil, and in front of men. Now women have to pray from behind a partition, a wall, or in a separate room from men. Sometimes we even have to go in through a separate entrance from men! That's the biggest reason I refuse to go to masjid. I am equal to men and not treated that why when I enter most masaajid. It went from women holding high positions of authourity in their communities to them not even being able to leave the house. It literally makes me psychically ill.

Don't you think that's a problem with Islam? I mean, do you think there exists an ideal Islam that's good and pure and that the beliefs and practices of most Muslims just fail to express the fullness of it? Because to me, the beliefs and practices of the adherents of any religion are the religion. I can't accept the idea of any idealized kind of "true" Christianity or Islam or anything else; the "true" Christianity or Islam is whatever really happens on the ground.

 

[jamaesi]

Don't you think that's a problem with Islam? I mean, do you think there exists an ideal Islam that's good and pure and that the beliefs and practices of most Muslims just fail to express the fullness of it? Because to me, the beliefs and practices of the adherents of any religion are the religion. I can't accept the idea of any idealized kind of "true" Christianity or Islam or anything else; the "true" Christianity or Islam is whatever really happens on the ground.

No, I don't. Go back to where I said when women used to teach from the minbar. It's Arab culture that messed that up, not Islam.

 

[TashaN]

Dear !Fluffy!,

I remember very well when you posted this very same information from the SAME site and the SAME fatwa and i answered you, but it seems that you love this site so much that you always quote from it all over and over again even though i told you last time when your name was "Moon Woman" that this doesn't represent Islam and it's his own idea. There is freedom in Islam and if this is how the writer think then why to make him speak in the name of the whole Muslims?

Don't tell me your are confused because of what this or that group say because it's normal that human beings differ in approaching issues in this life and you will find that in all religions but not only Islam. If you don't want to be confused then you have to read more in depth about this issue from various resources and to not depend in a single site and say "i'm confused"!

Believe me, i can quote the bible and find a thousand interpretation for one single verse by hundereds of well versed Christian scholars.

Please read the thread in the link below as i hope that everyone will do so.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/islam/37700-jihad-explained.html

You might read this one as well:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/islam/39295-jihad-not-holy-war.html

 

[Smoke]

No, I don't. Go back to where I said when women used to teach from the minbar. It's Arab culture that messed that up, not Islam.

Where are the masajid that aren't dominated by Arab culture, where unveiled women teach from the minbar? How many of them are there?

 

[fullyveiled muslimah]

Jamaesi I can't quote all the stuff in your posts that I wanna respond to but I feel you. Like with the exercise thing. A woman can go to a gym to work out. Now I personally wouldn't want to go to a gym where there are a lot of men because I can't work out in hijab, for one, and for two I don't want them staring at me while I'm jumping around trying to do pilates. Ahh, but there is a solution. Apparently some other wome felt that way too hence the invetion of women's workout world and curves. There are women there working out together and giving each other support. I see nothing wrong with that. I see good in it. It is some kind of thing, and I know where it comes from, that all of a sudden women are these second class citizens. It is really disturbing and revolting.

And as for the brain thing, they can't be serious can they? Oh my goodness. What's so sad about it is that alot of men, that are supposedly learned men, think that. I even heard one guy an "imam" give the khutbah for my sisters nikah. He was talking about the "rights" between the husband and wife, and do you know what he focused on?......... how to be obedient to her husband!!! Then when it got to what her rights were....and hold on to your hijab for this one.........her right was that she could be obedient to her husband!!!!

I was mortified. If it hadn't been my sister getting married I would have walked out. All the women there were simply aghast. We all had our mouths open, and my husband had his mouth open too. We were just speechless. Needless to say I never went back there again. Anybody talking that crap, I don't want to hear what other little islamic pearls they have to cast before us women swine. Goodness gracious.

It's gotten so bad that men don't even know the rights of women in general not to mention their wives. If you ask any random muslim husband to name you five of his rights and five of his wife's rights I bet he couldn't do it when it got to her. But Allah says in Quran more or less that He has given the men rights over the women, and has given the women A SIMILAR RIGHT. So it is mutual and not exclusive. How do we get them to understand that? It is frustrating to the highest degree. Whatever little rights Allah gave then have gone to their heads, and I think they don't even need to know these rights until the men go through a spritual tarbiyyat first. Just to understand what being a muslim is all about, before they get into what kind of rights they got.

A lot of men purposely keep islamic knowledge and the outlets to acquire this knowledge away from their wives. That's the real oppression. Also, they focus so much on this obedience to them, that obedience to Allah is lost. What about her duties to her Lord? What about first and foremost being a muslim woman, and that comes before her being a wife. Oh boy with all this going on in the muslim world, we better get it together. The day of reckoning will be a hard one indeed.

 

[TashaN]

Jamaesi I can't quote all the stuff in your posts that I wanna respond to but I feel you. Like with the exercise thing. A woman can go to a gym to work out. Now I personally wouldn't want to go to a gym where there are a lot of men because I can't work out in hijab, for one, and for two I don't want them staring at me while I'm jumping around trying to do pilates. Ahh, but there is a solution. Apparently some other wome felt that way too hence the invetion of women's workout world and curves. There are women there working out together and giving each other support. I see nothing wrong with that. I see good in it. It is some kind of thing, and I know where it comes from, that all of a sudden women are these second class citizens. It is really disturbing and revolting.

And as for the brain thing, they can't be serious can they? Oh my goodness. What's so sad about it is that alot of men, that are supposedly learned men, think that. I even heard one guy an "imam" give the khutbah for my sisters nikah. He was talking about the "rights" between the husband and wife, and do you know what he focused on?......... how to be obedient to her husband!!! Then when it got to what her rights were....and hold on to your hijab for this one.........her right was that she could be obedient to her husband!!!!

I was mortified. If it hadn't been my sister getting married I would have walked out. All the women there were simply aghast. We all had our mouths open, and my husband had his mouth open too. We were just speechless. Needless to say I never went back there again. Anybody talking that crap, I don't want to hear what other little islamic pearls they have to cast before us women swine. Goodness gracious.

It's gotten so bad that men don't even know the rights of women in general not to mention their wives. If you ask any random muslim husband to name you five of his rights and five of his wife's rights I bet he couldn't do it when it got to her. But Allah says in Quran more or less that He has given the men rights over the women, and has given the women A SIMILAR RIGHT. So it is mutual and not exclusive. How do we get them to understand that? It is frustrating to the highest degree. Whatever little rights Allah gave then have gone to their heads, and I think they don't even need to know these rights until the men go through a spritual tarbiyyat first. Just to understand what being a muslim is all about, before they get into what kind of rights they got.

A lot of men purposely keep islamic knowledge and the outlets to acquire this knowledge away from their wives. That's the real oppression. Also, they focus so much on this obedience to them, that obedience to Allah is lost. What about her duties to her Lord? What about first and foremost being a muslim woman, and that comes before her being a wife. Oh boy with all this going on in the muslim world, we better get it together. The day of reckoning will be a hard one indeed.

Oh my! :cover:

I just remmebered one of my friends in my university. We were talking about marriage then when i asked him about the rights of his future wife, he said that he will pay the Mahr and pay her monthly to go shopping and stuff, and when i asked him about his rights, he said that his wife have to cook for him, and clean his clothes, and he have got a very long list.

I told him that in Islam, a woman shouldn't pay for anything, he noded, but when i told him that she doesn't have to cook for him nor to clean his clothes he got shocked. Then, when i told him that in Islam, his wife can ask him to find someone to feed his baby with milk if his wife can't/don't do so, now he got so angry and shouted telling me that he doesn't want to get married anymore if this was the case. lol.

He shouted, where is my rightssssssssssss!!!!!!!!

Did he ever know that prophet Mohammed was cooking for himself, cleaning his clothes, fixing his shoes, etc by himself?!

 

[fullyveiled muslimah]

I told him that in Islam, a woman shouldn't pay for anything, he noded, but when i told him that she doesn't have to cook for him nor to clean his clothes he got shocked. Then, when i told him that in Islam, his wife can ask him to find someone to feed his baby with milk if his wife can't/don't do so, now he got so angry and shouted telling me that he doesn't want to get married anymore if this was the case. lol.

He shouted, where is my rightssssssssssss!!!!!!!!

Did he ever know that prophet Mohammed was cooking for himself, cleaning his clothes, fixing his shoes, etc by himself?!

That was hilarious!!! In all truth many brothers think this way. It is very sad indeed, so we need to do something about that. I want to start like a newsletter about women's rights and stuff and circulate it. Yeah......I think that's what I'll do.

 

[Popeyesays]

Compared to the traditions of Arab tribes before Islam Muhammed's teachings were LIBERATION for women.

Most westerners can't get their minds around that.

Of course, there was a social tendency to find any way they could to counter the teachings of Muhammed about the rights of men and women and go back to the old ways with a new mask of Islamic misinterpretation to protect it.

The Qur'an is pretty specific about the rights of men and women and couples, including what constitutes modest dress.

The Taleban and the Iranian Republic do their best to beat women into their "place" in utter disregard of Muhammed. Muhammed was totally devoted to Kadijeh, it was the Great Example to Muslims in how to treat their wives and daughters.

Regards,
Scott

 

[!Fluffy!]

I just read something on that website that actually made me scream out loud.

"Men's brains are more perfect than women's, there are studies proving this."

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGH.


Fluffy, please do not take that website seriously. I BEG you.

Believe me I don't want to, and in my heart I don't believe most of my muslim acquaintances buy into this form of islam. The problem is, it is one that a Muslim asked me to visit for a broader understanding of the true Islam and so I did, and bookmarked it, and have so far found it to be utterly distasteful. I just don't get it i guess.

 

[!Fluffy!]

Dear !Fluffy!,

I remember very well when you posted this very same information from the SAME site and the SAME fatwa and i answered you, but it seems that you love this site so much that you always quote from it all over and over again even though i told you last time when your name was "Moon Woman" that this doesn't represent Islam and it's his own idea. There is freedom in Islam and if this is how the writer think then why to make him speak in the name of the whole Muslims?

1. Sorry, but it's not about me so you can just stop killing the messenger. It just doesn't have anything to do with the thread.
2. In fact there is freedom in Islam and he does speak for many Muslims. That's the problem.

Don't tell me your are confused because of what this or that group say because it's normal that human beings differ in approaching issues in this life and you will find that in all religions but not only Islam. If you don't want to be confused then you have to read more in depth about this issue from various resources and to not depend in a single site and say "i'm confused"!

That's not a very effective approach to a complex issue, especially because your assumptions are wrong. I do read your posts and links. Honest. Therein lies the problem, or part of it, The Truth, because yours is not the only opinion on the planet. There are others who disagree strongly with you, and we need to listen to them and understand where they are coming from rather than just dismissing everything they say.

Believe me, i can quote the bible and find a thousand interpretation for one single verse by hundereds of well versed Christian scholars.

Well that's another argument but it doesn't count for anything on this particular thread, of course. It still doesn't address the point.

Please read the thread in the link below as i hope that everyone will do so.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/islam/37700-jihad-explained.html

You might read this one as well:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/islam/39295-jihad-not-holy-war.html

Okay. While that is an interesting interpretation, unfortunately it sounds like what was said before:

One of the strangest things to note is that we are living in a time when some of the Muslims are embarrassed to quote the verses and ahaadeeth on jihad in front of their kaafir friends. ​

Their faces turn red because they are too shy to mention the rulings on the jizyah, slavery and killing prisoners of war. They wish that they could erase these verses and ahaadeeth from the Qur’aan and Sunnah so that they would not be criticized by this world with its backward principles despite its claims to be civilized.

If they cannot erase them then they try to misinterpret them and distort their meanings so that they suit the whims and desires of their masters...(etc., see first 3 posts) ​

So one has to weigh the opinions, and remain intellectually honest in doing so. There is a problem which lies between some muslims and Sheikh Muhammad Salih al-Munajjid, and why exactly should we believe one interpretation trumps another, or one level of scholarship trumps another? Or why it is okay for other Muslims to read and understand his articles, but it is not okay for me to read and understand them? Is it an essential division between individuals or truly two schools of thought or doctrine? - one of whom is a known Islamic lecturer and author whose motives are contained here:

"Welcome to Islam Question & Answer!This site aims to provide intelligent, authoritative responses to anyones question about Islam, whether it be from a Muslim or a non-Muslim, and to help solve general and personal social problems. Responses are composed by Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid, a known Islamic lecturer and author. Questions about any topic are welcome, such as theology, worship, human and business relations, or social and personal issues."​

"All questions and answers on this site have been prepared, approved, revised, edited, amended or annotated by Shaykh Muhammad Saalih al-Munajjid, the supervisor of this site."​

"With the spread of Islam world-wide walillah il-hamd and its diffusion into the internet, some sites have been published claiming to serve Muslims and to speak in the name of Islam. However, not all of these sites, which discuss issues relevant to Islam, present accurate and reliable information based on the true beliefs and practices of the Prophet (peace & blessings of Allaah be upon him) and his companions. Thus, there is a need to increase the number of sites providing resources based on these authentic teachings. It is hoped that this site will be among them. The objectives of Islam Q&A include:​

• to teach and familiarize Muslims with various aspects of their religion
• to be a source for guiding people to Islam
• to respond to users questions and inquiries to the best of our resources and capabilities
• to assist in solving the social and personal problems of the Muslims in an Islamic context"

"It was decided to make the site all-encompassing, directed towards Muslims and non-Muslims alike. Subject areas include, but are not limited to, Islamic fiqh and jurisprudence, Islamic history, Islamic social laws (including marriage, divorce, contracts, and inheritance), Islamic finance, basic tenets and aqeedah of the Islamic faith and tawheed, and Arabic grammar as it relates to the Quran and Islamic texts."​

"The responses are handled by Sheikh Muhammad Salih al-Munajjid, using only authentic, scholarly sources based on the Quran and sunnah, and other reliable contemporary scholarly opinions. References are provided where appropriate in the responses. All requests are held with confidence, and replies are available personally and/or publicly (posted to this site)."​

His books and articles are available internationally and online, and his opinions are widely quoted in wikipedia articles. He is also a contributing author whose articles appear on other well known Islamic websites including islamonline, islam.com and islamawakening.com. His opinions appear to be widely respected and disseminated. Why is that the case if he is just so wrong?

In fact there are many muslim scholars sharing his views. The articles such as the one opening this thread are easy to read and understand. I can't say the same for those you linked to, and unfortunately find it difficult to dismiss his scholarship entirely in view of his credentials.

When I visited the international library there were not just hundreds but thousands of Muslim resources (books and magazine articles) supporting the scholarship presented in the first three posts of this thread, and (at least in English) many others presenting a revised/modernized/sanitized version.

The Truth is correct in saying there are various ways in which one can address and interpret certain passages in any text. The keys to true scholarship of any text remain the same: one must study the reality in which they reside, including historical content and context and the traditional vs non-traditional interpretations offered by religious scholars.

The reality in which Islam resides today tells us plainly, there are those whose traditional and fundamental understanding of the texts as presented here serves as motivation for their actions. This understanding removes any mystery as to their motivation as well as their goals. It sheds a clear light on the question: Why? Why is this happening? It is as simple as 1 plus 2 equals 3.

If this bothers and frustrates those who carry the same religious banner, well that too is understandable. I think we all know what it's like to be maligned because of someone else's actions, and there is no excuse for such ignorance. But it is imperative that we not lose sight of the facts for fear of hurting someone's feelings, OR for fear of being mocked or attacked. Our attitude / understanding of Islam in the world today needs to be one of fearless inquiry and reality testing. To deny the obvious facts is not an option, for me. So when a muslim posts a question like "what do you feel is wrong with Islam" i'll answer honestly, even tho i know it may wind up in a free for all or flame attack. There's no reason why we can't discuss it rationally.

 

[mcteethinator]

Check out IslamOnline.net

It's a much more moderate site that uses Qur'anic sources to discredit terrorists that kill innocent civilians.

 

[Smoke]

Compared to the traditions of Arab tribes before Islam Muhammed's teachings were LIBERATION for women.

Most westerners can't get their minds around that.

No, we get that. Muslim women are liberated compared to pre-Islamic Arabian women. Whoopee!

 

[mcteethinator]

No, we get that. Muslim women are liberated compared to pre-Islamic Arabian women. Whoopee!

They were liberated compared to women in Muslim countries today too.

 

[TashaN]

They were liberated compared to women in Muslim countries today too.

And compared to most non-muslim women at that time.