What do religious people positively contribute to the world that non-religious people can't?

[ChristineM]

Re + Legion.

Legion -- legion meaning - Google Search

Re- ligion

Note the spelling

 

[Mock Turtle]

Okay, I'll bite.

The problem with secularism is that it fundamentally does not understand sin.

Unlikely that many will see the value in such a term rather than not understand it - given that it is so tied to religious concepts.

I am genderfluid (as noted above) meaning that a good chunk of the way I self-identify is kinda hazy in terms of male/female. I often crossdress, even though my religious background calls it not sin but an abomination (which means "the Lord hates"). Now what exactly does this mean? Well, it means that our sins are also often our cross to bear. That is to say, the Jews (and the atheists) see sin as wickedness, as not following the rules.

As mentioned, atheists are unlikely to use such a term, or wickedness. Although many might, so as designate the extreme end of the 'bad behaviour' spectrum.

But the approach of following the rules, as Jews do, is that you always fall short. The law is a curse, one passage of the NT letters says. You will never match up to the standards of God. Secularism tends to either follow the same rules as the Jews (and supposed Christians) do, but without any spiritual understanding, which means that like the Jews, they run the risk of being Pharisees and hypocrites, but unlike the Jews there isn't any concept of atonement.

So no regrets, sorrow, or conscience in the secular world? I think you need to prove that. They will of course not agree with the religious concept of atonement.

Or they try to reject these laws in favor of virtues they made up, like "respect for the environment" ( while not respecting humans as of worth, taxing them to an early grave for carbon use, while you feel good that you recycled) , "honoring minorities" (this is funny, because democracy is the will of many against the few so really democracy can never be in favor of minorities unless it has betrayed its core tenants), or "honoring or celebrating diversity" ( which is really to say that you marginalize normalcy in favor of whatever weird lifestyles you think should be promoted).

Perhaps you have issues not related to religious belief? Not in the lower left quadrant?

These secularists abandon the law in their minds, but in search of virtue in the wasteland, they invent a sort of distorted or inverted morality where good is bad and vice versa.

Like to quote some?

They are not free from the law, however but in fact more tightly bound. Just now a different law... The Christian (real Christian not the Sunday school idiot that tries to be good enough to get into heaven) understands that the actual way out of this is through grace. We will never be good enough, we will never not be sinners, yet God wants us to know we are loved and forgiven. Grace is a gift we haven't earned.

Great. Stick with your chip-on-your-shoulder, and begotten from some particular text that you value. Some of us are free from such.

Right now I have a New Threads below me talking about how Trump is not a "typical politician". Trump is a good example of what I am talking about. Those on the left condemn him constantly for his flawed behavior. But his supporters tend to be those who understand that all of us are flawed, but they voted for him less on who he was, and more on what he we there to stop.

Really? Many of us see him as bad for the rest of the world, just as much as he is bad for the USA, and his personal (non) attributes are incidental - but unlikely to be ignored.

Sin is about separation. It's about having to choose between that lifestyle where you as a woman marry a woman, and your family that looks down on it. No I'm not saying that one choice is sinful so we shouldn't do it. Our cross that we carry is often our own sin, we have to resolve these things and sometimes that does mean choosing the girl over the scolding parents. Sometimes it doesn't, that's not the point. The point is the separation, the wedge this situation drives between things. I likewise, am now to choose between my job (which I present as a woman b for) and my family (who tolerates but doesn't support my being feminine). This is a time when my family is also trying to reconnect with relatives all of these rules and regulations, and I'm trying to figure out whether to just give up on the job, or to put the job first because my family hasn't had my back (whenever they go in the store, I have to wait in the car alone). I also saw this miniseries version of The Shining where the focus was less on him being crazy and more on the sort of delusion that the job is more important than his family's safety. So basically the point of all this, is not so much that sin is avoided because it is sin. But to understand that the conditions of life is to be in a state of sin. Confusion. Separation. In fact , we live in a world that is separated, matter from spirit, good from evil, male from female. So what about this, God hates part? Well, crossdressing would be just another sin, except it has a sense of self hatred (the other abominations mentioned in the Bible were things that had to do with Jewish identity, such as not mixing fabrics). (of se(the other mentioned ) That is, many transgender people have to go under the knife to feel better in their own skin, and on the average day even though I don't go that far, I wish I had breasts, I wish I didn't have facial hair. I wish I were reborn in a different form. While the separation caused by this is bad enough, there is an added element of self hatred that makes God in turn not just call it a thing he hates. Because God wants me to love myself. Suppressing my desires doesn't solve the problem (in fact, it made my depression worse), the solution is to figure out how to love yourself, and how to mend the separation.

The last I cannot comment on, since being male in a male body having typical attractions, I can't envisage how you feel about certain things, but perhaps some of your thinking stems from your particular position.

 

[pearl]

This question is for anyone who is seriously concerned with making the world a better place, even through the most humble of acts of service in one's family or community. What religious folk positively contribute that a non-religious folk don't?

Outside of a sense of hope in times of real despair, nothing. One does not have to be a religious person in order to seek the common good of humanity.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Re + Legion.

Legion -- legion meaning - Google Search

"Legion" is not part of the word "religion." There is zero evidence to indicate it ever was.

You're changing letters to create your own definition. That's not how language works. "I" is not the same as "E."

 

[Mock Turtle]

Religion mean re-legion / re-union with -- from where we all started the journey of life in the beginning/God's home.

Taking the above definition of religion into consideration -- a true religious person has NO interest in this world -- neither do work for any kind betterment -- nor the betterment of this world is possible.

The ONLY betterment happen is -- people become familiar with the "Truth" that this world can never become a permanent peaceful / better place to live on -- reside on.

Then we are irreconcilable, if some of the religious truly believe that nothing we do on Earth will actually make life better for those who currently are not in any favoured group.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Religious charities are better at sticking around, IMO.

But the post asks:

What do religious people positively contribute to the world that non-religious people can't?​

rather than:

Are religious charities better in some way?​

The answer to the first question is clearly and emphatically "No!".

Religious charities are better at sticking around, IMO..

But isn't that more a testament to the staying power of the underlying religious organization (e.g., church) rather than evidence of some superior quality inherent in religious people?

And, of course, we have

Doctors Without Borders ...
International Rescue Committee ...
Oxfam ... Red Cross ...
Save the Children ...
UNICEF ...​

and many, many more.

 

[bobhikes]

This question is for anyone who is seriously concerned with making the world a better place, even through the most humble of acts of service in one's family or community. What religious folk positively contribute that a non-religious folk don't?

Religious people are like everyone else individuals. Religions however have set goals and gather individuals together to achieve those goals. Religions can do a lot to effect the world.

 

[Kenny]

So religious people can contribute to faith communities that in turn nurture and heal some of the most damaged and vulnerable within our communities? I agree. God, if He exists would help with that, of course. Instant healing from hard drugs? Sure, but its usually not that straightforward.

Yes... that it a contribution.

Yes, it is not usually that straightforward. For Lucas Irrizary, it was. Multiple streams of hard drugs gone the moment he stepped forward in our church.

For Louie Bonilla, instand deliverance from alcoholism.

Not usual, but it does happen.

 

[Kenny]

That's just one of those stories that people tell about their religion or political party or ethnicity.Something about your group is so very special that it imparted special powers do its members.

Not 'our group' but a faith. Why the affront?

Again, obviously not true. This is stuff that believers just tried to paint all great accomplishments with. It's like when Oprah tried to insist that Diane Nyad attributes her accomplishments to her belief in God, and just couldn't get it through her head that an atheist could achieve amazing things without god beliefs.

Y'all Tell each other how great and unparalleled your accomplishments based on God's beliefs are, when the world is full of people without them doing the same things.

I didn't say that an atheist couldn't achieve amazing things. But rather, if you believe there is a God, you can break through barriers that otherwise would be impossible.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Perhaps another way of phrasing it is what do some religious people bring to the table that non-religious people don't. We could reverse the question, for sure. Why do you consider the question anymore loaded than any other question about differences and similarities between religious and non-religious folk?

From first read, it assumes religious have something to give that non-religious can't give. Do you mean is there something religious do give (as in choose to) that non-religious choose not to?

Since everyone is human and hopefully contribute to better humanity, I'm not sure what exactly is in a given religion (other than traditions and source/s of worship), that the non-religious don't have.

How is religion important to what both parties give to help humanity?

Any question of this kind is, by definition, a loaded (very complex) question. Good insights though.

 

[PAUL MARKHAM]

Religion gave us the basic "Love thy neighbour" stuff.

Non-Relion gave us science.

That's a very simplified way of looking at it, but the most accurate.

 

[chinu]

Then we are irreconcilable, if some of the religious truly believe that nothing we do on Earth will actually make life better for those who currently are not in any favoured group.

What is your question, actually ?

 

[Spirit of Light]

This question is for anyone who is seriously concerned with making the world a better place, even through the most humble of acts of service in one's family or community. What religious folk positively contribute that a non-religious folk don't?

That is not an easy question to answer because i met both non religious and religious people who are amazing in selflessly giving to others.
And i met both non religious and religious people who take from others in a selfish way.

 

[Mock Turtle]

What is your question, actually ?

It wasn't a question. You seemed to be stating that true religion means having no interest in bettering one's life, or others, or in how we treat the Earth, but rather in cultivating something else - which is something I would think most non-religious people would find alarming, when much of what they do is towards more practical considerations. And why so often the religious are at loggerheads with the non-religious - as in waiting for something to happen (Jesus coming again, for example) but where these beliefs are just not helpful.

 

[Augustus]

This question is for anyone who is seriously concerned with making the world a better place, even through the most humble of acts of service in one's family or community. What religious folk positively contribute that a non-religious folk don't?

In theory, nothing. But in reality it is very difficult to replace certain things provided by religion.

As just one example, attending Church/Mosque/Temple helps build community and foster a sense of belonging especially in places where most people belong to that faith.

In theory, you can replace this with a secular 'congregation' or social organisation, but you will never be likely to get anything close to the involvement level of traditional religious institutions.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Religion mean re-legion / re-union with -- from where we all started the journey of life in the beginning/God's home.

Taking the above definition of religion into consideration -- a true religious person has NO interest in this world -- neither do work for any kind betterment -- nor the betterment of this world is possible.

The ONLY betterment happen is -- people become familiar with the "Truth" that this world can never become a permanent peaceful / better place to live on -- reside on.

I see you have had a fair amount of criticism for this post. I too completely disagree with such a narrow definition of religion. I flatted with a couple of young people involved with the Tibetan Buddhist community many years ago. They would both spend many hours in meditation. As well as being poor flat mates that failed to collectively contribute to the running of the flat, they were a couple of the most unattractively self-absorbed people I’d ever met. So maybe their practice of religion felt good to themselves but they patently had no interest in others or the community as you describe.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Upon further reflection ... it's difficult to figure how much a person does unless you know them well. I've been enlightened about that a few times at funerals when the eulogist shared stuff about the deceased that I hadn't realised. For example, at one funeral I learned how an elderly acquaintance of mine had brought his handicapped neighbour groceries once a week for over 30 years.

Other folks simply brag, about donations., about how much they did, etc. But when you look into it, it's no more, or even far less, that the others around have done. One man here told me how he was a founding member of the temple I help at. He simply wasn't. It was an outright lie, trying to impress me.

Still others, out of insecurity (the cause of pride) have deceived themselves into thinking they're huge givers, when they're not.

All of this is outside the religion/no religion question in the OP. It's on the individual.

I come across many people in my work and its hard to know anyone really well in that context. Thinking about who they are and what they do or did is important in diagnosing illnesses and considering treatments though. Obvious examples are habits around nicotine, alcohol and drugs as well as their work they engage in and whose at home with them. I don’t like getting too far into others emotions and personal lives as I did when I worked in psychiatry. Its not for me to judge another person but to know enough about them that I may be of assistance as their physician.

One of the values of this forum and threads like this is the opportunity to reflect and discuss important concepts collectively with people with diverse perspectives.

 

[Vinayaka]

I come across many people in my work and its hard to know anyone really well in that context. Thinking about who they are and what they do or did is important in diagnosing illnesses and considering treatments though. Obvious examples are habits around nicotine, alcohol and drugs as well as their work they engage in and whose at home with them. I don’t like getting too far into others emotions and personal lives as I did when I worked in psychiatry. Its not for me to judge another person but to know enough about them that I may be of assistance as their physician.

One of the values of this forum and threads like this is the opportunity to reflect and discuss important concepts collectively with people with diverse perspectives.

I was thinking in terms of 'bettering the world'. Just because a person tells you he is, or thinks he is, doesn't necessarily mean he is. In the case of religious conversion, for example, the converter may well believe strongly that he's 'bettering the world'. But is he?

 

[amorphous_constellation]

This question is for anyone who is seriously concerned with making the world a better place, even through the most humble of acts of service in one's family or community. What religious folk positively contribute that a non-religious folk don't?

I think maybe the question is too broad. A religious and non-religious person could have beliefs that range from anything to anything. So then I guess it's kind of like asking how the actions of people in blue shirts compare to those in red shirts

 

[nPeace]

This question is for anyone who is seriously concerned with making the world a better place, even through the most humble of acts of service in one's family or community. What religious folk positively contribute that a non-religious folk don't?

One of the things which keep people going, is hope. Not just any hope though, is most important, but hope with real meaning and purpose.
Many people don't find much meaning and purpose in their pursuits to a happier life or better world, but their whole outlook on life changes immensely at the prospect of a better world - a world where injustice, wickedness, sickness, suffering and death, will be a thing of the past, and living forever in peace in a paradise home will be their future.

This is one thing I see, religious people positively contribute to the world that non-religious people can't.