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What do Muslims believe?

Discussion in 'Islam DIR' started by best friend, Mar 22, 2004.

  1. (Q)

    (Q) Active Member

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    Too bad we're not telepathic...

    Then we wouldn't need a forum. ;)
     
  2. The Shield of Islam

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    The article seems to suggest that the moon was split at one time in its history, you know, the full article was removed from NASA site for some strange reason...I cant find the whole article !!
     
  3. The Shield of Islam

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    Thank you runt, English is not my first languge, beside, he chose deliberately to IGNORE the historical proof about the splitting of the moon !

    About the article, I cant find the full article, it was here, but when I went there look what I got:

    File Not Found

    We're sorry. The page you are looking for has been removed. We've recently revamped our entire website, so please feel free to visit our new Sitemap and look around for the link you were trying to find. You can also contact us if you are unable to find what you were looking for.

    http://solarsystem.nasa.gov/404.cfm

    Very Strange !!!
     
  4. The Shield of Islam

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    This is not true and you know it...I have the full article which is similar to the one I posted on my favourites but it was REMOVED for very strange reason:

    File Not Found

    We're sorry. The page you are looking for has been removed. We've recently revamped our entire website, so please feel free to visit our new Sitemap and look around for the link you were trying to find. You can also contact us if you are unable to find what you were looking for.

    http://solarsystem.nasa.gov/404.cfm
     
  5. The Shield of Islam

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    Anyway, will you care to respond to the historical proof ????????

    :roll:
     
  6. Green Gaia

    Green Gaia Veteran Member

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    I still don't see how the NASA article proves that the Prophet Muhammad split the moon in half. If you want to believe he did, fine I'm not going to try to change your mind, but the "evidence" you are posting is not convincing enough for me. :?
     
  7. The Shield of Islam

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    Well maize, as I said, the whole article that SPECIFICALLY talk about splitting the moon has been REMOVED !!

    File Not Found

    We're sorry. The page you are looking for has been removed. We've recently revamped our entire website, so please feel free to visit our new Sitemap and look around for the link you were trying to find. You can also contact us if you are unable to find what you were looking for.

    http://solarsystem.nasa.gov/404.cfm

    But anyway, how about the HISTORICAL proof ?????????
     
  8. Green Gaia

    Green Gaia Veteran Member

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    Sheild, your historical proof is still not enough for me. If the moon had split in two during the lifetime of the Prophet Muhammad, there would be accounts from all over the Earth of this phenomenon happening, wouldn't you say? Your historical proof is full of names, places and words I am not familiar with and really can't comment on their validity. Why is it so important that you convince others this happened?
     
  9. The Shield of Islam

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    First of all, the splitting of the moon happened and lasted no more than 2 mins so the chances of it being picked up by other nations is slim ALTHOUGH Japanese records of that era also show that the moon was indeed splitt into 2 pieces.

    Second, I am not interested in convicing anyone about this miracle but when YOU asked for proof, I submitted one for you, that's all.
     
  10. Green Gaia

    Green Gaia Veteran Member

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    Oh, so only a few special people got to see it, ok. Kind of like Jesus walking on water? How do you know the Japanese records are of the same event? Where are these records and what do they say?
     
  11. The Shield of Islam

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    Come on Maize ! when I brought you the historical proof you claimed to not know the names and being unfamiliar with the event, Now you want the other Japanese proof so that you will repeat the same words you said in response to the historical proof !! if you dont want to believe in this miracle it is your own business, but please, dont question something you already deny and will deny no matter what kind of proof presented to you.

    Stop asking questions which when I answer you accuse me of trying to impose or convince you !!! it is getting pathetic !!

    :roll:
     
  12. Green Gaia

    Green Gaia Veteran Member

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    Give it a rest, Shield. Calling someone pathetic is not a good way to make friends. :)

    I wanted the Japanese "proof" because it would supposedly be a non-Islamic source. A non-baised source, if you will. But if you don't know to show me that's fine... I'm sure it won't convince me of the "miracle" either, but I'm curious about all things in a histortical context. I just wanted to see it out of curiousity.
     
  13. The Shield of Islam

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    I did not call you pathetic, I said: it is getting pathetic ( the whole situation)

    Well, the Historical proof about the Indian king is from NON MUSLIM sources as well !! :roll:

    No problem !! since you declared your intentions of not being convinced NO MATTER WHAT, I suppose we shall leave it and move on.

    Have a very nice day my friend ( if you allow me to use the word friend here ) !! :wink:
     
  14. The Ocelot

    The Ocelot Member

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    That is a problem. Which leads to this: How do you assure yourself heaven? Predestination is unfair and cruel, especially when it means damnation for some and heaven for others. I have seen verses in the Koran which are deadly theological errors:

    We sent not an apostle except (to teach) in the language of his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now Allah leaves straying those whom He pleases and guides whom He pleases: and He is Exalted in power, full of Wisdom.

    -Koran 14:4

    Let any who will, keep it in remembrance! But none will keep it in remembrance except as Allah wills: He is the Lord of Righteousness, and the Lord of Forgiveness.

    -Koran 74:55-56

    This is an admonition: Whosoever will, let him take a (straight) Path to his Lord. But ye will not, except as Allah wills; for Allah is full of Knowledge and Wisdom. He will admit to His Mercy whom He will; But the wrong-doers,- for them has He prepared a grievous Penalty.

    -Koran 76:29-31

    Verily this is no less than a Message to (all) the Worlds: (With profit) to whoever among you wills to go straight: But ye shall not will except as Allah wills, the Cherisher of the Worlds.

    -Koran 81:21-23

    It just isn't right, it isn't fair, and it is ungodly.

    As a Christian, I believe we were given complete free will. What we do with it is our problem. But God does not show favoritism. He loves us all equally and would not want anyone to go to hell. But those who are not saved by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, because they don't accept Him, cannot be purged of their sin through Him. So they have to go to hell, otherwise there would be wicked people in heaven. But that is THEIR choice. Not God's. God did not create us to be puppets, he created us to share in a relationship with him.

    The Ocelot
     
  15. Green Gaia

    Green Gaia Veteran Member

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    ***MOD POST***

    Ocelot: I suggest you take a look at the Forum Rules before posting again, please.

    This is a forum for learning about Islam. There will be no debating in any of the seperate religion forums. These forums are for learning about the individual religions.

    If you wish to debate a certain religion take it to the general discussion/debate/or off-topic sections.

    If you have any questions about this, please PM me or another moderator.

    Thank you.
    Maize
     
  16. The Ocelot

    The Ocelot Member

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    How can you hold Jesus as a prophet without being a Christian? To believe there is deity in what he says is to be Christian if he says that he is the way, the truth, and the life.

    The Ocelot
     
  17. Rex

    Rex Founder

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    Religion:
    I won't tell
    The word prophet not only means deity:

    Prophet:

    A person who speaks by divine inspiration or as the interpreter through whom the will of a god is expressed.

    A person gifted with profound moral insight and exceptional powers of expression.

    A predictor; a soothsayer.

    The chief spokesperson of a movement or cause.
     
  18. The Ocelot

    The Ocelot Member

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    Well in either case they would have to believe that what Jesus says is true in order to hold him as a prophet, right? That's the point I'm trying to make.
     
  19. Runt

    Runt Well-Known Member

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    Ocelot, I think (and Shield, correct me if I am wrong) that Muslims believe that Jesus spoke truth, but then his words were corrupted by history and were lost, making his words as they are found in the Bible (and as they are read by Christians) false.
     
  20. The Ocelot

    The Ocelot Member

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    I see, but what about the numerous scientific and historical sources which prove that the gospels were written within a century of Jesus' death?

    I know that Muslims do not believe He died, but suppose he did. Wouldn't an eyewitness like Mark have credibility? He wrote the gospel of Mark 30 years after, Matthew and Luke 50 years after, and John 100 years after Jesus' death. And each says the same thing, that Jesus claimed divinity and died on the cross.

    Why do muslims still believe he didn't die or say what christians think he said after evidence like that?

    The Ocelot
     
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