• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

What Allowed My Being?

Master Vigil

Well-Known Member
I’ve always been a believer of nature being the closest thing to god that we can understand. So whenever I have a question about the divine, I turn to nature for answers. Whether it is how to be humble, or how to be less stressful. I always find solace within the natural world and it’s wonder.

Every morning I drive to work on the same road, to and from. So as I was driving to work one morning, no ounce of me even expected any drastic change in this course, except for construction or an accident. But for some reason there was something different about it this morning. Around one bend, there were always a few empty lots that were pretty barren. So when I saw this morning that they were full of flowers, I was pretty shocked. So shocked in fact, that I actually had to pull over, get out of my car, run across the street, and talk to the little old man that was tending the buds.

He began to tell me how this land was never fertile enough to support any life before, but since our heavy rainy season in the spring, it has begun to sprout beautiful flowers and is now able to allow life. This hit me like a ton of bricks! Maybe it was just his choice of words, or maybe it was just my lack of coffee. But I felt dizzy after he said that. The whole concept was... The flowers can exist now because the environment “allowed” them to. That’s deep. Because if we take that further, what allowed our environment to even exist, and that environment, and so on, and so forth, etc...? And this brings about the argument of “infinite regress”.

Infinite regress pretty much means that the universe had no finite beginning. That it always existed in some form or another. I have no concern over whether infinite regress is possible or not. That is not what struck me, or matters to me. What matters to me, is something; whether natural or not; allows me to exist. Allows me to love, to have joy, to create, to conceive, to hug, etc... I did not allow myself to come into existence. In the end, I must accept that I am not totally in control. I am after all, nothing compared to the whole. What then is great? What?
 

Pariah

Let go
I’ve always been a believer of nature being the closest thing to god that we can understand. So whenever I have a question about the divine, I turn to nature for answers. Whether it is how to be humble, or how to be less stressful. I always find solace within the natural world and it’s wonder.

Every morning I drive to work on the same road, to and from. So as I was driving to work one morning, no ounce of me even expected any drastic change in this course, except for construction or an accident. But for some reason there was something different about it this morning. Around one bend, there were always a few empty lots that were pretty barren. So when I saw this morning that they were full of flowers, I was pretty shocked. So shocked in fact, that I actually had to pull over, get out of my car, run across the street, and talk to the little old man that was tending the buds.

He began to tell me how this land was never fertile enough to support any life before, but since our heavy rainy season in the spring, it has begun to sprout beautiful flowers and is now able to allow life. This hit me like a ton of bricks! Maybe it was just his choice of words, or maybe it was just my lack of coffee. But I felt dizzy after he said that. The whole concept was... The flowers can exist now because the environment “allowed” them to. That’s deep. Because if we take that further, what allowed our environment to even exist, and that environment, and so on, and so forth, etc...? And this brings about the argument of “infinite regress”.

Infinite regress pretty much means that the universe had no finite beginning. That it always existed in some form or another. I have no concern over whether infinite regress is possible or not. That is not what struck me, or matters to me. What matters to me, is something; whether natural or not; allows me to exist. Allows me to love, to have joy, to create, to conceive, to hug, etc... I did not allow myself to come into existence. In the end, I must accept that I am not totally in control. I am after all, nothing compared to the whole. What then is great? What?

Favorable evolutionary conditions leading to the growth of Homo sapien sapiens, your mother, and finally, you... or possibly, a personal, creator deity, which sustains you.

In the end, I must accept that I am not totally in control. I am after all, nothing compared to the whole.

This should be the moral of the story.

What then is great? What?

Must something be great? Or can something simply be without the adjectives?
 

PureX

Veteran Member
I’ve always been a believer of nature being the closest thing to god that we can understand. So whenever I have a question about the divine, I turn to nature for answers. Whether it is how to be humble, or how to be less stressful. I always find solace within the natural world and it’s wonder.

Every morning I drive to work on the same road, to and from. So as I was driving to work one morning, no ounce of me even expected any drastic change in this course, except for construction or an accident. But for some reason there was something different about it this morning. Around one bend, there were always a few empty lots that were pretty barren. So when I saw this morning that they were full of flowers, I was pretty shocked. So shocked in fact, that I actually had to pull over, get out of my car, run across the street, and talk to the little old man that was tending the buds.

He began to tell me how this land was never fertile enough to support any life before, but since our heavy rainy season in the spring, it has begun to sprout beautiful flowers and is now able to allow life. This hit me like a ton of bricks! Maybe it was just his choice of words, or maybe it was just my lack of coffee. But I felt dizzy after he said that. The whole concept was... The flowers can exist now because the environment “allowed” them to. That’s deep. Because if we take that further, what allowed our environment to even exist, and that environment, and so on, and so forth, etc...? And this brings about the argument of “infinite regress”.

Infinite regress pretty much means that the universe had no finite beginning. That it always existed in some form or another. I have no concern over whether infinite regress is possible or not. That is not what struck me, or matters to me. What matters to me, is something; whether natural or not; allows me to exist. Allows me to love, to have joy, to create, to conceive, to hug, etc... I did not allow myself to come into existence. In the end, I must accept that I am not totally in control. I am after all, nothing compared to the whole. What then is great? What?
Thanks for a great post!

I think for me, the important thought is that conditions have allowed me to exist, and at some point, conditions will disallow it. This doesn't make "conditions" God, because as you pointed out, something allowed these conditions to exist, and this becomes an infinite regression that I cannot resolve. It becomes a mystery.

But what I am left with, besides the infinite mystery, is the GIFT of my existence. The gift of BEING.
 

Pariah

Let go
But what I am left with, besides the infinite mystery...

Perhaps that is all you should be left with - it is a vision into the infinite mystery, that feeling, or realization of infinite regression as opposed to a logical, step-by-step proof of it. Mystics have always considered this more important than logic, in terms of living.
 

Super Universe

Defender of God
People think in absolutes, that in the beginning there absolutely was something or there absolutely was nothing. Really there was sort of something and sort of not.

Think of the universe as a bank account. Should you really be able to owe money? It's not yours.
How come you can spend more than you have? Because something allows you to. That something is the unabsolute.

Matter exists because the universe goes into debt, it owes the opposite so the opposite is also created (anti-matter) and, essentially, the two balance each other out. So, in a way, the positives that exist counter out the negatives and the universe stays at zero.

You are nothing compared to the whole? Yes, exactly.

What is great then?

The whole that you are a part of.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
But in the end this all comes to nothing. The infinite mystery is also infinitely pointless. Not knowing is still not knowing. This is why I'm not a mystic.

But what I can have, and own, is the idea that being is also a gift. I don't know from where, or what, or who, but I can see that it is a gift. That I can know. And upon that foundation I can build a meaningful life.
 

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
I’ve always been a believer of nature being the closest thing to god that we can understand. So whenever I have a question about the divine, I turn to nature for answers. Whether it is how to be humble, or how to be less stressful. I always find solace within the natural world and it’s wonder.

Every morning I drive to work on the same road, to and from. So as I was driving to work one morning, no ounce of me even expected any drastic change in this course, except for construction or an accident. But for some reason there was something different about it this morning. Around one bend, there were always a few empty lots that were pretty barren. So when I saw this morning that they were full of flowers, I was pretty shocked. So shocked in fact, that I actually had to pull over, get out of my car, run across the street, and talk to the little old man that was tending the buds.

He began to tell me how this land was never fertile enough to support any life before, but since our heavy rainy season in the spring, it has begun to sprout beautiful flowers and is now able to allow life. This hit me like a ton of bricks! Maybe it was just his choice of words, or maybe it was just my lack of coffee. But I felt dizzy after he said that. The whole concept was... The flowers can exist now because the environment “allowed” them to. That’s deep. Because if we take that further, what allowed our environment to even exist, and that environment, and so on, and so forth, etc...? And this brings about the argument of “infinite regress”.

Infinite regress pretty much means that the universe had no finite beginning. That it always existed in some form or another. I have no concern over whether infinite regress is possible or not. That is not what struck me, or matters to me. What matters to me, is something; whether natural or not; allows me to exist. Allows me to love, to have joy, to create, to conceive, to hug, etc... I did not allow myself to come into existence. In the end, I must accept that I am not totally in control. I am after all, nothing compared to the whole. What then is great? What?
Thank you for the marvellous post Master Dan.

Overall I am in agreement with you your conclusions. No, we are not in total control of our reality because we lack the conscious control that would be required. It is my perception that when one arrives at that exalted stage the illusion disintegrate. It is my perception that "that which allows" does so because it feels that the observer is worth the effort of its creativity. I suspect that part of the reason for the flowers was for you to understand what you have and what you will.

In comparrison to the whole, we are indeed very, very small, however we are personified aspects of the whole and so it is incumbent upon us to live life to its fullest so that we may augment the whole with our own unique perspective.

You are what is great and it is my suspicion that you will get as many answers as there are beings to give those answers, each from their own relative perspective. What is great? Everything is great Dan, but likewise, nothing is great. Life itself is the avenue whereby "energy" discovers, first hand, the nature of its actions and how those actions affect reality. The only thing gained by physical life is experience and that is all we ever take with us when we return to that which seeded our being.

A great post, keep the wonderful insights comin' baby.
 

Random

Well-Known Member
Surrendering the illusion of control and the proclivities of Choice are necessary for any genuine "awakening". For the illusion of control is born of the discursive Mind and the quintessential self-delusion of mankind is (choice) discrimination=good. Clinging to choice, we reinforce the notion of Self as agent, do-er. If there is an answer to the OP question, it is that "I" did, "I" allowed myself to be. Whatever one defines as "soul", to debate its pre-existence in this context would be folly. Certainly, there exists no Supreme Being that allows ones existence: for this would be to say the conditions of the Supreme Beings own existence were contingent upon another Higher Power...and so on up the chain, infinitely regressing.
 
Top