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Featured Were not the Hebrews already in Israel in Egypt?

Discussion in 'Religions Q&A' started by calm, Jan 21, 2020.

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  1. calm

    calm Active Member

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    At the time when they were on the border of Egypt and when they crossed the Red Sea, the Hebrews were already in Israel. Or weren't they? For according to the Bible, Israel is much larger than the Israel of today. From the Nile River of Egypt to the Euphrates River is the territory of Israel. That means that the whole edge of Egypt and the half part of saudi Arabia is actually the land of Israel. If this is so, why did it take them 40 years, or in other words, why did they migrated at all, if they have been in Israel all this time? Because as I said, they were already in Egypt in Israel and they were already in Israel when they crossed the Red Sea. The whole area, according to the Bible, is Israel.
     
    #1 calm, Jan 21, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
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  2. Flankerl

    Flankerl Well-Known Member

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  3. calm

    calm Active Member

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    And God did not let Moses enter the land of Israel because he sinned, so He only let him see the land. But Moses has been entering the land all this time?
     
  4. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    Before the Hebrew slaves were released from slavery in Egypt, they did not yet have a territory. It was promised to them, but the land itself was not yet defined or apportioned, as far as I am aware. The Israelites had not accepted God’s terms for his covenant until the assembly at Mt Sinai, and Moses’, as Mediator of that covenant, ascended the mountain to bring down the Ten Commandments.
     
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  5. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    No. Israel had not yet crossed the border.
     
  6. calm

    calm Active Member

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    What are you talking about? Moses was already in Israel when he crossed the Red Sea. Even already in "Egypt" he entered Israel. Read Genesis 15:18
     
  7. calm

    calm Active Member

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    They had already the territory. Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the twelve sons already lived there. The slaves only returned back to Israel. They leaved Israel because of a famine.
     
  8. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    In the time of the Exodus Egypt controlled Sinai and Canaan.

    Israel was NEVER a super power nor did they control any land to speak of. In the time of David Jerusalem was less than 10 acres and a thousand people.
     
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  9. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Were there ever Hebrew slaves in Egypt or is it simply another biblical myth?
    Were Jews ever really slaves in Egypt, or is Passover a myth?
     
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  10. Harel13

    Harel13 Well-Known Member

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    @sooda, somehow your answers will always be "it's a myth, it's fake, etc", which sounds odd, coming from someone who defines themselves as Christian, but whatever. :confused::)

    This still doesn't answer the question, which is referring to the context of the Biblical story, whether it's true or not.
     
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  11. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    Exodus 3:8...
    “I will go down to rescue them out of the hand of the Egyptians and to bring them up out of that land to a land good and spacious, a land flowing with milk and honey, the territory of the Caʹnaan·ites, the Hitʹtites, the Amʹor·ites, the Perʹiz·zites, the Hiʹvites, and the Jebʹu·sites.”

    They wandered in the wilderness for 40 years as a punishment for their lack of faith. They did not enter the Promised Land until after the period had ended. Once there, the land was apportioned according to their tribes.
     
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  12. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    Just FYI, I tried to read the article, but, they are asking me to sign-up.

    It's no biggie. I just thought u would appreciate know I was trying to read the article in your post.

    :)
     
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  13. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    The history is pretty straightforward.. Egypt controlled Sinai and Canaan and the Canaanites were successful in mining, metallurgy and pottery making. They paid tribute to Pharaoh.

    The Bible story glorifies the Hebrews, but its fiction. They were just a landless Canaanite tribe who embraced monotheism early. They would not even have been a blip on the radar except they sat on the trade route and provided a haven from bandits along the route.
     
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  14. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    Jerusalem is hardly the land of milk and honey.. Its stony and arid.. a tough formidable landscape.
     
  15. calm

    calm Active Member

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  16. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    The Passover was inextricably linked to the sacrifice of the Messiah. As “the Lamb of God” his blood saved those who followed the directive to put the blood on their door posts. Had they failed to obey their God, the Israelites would have lost their firstborn as well.

    It’s a matter of faith, which you can question as an atheist. I don’t question it at all because I understand what it all means in the big picture. That is my choice. You have to make your own.
     
  17. calm

    calm Active Member

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    I think you do not understand me. But thanks anyway for your answer.
     
  18. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    :facepalm: Yep, so once again God is a liar who can’t provide what he promises.....whatever....
     
  19. epronovost

    epronovost Well-Known Member

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    For a TL;DR version in one sentence: The Hebrew people were never held in slavery in Egypt. The big event of mass slavery happened under Nebuchadnezzar reign until Cyrus the Great allowed them to return to Israel.
     
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  20. Harel13

    Harel13 Well-Known Member

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    Still evading the question. The question is based solely on the content of the Bible, which says, as @calm correctly stated, that the Land of Israel's borders are from the Red Sea to the Euphrates River, meaning the Sinai Desert is Israel. Yet it also states that Moses never entered the Land of Israel.

    If it's hard to think about it like that, how about substituting Israel for Narnia. The larger Narnia includes Calormen, Archenland, Telmar and a bunch of other fictional countries. If Moses stood in Archenland, which is technically part of Narnia, then that means that Moses was actually in Narnia. Why does CS Lewis then proceed to say that Moses never entered Narnia, if he actually did enter Narnia? :D
     
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