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Wedding Garment

Muffled

Jesus in me
I believe Mat 22 has a parable relating to the Rapture.

Mat 22:9 Go therefore to the main roads and invite to the wedding feast as many as you find.’ 10 And those servants went out into the roads and gathered all whom they found, both bad and good. So the wedding hall was filled with guests 11 “But when the king came in to look at the guests, he saw there a man who had no wedding garment. 12 And he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you get in here without a wedding garment?’ And he was speechless. 13 Then the king said to the attendants, ‘Bind him hand and foot and cast him into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

So if Muslims and people of other persuasions are gathered will they have a wedding garment?

In Revelations it says they are robed in white cleansed by the blood of the lamb. Is that enough or does God require a person to receive Jesus as Lord and Savior?

I believe God wants those who are totally committed to being without sin and that means receiving Jesus as Lord and Savior.
 

beenherebeforeagain

Rogue Animist
Premium Member
But the man would not have been speechless!

In my opinion, here's how he would have answered, "Friend, two hours ago I was not on the list of invitees to your happy soiree here. I was busy laboring at my job, trying to make my livelihood. Suddenly, I was accosted by your servants, who bade me drop everything and come immediately to your feast, not even allowing me time to go home, change clothes and otherwise make myself presentable.

"So, my friend, two hours ago I was not worthy of being invited, but an hour later I am worthy of being compelled to attend...as a substitute for someone else who you really would have preferred...and now you complain because I am in attendance but not properly attired because of your poor event planning, and poor choice of guests? And you now propose to bind me and toss me out into the night?

"Don't get me wrong: I appreciate the late invitation and the fine spread you have provided. I am a glad at your good fortune that allows you to give such a feast. But your failure to let your intended guests know BEFORE the feast was laid isn't the brightest idea. Really, how could you have expected a good turnout?

"Well, I guess because you are a great lord you get to do as you please, but if you didn't want me here as I am, why in the Hell did you have your servants round me and the others up? You may now justly bind me and cast me out, but I leave you with a thought: You, Sir, are an inconsiderate ***!"
 

9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
I believe Mat 22 has a parable relating to the Rapture.

Mat 22:9 Go therefore to the main roads and invite to the wedding feast as many as you find.’ 10 And those servants went out into the roads and gathered all whom they found, both bad and good. So the wedding hall was filled with guests 11 “But when the king came in to look at the guests, he saw there a man who had no wedding garment. 12 And he said to him, ‘Friend, how did you get in here without a wedding garment?’ And he was speechless. 13 Then the king said to the attendants, ‘Bind him hand and foot and cast him into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

So if Muslims and people of other persuasions are gathered will they have a wedding garment?

In Revelations it says they are robed in white cleansed by the blood of the lamb. Is that enough or does God require a person to receive Jesus as Lord and Savior?

I believe God wants those who are totally committed to being without sin and that means receiving Jesus as Lord and Savior.
You do realize that the king in that parable comes off as awful, don't you?
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
But the man would not have been speechless!

In my opinion, here's how he would have answered, "Friend, two hours ago I was not on the list of invitees to your happy soiree here. I was busy laboring at my job, trying to make my livelihood. Suddenly, I was accosted by your servants, who bade me drop everything and come immediately to your feast, not even allowing me time to go home, change clothes and otherwise make myself presentable.

"So, my friend, two hours ago I was not worthy of being invited, but an hour later I am worthy of being compelled to attend...as a substitute for someone else who you really would have preferred...and now you complain because I am in attendance but not properly attired because of your poor event planning, and poor choice of guests? And you now propose to bind me and toss me out into the night?

"Don't get me wrong: I appreciate the late invitation and the fine spread you have provided. I am a glad at your good fortune that allows you to give such a feast. But your failure to let your intended guests know BEFORE the feast was laid isn't the brightest idea. Really, how could you have expected a good turnout?

"Well, I guess because you are a great lord you get to do as you please, but if you didn't want me here as I am, why in the Hell did you have your servants round me and the others up? You may now justly bind me and cast me out, but I leave you with a thought: You, Sir, are an inconsiderate ***!"

I believe the gospel has been preached to everyone so one can't plead ignorance.

I believe it is angels doing the gathering and they do not have omniscience to know who has a wedding garment and who doesn't. The king (Jesus) knows because as God He is omniscient.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
You do realize that the king in that parable comes off as awful, don't you?

I prefer Him to the alternative. I can't say which is worse dying in outer space from heat, cold and lack of oxygen or being burned up in fire on the earth. As for me I believe I have selected the best course of life eternal.
 

beenherebeforeagain

Rogue Animist
Premium Member
I believe the gospel has been preached to everyone so one can't plead ignorance.

I believe it is angels doing the gathering and they do not have omniscience to know who has a wedding garment and who doesn't. The king (Jesus) knows because as God He is omniscient.
You do realize that Jesus would have welcomed the peasants, cripples, outcasts, etc., that were called late for the feast, and in fact would have welcomed them and NOT cast them out.

EDIT: Indeed, the ones who would have been bound and tossed into the outer darkness would have been those invitees who begged off attendance. The replacements would have been forgiven for not being prepared.

Who said anything about pleading ignorance? The host didn't get the people he most wanted to impress, and so had substitutes DRAGGED in so he'd have a full house for his party, because his ego is so much more important than anyone/everyone else's...

Yes, what you've said is a typical Christian interpretation of the parable, but I think the situation it presents is wrong, and I suspect that the parable either was modified or inserted into the gospel long after Jesus' lifetime.
 
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9-10ths_Penguin

1/10 Subway Stalinist
Premium Member
I prefer Him to the alternative. I can't say which is worse dying in outer space from heat, cold and lack of oxygen or being burned up in fire on the earth. As for me I believe I have selected the best course of life eternal.
Heh... again, not exactly a ringing endorsement: "I'll side with the unjust, incompetent tyrant, because otherwise I'd incur his wrath, too."
 

beenherebeforeagain

Rogue Animist
Premium Member
Matt 22 And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, 2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, 3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding:...

So the parable is about what the Kingdom of Heaven is like...it is like...a weakling king who can't get his wealthy subjects--the ones he most wants to impress--to come celebrate his son's wedding, and instead of punishing them, forces second or third choices--literally, the rabble in the street, people he apparently wouldn't give the time of day to normally--to attend in their place...and then punishes some of them for not being properly dressed...

So what does this parable teach about the Kingdom of Heaven? That it's fair and just? Or that it's just arbitrary? Or something else?

My personal understanding is that even if this was originally one of Jesus' sayings, something was lost in the translation and repeating of the story...Otherwise, it is simply something placed on Jesus' lips to justify the inequities of the social, economic and political system...
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
You do realize that Jesus would have welcomed the peasants, cripples, outcasts, etc., that were called late for the feast, and in fact would have welcomed them and NOT cast them out.

EDIT: Indeed, the ones who would have been bound and tossed into the outer darkness would have been those invitees who begged off attendance. The replacements would have been forgiven for not being prepared.

Who said anything about pleading ignorance? The host didn't get the people he most wanted to impress, and so had substitutes DRAGGED in so he'd have a full house for his party, because his ego is so much more important than anyone/everyone else's...

Yes, what you've said is a typical Christian interpretation of the parable, but I think the situation it presents is wrong, and I suspect that the parable either was modified or inserted into the gospel long after Jesus' lifetime.

I believe that is true. All are invited but not all are chosen.

I believe the non-attendees get burned up in the fire that consumes the world.

There is no such thing as forgiveness of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Just showing up is not enough.

I believe that is easy non-believism. That is a lot easier than facing the truth.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
Matt 22 And Jesus answered and spake unto them again by parables, and said, 2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son, 3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding:...

So the parable is about what the Kingdom of Heaven is like...it is like...a weakling king who can't get his wealthy subjects--the ones he most wants to impress--to come celebrate his son's wedding, and instead of punishing them, forces second or third choices--literally, the rabble in the street, people he apparently wouldn't give the time of day to normally--to attend in their place...and then punishes some of them for not being properly dressed...

So what does this parable teach about the Kingdom of Heaven? That it's fair and just? Or that it's just arbitrary? Or something else?

My personal understanding is that even if this was originally one of Jesus' sayings, something was lost in the translation and repeating of the story...Otherwise, it is simply something placed on Jesus' lips to justify the inequities of the social, economic and political system...

I believe that would cover it. I believe everyone has an equal opportunity to respond correctly.
 

beenherebeforeagain

Rogue Animist
Premium Member
I believe that would cover it. I believe everyone has an equal opportunity to respond correctly.
Sorry, I don't read it as describing a fair and just kingdom; the parable reflects a violent, capricious and vindictive 'Lord,' who would not himself want to be treated the way he treats his 'subjects.' To respond 'correctly'--that is, in the way to gain the benefits of a free meal from the King and not get bound and tossed (or slayed outright...)--that is, to gain entry into the Kingdom of Heaven--is to embrace not love, peace and compassion, but to expect retribution.

Jesus is quoted as saying that one must forgive seventy times seven times...I don't believe that Jesus will forgive seventy times seven times, but on the 491st time, you'd better look out! Off to the fiery pit with you!
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I prefer Him to the alternative. I can't say which is worse dying in outer space from heat, cold and lack of oxygen or being burned up in fire on the earth. As for me I believe I have selected the best course of life eternal.
Huh? What are you talking about?
...and what does this have to do with the rapture?
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
Sorry, I don't read it as describing a fair and just kingdom; the parable reflects a violent, capricious and vindictive 'Lord,' who would not himself want to be treated the way he treats his 'subjects.' To respond 'correctly'--that is, in the way to gain the benefits of a free meal from the King and not get bound and tossed (or slayed outright...)--that is, to gain entry into the Kingdom of Heaven--is to embrace not love, peace and compassion, but to expect retribution.

Jesus is quoted as saying that one must forgive seventy times seven times...I don't believe that Jesus will forgive seventy times seven times, but on the 491st time, you'd better look out! Off to the fiery pit with you!

I believe most people are well over that by now. Salvation is so easy; just give control of your life to God.
 
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