Watchtower Governing Body: Are They The Exclusive Channel For God??

[Pegg]

Can you point me to a Watchtower official document which will answer my question?

Are the members of the Governing Body born again NOW?

I have gone to the official site, and the answer is not there.

WT 2009 4/1 pp11-12

SINCE the days of the apostles, God has been choosing from among mankind a limited number of faithful Christians, adopting them as sons. The change that these adopted sons experience is so complete that God’s Word describes it as a new birth. The purpose of the new birth is to prepare such born-again servants of God to become rulers in heaven. (2 Timothy 2:12) To become rulers, they are raised out of death to heavenly life. (Romans 6:3-5) In heaven, “they are to rule as kings over the earth” along with Christ.—Revelation 5:10; 11:15.​

If you look at the verse in 2 Timothy 2:12, it shows that a chosen one can have their choosing revoked if they fail to maintain loyalty while they are alive. If they remain loyal unto death, they receive a 'new birth' as a spirit son of God. They become like Jesus and join the heavenly kingdom. So all of the anointed (not only the GB) have a 'born-again' status while on earth, and if faithful to death they will receive a new birth thereby literally becoming 'born-again'

Until they reach heaven, we tend to refer to them as 'anointed' rather then 'born-again'
But in reviewing the information, its not really wrong to call them born-again so long as we realise that the term is a reference to them becoming spirits. Its like being included in your parents a Will. You know you have an inheritance, but you wont see the reality of that inheritance until your parents die. Until that death occurs, you wont receive what has been bequeathed.

 

[Pegg]

That is Great!! I believe the same!

You would probably also agree with me that we should not appeal to human creeds, confessions or catechisms as the ultimate authority over our beliefs as much of our modern churches do. Yes? No?

As christians, we should follow what the Bible teaches. If the Bible teaches something different than what my particular religious denomination teaches, then I should follow the Bible, right?

Absolutely. That is precisely why I follow the guidance of the Watchtower. They are one of the few christian groups to uphold the bible as the basis of their teachings. They did away with the false trinity doctrine, hellfire, pergatory, christmas, easter and many other false teachings a long time ago. They uphold the bibles high moral standards. They have been promoting bible truth and the good new of the Kingdom 'continually' for over 100 years. They have reached into all parts of the earth as Jesus required his disciples to do. They have done so during war time and never have they missed an issue of the Watchtower even when being hunted by the governments. Even in lands where they were under ban and suffered persecution, their numbers grew and their spritutal food kept being sent out...it even got into nazi prison camps! How could this happen without the help from above???.

this tells me that they are Christs brothers.

 

[Mountain_Climber]

WT 2009 4/1 pp11-12

SINCE the days of the apostles, God has been choosing from among mankind a limited number of faithful Christians, adopting them as sons. The change that these adopted sons experience is so complete that God’s Word describes it as a new birth. The purpose of the new birth is to prepare such born-again servants of God to become rulers in heaven. (2 Timothy 2:12) To become rulers, they are raised out of death to heavenly life. (Romans 6:3-5) In heaven, “they are to rule as kings over the earth” along with Christ.—Revelation 5:10; 11:15.​

If you look at the verse in 2 Timothy 2:12, it shows that a chosen one can have their choosing revoked if they fail to maintain loyalty while they are alive. If they remain loyal unto death, they receive a 'new birth' as a spirit son of God. They become like Jesus and join the heavenly kingdom. So all of the anointed (not only the GB) have a 'born-again' status while on earth, and if faithful to death they will receive a new birth thereby literally becoming 'born-again'

Until they reach heaven, we tend to refer to them as 'anointed' rather then 'born-again'
But in reviewing the information, its not really wrong to call them born-again so long as we realize that the term is a reference to them becoming spirits. Its like being included in your parents a Will. You know you have an inheritance, but you wont see the reality of that inheritance until your parents die. Until that death occurs, you wont receive what has been bequeathed.

I can agree with the spirit of your comment.

In the end, it matters not about details insofar as their literally coming to wear a spirit beings body. It will prove to be what it proves to be. Until then, so long as we accurately gain the spirit of the counsel, we are able to be obedient to that counsel.

I would only ask you to consider that as first-fruits of the harvest the remainder of the harvest is expected to eventually mature to be like them. That is why they become as fountains of living water to the rest of the house, even as spoken at Revelation 7.

 

[Pegg]

I can agree with the spirit of your comment.

In the end, it matters not about details insofar as their literally coming to wear a spirit beings body. It will prove to be what it proves to be. Until then, so long as we accurately gain the spirit of the counsel, we are able to be obedient to that counsel.

I would only ask you to consider that as first-fruits of the harvest the remainder of the harvest is expected to eventually mature to be like them. That is why they become as fountains of living water to the rest of the house, even as spoken at Revelation 7.

eventually all mankind, under their guidance and instruction, will become perfect again and they will have the wonderful opportunity to live forever on the earth.

But I cant agree with you that the heavenly kingdom is going to be located here on earth in a physical way. This is where we differ greatly. The throne of God is situated in the heavens, and Jesus said that the rulership of God will be located in heaven....just as it was in the beginning when Adam was created. God ruled Eden from heaven...he needed no earthly throne or earthly king. Adam knew God face to face because Adam was perfect and the Garden of Eden itself was a temple where the worship of God and the carrying out of Gods Will was the norm. When the whole earth is filled with the knowledge of Jehovah and all mankind are restored to such perfection, the entire earth will once again be like that garden of Eden....a place of worship.
And all this is accomplished from heaven, by means of the heavenly kingdom....not by means of an earthly kingdom:
Acts 3:21 Heaven must hold this one within itself until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

They are one of the few christian groups to uphold the bible as the basis of their teachings.

Don't let an elder hear you say this! JW's are supposed to be the "ONLY" ones teaching the truth.

They did away with the false trinity doctrine, hellfire, pergatory, christmas, easter and many other false teachings a long time ago.

Can you show me 1 "ONE" verse of scripture that says, "THOU SHALT NOT CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS, EASTER, 4th OF JULY?"

They have been promoting bible truth and the good new of the Kingdom 'continually' for over 100 years.

How about the false truth they taught, "For a number of years, we thought that the great tribulation began in 1914 with World War I and that “those days were cut short” by Jehovah in 1918 when the war ended so that the remnant would have the opportunity to preach the good news to all nations." (Watchtower July 15, 2013)

In review, what have we learned? In the beginning of this article, we raised three “when” questions. We first considered that the great tribulation did not begin in 1914 but will start when the United Nations attacks Babylon the Great. Then, we reviewed why Jesus’ judgment of the sheep and the goats did not begin in 1914 but will occur during the great tribulation. Finally, we examined why Jesus’ arrival to appoint the faithful slave over all his belongings did not occur in 1919 but will take place during the great tribulation. So, then, all three “whens” apply to the same future time period—the great tribulation. (Watchtower July 15, 2013)

They taught this false truth for 90 years or more. How many peoples lives you think were destroyed because they didn't agree?

The GB claims to be "SPIRIT DIRECTED" but they claim to be "IMPERFECT MEN" so they can't teach anything infallible. The whole Bible was written by "IMPERFECT MEN", is the Bible fallible? No, if God is directing the writing it cannot be fallible!

Christendom, as JW's like to call it, taught for those 90+ years that the Watchtower was wrong about the tribulation truth. Since JW's are supposed to be so honest, tell me who taught the "REAL TRUTH" all those years?

 

[Pegg]

Don't let an elder hear you say this! JW's are supposed to be the "ONLY" ones teaching the truth.

other groups have done away with some false teachings but held onto others. The christadelphians for example did away with the trinity too, but they have other teachings which are quite wrong. The mormons have the preaching commission right, but they have other teachings quite wrong.
Jehovahs Witnesses are the closest religion we have to the bible and its teachings. And even if some of our teachings are not quite right yet, we trust they will be when God feels fit to reveal the information.

Can you show me 1 "ONE" verse of scripture that says, "THOU SHALT NOT CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS, EASTER, 4th OF JULY?"

Christianity is not based on law. Its based on priciples.
The Watchtower have continually helped people to understand Christian principles and provided advice on how to reason on them so as to apply them.

“You are no part of the world.”—JOHN 15:19 this principle would apply to worldly holidays and customs. Worldly customs may not seem wrong in themselves, but a christian should seriously consider the basis of all worldly holidays and customs. 4th of July is a political celebration of indepenence from Great Britain. Christians are instructed to remain politically neutral. So as a christian i would not feel comfortable celebrating a political victory.
Same goes for War Memorial celebrations... we are against war as Jesus directed his followers to 'put your swords away' and make peace rather then war.

christmas/easter/valentines/halloween.... these all have religious connotations and originate in false religions. They are not christian celebrations. You wont find any of these in the scriptures.

The GB claims to be "SPIRIT DIRECTED" but they claim to be "IMPERFECT MEN" so they can't teach anything infallible. The whole Bible was written by "IMPERFECT MEN", is the Bible fallible? No, if God is directing the writing it cannot be fallible!

Christendom, as JW's like to call it, taught for those 90+ years that the Watchtower was wrong about the tribulation truth. Since JW's are supposed to be so honest, tell me who taught the "REAL TRUTH" all those years?

no one claims to be infallible and the GB are very open when it comes to correcting themselves. They are also not averse to correcting older ideas when their understanding of something suddenly changes. This to me shows humility and Godly direction. Even Jesus own apostles had some wrong ideas among them...but they learned to change them.

It is wrong to assume that the GB are 100% correct on every matter and even they dont claim that. There are no perfect people on earth... Jehovah is working with imperfect people and it will remain that way for as long as mankind are imperfect. If you expect perfection you will be disappointed. But if you seek the spirit of the truth you will find it among Jehovahs people.

 

[Katzpur]

The mormons have the preaching commission right, but they have other teachings quite wrong.

Funny you should say that. We'd say exactly the opposite.

 

[Mountain_Climber]

eventually all mankind, under their guidance and instruction, will become perfect again and they will have the wonderful opportunity to live forever on the earth.

But I cant agree with you that the heavenly kingdom is going to be located here on earth in a physical way. This is where we differ greatly. The throne of God is situated in the heavens, and Jesus said that the rulership of God will be located in heaven....just as it was in the beginning when Adam was created. God ruled Eden from heaven...he needed no earthly throne or earthly king. Adam knew God face to face because Adam was perfect and the Garden of Eden itself was a temple where the worship of God and the carrying out of Gods Will was the norm. When the whole earth is filled with the knowledge of Jehovah and all mankind are restored to such perfection, the entire earth will once again be like that garden of Eden....a place of worship.
And all this is accomplished from heaven, by means of the heavenly kingdom....not by means of an earthly kingdom:
Acts 3:21 Heaven must hold this one within itself until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old.

Well, I can understand that you want to keep thinking that.

But in your own example which you gave, God's rulership was in heaven, yes, but the perfect Adam (who is the parallel of that 144,000) was right here on earth where his dominion was with God being his superior in that dominion.

It is really ever so obvious a thousand different ways that this is one Jehovah's Witnesses have gotten wrong. And once you get it right you will be able to stop reading more into the scriptures than is there.

 

[Pegg]

Well, I can understand that you want to keep thinking that.

But in your own example which you gave, God's rulership was in heaven, yes, but the perfect Adam (who is the parallel of that 144,000) was right here on earth where his dominion was with God being his superior in that dominion.

It is really ever so obvious a thousand different ways that this is one Jehovah's Witnesses have gotten wrong. And once you get it right you will be able to stop reading more into the scriptures than is there.

Lets put it this way, if things go back to the way God had it when he was the ruler in Eden and the man was his servant, then that means that all mankind are his servants and he is their ruler. And as you say, he ruled from heaven.... so dont you think that logically means any future rulership of God will most likely also be from heaven?

 

[katiemygirl]

Funny you should say that. We'd say exactly the opposite.

I swear you have radar! The word mormon shows up in a thread and WHAM, just like that, Katz appears! WOW! Your are an amazing woman! LOL. What is your secret?

 

[katiemygirl]

="Pegg, post: 4315059, member: 23994"]WT 2009 4/1 pp11-12

SINCE the days of the apostles, God has been choosing from among mankind a limited number of faithful Christians, adopting them as sons. The change that these adopted sons experience is so complete that God’s Word describes it as a new birth. The purpose of the new birth is to prepare such born-again servants of God to become rulers in heaven. (2 Timothy 2:12) To become rulers, they are raised out of death to heavenly life. (Romans 6:3-5) In heaven, “they are to rule as kings over the earth” along with Christ.—Revelation 5:10; 11:15.​

FINALLY! My question has been answered. Thank you!! Aren't you glad I asked?

A person does not have to die to be born again, as you first thought. That makes perfect sense when you think about it. Jesus was speaking to a living being when He said, "Unless ONE is born again, he will not see the kingdom of God."

Wasn't Jesus also presenting a choice to Nicodemus?

How would that be different than my Father saying to me, "Unless you clean your room, you will not see your friends today?"

Hasn't my Father just given me a choice, a decision to make?

Pegg, how is being born again any different than being made new, becoming a new creation, or being regenerated? Don't they all mean the same thing?

 

[katiemygirl]

="Pegg, post: 4315068, member: 23994"]Absolutely. That is precisely why I follow the guidance of the Watchtower.

I am happy to hear that we TOTALLY agree that we should follow what the Bible teaches and not some human creed, confession or catechism.

If the Watchtower Society was teaching something that is contrary to the teaching of the Bible, would you follow the Watchtower or the Bible?

 

[Mountain_Climber]

Lets put it this way, if things go back to the way God had it when he was the ruler in Eden and the man was his servant, then that means that all mankind are his servants and he is their ruler. And as you say, he ruled from heaven.... so dont you think that logically means any future rulership of God will most likely also be from heaven?

That is where you have the 144,000 stepping away from the Davidic Covenant which was with a man and not with a spirit being. David ruled in God's kingdom. The covenant was for his throne to be made to endure forever, right here on earth.

Psalms 132:11 "Jehovah hath sworn in truth unto David; he will not turn from it; Of the fruit of thy body will I set upon thy throne."

 

[Pegg]

That is where you have the 144,000 stepping away from the Davidic Covenant which was with man and not with spirit beings.

The davidic covenant is a promise to David and his offspring. Are you from the royal line of King David of Ancient Israel? Jesus was. And Jesus is the one to whom the davidic throne has been given. The rulership has been handed to Jesus....and Jesus brothers.

Rev 14:3 And they are singing what seems to be a new song+ before the throne and before the four living creatures+ and the elders,+ and no one was able to master that song except the 144,000,+ who have been bought from the earth.

If they are going to be our judges, I want to be sure that they know what it means to be a sinner, to be tempted, to fail, to feel regret .... no angel knows about that. No angel knows how it feels to get sick, to feel depressed, to loose a loved one in death. I want judges who 'know' what its like to go through the daily struggles of life, dont you?

 

[Pegg]

FINALLY! My question has been answered. Thank you!! Aren't you glad I asked?

Yes, i am, all this extra research is good...you are helping to sharpen me hopefully

A person does not have to die to be born again, as you first thought. That makes perfect sense when you think about it. Jesus was speaking to a living being when He said, "Unless ONE is born again, he will not see the kingdom of God."

Wasn't Jesus also presenting a choice to Nicodemus?

How would that be different than my Father saying to me, "Unless you clean your room, you will not see your friends today?"

Hasn't my Father just given me a choice, a decision to make?

Pegg, how is being born again any different than being made new, becoming a new creation, or being regenerated? Don't they all mean the same thing?

I would say its very different because prior to death, a born again (or anointed) person has the 'hope' of heavenly life. The 'hope' is give' to the person based on Gods own choice to give him such a hope.
Receiving the hope occurs after God resurrects the person to heavenly life. Only then can they say they have been 'born-again'... they went from physical earthly life to spiritual heavenly life.

So its like that 'Will' with your name on it. You know you will inherit something from your grandparents.... but you wont see it until they die.

 

[Pegg]

I am happy to hear that we TOTALLY agree that we should follow what the Bible teaches and not some human creed, confession or catechism.

If the Watchtower Society was teaching something that is contrary to the teaching of the Bible, would you follow the Watchtower or the Bible?

I would follow the bible. Would you?

 

[katiemygirl]

="Bible Student, post: 4314542, member: 54450"]
Regeneration simply means ,the formation of new.A renewal.This is in any dictionary.

Here is Strong's definition.

◄ 3824. paliggenesia ►
paliggenesia: regeneration, renewal
Original Word: παλιγγενεσία, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: paliggenesia
Phonetic Spelling: (pal-ing-ghen-es-ee'-ah)
Short Definition: a new birth, regeneration
Definition: a new birth, regeneration, renewal.

We agree that being born again is being made new, renewed, regenerated, becoming a new creation.

I assume you would also agree that sins are forgiven at regeneration considering Titus 3:5 speaks of the "washing of regeneration."

Are only the anointed forgiven?

 

[Mountain_Climber]

Rev 14:3 And they are singing what seems to be a new song+ before the throne and before the four living creatures+ and the elders,+ and no one was able to master that song except the 144,000,+ who have been bought from the earth.

If they are going to be our judges, I want to be sure that they know what it means to be a sinner, to be tempted, to fail, to feel regret .... no angel knows about that. No angel knows how it feels to get sick, to feel depressed, to loose a loved one in death. I want judges who 'know' what its like to go through the daily struggles of life, dont you?

Yes, (1) that is spoken in relation to be purchased from this old earth which passes away. And so that expression merely means they are guaranteed not to pass away with it. And (2) they will be the rulers on God's footstool which is before his throne and so all those symbolic things you mention can yet be true. You know Revelation is a book of signs and typification.

You will have judges that can sympathize as they will be just like you, living right here on earth where they have suffered just like you.

Similarly you have them in the wrong heavens. They replace the one mentioned here:
Isaiah 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth shall wax old like a garment, and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished.

And you know that even your group knows earth's present governments constitute ruling in that heavens. (A lofty position of government as blessed of God, for he raises up whom he will and he lowers whom he will.)

 

[katiemygirl]

because prior to death, a born again (or anointed) person has the 'hope' of heavenly life. The 'hope' is give' to the person based on Gods own choice to give him such a hope.
Receiving the hope occurs after God resurrects the person to heavenly life. Only then can they say they have been 'born-again'... they went from physical earthly life to spiritual heavenly life.

So its like that 'Will' with your name on it. You know you will inherit something from your grandparents.... but you wont see it until they die.

Do you think that when a person is born again in this life that his sins are forgiven?

And would you agree that being born again is the same as being made new, being regenerated?

 

[katiemygirl]

I would follow the bible. Would you?

Yes M'am! And I do!