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Upanishads

I have come in contact with advaita vedanta a little bit and find it very interesting. As it considers the upanishads as important texts, it raised some questions.

Since both upanishads and vedic texts was written during a very long time span - what makes a text get the status as a vedic or upanishadic?

And next question: is it so that all upanishads are part of vedas? In that case, what makes them separable from other vedic texts?
 

Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I have come in contact with advaita vedanta a little bit and find it very interesting. As it considers the upanishads as important texts, it raised some questions.

Since both upanishads and vedic texts was written during a very long time span - what makes a text get the status as a vedic or upanishadic?

And next question: is it so that all upanishads are part of vedas? In that case, what makes them separable from other vedic texts?

An oversimplification, but ... The Upanishads are philosophical treatises. The Vedas outline ritual, living, astrology, ayurveda, and more ... everything under the sun, except philosophy.
 

shivsomashekhar

Well-Known Member
Since both upanishads and vedic texts was written during a very long time span - what makes a text get the status as a vedic or upanishadic?

Tradition.

We do not know exactly when the core Veda became canonical, but it was mostly around 1000 BC or a little earlier. Since it is canonical, we know exactly what is Veda and what is not.

Upanishads are a mix of old and new. But they are all generally attached to one of the Veda (Atharvana, mostly).

Older Upanishads are more commonly accepted than the new.

The core of the Veda is the Samhita - simple prayers for prosperity, health, wealth, etc. Next come the Brahmana texts which are mostly about rituals such as fire sacrifices, horse sacrifices, etc., conducted for prosperity, rain, birth of male children, etc. You can find more on Wikipedia.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
As it considers the upanishads as important texts, it raised some questions.
Since both upanishads and vedic texts was written during a very long time span - what makes a text get the status as a vedic or upanishadic?
And next question: is it so that all upanishads are part of vedas? In that case, what makes them separable from other vedic texts?
Age, ancientness. What are considered part of Vedas are: Brahmanas (1), Aranyakas (2) and Upanishads (3). They contain very old material, though it is very difficult to sort out what is new and what is old. Among the Upanishads 13 or so are considered very old and they are most respected. They are known as 'Mukhya Upanishads' (Principle or Main Upanishads). Two of the Upanishads are very short - Mandukya (12 verses) and Ishavasya (18 verses). People kept on writing Upanishads in later times as well, but these don't get the same respect and are mostly associated with sects of Hinduism.

from Wikipedia Vedas - Wikipedia and other related pages.
Samhita (Vedas proper): Samhita literally means "put together, joined, union", a "collection", and "a methodically, rule-based combination of text or verses". Samhita also refers to the most ancient layer of text in the Vedas, consisting of mantras, hymns, prayers, litanies and benedictions.
- For example, Taittiriya Samhita of YajurVeda was written prior to 2,000 BC.

Parts of Vedic Samhitas which constitute the oldest living part of Hindu tradition:
(1) comment and explain the rituals as well as expound on their meaning and many connected themes.
(2) "wilderness texts" or "forest treaties", were composed by people who meditated in the woods as recluses and are the third part of the Vedas. The texts contain discussions and interpretations of ceremonies, from ritualistic to symbolic meta-ritualistic points of view.
(3) ancient Sanskrit texts that contain some of the central philosophical concepts and ideas of Hinduism. Upanishads are not concerned with rituals, they are concerned with philosophy.

The Sanskrit term Upaniṣad (from upa "by" and ni-ṣad "sit down") translates to "sitting down near", referring to the student sitting down near the teacher while receiving spiritual knowledge.
 
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Thank you! So what I now still wonder is what makes an upanishad considered as an upanishad? Was it actually stated by the author that "this is an upanishad" or is it simply the style of writing that later made people of the tradition consider some texts as upanishads?
 

shivsomashekhar

Well-Known Member
Thank you! So what I now still wonder is what makes an upanishad considered as an upanishad? Was it actually stated by the author that "this is an upanishad" or is it simply the style of writing that later made people of the tradition consider some texts as upanishads?

It is the content and some other circumstances that led to the main Upanishads entering the canon. Once the concept took hold, the title identified the Upanishad. By the 14th Century AD, there were hundreds of Upanishads in existence.
 

atanu

Member
Premium Member
I have come in contact with advaita vedanta a little bit and find it very interesting. As it considers the upanishads as important texts, it raised some questions.

Since both upanishads and vedic texts was written during a very long time span - what makes a text get the status as a vedic or upanishadic?

And next question: is it so that all upanishads are part of vedas? In that case, what makes them separable from other vedic texts?


This Wikipedia page gives a good summary.

Upanishads - Wikipedia

...

Upanishads constitute the innermost or the end of the Vedas, and hence are called Vedanta. There are 108 Upanishads listed in Muktika Upanishad, but 10 Upanishads are called mukhya or principal upanishads.

There are 4 Vedas. The Rig has been organised in 10 books, by Vedavyasa, as per common belief among the religious teachers, who also hold that the present written down Veda is only part of a much larger unwritten Veda.

Upanishads are definitely the integral and the knowledge part, as opposed to the procedural part, of the Vedas. As can be seen from the Wiki page, all 4 Vedas have upanishads associated with them.
 
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Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Thank you! So what I now still wonder is what makes an upanishad considered as an upanishad? Was it actually stated by the author that "this is an upanishad" or is it simply the style of writing that later made people of the tradition consider some texts as upanishads?
Designated so by tradition. When an argument was advanced, people asked who said it? So, the reply was such and such sage said that or this is the main characterstic of that body of argument? That is how the name stuck. Either by the name of the person, e.g., Maitreya ascribed to Maitrayana, or Atireya ascribed to Sage Atri; or based on the content, Brihadaranyaka Upanishad (Upanishad from the big forest); Katha (Stories); or by philosophy, Prashna (Question), Kena (Who), etc.
 

ameyAtmA

~ ~
Premium Member
The Shvetashvatara Upanishad is my favorite Upanishad of the present time, and especially as it is one of the go-to Upanishads for Shaivites in general.

Shwetashvatara is one of my favorite Upanishads also -- actually ALL are. However I had done some analysis on the Shwetashvatara more recently than others. I have my thoughts written up and was contemplating posting a thread on the Shwetashatara here, a few months ago - but never did.
Perhaps it is time I started that thread and .others can contribute.
 
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