Unable to kill.

[Spirit of Light]

In an other thread the discussion about killing or not killing (pasifist) arise.
And @mikkel_the_dane argued that he would kill to save me in a situation of danger.
Personally I can not accept that other people get killed to save my life, nor can i or will i kill an other being.

Realizing this, comes with its challenges due to people think they can not trust a pasifist. The thing is. I can take a bullet for you. But I will not wish others to die for me.

I cant answer if this is a form of selfishness or not

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

In an other thread the discussion about killing or not killing (pasifist) arise.
And @mikkel_the_dane argued that he would kill to save me in a situation of danger.
Personally I can not accept that othet people get killed to save my life, nor can i or will i kill an other being.

Realizing this, comes with its challenges due to people think they can not trust a pasifist. The thing is. I can take a bullet for you. But I will not wish others to die for me.

I cant answer if this is a form of selfishness or not

No, I trust you as a human. And accept that you don't accept my choice. This is not ment as a debate.
The funny thing is that I accept I would die, because in some relevant to you being a pacifist, I would. And I accept that you don't accept my choice to save you by killing another human, but I still would. Can you accept that?

As for judgment of it, in the end, if there is God, then it is with God and not us humans. I accept that.

 

[Spirit of Light]

No, I trust you as a human. And accept that you don't accept my choice. This is not ment as a debate.
The funny thing is that I accept I would die, because in some relevant to you being a pacifist, I would. And I accept that you don't accept my choice to save you by killing another human, but I still would. Can you accept that?

As for judgment of it, in the end, if there is God, then it is with God and not use humans. I accept that.

I can forgive you. if you did the action. But seeing killing as a wrong action to do it is you as a person I forgive, not the killing in it self.

I am unsure why my pacifism would get you killed in some way? You are free to leave the area of danger, or?

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

I can forgive you. if you did the action. But seeing killing as a wrong action to do it is you as a person I forgive, not the killing in it self.

I am unsure why my pacifism would get you killed in some way? You are free to leave the area of danger, or?

You can construct using philosophically possible a situation that would apply. I am in part trained to use such examples.

 

[Spirit of Light]

You can construct using philosophically possible a situation that would apply. I am in part trained to use such examples.

My goal in any situation i experience is not not harm anyone, or get others in to harmful situations.
I am aware my belief in non voilence seems like unrealistic.

 

[Shakeel]

I am unsure why my pacifism would get you killed in some way? You are free to leave the area of danger, or?

It's a wonder anybody ever gets killed!

 

[Spirit of Light]

It's a wonder anybody ever gets killed!

The world would be a better place if nobody killed or was killed

 

[Gargovic Malkav]

I cant answer if this is a form of selfishness or not

I think this depends on the reason why you don't want others to die for you, but are willing to die for others.

 

[Justanatheist]

The world would be a better place if nobody killed or was killed

The question is whether or not we can achieve that peace through pacifism or can it only be achieved through violence. I hate violence, I suffered from sadistic violence for the first 14 years of my life but it would never of stopped if I had not learnt to use violence myself. Always been the great dichotomy of my life, Violence is not the answer but ultimately violence is the answer

 

[Gargovic Malkav]

I hate violence, I suffered from sadistic violence for the first 14 years of my life but it would never of stopped if I had not learnt to use violence myself.

Were you in a war or a bully victim or something?

 

[Spirit of Light]

I think this depends on the reason why you don't want others to die for you, but are willing to die for others.

My life is in the hands of Allah, so if I die there is a reason why.
And I do not wish other people to have sinned by killing.

 

[Justanatheist]

Were you in a war or a bully victim or something?

Bully victim.

 

[Spirit of Light]

The question is whether or not we can achieve that peace through pacifism or can it only be achieved through violence. I hate violence, I suffered from sadistic violence for the first 14 years of my life but it would never of stopped if I had not learnt to use violence myself. Always been the great dichotomy of my life, Violence is not the answer but ultimately violence is the answer

Speaking only for my own being, I reached the peace through sufism and a non voilant mind. I do not wish to harm any living being

 

[Shakeel]

My life is in the hands of Allah, so if I die there is a reason why.
And I do not wish other people to have sinned by killing.

There is nothing in Islam that asks you to die out of fear of killing - out of cowardice. Defending yourself and others is your obligation is certain circumstances.

And it is not sinful to kill to save a life.

 

[Gargovic Malkav]

Bully victim.

Yeah, bullies are not exactly known to listen to reason or pleadings of mercy...
Sorry to hear that...

 

[Justanatheist]

Speaking only for my own being, I reached the peace through sufism and a non voilant mind. I do not wish to harm any living being

Sadly there are violent people in this world who would run it if we let them, that is the problem, who commits the violence required to allow others to live in peace.

 

[Spirit of Light]

There is nothing in Islam that asks you to die out of fear of killing - out of cowardice. Defending yourself and others is your obligation is certain circumstances.

And it is not sinful to kill to save a life.

I see killing as a wrong action, it is not out of compassion nor from the pure heart to kill other beings.

 

[Secret Chief]

Speaking only for my own being, I reached the peace through sufism and a non voilant mind. I do not wish to harm any living being

This is a great aspiration to live by. But it is impossible of course - because we kill sentient beings every day, but not necessarily intentionally or knowingly. A zen-sounding question: To live is to kill - what are you going to do?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Sadly there are violent people in this world who would run it if we let them, that is the problem, who commits the violence required to allow others to live in peace.

The world is a cruel place due to egoism and greed, so yes as you say. The world do not deem to want peace and love

 

[Justanatheist]

Yeah, bullies are not exactly known to listen to reason or pleadings of mercy...
Sorry to hear that...

One day you realise that the physical action of being hurt is nothing compared to the phycological fear of being hurt. That is the day you can strike back, that is the day you realise you do not have to win a fight to beat the bully.