Turkey Invades Syria

[sooda]

I believe he sometimes tells white lies in order to neutralize political opposition or he tells white lies in order to further right-wing populism, but maybe we can at least agree sometimes the end justifies the means.

Trump: Kurds Didn't Help Us With Normandy

"“The Kurds are fighting for their land, just so you understand, they’re fighting for their land,” Trump said at a White House event on Wednesday. “And as somebody wrote in a very, very powerful article today, they didn’t help us in the Second World War, they didn’t help us with Normandy, as an example, they mention names of different battles. But they’re there to help us with their land.”"

Trump Mocked for Saying Kurds Didn't Help U.S. at Normandy

How do any of you still support this loser???

 

[LuisDantas]

Under normal circumstances I wouldn't think about giving them the martrydom they crave. But let's be honest, ISIS has never shown it has any sort of decency or respect towards life, and the Kurds face a much greater issue then the ethics behind prisoners of war who are dedicated to their extermination. It sucks, but those 10,000 prisoners are 10,000 risks and liabilities should things get worse for the Kurds. War is ugly, and sometimes people are forced to do ugly things for their survival.

I don't think we want to go there.

For one thing, that is far too close to the discourse of suicide bombers for confort.

For another, ISIS are not aliens from another planet. Who know how many of them have friends and relatives that just might be pushed into dangerous extremism if given the proper incentive. Butchering those people will result in a stain of blood that will be remembered by generations and perpetuate the cycle of hatred and beligerance.

 

[Shad]

For shame. Do you realize that you are proposing summary execution of prisoners without a judgement?

Except for the fact that I said hand them over to Iraq and Syria. Besides if those 10k are members of ISIS the judgement has already been made.

Now ask yourself why these prisoners have not been turned over to national authorities when there is one is Damascus and another in Baghdad

 

[Shad]

Yes, I agree with the solutions you propose.

Turning them over I assume?

 

[Shad]

Agreed, wholeheartedly. The UN is one of the biggest wastes of money on the planet. It is nothing more than a propaganda machine where little inconsequential tinpots can strut around and pontificate like they were actually big consequential tinpots. The other little tinpots whoop and holler for each other.

A big joke

Did you read that the UN is running out of money? Kiss more of USA tax dollars goodbye funding an organization most members only pay lip service to.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don't think we want to go there.

For one thing, that is far too close to the discourse of suicide bombers for confort.

For another, ISIS are not aliens from another planet. Who know how many of them have friends and relatives that just might be pushed into dangerous extremism if given the proper incentive. Butchering those people will result in a stain of blood that will be remembered by generations and perpetuate the cycle of hatred and beligerance.

If there is a real chance it may be me or them, it's going to be them. ISIS members are people, but they are people who pledged themselves to the destruction of pretty much everyone and everything that isn't them. If there is nothing else they can do with them, it may be the only option for their own safety.

 

[sooda]

Did you read that the UN is running out of money? Kiss more of USA tax dollars goodbye funding an organization most members only pay lip service to.

Russia and Iran should pay to rebuild Syria since they support the barrel bomber.

 

[LuisDantas]

If there is a real chance it may be me or them, it's going to be them. ISIS members are people, but they are people who pledged themselves to the destruction of pretty much everyone and everything that isn't them. If there is nothing else they can do with them, it may be the only option for their own safety.

Sigh. Maybe I should be talking to them instead of to you.

 

[Cooky]

From BBC:
Turkish troops launch Syria offensive

Thoughts?

My thought is that Islamic wars are petty.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

My thought is that Islamic wars are pretty.

<ignore-list>

I don't need to start my day reading this kind of despicable ugliness.​

</ignore-list>

 

[Shad]

Russia and Iran should pay to rebuild Syria since they support the barrel bomber.

The US too since it was involved in the war. Lets not pretend the US is there for a good cause. They want Assad out and armed anyone rebel group that the US wasn't shooting at.

 

[metis]

I wonder were the UN is in all this. It shouldn't be the US involved except in support of UN action IMO.
I don't think the US government should take it on itself to decide who is the good guys here.

I agree, but remember that Obama caught hell using that approach when he was accused of "leading from behind".

Either way, we asked the Kurds to help us against ISIS, and they did. So, not only did Trump just throw them under the bus but the stage is also set for possible "ethnic cleansing" of the Kurds by the Turks.

 

[Shad]

I don't think we want to go there.

For one thing, that is far too close to the discourse of suicide bombers for confort.

For another, ISIS are not aliens from another planet. Who know how many of them have friends and relatives that just might be pushed into dangerous extremism if given the proper incentive. Butchering those people will result in a stain of blood that will be remembered by generations and perpetuate the cycle of hatred and beligerance.

Terrorists have no protection in the Geneva Convention. ISIS are not POWs nor have any rights of POWs

If families flip out over their jihadist family member being killed then those families are sympathizers to the cause of the Jihadist. Millions of Germans were killed in WW2 yet Germany isn't flipping out today as Germans realized their mistake. Heck German war guilty is a national thing these days.

 

[LuisDantas]

Terrorists have no protection in the Geneva Convention. ISIS are not POWs nor have any rights of POWs

If families flip out over their jihadist family member being killed then those families are sympathizers to the cause of the Jihadist. Millions of Germans were killed in WW2 yet Germany isn't flipping out today as Germans realized their mistake. Heck German war guilty is a national thing these days.

I don't particularly care about what you are saying. I do care about killing 10 thousand people when it is so avoidable.

 

[Shad]

I don't particularly care about what you are saying. I do care about killing 10 thousand people when it is so avoidable.

Why do you not want 10k terrorist to face the consequences of their actions?

 

[metis]

Saw that in the news this morning. One can't help but wonder if the Trump Towers Istanbul had anything to do with Trump's decision to pull out.

I do believe you're right on this. We should remember that Trump violates the Emoluments Clause in the Constitution daily, which is about $.

 

[metis]

Interesting that Turkey sees the Syrian Kurds as a terrorist group. Label a group as terrorists and you can justify any action against them.

Hard for me to judge, from the otherside of the world, who the terrorists are.

I can very much understand the Turk's concern over the Kurds because there's a long history of conflict between the two. But Trump's pulling out of Syria not only will further destabilize that country but also this can all too easily spread to Iraq and maybe even Lebanon. Even the Israeli's have to be concerned as Trump's actions help both Russia and the Iranians, plus will feed ISIS itself.

 

[metis]

My thought is that Islamic wars are pretty.

Since when is that Catholic in any way?

 

[sooda]

The US too since it was involved in the war. Lets not pretend the US is there for a good cause. They want Assad out and armed anyone rebel group that the US wasn't shooting at.

Assad is a butcher just like his father. Syria was in terrible straits from 2006 to 2011 when Assad arrested the school boys and killed a couple of them a month later,, That's when the protests erupted..

The irony here .. at least to me.. is that those five years when Syria was falling into the abyss neither Russia nor Iran stepped up to help or council Assad.

 

[Shad]

Assad is a butcher just like his father. Syria was in terrible straits from 2006 to 2011 when Assad arrested the school boys and killed a couple of them a month later,, That's when the protests erupted..

The irony here .. at least to me.. is that those five years when Syria was falling into the abyss neither Russia nor Iran stepped up to help or council Assad.

Both have been helping Assad for years just not through official channels at all times.

So are you acknowledging the US leaders from Bush to Obama lied about the reason for being in Syria which was claimed to be ISIS. Instead that was a lie and really US involvement was about regime change?