Total verses in Qur'an: they fool you again!

[Union]

Salaam alaik! Main point of thread has vital role in doing dawah to non muslims. But I think it is not the good place to discuss this.

Salam . Thanks for your dua sis. Is it not wise to extinguish the fire at your own home rather to blow out for others’ home’s fire first ? We have to reconcile our own issues by our own selves , can’t expect any one’s to do it . Muslim nation is bowed by its knees with humiliation over the bloody century-old history of conflict between Shia , Sunni , Hanafi, Shafi, Salafi , Wahabi , Ismali etc etc. What do you think , how you gonna unite them like the time of the Prophet ? We have to weep out all the weeds that grown under the tree of real Islam . That is what I am trying to do here .

Mistake!

Have you ever heard that imaams have conflict among them at this point? :no:

I think you didn’t read my post attentively . Let me quote you again :

01. Tafseer Al Itqan fi Uloom al Quran, Volume 1 page 84

Allamah Jalaluddin Suyuti has recorded a tradition from Ibn Abbas [ra] wherein he says: “The number of verses in the Quran are 6616”

02.Al Itqan fi Uloom al Quran, Volume 1 page 84 :

Allamah Jalaluddin Suyuti whilst citing Sunni scholarly opinion from Sunni scholar Uthman bin Saeed bin Uthman Abu Amro al-Daani (d. 444 H) wrote:

Al-Daani said: ‘They agreed that the number of verses of Quran are six thousand but they disagreed in what has been added further (to the Quran), some of them didn't add more whilst others said it was two hundred and four. Some said two hundred and fourteen, others said two hundred and nineteen. Some said two hundred and twenty five, others said two hundred and thirty six.’

03.Tafseer Ibn Kathir, Volume 1 page 7, number of verses&Tafseer Qurtubi, Volume 1 page 65, number of verses :

“The total number of verses Quranic verses are 6000. Disagreement remains about the remainder verses. There are various views and statements about them. One statement is that there are 6204 verses”

So no conspiracy. There is more importand point to discuss: Shia sect counts Quran in 40 paras, and they are at the conflict with other muslims that is more important issue to discuss I think!

No doubt Shia are deluded also in the same issue . But why don’t you respond to the following Sunni hadith reports first where Bukhari , Muslim, Tirmidhi , Abu Dawud etc. hadith books reported the Qur’an to be distorted :
http://www.religiousforums.com/foru...lims-only-hadiths-saying-enemies-prophet.html

Or this : http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/islam/83336-satanic-verses-who-real-culprits-behind.html


It is pointless to quarrel with Shias instead of learning first who really made the ground to fight with your own brother .:candle:

 

[Union]

OK, brother, you seem right about these numbers. i checked and found the same numbers. do you know any source that says otherwise? i remember people saying there are 6667 verses in Qur'an but i never checked it out before. yet that number stayed in my mind if it was true. so this is my personal fault if you ask me. strange thing, not surprising though.

thank you for warning me about it



.

Salam .
I do really appreciate your prompt quality of understanding the real fact unlike others here . I myself really unaware of the source of these deceit 6666 or 6667 numbers :

The famous number that is widely known to the people about the total number of verses of the Qur’an is 6666 . Believe me I tried a lot to dig out the source of this number but I give up . From where Muslims got this number is now a mystery to me . I do appreciate if some knowledgeable person will focus some light on the source of this number 6666 :help:.

For others number here I find :

01. Tafseer Al Itqan fi Uloom al Quran, Volume 1 page 84 :

Allamah Jalaluddin Suyuti has recorded a tradition from Ibn Abbas [ra] wherein he says: “The number of verses in the Quran are 6616”

02.Al Itqan fi Uloom al Quran, Volume 1 page 84 :

Allamah Jalaluddin Suyuti whilst citing Sunni scholarly opinion from Sunni scholar Uthman bin Saeed bin Uthman Abu Amro al-Daani (d. 444 H) wrote:

Al-Daani said: ‘They agreed that the number of verses of Quran are six thousand but they disagreed in what has been added further (to the Quran), some of them didn't add more whilst others said it was two hundred and four. Some said two hundred and fourteen, others said two hundred and nineteen. Some said two hundred and twenty five, others said two hundred and thirty six.’

03.Tafseer Ibn Kathir, Volume 1 page 7, number of verses&Tafseer Qurtubi, Volume 1 page 65, number of verses :

“The total number of verses Quranic verses are 6000. Disagreement remains about the remainder verses. There are various views and statements about them. One statement is that there are 6204 verses”

Thanks .

 

[fullyveiled muslimah]

I'm trying to figure out the importance of the numbering of verses? If someone counts all the tasmih along with the individual verses, and one does not, who's right and who's wrong? Does it matter? What about Muslims and our practice or lack thereof of Islam as a whole? I think sooo many other things can and should be discussed by us, that this seems totally nonsensical.

I'm with Mestemia on this.opcorn:

 

[Union]

I'm trying to figure out the importance of the numbering of verses? If someone counts all the tasmih along with the individual verses, and one does not, who's right and who's wrong? Does it matter? What about Muslims and our practice or lack thereof of Islam as a whole? I think sooo many other things can and should be discussed by us, that this seems totally nonsensical.

I'm with Mestemia on this.opcorn:

Salam . This passive attitude is good for your own , but how are you going to respond to the anti-Islamic personnel if they asked you the total number of verses in the Qur’an ? You can’t say them ‘ I don’t know’ or ‘this is not necessary’ . You have to give them an answer , a true one .

If you fetch any old manuscript of the Qur’an , you will able to find a clear numbering of each and every verses . Hence it is quite rational of knowing the total number of the verses in the Qur’an .

As just add up them in my very first post , this as simple as water . But the confusion arose when you look into your Tafsir and Hadith books . The prominent Imams of Ahle Sunna gave so many puzzling numbers which in no way even close to the real number . Insated of going to confuse their millions followers , they could have picked the Qur'an and added them up . That's how they could simply dismiss all other misleading information in this reagard .

Thanks .

 

[fullyveiled muslimah]

Salam . This passive attitude is good for your own , but how are you going to respond to the anti-Islamic personnel if they asked you the total number of verses in the Qur’an ? You can’t say them ‘ I don’t know’ or ‘this is not necessary’ . You have to give them an answer , a true one .

I could say "I don't know". It's a perfectly valid answer if it's the truth. I could also tell them it isn't necessary, and then point out to them the more necessary information such as the basic message of Qur'an. Just sayin

 

[Union]

I could say "I don't know". It's a perfectly valid answer if it's the truth. I could also tell them it isn't necessary, and then point out to them the more necessary information such as the basic message of Qur'an. Just sayin

Salam sister . All the Qur’ans around you is numbered , verse by verse . Only what you have to do is to add them up and tell them the right number . This is a simple task . Therefore your ‘don’t know’ answer will turn to a strong ‘ yes I know it’ .

I do really support you when you are saying we have more necessary task to do and that is to ponder on the message of the Qur’an instead of investing the time in counting its total verse number . But our own Ulemas changed that situation . They intensively emphasis explaining the total number of verses of the Qur’an and came up with so many divergence numbers even far from the truth . Consequently this misleading discussion (in your view unnecessary ) in our tafsir and Hadith books becomes a boomerang to the Anti-Islamic society . They have been using this materials to prove that Quran’s verses were added or subtracted . You can’t blame them , because its our prominent Imams who gave them that tools to attack Islam . Therefore it becomes obligatory for us now to clarify the issue and rejected all the misinformation though they were from our Shariah Law givers . In that way it becomes necessary for us to know how many total verses are there in the Qur’an .

01. Tafseer Al Itqan fi Uloom al Quran, Volume 1 page 84 :
Allamah Jalaluddin Suyuti has recorded a tradition from Ibn Abbas [ra] wherein he says: “The number of verses in the Quran are 6616”

02.Al Itqan fi Uloom al Quran, Volume 1 page 84 :

Allamah Jalaluddin Suyuti whilst citing Sunni scholarly opinion from Sunni scholar Uthman bin Saeed bin Uthman Abu Amro al-Daani (d. 444 H) wrote:

Al-Daani said: ‘They agreed that the number of verses of Quran are six thousand but they disagreed in what has been added further (to the Quran), some of them didn't add more whilst others said it was two hundred and four. Some said two hundred and fourteen, others said two hundred and nineteen. Some said two hundred and twenty five, others said two hundred and thirty six.’

03.Tafseer Ibn Kathir, Volume 1 page 7, number of verses&Tafseer Qurtubi, Volume 1 page 65, number of verses :

“The total number of verses Quranic verses are 6000. Disagreement remains about the remainder verses. There are various views and statements about them. One statement is that there are 6204 verses”

Thanks .

 

[Breathe]

It's amazing how people can memorize all that. May they be rewarded for their effort!
Which one do you guys think that one should answer when asked if they can't provide a long answer?