To BElieve or not to BElieve???

[FlyingTeaPot]

You have no religion, would you accept God to be true if defined only as the origin of the universe?

Sure, why not. I don't know enough to say this definitively, and scientists are grappling with this very debate right now, but I think the universe did indeed have an origin. And so if you choose to define 'God' as the origin of the universe, I would believe it (not know it) to be true.

 

[james blunt]

Sure, why not. I don't know enough to say this definitively, and scientists are grappling with this very debate right now, but I think the universe did indeed have an origin. And so if you choose to define 'God' as the origin of the universe, I would believe it (not know it) to be true.

Proving everyone can believe in God and it is only the semantics by all religions that is not acceptable to some. Thank you for your reply, I am glad you are a honest person.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

Proving everyone can believe in God and it is only the semantics by all religions that is not acceptable to some. Thank you for your reply, I am glad you are a honest person.

What I don't get is why belief in God (as defined by you in your earlier post) is necessary or a big deal. I could define God as ' The thing that got stuck in my shoe this morning' and still be exactly in the same position as when you defined God to be 'Origin of the universe'. It is indeed only the semantics. It does not affect anything in our world, and is certainly not something worth fighting each other over.

 

[james blunt]

What I don't get is why belief in God (as defined by you in your earlier post) is necessary or a big deal. I could define God as ' The thing that got stuck in my shoe this morning' and still be exactly in the same position as when you defined God to be 'Origin of the universe'. It is indeed only the semantics. It does not affect anything in our world, and is certainly not something worth fighting each other over.

I consider when people worship God, it is worshipping whatever created the Universe, whether that something be pixies , a scientist , natural occurrence or an entity as a spirit. The problem in my eyes is the holy books of all religions.
Now quite clearly the books are the work and words of the authors , God never spoke to anybody , their own imaginations wrote the books. Turning God into a subjective version rather than a version with an exact meaning, that even science could agree upon.
The worlds fuss is over books, I don't want to sound disrespectful, but do people think Harry Potter is real too?

Now according to religion, you have to be honest in Gods eyes, religion is not being very honest at all.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

I consider when people worship God, it is worshipping whatever created the Universe

If we stick my your definition of God, I don't see much reason to think about it, let alone worship it.

 

[sayak83]

Imran Hussein speaks to an atheist about belief, and how conversations regarding belief have to be grounded in rationality!

Filmed in the world famous Speakers Corner in London’s Hyde Park!

It would be more interesting if you debate an atheist here and we read along.

 

[james blunt]

If we stick my your definition of God, I don't see much reason to think about it, let alone worship it.

Exactly, those who want to pray , can pray inside their own minds like I do in a crisis. I think in hard times or loss by death etc, even the ''hardest'' of people look to the sky and ask for help.

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

Exactly, those who want to pray , can pray inside their own minds like I do in a crisis. I think in hard times or loss by death etc, even the ''hardest'' of people look to the sky and ask for help.

Well, if that helps you when you need consolation, who am I to judge how you get through it? What matters is that it helps you in a time of despair, and that's a beautiful thing.

 

[james blunt]

Well, if that helps you when you need consolation, who am I to judge how you get through it? What matters is that it helps you in a time of despair, and that's a beautiful thing.

I am not sure it helps any, but then sometimes I do think it helps sometimes because I get a bit of good Karma at the right time which is normally a bad time. Could be a coincidence I agree, but at times I feel like I am ''Truman''.

The Truman Show - Wikipedia

I have been thinking a lot lately , a person could only know there was no firmament , if one had been into space.


So to the thread title, should we believe or not believe anything unless it is proven to ourselves?

 

[FlyingTeaPot]

So to the thread title, should we believe or not believe anything unless it is proven to ourselves?

Well, then it would defeat the purpose of belief if you knew it to be true.

 

[james blunt]

Well, then it would defeat the purpose of belief if you knew it to be true.

Yes indeed, that is a question I pose that hopefully enlightens the audiences sense of understanding the difference in belief and knowing something.

 

[Revoltingest]

@YmirGF is the hero we need, but not the one we deserve. Because he can take it. He's a silent guardian. A watchful protector.

I imagine a movie....
"Guardians of the Forum"
Chris Pratt would play @YmirGF.

 

[Vinayaka]

One of the sweet ironies to videos like this is that in effect, they do the opposite of what is intended. Many more people are turned off than turned on, and the speakers don't even realise it.

 

[Revoltingest]

One of the sweet ironies to videos like this is that in effect, they do the opposite of what is intended. Many more people are turned off than turned on, and the speakers don't even realise it.

The common mistake when proselyting is to pontificate from one's own perspective.
But the other side's is based upon very different assumptions. Thus, there's no
meeting of the minds. Ya gotta think of your audience. The most successful
approach is to first try to understand the other, & then reason from common ground.
("Success" is defined as both conversationalists finding it interesting.)

 

[Vinayaka]

The common mistake when proselyting is to pontificate from one's own perspective.
But the other side's is based upon very different assumptions. Thus, there's no
meeting of the minds. Ya gotta think of your audience. The most successful
approach is to first try to understand the other, & then reason from common ground.
("Success" is defined as both conversationalists finding it interesting.)

All mouth and no ears.

 

[A Vestigial Mote]

Straw man is assuming someone’s position wrongly... I did it right!

It’s been interesting. I think this atheist in the video has made some of you quite uncomfortable.

@LuisDantas said it perfectly when he stated "But the video sure is unrepresentative either way." That's all that needs said really. There are plenty of moments in the video where an atheist who has thought with any sort of depth about the reasons for his/her atheism could have easily taken the Muslim to task. But instead the Muslim got completely unequal face-time and the atheist just sat there like a lump, nodding his head and saying "yes" for long periods. I would definitely not accept this guy as any kind of "representative" for atheism. Just as you wouldn't accept some wishy-washy Muslim as your representative. It's an extremely simple matter - no difficulty presents itself here - as much as you seem to want to instill it.

I mean, 5.5 mins. into the video, the Muslim is getting the "atheist" to admit that he "holds the belief that atheism is true." The wording of that statement alone is complete and utter nonsense. I don't "believe that atheism is true" - there is nothing there to believe IN. I DO NOT BELIEVE in God - that's all. The "atheist" in the video doesn't even appear to grasp the definition of "atheism." And you're going to tell me it seems fair to state that a discussion against the viewpoints of such an individual was "successful?" That's like going out on a candy-run and claiming it was a huge success after having stolen it all from babies.

 

[YmirGF]

It would be more interesting if you debate an atheist here and we read along.

*looks up from sharpening his fangs*

I'd be quite happy to have a respectful discussion with @Mohsen on the very topic. Mohsen?

 

[LuisDantas]

As-salamu alaykum

Every person on the planet has to believe in God

Defining God - The origin of the Universe.

It is not a belief that the Universe began, it is fact, everyone has to accept God, then stop arguing the semantics. God needs no description or falsifiable testament, God is the origin of the Universe, simple acceptance for all, even atheists.

With all due respect, that is simply wrong.

 

[stvdv]

I'd be quite happy to have a respectful discussion with @Mohsen on the very topic. Mohsen?

I look forward for this event to happen. Mohsen brought up a very good point. First "to believe or not", Next "what to believe". Good order

 

[stvdv]

With all due respect, that is simply wrong.

Agreed. And also proofs that this above mentioned discussion "to believe or not" is still needed. Go for it @YmirGF: + @Mohsen: