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To any Atheists, I Have a Few Scenarios for you to Look At.

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by DarkSun, Oct 24, 2009.

  1. DarkSun

    DarkSun :eltiT

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    2,838
    Imagine these scenarios:

    1 - You're a native American living freely in Europe. One night, you have a dream about white men coming to your land in big ships. The dream turns bleak. You dream of sickness, of disease, of death, of pain all because of the white men. When you wake up, you were so sure that the dream was real - but when you tell your elders they automatically console you... and tell you that such a thing will never happen, and that it was all a figment of your imagination. You keep believing what you saw to be true, and eventually everyone around you gives up on you as being deluded. Prove that the girl's dream was wrong.

    2 - You're living in England in the 1750s. You have a firm view in mind that all swans are white. Someone then travels to Australia fifty years later and sends you back a letter telling you that they saw a black swan. But this can't be true. Swans are white. Your friend is obviously lying because black swans clearly don't exist, as you've never seen one yourself before. Prove that the man was lying.

    3 - You're walking passed a church one day. The year is 2010 and your life is going pretty darn well. Suddenly, a small child strolls out and asks you why you're not inside. Not believing in a God of any kind, you smile to the boy and say you don't belong there. The boy frowns and walks back inside. You sigh. That poor child is being brainwashed. He's deluded and his parents are feeding lies to him. Prove this to be true.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2009
  2. Smoke

    Smoke Done here.

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    19,902
    Oh, wow. I see now that if I can't prove a negative, I can't be an atheist. It's so obvious! And if anybody's belief or testimony has ever been doubted, and that person turned out to be right, it is obvious that the beliefs and testimonies of believers are also right! I can't think why I didn't see it before! Hallelujah!
     
    Magic Man likes this.
  3. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora Staff Member Premium Member

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    56,367
    Religion:
    Erotic Dance
    It's 2000. You're walking along a street one day when a homeless person panhandles you. You refuse to give him any money, so he curses you, saying, "The next time you have sex, you'll catch a deadly pox." Consequently, you spend the rest of your life celibate in order to foil his curse. Prove that you weren't an idiot.
     
  4. nonbeliever_92

    nonbeliever_92 New Member

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    1,286

    :facepalm: How the hell do you propose someone "proves" a negative? It's not the perrogative of an atheist to "prove" that there isn't a god, nor is it necessary for one to do so. These are too weak to even be called strawmen. :rolleyes:
     
  5. dogsgod

    dogsgod New Member

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    3,872
    I don't believe theists have a clue. Prove me wrong.
     
  6. Kerr

    Kerr Well-Known Member

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    6,499
    Travel down to Australia and see for yourself :p.
     
  7. DarkSun

    DarkSun :eltiT

    Messages:
    2,838
    Not remotely what I was getting at, but nice strawman.

    I can't. And you can't disprove that some theists might be onto something. So everyone's on equal ground, really.


    How would someone prove a negative? Well you can't, can you? And it just so happens that in this case, the "positive" also can't be proven. So unless someone actually provides some scientific evidence one way or the other, both theists and atheists are equally justified in their views.

    What? Go down to Australia just to disprove something I know is wrong? What lunacy is this? :p
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2009
  8. Religionisus

    Religionisus New Member

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    13
    What about this:
    Atheists have a belief system which include:
    Enjoy life,
    Call every Christian crazy,
    Read the God delusion,

    So Atheism is a religion, so Atheists are being that what they hate, so they should kill themselves to get rid of their religion!

    :D
     
  9. Phasmid

    Phasmid Mr Invisible

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    2,282
    It's not a belief system at all... it's just a lack of belief in god. Militant atheists don't represent all atheists just as YEC don't represent all Christians.
     
  10. Religionisus

    Religionisus New Member

    Messages:
    13
    You sure about that?

    The Atheist Life:

    Fight Christians,
    Fight Religion,
    Enjoy life,
    Nothing is a sin, you can do whatever you want,
    Eat have sex 24/7 it doesn't matter,


    Really the atheist's way of living sounds like The Church of Satan's way of living and since some of them claim to be Atheists...it sounds like Atheists do have rules.

    Atheism is the belief of no Gods

    Belief= System of beliefs= Religion.

    Just face it...Religion will never die.
     
  11. Kerr

    Kerr Well-Known Member

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    6,499
    Actually you have no idea of what it means to be an atheist. Atheism is not more of a religion then theism is.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2009
    Shyanekh likes this.
  12. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora Staff Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    56,367
    Religion:
    Erotic Dance
    :biglaugh:
     
  13. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora Staff Member Premium Member

    Messages:
    56,367
    Religion:
    Erotic Dance

    Sorry if it's a strawman, but I don't see that yet. Could you explain why it's a strawman. I'm missing that.
     
  14. jamaesi

    jamaesi To Save A Lamb

    Messages:
    4,699
    Uh oh, looks like someone leaked a copy of the Atheist Agenda, people are catching on... y'all are gonna have to regroup and restrategize. :cover:
     
  15. Kerr

    Kerr Well-Known Member

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    6,499
    Nope, he got one of the fake agendas we use to confuse theists.
     
    Sunstone likes this.
  16. Ardeaa

    Ardeaa New Member

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    48
    Perhaps I'm a nitpicker, but this scenario itself is flawed. Perhaps you remember Black Elk, who had a similar vision? When he told his people,they not only took it seriously, but also undertook to "manifest" the vision through an elaborate ceremony. He was honored as a seer. Native Americans have always respected dreams and visions.
     
    Willamena likes this.
  17. themadhair

    themadhair New Member

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    2,486
    I too want to see how this is a strawman. Particularly given that you seemed unwilling to confront such analogies in previous treads.

    I can imagine OJ’s lawyer in court during his next case telling the jury that since they cannot disprove aliens involvement with the evidence they must acquit due to contaminated evidence. Thankfully our justice systems don’t work on the flawed principles of the OP’s logic.
     
  18. BucephalusBB

    BucephalusBB ABACABB

    Messages:
    6,448
    I don't get it.. Was it my dream or the girls dream? And who is that girl anyway?
    And why on earth would I keep telling others my dream if they all think it's just a dream anyway? Why would "what I believe" and "what I keep telling them" be the same?

    I have no need to prove him wrong, I don't care if he has a different belief from mine. Besides, it is just a swan. Beautifull creatures, but not interresting enough for me to discover the black swan. Whenever I see one I'll tell my friend he was right.

    I get the feeling that when you said "to any atheist...", you actually didn't mean me at all? :confused:
    I do not view the kid as poor and neither is he brainwashed. After all, at his age he could have been me running out of that church. His parents might be feeding lies, but I asume they are in that church as well and do not see it as lies. Furthermore, If I would need to prove anything to the boy, it would still mean I would have to get int hat church or wait for the boy to come back. Both are not interresting enough to spend my time on.

    Now I know I am only the first to really answer the questions, I am curious as to why you made them..
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2009
    DarkSun likes this.
  19. Willamena

    Willamena Just be there, doing that

    Messages:
    32,034
    Ooh! Is this like 2-Minute Mysteries?

    Nothing in her dream occured, so while "proof" lies in that piece of evidence that convinces, there is no evidence here that could convince.

    I like the suggestion to travel to Australia and find out for oneself. That would supply the needed piece of evidence.

    Apart from that I could never think those things, to prove a speculative opinion to be true would require entirely too much work (convincing the child's parents to allow the child to participate, getting licences and permits, hiring investigators and psychologists, devising and conducting empirical experiments), not to mention expensive.
     
  20. Willamena

    Willamena Just be there, doing that

    Messages:
    32,034
    Obviously you are a little girl in a past life in the scenario. :p
     
    BucephalusBB likes this.
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