Time to arm or to disarm?

[MrMrdevincamus]

Hmmm', in the year 2525 If man is still alive.....Well, Mr Zager and Evans it seems Chaos and violence is everywhere, but I am fairly sure we will be around for a few centuries. However, sometimes I wonder wtf is going on! Police being ambushed, police ambushing citizens etc. Kids blowing away kids, open war in the inner cities. Firefights by citizens vs Mexican drug cartels in border states. Even mother nature is dealing us formidable natural disasters that strain the ability of first responders and in some cases the bravery of the cops swore to protect and serve. Katrina and Compton provided examples of the latter, ie cops that did everything from running away when firefights threatened to erupt, to mass retreat when the firefights DID erupt, to those who turned a blind eye to beatings looting's and such*.

Also way back in time during the school shootings I noticed the police guys, many of who were nearly obese as me were taking a long time to move in. Instead they took cover and waited! I am no expert in urban combat but I do have some training in such things. The main objective when there are active shooters are involved is to neutralize the threat first. Now we have two hurricanes to add to the social unrest and all sorts of crap stirred up by unknown players (GEORGE SOROS etc) interested in changing the fundamental make up of our so called democratic republic. But this thread is about the American citizens right to keep and bear arms. The question is does the increase in social unrest and natural disasters etc influence anyone to buy a firearm or maybe all the violence would have one decide to disarm, because of being fed up with such things. Me? I just bought two new firearms and 200 rounds of ammo for each firearm I own ie an AR-15 two .38s a .44, a .45 1911, a 12 ga pump riot gun, ummm' a 30.06 Remington for trading. I would be comfy with just the .44 a .38 and the shotgun and AK. Most people that are pro firearm for defense would be protected with only a good 12 ga pump, unless complete urban Compton type war broke out imo.

I am not anti cop. I admire and respect most cops but the bad cops including cowards seem to be increasing in number during the last ten to fifteen years.

; {>

 

[Mister Silver]

Poll option C: No, and I personally own no firearms.

 

[MrMrdevincamus]

Poll option C: No, and I personally own no firearms.

Good for you! I respect your right to choose. I was anti-(personal carry) firearm until about age 32, the age that I was robbed of two dollars and smacked so hard with what is known as a sap that it spit my lip from chin to half way to the corner of my eye. The entire thing was made worse because I had my gf with me ! I managed to pull away even with two flat tires and my teeth in places they shouldn't be!

That said, I don't think most of the population will have to defend themselves with a firearm, but I am grateful to have the choice to own and to carry one. Btw, I drove for a half mile and pulled over while my gf called police. We waited over 20 min before deciding to drive to the hospital a few miles away on those flats. The cops never showed up.

I was just lucky I guess.

; {>

 

[Mister Silver]

Good for you! I respect your right to choose. I was anti-(personal carry) firearm until about age 32, the age that I was robbed of two dollars and smacked so hard with what is known as a sap that it spit my lip from chin to half way to the corner of my eye. The entire thing was made worse because I had my gf with me ! I managed to pull away even with two flat tires and my teeth in places they shouldn't be!

That said, I don't think most of the population will have to defend themselves with a firearm, but I am grateful to have the choice to own and to carry one. Btw, I drove for a half mile and pulled over while my gf called police. We waited over 20 min before deciding to drive to the hospital a few miles away on those flats. The cops never showed up.

I was just lucky I guess.

; {>

One night while leaving a bar, I only lived a few blocks away, I got mugged while walking. It was a two man operation; one man called to me from across the street as he crossed the road (it was probably 2 or 3 in the morning, so there was practically no traffic) while another man came up behind me and used a choke hold. I am not certain how long I was out, but it probably wasn't long. I woke up, got up off the ground, and ran home. It was the only time anything like that had ever happened to me, and the furthest thing from my mind was getting a firearm for personal protection.

 

[MrMrdevincamus]

One night while leaving a bar, I only lived a few blocks away, I got mugged while walking. It was a two man operation; one man called to me from across the street as he crossed the road (it was probably 2 or 3 in the morning, so there was practically no traffic) while another man came up behind me and used a choke hold. I am not certain how long I was out, but it probably wasn't long. I woke up, got up off the ground, and ran home. It was the only time anything like that had ever happened to me, and the furthest thing from my mind was getting a firearm for personal protection.

I can honestly say that is the first time I have heard of a thief using a choke hold to rob someone! You were lucky. That said I lost far more sleep worrying about the what if's concerning my girlfriend when I was robbed, or attempted to be robbed.However, even if she was not involved I still would have armed myself due to my up coming job as a vending route owner. To each his own, eh?

; {>

 

[columbus]

Time to Arm or to Disarm?
What a profoundly obvious use of the "fallacy of the excluded middle".
Tom

 

[YmirGF]

Poll option C: No, and I personally own no firearms.

Ditto. A good old fashioned roundhouse will usually make people think twice anyways.

Edit: Sorry, couldn't vote in the poll as it stands.
There are very useful forms of self-defense that do not require a weapon, beyond your body, that is.

 

[SalixIncendium]

I need an option D...No, and I need someone to help me find the lost key to my lock box so I can get my firearm out.

 

[sayak83]

Hmmm', in the year 2525 If man is still alive.....Well, Mr Zager and Evans it seems Chaos and violence is everywhere, but I am fairly sure we will be around for a few centuries. However, sometimes I wonder wtf is going on! Police being ambushed, police ambushing citizens etc. Kids blowing away kids, open war in the inner cities. Firefights by citizens vs Mexican drug cartels in border states. Even mother nature is dealing us formidable natural disasters that strain the ability of first responders and in some cases the bravery of the cops swore to protect and serve. Katrina and Compton provided examples of the latter, ie cops that did everything from running away when firefights threatened to erupt, to mass retreat when the firefights DID erupt, to those who turned a blind eye to beatings looting's and such*.

Also way back in time during the school shootings I noticed the police guys, many of who were nearly obese as me were taking a long time to move in. Instead they took cover and waited! I am no expert in urban combat but I do have some training in such things. The main objective when there are active shooters are involved is to neutralize the threat first. Now we have two hurricanes to add to the social unrest and all sorts of crap stirred up by unknown players (GEORGE SOROS etc) interested in changing the fundamental make up of our so called democratic republic. But this thread is about the American citizens right to keep and bear arms. The question is does the increase in social unrest and natural disasters etc influence anyone to buy a firearm or maybe all the violence would have one decide to disarm, because of being fed up with such things. Me? I just bought two new firearms and 200 rounds of ammo for each firearm I own ie an AR-15 two .38s a .44, a .45 1911, a 12 ga pump riot gun, ummm' a 30.06 Remington for trading. I would be comfy with just the .44 a .38 and the shotgun and AK. Most people that are pro firearm for defense would be protected with only a good 12 ga pump, unless complete urban Compton type war broke out imo.

I am not anti cop. I admire and respect most cops but the bad cops including cowards seem to be increasing in number during the last ten to fifteen years.

; {>

No, I won't buy or use a firearm unless I am going out in a wilderness or something.

 

[columbus]

.However, even if she was not involved I still would have armed myself due to my up coming job as a vending route owner. To each his own, eh?

Ya know, that's the kind of job where I can see having a weapon.
But there are options other than firearms. Tasers or mace might be better, since they are less lethal. Personally, I would be inclined to something where "Shoot first, ask questions later" was less likely to result in a homicide. Call me a hardcore ProLifer if you must.
But if you decided that a gun was your best option, I would want requirements for training and securing the weapon when you aren't on the job. I would be inclined to require proof that you have a government spec gun safe and a host of other measures to safeguard the gun itself.
Tom

 

[Nakosis]

Hmmm', in the year 2525 If man is still alive.....Well, Mr Zager and Evans it seems Chaos and violence is everywhere, but I am fairly sure we will be around for a few centuries. However, sometimes I wonder wtf is going on! Police being ambushed, police ambushing citizens etc. Kids blowing away kids, open war in the inner cities. Firefights by citizens vs Mexican drug cartels in border states. Even mother nature is dealing us formidable natural disasters that strain the ability of first responders and in some cases the bravery of the cops swore to protect and serve. Katrina and Compton provided examples of the latter, ie cops that did everything from running away when firefights threatened to erupt, to mass retreat when the firefights DID erupt, to those who turned a blind eye to beatings looting's and such*.

Also way back in time during the school shootings I noticed the police guys, many of who were nearly obese as me were taking a long time to move in. Instead they took cover and waited! I am no expert in urban combat but I do have some training in such things. The main objective when there are active shooters are involved is to neutralize the threat first. Now we have two hurricanes to add to the social unrest and all sorts of crap stirred up by unknown players (GEORGE SOROS etc) interested in changing the fundamental make up of our so called democratic republic. But this thread is about the American citizens right to keep and bear arms. The question is does the increase in social unrest and natural disasters etc influence anyone to buy a firearm or maybe all the violence would have one decide to disarm, because of being fed up with such things. Me? I just bought two new firearms and 200 rounds of ammo for each firearm I own ie an AR-15 two .38s a .44, a .45 1911, a 12 ga pump riot gun, ummm' a 30.06 Remington for trading. I would be comfy with just the .44 a .38 and the shotgun and AK. Most people that are pro firearm for defense would be protected with only a good 12 ga pump, unless complete urban Compton type war broke out imo.

I am not anti cop. I admire and respect most cops but the bad cops including cowards seem to be increasing in number during the last ten to fifteen years.

; {>

Our {US} founding fathers found it necessary to fight against tyranny and felt it necessary that this country's citizens be allowed to carry firearms in case they ever found it necessary to fight against a tyrannical authority again.

A government which outlaws firearms in effect has total control over its population. While we could hope in such a situation a government would remain benevolent towards its citizenry there's no guarantee. Obviously gun ownership is also no guarantee you will be able to protect your freedom, however without it you'd not even have the option to try.

So the question is whether you want the option to protect your freedom or give up that option it the hope that the ruling authority will continue to and be able to protect your freedoms for you.

Historically governments have turned tyrannical. In fact Plato, in his Republic, tells us that tyranny arises, as a rule, from democracy.

The founding fathers saw the need to allow the citizenship of this nation to bear firearms as a necessity to face this this eventuality.

 

[metis]

Believing that if everyone has a gun it would make us all safer is like believing that if we put more cars on the road traffic accidents will decrease.

 

[Stevicus]

Hmmm', in the year 2525 If man is still alive.....Well, Mr Zager and Evans it seems Chaos and violence is everywhere, but I am fairly sure we will be around for a few centuries. However, sometimes I wonder wtf is going on! Police being ambushed, police ambushing citizens etc. Kids blowing away kids, open war in the inner cities. Firefights by citizens vs Mexican drug cartels in border states. Even mother nature is dealing us formidable natural disasters that strain the ability of first responders and in some cases the bravery of the cops swore to protect and serve. Katrina and Compton provided examples of the latter, ie cops that did everything from running away when firefights threatened to erupt, to mass retreat when the firefights DID erupt, to those who turned a blind eye to beatings looting's and such*.

Also way back in time during the school shootings I noticed the police guys, many of who were nearly obese as me were taking a long time to move in. Instead they took cover and waited! I am no expert in urban combat but I do have some training in such things. The main objective when there are active shooters are involved is to neutralize the threat first. Now we have two hurricanes to add to the social unrest and all sorts of crap stirred up by unknown players (GEORGE SOROS etc) interested in changing the fundamental make up of our so called democratic republic. But this thread is about the American citizens right to keep and bear arms. The question is does the increase in social unrest and natural disasters etc influence anyone to buy a firearm or maybe all the violence would have one decide to disarm, because of being fed up with such things. Me? I just bought two new firearms and 200 rounds of ammo for each firearm I own ie an AR-15 two .38s a .44, a .45 1911, a 12 ga pump riot gun, ummm' a 30.06 Remington for trading. I would be comfy with just the .44 a .38 and the shotgun and AK. Most people that are pro firearm for defense would be protected with only a good 12 ga pump, unless complete urban Compton type war broke out imo.

I am not anti cop. I admire and respect most cops but the bad cops including cowards seem to be increasing in number during the last ten to fifteen years.

; {>

I think the police are able to handle most threats that are out there, but I have nothing against those who feel the need for more protection. The police can't be everywhere at once, so it might take some time for them to respond to a call for help.

Statistically, however, crime has been going down in recent decades, so it's nowhere near as bad out there as it used to be. Even the cartel wars in Mexico have subsided considerably.

In the event of gangs or social unrest or some kind of disaster, an individual (however well-armed) is still just an individual against a group (which would also likely be well-armed).

 

[columbus]

A government which outlaws firearms in effect has total control over its population.

That was true 200 years ago.
But if I were going to take over the country, I would prefer a dozen computer hackers over a dozen sharpshooters any day.
Tom

 

[Shiranui117]

Ditto. A good old fashioned roundhouse will usually make people think twice anyways.

Edit: Sorry, couldn't vote in the poll as it stands.
There are very useful forms of self-defense that do not require a weapon, beyond your body, that is.

I will note that that is a spinning hook kick, not a roundhouse.

 

[Stevicus]

That was true 200 years ago.
But if I were going to take over the country, I would prefer a dozen computer hackers over a dozen sharpshooters any day.
Tom

Or maybe a dozen nuclear engineers.

 

[MrMrdevincamus]

I need an option D...No, and I need someone to help me find the lost key to my lock box so I can get my firearm out.

Anyone can comment I should have made an third option entitled 'other' so now its official. As for your comment I think technology is coming to the rescue of lockable firearms. I am sure that soon firearms will be able to recognize the owner before it can be used.

; {>

 

[BSM1]

Ditto. A good old fashioned roundhouse will usually make people think twice anyways.

Edit: Sorry, couldn't vote in the poll as it stands.
There are very useful forms of self-defense that do not require a weapon, beyond your body, that is.

Good point. But those of my age and above would worry more about breaking a hip than a jaw. I think I'll just take my chances with my friends, Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Believing that if everyone has a gun it would make us all safer is like believing that if we put more cars on the road traffic accidents will decrease.

False equivalence. The primary purpose of a car is to commute from destination to destination. The primary use of a firearm is to disable a being by force.

 

[columbus]

Or maybe a dozen nuclear engineers.

Or a dozen advertising experts.
The modern world is so different from the one that the Constitution was written in that I cannot be a strict Constitutionalist.
The Founding Fathers were well meaning(somewhat) , but they weren't omnimax. I don't see the Constitution as Holy Writ, the way some people do(when it suits them).
Tom