Those with christian backgrounds

[neversilence]

Hay, it's okay. I'm facing the same situation as you at this moment. All I can say is that eventually it will be okay... She'll still look down on us and love us, even if we have doubts for a momenta! ^_^

 

[kutulu]

i have always saw the flaws in christian beleifs...

at about age 14 i abandoned them in search of the truth...

 

[Nisou Kitsune]

As George Carlin said: "I was Catholic until I reached the age of Reason."

 

[kutulu]

being catholic is pagan enough. lol. they have an endless number of saints.

 

[Astravalon]

I was wondering for those of you who were brought up as christians how long did it take you to stop thinking that you might be going to hell? Well not hell excatly but to....get past what you were taught & move on with something that's a completly different.

I was still a Christian when I became convinced that there was no hell (at least, in the mainstream sense of endless torment). I then became what's known as a Christian Universalist, which is a Christian who believes everyone will be saved. So, being a Christian and not believing in hell is doable, though it's not considered "orthodox" and won't exactly gain popularity points at church, lol!

Bottom line, though, is that the same bible Christians use to support "hell" can also be used to support the notion of a deity who doesn't need to resort to something so... cruel? .... to solve His problems.

As to the 2nd part of your question regarding moving on to something different, a recent debate (on another forum) served as a catalyst of sorts that led me to reconsider my belief that the bible doesn't contain contradictions. I won't bore you with the details here, but, for the time being anyway, I'm having a hard time considering myself "Christian". I bowed out of that debate because I could feel myself actually slipping into a different belief-category that would have disqualified me from posting in that part (a "Christians Only" section) of the form, lol!




,

 

[Nisou Kitsune]

Iridescence, I would love to hear about that debate and I am absolutely positive that the people here wont be bored with it. We are religious junkies after all

 

[Astravalon]

Iridescence, I would love to hear about that debate and I am absolutely positive that the people here wont be bored with it. We are religious junkies after all

Okay, well, here's an overview of what transpired.

My 'eureka moment' came during an online debate about whether or not Christians today are required to adhere to the Commandments. I pointed out to them that if one is going to legalistically adhere to the Commandments, they need to remember that there were hundreds more than just the 10 that most people think about. Plus, according to the Bible (James 2:10), anyone who tries to live by the law and messes up on even one point is guilty of breaking all of it. Besides that, the Bible states that Jesus came to fulfill the law Himself, and Paul later states that the law has been abolished (makes sense, it having been fulfilled already by Christ). For some reason, none of this swayed the pro-law folks.

Then, in a completely unrelated discussion, someone asked about Jeremiah 8:8, which states,

"'How can you say, "We are wise, for we have the law of the LORD," when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?’”
​

That one blew me away. Now, not only are people insisting we still keep the commandments today, but Scripture seems to be saying that whatever it is that we think are “the commandments” were tampered with by the very scribes who wrote them down. Add to that the whole translation-process over hundreds of years and that just makes things even more ... interesting.

I decided to bring Jeremiah 8:8 up in the debate I was involved with. The response I got was along the lines of “Oh, that’s not what Jeremiah 8:8 is saying!” No, Jeremiah 8:8 supposedly is talking about how the people don’t obey. Well, yeah, it’s hard to obey laws that have been misrepresented by the scribes.

At any rate, I began to suspect that there may be contradictions in scripture when I took into consideration James 2:10 and other parts of James regarding the law. James 2:24 (“You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.”) contradicts Romans 3:28 (“For we maintain that a man is justified by faith apart from observing the law.”) and Ephesians 2:8-9 (“8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast.”).

Up to this point I believed that the Bible was inerrant and that any perceived contradictions were the result of my misinterpreting the text, but I'm getting somewhat tired of trying to reconcile verses, at least in the sight of others who are unwilling to consider a different way of interpreting them. While I still think the Bible contains wisdom, I'm not so willing to elevate it above other sacred texts right now, especially since there are so many ways it can be interpreted.

I guess I reached my saturation point with all that, lol! I'm not too worried, though, because as a Christian I believe God has everyone's back -- I'm something of a "heretic" in Christian circles as I believe in universal salvation (Christian universalism). This alone has gone a long way in helping me chill and not feel that "right" or "wrong" belief will doom me (or anyone else) to endless post-mortem misery.

That said, though, I'm not really comfortable calling myself a "Christian" right now. "Universalist", most definitely, but the whole "Christian" thing, eh.... not so much.

.

 

[Nisou Kitsune]

This argument is an interesting one, however it has been around a while. Most of the pagans I know have converted from some type of Christian background, be it Baptist, Catholic, or another branch, and most of them converted because of some disenfranchised feeling towards the philosophies.

Take me for example. I was Roman Catholic before I converted to Paganism. Not only does my feminist beliefs clash with the beliefs of the church, but there are numerous examples as to how priests and clergy men have soiled their religion. Pedophiles, anyone?

No, not every priest is a pedophile, and not, not every priest deviates from the Bible, but my favorite pastor, and every pastor thereafter, have blatantly went against the book. Why be a Catholic if even the holy men dont follow the "rules"?

However, this place in the forum is not a place to debate ideology of other religions. DIR forums are there for seekers and those with questions. If you want to continue this discussion, we can move this to the Debate section.

 

[Astravalon]

This argument is an interesting one, however it has been around a while. Most of the pagans I know have converted from some type of Christian background, be it Baptist, Catholic, or another branch, and most of them converted because of some disenfranchised feeling towards the philosophies.

Take me for example. I was Roman Catholic before I converted to Paganism. Not only does my feminist beliefs clash with the beliefs of the church, but there are numerous examples as to how priests and clergy men have soiled their religion. Pedophiles, anyone?

No, not every priest is a pedophile, and not, not every priest deviates from the Bible, but my favorite pastor, and every pastor thereafter, have blatantly went against the book. Why be a Catholic if even the holy men dont follow the "rules"?

I hear ya! I was raised Catholic before switching over to a nondenominational church.

However, this place in the forum is not a place to debate ideology of other religions. DIR forums are there for seekers and those with questions. If you want to continue this discussion, we can move this to the Debate section.

That's okay... my previous post was just by way of background. I'm all debated out and am in something of a Seeker mode myself now.

.

 

[Nisou Kitsune]

We are always friendly here in the Pagan board and welcome everyone.

I hope you stick around RF and share your opinions and beliefs. I look forward to it.

 

[Luminous]

The Idea of Hell bothered me about as much as the idea of voidness and of Heaven and of Venus and Mercury, and of a cows body. they were places where the real me simply wasn't.