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"They shall say 'Lo Here and Lo There', believe them NOT, nor follow them - Luke 17:23

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Magdalene, Feb 24, 2021.

  1. Magdalene

    Magdalene New Member

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    Christians these days are still as the Men of Galilee - still gazing up to heaven - the skies, waiting for Jesus.

    Acts 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

    Cosmic News Flash!! -
    If Jesus was returning physically, the two men in white apparel had no reason to ask them why they were gazing up to heaven.

    Acts 1:11 is the nexus in the Bible from knowing Jesus physically to knowing him spiritually -
    "Christ in you the HOPE OF GLORY" - Colossians 1:27

    The manner he left physically was in Ascension -
    Is he in Ascension in you?

    Is the "Daystar arising IN YOUR HEART"? - II Peter 2:19
     
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  2. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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  3. Magdalene

    Magdalene New Member

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  4. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    Sunrise123 is just pointing out the passages and has said before he isn't a Christian. He's not waiting for Jesus.

    I thought your first post had some interesting points. What is your answer to NT quotes that say to continue to wait for Jesus to return?
     
  5. Magdalene

    Magdalene New Member

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    Give me your favorite one. Just one.
     
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  6. Brickjectivity

    Brickjectivity Veteran Member
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    I don't have a favorite one, and I don't intend to attack your belief. We are all in this together, stuck with the same problems and solutions. I will look a passage up on blueletterbible or more if I see more. I'm curious about how you would handle this, you specifically. I never said I disagreed with you.

    "Be patient, then, brothers and sisters, until the Lord's coming. See how the farmer waits for the land to yield its valuable crop, patiently waiting for the autumn and spring rains. You too, be patient and stand firm, because the Lord's coming is near." (NIV James 5:7-8)

    By the way my favorite translation is usually the original NIV, by the way. I view some of its dynamic translation as a downside. I think its good to be familiar with other translations which are less dynamic such as the RV or KJV, because they often us the same English word for a given Hebrew word or Greek word...which sometimes helps to tie things together which have been obscurred in dynamic translation. A dynamic translation, however, can be more readable and understandable and sometimes gets things across which might be missed in a word for word translation.
     
  7. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.

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    Makes me wonder how Paul got past the loophole in light of Luke 17:23
     
  8. halbhh

    halbhh The wonder and awe of "all things".

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    Both fit the text, and instead of arguing it's only one or the other, we can consider it is both.

    Ala --

    "...knowing this first of all, that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own sinful desires. They will say, “Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation.”
    ...
    But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.
    Bible Gateway passage: 2 Peter 3 - English Standard Version

    This makes sense: God would not be constrained by time, or our timelines....

    A billion years to Him might be like merely walking from one room into another, just...not a barrier or problem for Him.
     
  9. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

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    They looked to heaven, because Jesus was just taken up, and a cloud received him out of their sight, as acts 1:9 says. They were not watching and waiting for Jesus to come back.
     
  10. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    No. I believe that the "Christ" is the same as the "Avatar" who returns again and again. And I believe that the 'thief in the night' refers to Him being ignored when he came a few decades ago to usher in the Satyuga/New Humanity.
     
  11. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    Actually, they asked him if he was restoring the Kingdom to Israel at this time....they knew he was going to do that...but not when. Which is why he told them to wait in Jerusalem for the answer.

    Acts 1:6-11 says...."So when they had assembled, they asked him: “Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time? . . . .while they were looking on, he was lifted up and a cloud caught him up from their sight. 10 And as they were gazing into the sky while he was on his way, suddenly two men in white garments stood beside them 11 and said: “Men of Galʹi·lee, why do you stand looking into the sky? This Jesus who was taken up from you into the sky will come in the same manner as you have seen him going into the sky.”

    If the way he left was the way he would return.....how did he leave? Was it a public event with onlookers? Were there trumpets, fanfare or some kind of celestial or natural phenomena like an earthquake such as occurred at his death? Or did he just rise into the clouds and disappear?

    Clouds in the Bible can be a metaphor for concealment. It is my belief that Jesus was raised as a spirit being, (1 Peter 3:18) back to the form he had before his Father sent him on his mission. He has always been God's Logos (spokesman) so I believe that he has been interacting with humans all through the OT, just never named.

    Having been raised "in the spirit", after his resurrection, he was able to materialize in human form, but he did not always "appear" in the same body. Most of the time his disciples did not recognize him. On the occasion of Thomas' doubting, he produced a body with the woulds of his execution. But at other times there was no mention of them. On another occasion he was dining with them, and he disappeared right before their eyes.

    Concerning his promised return Jesus gave his apostles a "sign" to let them know when it had taken place. (Matthew 24:3) If it was a similar situation to his departure, then it would not be with anything else to indicate that it had taken place. The world at large would be unaware...only his true disciples would be aware of it.

    Those not 'keeping on the watch' for his return would be caught unawares.....
    Matthew 24:43-44....
    "But know one thing: If the householder had known in what watch the thief was coming, he would have kept awake and not allowed his house to be broken into. 44 On this account, you too prove yourselves ready, because the Son of man is coming at an hour that you do not think to be it."

    Jesus will manifest himself as judge of the "sheep" and the "goats" in due time.....but he has been here since he was installed as King, and the "last days" of this world began. He has been guiding and directing his disciples in the work he told them to do. (Matthew 24:14; Matthew 28:19-20)

    The binding and abyssing of satan was his first act as King. The cleansing of the heavens will be followed by a cleansing of the earth....but for now the devil and his hordes are very busy....and their time is running out.

    Revelation 12:7-12...
    "And war broke out in heaven: Miʹcha·el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled 8 but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them any longer in heaven. 9 So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. 10 I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

    Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God! 11 And they conquered him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the word of their witnessing, and they did not love their souls even in the face of death. 12 On this account be glad, you heavens and you who reside in them! Woe for the earth and for the sea, because the Devil has come down to you, having great anger, knowing that he has a short period of time.”


    So the devil is confined to the earth right now and intensifying his efforts to wreak havoc wherever he can. His time is almost up and he is pulling out all the stops. He is no longer subtle in his approach.....he is in all our faces. Violence...immorality and the supernatural....all now saturating our world in reality and in our entertainment.....and all in the kind of graphic detail that is meant to desensitize us. Look at what kids do for entertainment these days.....fed a steady diet of violence, bloodshed and supernatural villains.

    Add to that what he did to Job and you have a reason for all the tragedy and sickness in this world.

    How much of the earth is satan not misleading? (1 John 5:19)
     
  12. whosetosay...

    whosetosay... Member

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