1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured There is no evidence for God, so why do you believe?

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Xavier Graham, May 9, 2022.

  1. Sheldon

    Sheldon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2021
    Messages:
    10,825
    Ratings:
    +7,130
    Religion:
    None

    The same one you seem determined to ignore, that your claim the bible is a reliable source, is contradicted by the fact that there are 45k different Christian sects and denominations, all claiming their interpretation is the correct one, and so like you, they know what it means.
     
  2. Sheldon

    Sheldon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2021
    Messages:
    10,825
    Ratings:
    +7,130
    Religion:
    None
    It doesn't matter, if the bible were as you claimed, a reliable source, it could hardly produce 45k different sects and denominations all claiming to know best what it means.

    So your interpretation is unreliable then, or are you not a man? :rolleyes: You seem very determined to tap dance around the point here, but your ludicrous arguments just appear ever more desperate.
     
  3. ElishaElijah

    ElishaElijah Return

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2021
    Messages:
    6,027
    Ratings:
    +607
    Religion:
    Believer
    #3320 Name the differences and test those differences against the Bible and see which is unreliable, the Bible or the denomination.
    That’s seems the way to go, that would be a proper test.
    All you’re saying is the Bible is unreliable because people see it different, that’s not a test or a valid conclusion.
     
  4. Sheldon

    Sheldon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2021
    Messages:
    10,825
    Ratings:
    +7,130
    Religion:
    None
    I have explained multiple times that the difference is irrelevant and why. How hard can this be to grasp?

    One more try then, even if one of those 45k could demonstrate their version was true, and the other 44999 incorrect, it would still be the case that 45k differing conclusions indicated an unreliable source.
     
  5. ElishaElijah

    ElishaElijah Return

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2021
    Messages:
    6,027
    Ratings:
    +607
    Religion:
    Believer
    My interpretation of Scripture still stands up unless you can dispute what I’ve said with Scripture.
    Since you don’t know or understand Scripture, cannot determine what the differences are between denominations to see if the Bible is unreliable, the denomination is off and contradicting the Scriptures or they just have different preferences then another Body of believers and use a different name but believe the same things.
    So instead of avoiding these how about I give you some time for reflection.
     
  6. Sheldon

    Sheldon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2021
    Messages:
    10,825
    Ratings:
    +7,130
    Religion:
    None
    45k different sects and denominations hardly suggests a reliable source, not to any objective observer. No matter how many times you repeat the claim, it remains refuted by that evidence.
     
  7. Sheldon

    Sheldon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2021
    Messages:
    10,825
    Ratings:
    +7,130
    Religion:
    None
    That's exactly what anyone from any of the other 44999 sects or denominations will say, and it still doesn't matter of course.

    That's your opinion, and still irrelevant, as the 45k different sects and denominations is evidence the bible is not a reliable source. One need not have read it at all to see this simple fact.

    I haven't avoided them, i have tried to help you understand why they are irrelevant to the point being made, as have many others, so far you don't seem to understand what is being said, or why.

    Lets try a hypothetical:

    I don't believe any of the 45k is right obviously, but for the sake of argument lets say one of them could establish themselves as correct and the others all wrong, this wouldn't make the bible a reliable source, since 44999 different and incorrect conclusions had also been derived from it.
     
  8. ElishaElijah

    ElishaElijah Return

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2021
    Messages:
    6,027
    Ratings:
    +607
    Religion:
    Believer
    Let me give you an FYI and will leave you with this: This is my view and what I believe and know the Bible teaches
    There are 2 groups of people, Believers in Christ,’people born again and going to Heaven and Unbelievers who reject Jesus Christ and going to Hell, eternally separated from God.
    That’s my view and The end. Thanks and see you on another thread.
     
  9. Sheldon

    Sheldon Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2021
    Messages:
    10,825
    Ratings:
    +7,130
    Religion:
    None
    That has no relevance to the point at all. You claimed the bible is a reliable source, yet there are 45k different sects and denominations of Christians, which suggests the opposite. Saying "the end" is no more compelling an argument than claiming to believe you are right, and the others wrong.

    It is demonstrably not reliable to an objective observer.
     
  10. rational experiences

    rational experiences Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2020
    Messages:
    10,469
    Ratings:
    +630
    Religion:
    spiritualist
    The history of a natural man first without any book.

    Is natural first. Exact human position by thinking I claim dominion over everything.

    Why?

    I owned dominion naturally as the eternal being who held by my song then caused exploded a part of my own eternal living status. Gone forever space now divided us.

    Burnt creation the losses.

    Karmic consequence. I hence then inherited causes. By leaving the eternal myself as burning created self creation as it refilled in space.

    By gas spirit.

    So I know spirit body was first. As spirit burnt got put back. The refill.
    Spirit body as mass changed.

    In science the sleeping burnt spirit I evilly manifested when I reburnt it in machine conversions then cooled it.

    So I gave myself all evidence.

    I once had caused creation. I inherited dominion as the creator by human form is exact advice.

    However I don't create from my human position. I only destroy.

    So I imposed a legal system that said what God had created no man is allowed to change.

    As I prove I personally wanted to leave earth by metal mass and penis of man designs. Thought only first. Inferred I want to leave earth.

    So he built a metal machine applied a mass reaction to equals heavens gas then reacted burning up heavens gas too. Exact teaching warned.

    As above so below my confession.

    A book is written by a human thinking.

    Natural says a thinker existed a long time naturally before any man human did.

    No words.

    Natural is natural..no words.

    Just a man who used lots and lots of human words to give any natural body a hu man's description.

    By man's words only.

    First word use does not make you God.

    Then by use of words you imply how to calculate numbers.

    Notice numbers are not letters or words first?

    Then after attacked sacrificed by earth God and heavens god. You wrote all of your says. Saying.

    So you used an angle being a letter. Which you said I give the letter a human applied number factor.
    As by medium I heard voices speaking. Words.

    Not sensible words.

    So I proved a human just a man as a theist thinker scientist by evaluation myself that the calculus did it.

    By first using O. Circle giving it a number was all just in his head first... then applied calculus.

    Phi fell out not as Phi but as changes to a mass heavens that was never Phi.

    It was the sign I caused as proof life attacked.

    As Phi was only in my head first. Not physical.

    Why I proved as a biological owner DNA human that I did it to myself.

    No man is God. My human teaching.

    Why my own word use in an illogical strange confession said so. Written testimony.

    Voice...images...visions...fake vision stories. Actually just data and not the words. The words by letters allowed the number evaluation to prove myself wrong.

    Bible was against the theist human destroyers. Man's self contradiction by legal testimony of proof.

    Isn't any other type of book.
     
  11. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790

    No high level Christian, priest, pastor, NT scholar makes those ridiculous claims. But first, it isn't hard to understand simple savior demigod myths and the theology associated. Understanding the myths doesn't make them real anyways. I could say you don't understand the Lord of the Rings but Tolkiens ghost comes to me and teaches me the true meaning. It's still fiction and so is scripture.

    But if you insist you have some communication with a deity then please, communicate with it. Tell me my name and the town I live in. I have a 14 digit number from pi you can also have the spirit tell you.
    Otherwise save it, I don't believe you unless you have evidence.

    But also if you need God to explain scripture then please, go to biblegateway and demonstrate how your understanding differers from experts who give commentaries on scripture. The we can write to the authors and claim you have a better understanding because God explains it to you directly. Even though it's all completely understood just fine? Your claims of God communication are no different than any other person claiming to be speaking to a supernatural entity. ZERO evidence when needed.






    Wow, another? Since the last article you posted was a literal lie?? Voltaire did not say that on his death bed and the article completely lied, disrespected his last words and rather than do what a good person would do, try and make that right, you just post more lies? You didn't write to the apologetics site and ask for an explanation why they are spreading lies. It didn't seem to bother you at all misrepresenting someone, telling a lie, you just move on to the next.

    As to his prediction. By 2050 in the U.S. Islam will outnumber Christians. Eventually that will be the world.

    "Muslim population growth is the population growth of Muslims worldwide. Between 2015 and 2060, Muslim population is projected to increase by 70%."
     
  12. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790
    Evidence says so.
     
  13. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790


    HA HA HA HA HA! IS this a joke about how bad apologetics are? I was wondering why the "claims" were nonsense? It's because it's an apologist with no credentials literally making stuff up:


    J. Warner Wallace
    J. Warner Wallace is a Dateline featured cold-case homicide detective, popular national speaker and best-selling author. He continues to consult on cold-case investigations while serving as a Senior Fellow at the Colson Center for Christian Worldview. He is also an Adj. Professor of Christian Apologetics at Talbot School of Theology, Biola University, and a faculty member at Summit Ministries. He holds a BA in Design (from CSULB), an MA in Architecture (from UCLA), and an MA in Theological Studies (from Gateway Seminary)."


    Christianity is a combination of Hellenism and Persian myths. A bad apologetics article that doesn't understand the debate doesn't change that.

    Wow, I actually thought you knew better than this? There is a PhD historical field. Outside of that field you get crank like Ceasers Messiah, an investigative piece on how evidence shows Jesus was a creation of 3rd century Rome. It's convincing. Until you hear a Biblical historical scholar speak on it. It's total crank. As is this desperate apologetics either making stuff up or using Google?


    The wise men are not part of the Osirus myth but they were believed to be Persian until Christian scholars admitted they probably didn't really exist -

    "Furthermore, most biblical scholars pooh-pooh the idea that the magi were historical at all. The Catholic Bible scholar Raymond Brown, in his monumental study, The Birth of the Messiah notes that it was a mark of modernist orthodoxy not to believe in the historicity of the magi story. Confronted with exotic wizards, magical stars, angelic messengers and a mystical trek across the desert, the modernist deconstructionist biblical experts were more scoffers than scholars. The deemed the Magi’s quest to be not only mystical, but mythical. The magi were wonderful wizards conjured up to make baby Jesus seem more special."
    he went to study theology at Oxford University and was ordained a an Anglican minister in England. In 1995 Fr. Dwight and his family were received into the Catholic Church.
    Were the Three Wise Men History or Myth?


    The eucharist is from Greek religions, adopted by CHristianity.
    The Relationship between Hellenistic Mystery Religions and Early Christianity:

    A Case Study using Baptism and Eucharist

    Jennifer Uzzell
    "
    Eucharist.

    -Perhaps the clearest point of contact between the Mysteries and Christian Eucharist, and one of which the Church Fathers were painfully conscious, lay in a sacramental meal of bread or cakes and wine mixed with water in which initiates to the cult of Mithras participated.

    They seek salvation from the debased material world through a spiritual ascent through the spheres. Mithras was expected to return to earth to lead his followers in a final cataclysmic battle between good and evil.

    -The Mithraic sacramental meal almost certainly predates Christianity and cannot, therefore, be contingent upon it.

    -It seems likely that there was dialogue, friendly or otherwise, between the groups which led to ideological growth and development in both; with Christianity increasingly appropriating the language and ritual of the Cults in what it eventually came to refer to as the μυστηριον (mystery) of the Eucharist.



    It is beyond doubt that substantial similarities exist between the rituals of baptism and Eucharist and the various sacral meals and initiations practised within the Mystery religions. These similarities extend beyond the forms of the rituals themselves into the purpose, symbolism and function of the rituals.

    Pagan commentators such as Celsus and Lucian also clearly regarded Christianity as one of the Mysteries; with Lucian making use of Mystery terminology referring to Christianity as a καινη τελετε (literally a ‘new initiation’)."




    Every dying-and-rising god is different. Every death is different. Every resurrection is different. All irrelevant. The commonality is that there is a death and a resurrection. Everything else is a mixture of syncretized ideas from the borrowing and borrowed cultures, to produce a new and unique god and myth.
    Within the confines of what was then the Roman Empire, long before and during the dawn of Christianity, there were many dying-and-rising gods. And yes, they were gods—some even half-god, half-human, being of divine or magical parentage, just like Jesus (John 1:1-18; Matthew 1:18-25; Luke 1:26-35; Philippians 2:6-8 & Romans 8:3). And yes, they died. And were dead. And yes, they were then raised back to life; and lived on, even more powerful than before. Some returned in the same body they died in; some lived their second life in even more powerful and magical bodies than they died in, like Jesus did (1 Corinthians 15:35-50 & 2 Corinthians 5:1-10). Some left empty tombs or gravesites; or had corpses that were lost or vanished. Just like Jesus. Some returned to life on “the third day” after dying. Just like Jesus. All went on to live and reign in heaven (not on earth). Just like Jesus. Some even visited earth after being raised, to deliver a message to disciples or followers, before ascending into the heavens. Just like Jesus.


    Is what the google version says.
    Not only does Plutarch say Osiris returned to life and was recreated, exact terms for resurrection (anabiôsis and paliggenesia: On Isis and Osiris 35; see my discussion in The Empty Tomb, pp. 154-55), and also describe his physically returning to earth after his death (Plutarch, On Isis and Osiris 19), but the physical resurrection of Osiris’s corpse is explicitly described in pre-Christian pyramid inscriptions! Osiris was also resurrected, according to Plutarch, on the “third day,” and died during a full moon, just like Christ: Passover occurs during the full moon; and in Plutarch, On Isis and Osiris 39 and 42, Osiris dies on the 17th of Athyr, the concluding day of the full moon, and is raised on the 19th, two days later—thus three days inclusively, just like Jesus.

    Plutarch writes that “Osiris came to Horus from the other world and exercised and trained him for the battle,” and taught him lessons, and then “Osiris consorted with Isis after his death and she became the mother of Harpocrates.” It’s hard to get more explicit than that. Contrary to Ehrman, there is no mention of Osiris not being in his resurrected body at that point. To the contrary, every version of his myth has him revive only after Isis reassembles and reanimates his corpse. As Plutarch says, “the soul of Osiris is everlasting and imperishable, but his body Typhon oftentimes dismembers and causes to disappear, and that Isis wanders hither and yon in her search for it, and fits it together again” (On Isis and Osiris 54).
     
  14. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790

    cont.....


    And indeed, carved on the walls of the pyramids centuries before Christianity began were the declarations of the goddess Isis (or Horus, or their agents), “I have come to thee…that I may revivify thee, that I may assemble for thee thy bones, that I may collect for thee thy flesh, that I may assemble for thee thy dismembered limbs…raise thyself up, king, [as for] Osiris; thou livest!” (Pyramid Texts 1684a-1685a and 1700, = Utterance 606; cf. Utterance 670); “Raise thyself up; shake off thy dust; remove the dirt which is on thy face; loose thy bandages!” (Pyramid Texts 1363a-b, = Utterance 553); “[As for] Osiris, collect thy bones; arrange thy limbs; shake off thy dust; untie thy bandages; the tomb is open for thee; the double doors of the coffin are undone for thee; the double doors of heaven are open for thee…thy soul is in thy body…raise thyself up!” (Pyramid Texts 207b-209a and 2010b-2011a, = Utterance 676). That sure sounds like a physical resurrection of Osiris’s body to me. (As even confirmed by the most recent translation of James P. Allen, cf. pp. 190, 224-25, 272. The spells he clarifies are sung to and about the resident Pharaoh, but in the role of Osiris, receiving the same resurrection as Osiris, e.g. “there has been done for me what was done for my father Osiris on the day of tying bones together, of making functional the feet,” “do for him that which you did for his brother Osiris on the day,” etc.)
    Plutarch goes on to explicitly state that this resurrection on earth (set in actual earth history) in the same body he died in (reassembled and restored to life) was the popular belief, promoted in allegorical tales by the priesthood—as was also the god’s later descent to rule Hades. But the secret “true” belief taught among the initiated priesthood was that Osiris becomes incarnate, dies, and rises back to life every year in a secret cosmic battle in the sublunar heavens. So in fact, contrary to Ehrman (who evidently never actually read any of the sources on this point), Plutarch says the belief that Osiris went to Hades was false (On Isis and Osiris 78); and yet even in that “public” tale, Osiris rules in Hades in his old body of flesh, restored to life. Hence still plainly resurrected. But as Plutarch explains (On Isis and Osiris 25-27 & 54 and 58), the esoteric truth was that the god’s death and resurrection occurs in sublunar space, after each year descending and taking on a mortal body to die in; and that event definitely involved coming back to life in a new superior body, in which Osiris ascends to a higher realm to rule from above, all exactly as was said of the risen Jesus (who no more remained on earth than Osiris did). The only difference is that when importing this into Judaism, which had not a cyclical-eternal but a linear-apocalyptic conception of theological history, they converted the god’s dying-and-rising to a singular apocalyptic event.

    And that’s just Osiris. Clearly raised from the dead in his original, deceased body, restored to life; visiting people on earth in his risen body; and then ruling from heaven above. And that directly adjacent to Judea, amidst a major Jewish population in Alexandria, and popular across the whole empire. But as Plutarch said in On the E at Delphi 9, many religions of his day “narrate deaths and vanishings, followed by returns to life and resurrections.” Not just that one. Plutarch names Dionysus as but an example (and by other names “Zagreus, Nyctelius, and Isodaetes“). And we know for a fact this Dionysus wasn’t the only example Plutarch would have known. Plutarch only names him because he was so closely associated with Osiris, and the most famous.


    Are there any other ridiculous articles from coldcaseCristianity you need debunked?
     
  15. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790
    Then you don't know the Bible. You need to speak to imaginary deities more. One passage in Matthew doesn't trump every other?

    God wants some to go to hell.
    The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil. Proverbs 16:4
    He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. John 12:40

    Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. Romans 9:18

    God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned. 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12
    How to get saved
    1. Matthew 12:37
    2. John 5:29
      I the Lord ... give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings. -- Jeremiah 17:10

      For we must all appear before the jugment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad. -- 2 Corinthians 5:10
    3. Romans 3:28
      Therefore, being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. -- Romans 5:1

      A man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ. -- Galatians 2:16

      For by grace are ye saved through faith. -- Ephesians 2:8
    4. James 2:17
    5. Psalm 62:12
      For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. -- Matthew 16.27

      And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. -- Revelation 20:12-13

      Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works. -- 2 Corinthians 11:15The Father, who without partiality judges according to each one's work. -- 1 Peter 1:17What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? -- James 2:14, 17, 20, 24, 26I will give unto every one of you according to your works. -- Revelation 2:23Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work. -- Revelation 22:12
    1. Burn your work.If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. -- 1 Corinthians 3:15
    2. Work it out with fear and trembling.Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. -- Philippians 2:12
    3. Be hungry now and never get full.Blessed are ye that hunger now: for ye shall be filled. ... Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. -- Luke 6:21, 24
    4. Hunger and thirst after righteousness.Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled. -- Matthew 5:6
    5. Do what is lawful and right.When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness ... and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. -- Ezekiel 18:27
    6. Do nothing. Die in Adam; come alive in Christ.For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. -- 1 Corinthians 15:22
    7. Obey the law of the wise.The law of the wise is a fountain of life, to depart from the snares of death. -- Proverbs 13:14
    8. Do God's willHe that doeth the will of God abideth for ever. -- 1 John 2:17
    9. Do the will of Jesus' father.Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. -- Matthew 7:21
    10. Be a doer of the law.Who will render to each one according to his deeds. ... For not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified. -- Romans 2:6, 13
    11. Call on the name of the Lord.Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. -- Acts 2:21, Romans 10:13
    12. Call upon God.As for me, I will call upon God; and the LORD shall save me. -- Psalm 55:16
    1. Trust in the Lord.The LORD shall ... save them, because they trust in him. -- Psalm 37:40
    2. Seek the Lord and don't forsake him.The LORD searcheth all hearts, and understandeth all the imaginations of the thoughts: if thou seek him, he will be found of thee; but if thou forsake him, he will cast thee off for ever. -- 1 Chronicles 28:9
    3. Get to know God.In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction. -- 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9
    4. Wait for him.Wait on the LORD, and he shall save thee. -- Proverbs 20:22Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us. -- Isaiah 25:9
    5. Wait and come for 1335 days.Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. -- Daniel 12:12
    6. Just look at him.Look unto me, and be ye saved. -- Isaiah 45:22
    7. Get lost.The Son of man is come to save that which was lost. -- Matthew 18:11, Luke 19:10
    8. Get scourged.Whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. -- Hebrews 12:6
    9. Get tortured.Others were tortured ... that they might obtain a better resurrection. -- Hebrews 11:35
    10. Get lucky.I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. ... Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth. ... Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: -- Romans 9:15-22
    11. Hope.For we are saved by hope. -- Romans 8:24
    12. Repent.Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. -- Luke 13:3,
     
  16. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790
    more, there are about 100 more as well: Believers are Christian, don't care what you think.

    1. Overcome.He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God. -- Revelation 2:7He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death. -- Revelation 2:11He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels. -- Revelation 3:5Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God ... and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem ... and I will write upon him my new name. -- Revelation 3:12
    2. Don't be so darned wicked.When the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul. -- Ezekiel 18:27
    3. Don't offend the little ones.But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. -- Matthew 18:6, Mark 9:14, Luke 17:2
    4. Don't be filthy or naughty; receive the engrafted word.Lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. -- James 1:21
    1. Walk upright.Whoso walketh uprightly shall be saved. -- Proverbs 28:18
    2. Endure temptation.Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life. -- James 1:12
    3. Don't lust.Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. -- James 1:15
    4. Bridle your tongue.If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. -- James 1:26
    5. Believe in Jesus.Whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. -- John 3:16I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live. And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. -- John 11:25-26
    6. Believe on Jesus.He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life. -- John 3:36Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life. -- John 6:47Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved. -- Acts 16:31
    1. See Jesus and believe on him.Every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day. -- John 6:40
    2. Confess with your mouth "Jesus is Lord" and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead.If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. -- Romans 10:9
    3. Confess Jesus before men.Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. -- Matthew 10:32Whosoever shall confess me before men, him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God. -- Luke 12:8
    4. Obey Jesus.And [Jesus] being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him. -- Hebrews 5:9
    5. Hear the words of Jesus and believe in whoever sent him.He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life. -- John 5:24
    6. Hear and do the sayings of Jesus.Whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock. -- Matthew 7:24
    7. Keep Jesus' saying.If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death. -- John 8:51
    8. Drink Jesus' water.Whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life. -- John 4:14
      1. Get saved by the grace of Jesus.Through the grace of the LORD Jesus Christ we shall be saved. Acts 15:11
      2. Be dead with Jesus.It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: -- 2 Timothy 2:11
      3. Be born again.Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. -- John 3:3
      4. Be born of water and the spirit.Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. -- John 3:5
      5. Be spiritually minded.To be spiritually minded is life. -- Romans 8:6
      6. Believe Paul's gospel.Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. 1 Corinthians 15:1-2
      7. Listen to Peter's words. (They will save you and your whole familiy!)Peter ... shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved. Acts 11:13-14
      8. Believe and be baptized.He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved. -- Mark 16:16
      9. Just get baptized (you can keep the filth of the flesh).Baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh). -- 1 Peter 3:21
      10. Have a contrite spirit.The LORD ... saveth such as be of a contrite spirit. -- Psalm 34:18
        1. Have the Son of God.God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. -- 1 John 5:11-12
        2. Don't be deluded by God.God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12
        3. Don't be blinded by God.Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded. ... God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear;) unto this day. ... Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see. -- Romans 11:7-10
        4. Bear good fruit.Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. -- Matthew 7:19, Luke 3:9, 13:9
        5. Be grafted in.And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again. -- Romans 11:23
        6. Be chosen, not just called.For many are called, but few are chosen. -- Matthew 22:14, 20:16God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation. -- 2 Thessalonians 2:13
        7. Matthew 5:48
        8. Be meek.When God arose to judgment, to save all the meek of the earth. -- Psalm 76:9Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth. -- Matthew 5:5
        9. Be washed by the Holy Ghost.Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost. -- Titus 3:5
     
  17. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790
    It's already been pointed out that Christian scholarship does not consider the gospel sayings of Jesus to be reliable. What one radical fundamentalist thinks is of little importance vs the field of Christian scholars.
    Even with that you posted ONE passage. I posted dozens that contradict it. I can keep going.
     
  18. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790

    There are many Christian sects and many have different ideas about what is a Christian. You should argue inter-faith politics with them. It's all made up stories so it doesn't matter. I have read scripture many times. This does not change the fact that it's fiction. I've read the Quran as well. I need to read it more but no matter how well I understand it it's still fiction.

    A Christian is someone who is saved, exhibits a changed life, walks in faith, shares the Gospel, and helps teach others how to live like Christ. In doing these things, they demonstrate Christlikeness, which demonstrates how the Bible defines being a Christian.
    Dr. Michael L. Williams is a pastor, author, Christian educator and Biblical counselor who has served in ministry since March of 2000. Dr. Mike holds under-graduate through post graduate degrees in Christian Education
     
  19. joelr

    joelr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2014
    Messages:
    4,288
    Ratings:
    +1,790

    Wow did you need Jesus to tell you that?
    All savior myths say you need their savior to get to the afterlife. None are real.
    No evidence has ever been presented for any God.
    It looks like afterlifes are not an actual thing. Christianity didn't even come up with it. You can run around believing Greek myths all you like. But when you come to a debate forum and fail to actually debate and just preach that is deceptive and doesn't show good character. So the religion isn't really helping you in any way? Yet another apologist finds out he has nothing to debate with except the same claims every other religion, cult and conspiracy theory has.
     
  20. rational experiences

    rational experiences Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2020
    Messages:
    10,469
    Ratings:
    +630
    Religion:
    spiritualist
    Basic man men. Star fall brain burnt men individuals. As phenomena in a heavens mass made it individual inheritance.

    Men. The human god theist.

    Who theories in pretence when I don't exist. As a human who does exist. Then builds a reaction to cause it to occur. Life's removal one by one human unnaturally.

    His I'm a pretend God...scientist.

    Began as men in pretence already exuding using expressing self idolations. Meek innocent families enslaved. As they didn't believe nor support self violence.

    Family.

    Murdering self idolator. I believe in your self sacrifice family...not mine.

    Science observation the only place natural science is observation.

    As life isn't a circle on a piece of paper given a number by men.

    Sciences position only...position of no change.

    Says religious science testimonial said no man is the substances of his observation. The gods. Bodies of powers. Owners. Holders by body type.

    His type of God he said a human. Species one the human. Two of equal man and woman. As species continues by sex.

    Idolating men preaching from a scientific testimony religious book and science building don't treat women equally.

    My native indian American father taught me. No temple owner.

    If they wrote a list of how many times a human woman is murdered in their fake womb zero maths calculus religious book.... probably one only human would exist.

    Himself.

    Claiming he had by ovah ovary overcome the real human mother's cell. As one human. As the ovary became a man's possession.

    If you cared to stop self idolising your own human self and read what science data you wrote.

    Brother.
     
Loading...