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Theists: What would a godless universe look like?

Rational Agnostic

Well-Known Member
I have a genuine question for theists and it is not meant to be a trick in any way. There are many things that I would expect to see in a universe containing a benevolent, omnipotent, personal god that I don't see in this universe, which leads me to conclude that such a god is unlikely to exist. I'm curious as to what theists would expect to see in a godless universe, and how a godless universe would differ from one in which a god existed. What would you expect this universe to look like if no gods existed, and how would that be different from the current universe?
 

Super Universe

Defender of God
I have a genuine question for theists and it is not meant to be a trick in any way. There are many things that I would expect to see in a universe containing a benevolent, omnipotent, personal god that I don't see in this universe, which leads me to conclude that such a god is unlikely to exist. I'm curious as to what theists would expect to see in a godless universe, and how a godless universe would differ from one in which a god existed. What would you expect this universe to look like if no gods existed, and how would that be different from the current universe?

You didn't get the life you wanted so you don't believe in God. That's the atheist motto.

It's not about you. It's not about Christians or Muslims or Jews or any other religious group. God did it His way for Him, not for humans.

What would a godless universe look like? It wouldn't exist.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
If there were such a thing, it would be without love. All actions would be mechanical and automatic with all relationships between people totally superficial.
Why?
Wouldn't useful features like photosynthesis, co-operation, bipedalism, tribal solidarity, cellular respiration, bonding and love develop through natural selection?
Why would people be asocial creatures like bears or frogs if co-operation conferred so great a survival benefit?
 
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Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Nothing. (Nothing begets nothing.)

If there was a creator but he was evil.....there’d be no sunsets, no beautiful scenery, no tasty food. No happy times.
What do sunsets and scenery and tasty food have to do with anything? Our enjoyment of them isn't because they have any intrinsic merit, but because we evolved in such a way that they would be beneficial to us, and attraction to beneficial things was selective. We could just as easily have evolved to enjoy things we now consider horrible and disgusting -- and we'd likely attribute them to a beneficent god just as we do now.
 

Super Universe

Defender of God
Why?
Would there be no physics or chemistry in a godless universe?
Huh? I don't follow. Clarify?
OK.... Why?

Atheists say God does not exist, not, maybe God exists or doesn't exist. They are absolutely sure God does not exist but they have not explored even .1% of the universe so how would they know?

People believe what they want to believe, that's why. Atheists think, if God is a loving God then how come I didn't get the toy I wanted one Christmas? You didn't get the toy you wanted one Christmas because your parents were bad people, not because God did not exist.

Why would a godless universe not exist? Atheists and scientists think that there is a grand unified theory of everything, basically math and theory that explains how the universe formed itself without a supreme being. There is no such thing because that is impossible.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Why?
Wouldn't useful features like useful features like photosynthesis, co-operation, bipedalism, tribal solidarity, cellular respiration, bonding and love develop through natural selection?
Why would people be asocial creatures like bears or frogs if co-operation conferred so great a survival benefit?
Since the OP is pure speculation, I'm speculating. Since to me Divinity is Love, a divinity-less universe would not have love by definition.

Photosynthesis and other physical developments would happen. Mechanical emotionless cooperation could happen but agreements would be based on personal grain.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
What do sunsets and scenery and tasty food have to do with anything? Our enjoyment of them isn't because they have any intrinsic merit, but because we evolved in such a way that they would be beneficial to us, and attraction to beneficial things was selective. We could just as easily have evolved to enjoy things we now consider horrible and disgusting -- and we'd likely attribute them to a beneficent god just as we do now.

It has to do with enjoyment.

Things we consider “Horrible and disgusting” usually aren’t beneficial.

There’s way too much purposeful interaction to really support a naturalistic view. And attraction (of molecules) does not lead to function.
 
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rational experiences

Veteran Member
Why?
Wouldn't useful features like useful features like photosynthesis, co-operation, bipedalism, tribal solidarity, cellular respiration, bonding and love develop through natural selection?
Why would people be asocial creatures like bears or frogs if co-operation conferred so great a survival benefit?
You mean machines only, as the Stephen Hawking warning.

Why a male who designs a machine and says from all studies of everything it will react by my thoughts about everything. But his machine just sits motionless as the design.

So then he manipulates the machine and controls the machine claiming he is the bio God of love, a man and hence he will create creation, that sort of subliminal mentality? Design says no volition, no movement or change.
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
I have a genuine question for theists and it is not meant to be a trick in any way. There are many things that I would expect to see in a universe containing a benevolent, omnipotent, personal god that I don't see in this universe, which leads me to conclude that such a god is unlikely to exist. I'm curious as to what theists would expect to see in a godless universe, and how a godless universe would differ from one in which a god existed. What would you expect this universe to look like if no gods existed, and how would that be different from the current universe?
without God...
the primordial singularity never would have formed
the void would remain....as void

perfect in every way

light is an aberration
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
If you said to a human conscious, where did the creation come from.

He would say a hot dense state.

In science a hot dense state is destruction...for it is self consuming.

So then you would ask, so how did it become form, he would quote, as it self consumed more space opened so it enabled cooling. Causing space allowed form to actualise.

Consciousness, advice, is not science. We own that status first, storytelling and self advice as a storyteller.

If I said to my brother science always knew that creation came from a state that was higher, so it was not burning first as origins and the origin had to change.

We called that condition the eternal. So it makes space be what the eternal lost into burnt hot dense state.

So the gases, a burnt eternal body, fills back in the emptied out eternal mass...and then contacts it. And we said that the Earth heavens owning Earth a planet, communicated to by its heavens the eternal.

And spirit eternal owned, came out into the force changed, and converted...became less...but are the higher less of the eternal than anything else in creation. What science always said and knew.

So we gave that story to the Earth and said God did it.

So God the heavens owns the lower burning eternal history and it is in contact with where we came out of, the real eternal.

Science would therefore claim that we are in Hell...the lower burning eternal body, gases/spirit.

Yet in science Hell is actually increased radiation converting to re cause massive burning/heat.

So science owns in human spiritual life, one total mind feed back self removal of natural spiritual awareness. Why spiritual humanity own the argument against scientists, actually as a human aware reasoning and teaching.

We say when we bio life die we still own one eternal spirit. We die due to the radiation constant being present, bio life does not survive radiation....yet when it lives as consciousness its claim is that it survives radiation.

So we live as a contradictive teaching status to become self destructive for lying.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Atheists say God does not exist, not, maybe God exists or doesn't exist. They are absolutely sure God does not exist but they have not explored even .1% of the universe so how would they know?
Few atheists maintain that God absolutely does not exist. Most simply don't believe, pending evidence -- much like you probably don't believe in faeries or Zeus or Martians.

Atheists don't believe because it's impracticable to believe in everything and then tick things off your belief list when they're "disproven" -- which is usually impossible.
The reasonable approach is to believe in what you have evidence of and add to it as evidence of new things emerges. This is the only reasonable approach.
Atheists don't believe because they are reasonable.

People believe what they want to believe, that's why. Atheists think, if God is a loving God then how come I didn't get the toy I wanted one Christmas? You didn't get the toy you wanted one Christmas because your parents were bad people, not because God did not exist.
This is absurd! Where'd you get these ideas about atheists? Atheists aren't children, and don't think in childish ways.

Atheists don't believe what they want to believe. That would be theists. Atheists believe what there is evidence for. If evidence for God emerges, atheists will become theists. Till then, they withhold belief.

Do you believe in unicorns and Santa Clause? If not, why not? Is it because you didn't get the toy you wanted?

Why would a godless universe not exist? Atheists and scientists think that there is a grand unified theory of everything, basically math and theory that explains how the universe formed itself without a supreme being. There is no such thing because that is impossible.
I'll turn that question around. Why would a God-created universe exist?

Why do you summarily declare physics impossible? Physics works. Aren't you posting from a computer? How do you explain how that works, without physics, and, indeed, without quantum mechanics?

It's strange enough that you believe in something with neither supporting evidence nor an explanatory need. So I ask you: Why do you believe in God?
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Since the OP is pure speculation, I'm speculating. Since to me Divinity is Love, a divinity-less universe would not have love by definition.

Photosynthesis and other physical developments would happen. Mechanical emotionless cooperation could happen but agreements would be based on personal grain.
So why would mechanical interaction and selfish self-interest evolve but not love, bonding and emotional attachment? Like selfishness, these are useful, hence, selective.
 

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I have a genuine question for theists and it is not meant to be a trick in any way. There are many things that I would expect to see in a universe containing a benevolent, omnipotent, personal god that I don't see in this universe, which leads me to conclude that such a god is unlikely to exist. I'm curious as to what theists would expect to see in a godless universe, and how a godless universe would differ from one in which a god existed. What would you expect this universe to look like if no gods existed, and how would that be different from the current universe?

Brahman can't be seen because it's IS all things. Is that simple enough? It's you, me, the creation, and the created simultaneously. It's even "all the gods"... :D

But, the short of it is, if you don't believe that then it looks no different to you, either way.
 

The Anointed

Well-Known Member
I have a genuine question for theists and it is not meant to be a trick in any way. There are many things that I would expect to see in a universe containing a benevolent, omnipotent, personal god that I don't see in this universe, which leads me to conclude that such a god is unlikely to exist. I'm curious as to what theists would expect to see in a godless universe, and how a godless universe would differ from one in which a god existed. What would you expect this universe to look like if no gods existed, and how would that be different from the current universe?

What would a godless universe look like? Considering that God is the eternal energy, which has neither beginning or end, and that He, who is all that exists and has manifested himself as this living universal body, a godless universe, could not exist.
 
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