Mr_Spinkles said:
true blood said:
What does it matter if the propostion is based on assumptions? What is wrong with using quotes? The poster stated his proposition so why does the oppostition need to assume he must assume the same as the oppostions? The oppostion isn't suppose to agree with the propostion thus the debate takes place lol.
I completely agree with you, true blood we should not bash other people's beliefs. As part of the debate, I am simply pointing out that
Harry's arguments are based on an assumption. An argument based on an assumption is not a very strong argument. Hence I am debating. 8)
I am not assuming what I post is true,it is the truth.
Jesus said: "I am come from God" (John 8:42).
"The Son can do nothing of Himself, but what he seeth the Father do". (John 5:19)
"Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." (Matt. 16:16)
At the Lord's baptism a voice from heaven was heard to say: "This is My beloved Son in whom I am well pleased." ("Matt. 3:17)
The Lord also said: "My Father is greater than I." (John 14:28)
"No man cometh unto the Father but by Me." (John 14:6) On the cross Jesus said: "Father, forgive them ..." (Luke 23:34), and "My God, My God, why hast Thou forsaken Me?" (Matt. 27:46)
Also, after the resurrection, the Lord said to the disciples, "Teach all nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father,and of the Son,and of the Holy Spirit." (Matt. 28:19) In this last passage, not only does it seem that the Father and the Son are two persons, but also that there is yet a third Divine Person or Being, the Holy Spirit.
If we were to consult only such passages as these, and ignore all the others that seem to conflict with them, we might come to the conclusion that God is in three Persons. This is extremely puzzling to anyone of a reflective turn of mind, because his common sense tells him that there simply cannot be three Divine Persons, or three Divine Beings because this is the same as saying that there can be three Infinities of three Gods. The task of uniting three distinct Divinities into one God is a forlornly hopeless task.
But the way of this frustration is to notice that it is never explicitly stated in so many words that the Father and the Son are two distinct Persons. That is never said.
But it was assumed - taken for granted - by the Councils of the Early Christian Church from 325 AD onwards and has been unthinkingly accepted as the orthodox Christian faith itself.
But search as you will, you will never find a passage that says explicitly that the Father and the Son are TWO, or that he who has seen the Son has yet to see the Father. As a matter of fact, you will find the very opposite, as we shall see in a moment. I am not using assumptions,the early church did.
the Father and the Son are one,as soul and body of Jesus Christ, that the Father is in the Son,as the soul is in the body and the Son in the Father,as the soul and body are one person? This the Lord plainly says (in John 10:30, and 14:10, 11).
If you do not believe this you divide God into two.When this is done you are unable to think about God otherwise than naturally, sensually, and even materially.
This has been done in the world since the time of the Council of Nicene in the year 325AD, which introduced the doctrine of three Divine persons from eternity, and thereby turned the church into a theater furnished with painted hangings, wherein the actors were representing new plays.
When you are able to understand these truths,than you would see what it means by sitting at the right hand God,because sitting at the right hand of God does not mean two persons sitting nicely side by side.
To sit at the right hand' does not mean to sit at the right hand, but it means Jehovah God's Divine Omnipotence through the Human Form that He assumed in the world under the name Jesus Christ,and born of the virgin Mary.
By means of this He is in things last as well as in things first.
By means of this He entered and overthrew and subjugated the hells.
By means of this He restored order in the heavens. By means of this He redeemed both men and angels, and will continue to redeem for ever.Amen
Harry