The teachings of Jesus

[Tinker Grey]

Fellow non-believers often say things like "I don't believe he was God; but he was a good and wise teacher."

I'm asking here, what are these good and wise teachings?

I really don't know. I have a saying that I probably cribbed from someone else: The teachings of Jesus that are true are not profound; the teachings that are profound aren't true. The good stuff other people have taught, so in that sense he wasn't "great".

One unique teaching is "Love your enemies". Some may consider that profound, but it is hardly wise. Depending on how you define love, anyway. AND that's another thing, wouldn't a good teacher define his/her terms?

Consider "forgive people". If by forgive you mean figure out how to get on with your life, sure. If you mean, act as if nothing happened -- no way in hell. (Think of someone raping your child.)

So, anyone care to make a case that Jesus was a good teacher?

 

[endlessvoid2018]

I do think the same. I would say his teachings more so about loving your neighbor and such, are particularly good though. But beyond that, the rest are kind of questionable, which is why I don't believe in them.
Sorry, if someone hates me and is ready to strike me down or is coming at me, I cannot love such a person.
I think Jesus' teachings about forgiveness are also valuable. However, looking on it, one would have to question the situation of whether forgiveness is merited. If someone murders my family member, no. Sorry. Can't forgive you. If you lie to me, steal something from me, etc, something relatively offensive but minor, sure. I can forgive that.

 

[Tinker Grey]

I do think the same. I would say his teachings more so about loving your neighbor and such, are particularly good though. But beyond that, the rest are kind of questionable, which is why I don't believe in them.
Sorry, if someone hates me and is ready to strike me down or is coming at me, I cannot love such a person.
I think Jesus' teachings about forgiveness are also valuable. However, looking on it, one would have to question the situation of whether forgiveness is merited. If someone murders my family member, no. Sorry. Can't forgive you. If you lie to me, steal something from me, etc, something relatively offensive but minor, sure. I can forgive that.

Thanks for the reply.

I guess part of my point, though, is while being good to your neighbor is a good thing the teaching itself is banal. It's "be good to your fellow man" which philosophers before and since have taught.

Too, neighbor with good Samaritan implied definition of any one who needs your help is useless. This perhaps is a problem of the gospel writer who's trying to make his subject appear impressive.

J: Love your neighbor
P (person): who is my neighbor? What is Love?
J: Anyone who needs help. Helping.
P: So why didn't you say "help anyone who needs it" instead of "love your neighbor"

 

[Kfox]

Fellow non-believers often say things like "I don't believe he was God; but he was a good and wise teacher."

I'm asking here, what are these good and wise teachings?

I really don't know. I have a saying that I probably cribbed from someone else: The teachings of Jesus that are true are not profound; the teachings that are profound aren't true. The good stuff other people have taught, so in that sense he wasn't "great".

One unique teaching is "Love your enemies". Some may consider that profound, but it is hardly wise. Depending on how you define love, anyway. AND that's another thing, wouldn't a good teacher define his/her terms?

Consider "forgive people". If by forgive you mean figure out how to get on with your life, sure. If you mean, act as if nothing happened -- no way in hell. (Think of someone raping your child.)

So, anyone care to make a case that Jesus was a good teacher?

Men of war will usually worship a God of war (Allah, Yahweh etc) Men of peace will usually worship a God of peace. I believe Jesus was made a God of peace; a good alternative to the more common God's of war of his time.

 

[Tomef]

Fellow non-believers often say things like "I don't believe he was God; but he was a good and wise teacher."

I'm asking here, what are these good and wise teachings?

I really don't know. I have a saying that I probably cribbed from someone else: The teachings of Jesus that are true are not profound; the teachings that are profound aren't true. The good stuff other people have taught, so in that sense he wasn't "great".

One unique teaching is "Love your enemies". Some may consider that profound, but it is hardly wise. Depending on how you define love, anyway. AND that's another thing, wouldn't a good teacher define his/her terms?

Consider "forgive people". If by forgive you mean figure out how to get on with your life, sure. If you mean, act as if nothing happened -- no way in hell. (Think of someone raping your child.)

So, anyone care to make a case that Jesus was a good teacher?

Pretty novel, maybe. Baffling ‘enemies’ by putting up no resistance, while telling them they would pay for it later, seems to have been a pretty new idea, and it certainly won a lot of converts. Institutional churches have largely turned that on its head, though, with more of a follow our doctrines or die approach (until the enlightenment), so presumably they don’t consider it wise. Religious practices since Christ often involve more of a crude imitation via various forms of self-denial, which seems to miss the point.

In terms of its wisdom within the intended context I suppose it makes sense. What came down to us as Jesus’ teachings are an amalgam of ideas that can, when practised, go some way towards achieving what the law attempted to do, namely to form a cohesive group. They seem to work in that sense, as far as it goes, in that individual churches or denominations maybe form communities of a sort.