The South's Loyal Slave Monuments Have To Go

[Shad]

In the South in not only did they put up monuments dedicated to treasonous scum that betrayed flag and country, they dare to put up monuments to perpetuate the myth that slaves loved being slaves and love their masters. In effect doing such was a vicious and cynical attempt to revise history and undermine the reality of the true horrors and terrors of slavery. They put up monuments of soldiers going off to war kissing black babies as if they were the true protectors of these poor black children, monuments on churches for slaves who prayed in earnest for the safe return of their master who is going off to sacrifice all for them and a statue of black man ( called The Good Darky) which praises their victims for being "good negroes" by being obedient slaves.

Such a callous public display of cruelty is nothing but a symptom of the racist psychopathy that plagues the South, a disgusting pornographic display of the dark subtle spirit of the vile hatred and bigotry of white men and women who condone and enjoy such twisted lies and narratives, propaganda that calls evil good and good evil. These statue should be not only removed but smashed to piece and erase forever.

My view is to use a few for educational purposes as part of the Reconstruction era, lost cause movement and other backlashes to the Civil War and change in America. Those items will not longer be used endorse those views in the public but as part of history for the public. More so I would hammer home the point of how many of the Southern masses were used to keep the elite rich with the statues being the legacy of a giant con. Think of Auschwitz minus the memorial part. Open the rest to sale. Those that do not sell are marked destruction and/or recycling depending on material used. Outside some sort of museum structure I see no reason why these need to remain in the public square.

 

[Shad]

Let's demolish Davis's obelisk too.
Jefferson Davis State Historic Site - Wikipedia
And next the Jefferson Memorial in DC.
History must be sanitized!

Jefferson is not so simple. He is a conflicted figure that is not so cut and dry. Lincoln and him shared similar ideas about emancipation namely deportation after. Yet Lincoln is hailed as one of if not the greatest leaders the US has had to date. Lincoln seemed to hate Jefferson but used Jefferson's writings as a basis for some of his own action and policy.

 

[pearl]

As usual, I'll suggest caution in judging historical events by modern senses of morality.

In the 2011 movie 'The Help' depicts the time in the '60's and the lives of living in Mississippi during and after 'Jim Crow'. The only thing that changed morally accepted behavior was the law.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TheHelp_(film)

 

[Revoltingest]

What did you mean by "sanitizing history" in regards to removing monuments that honored the dishonorable?

Tis just similar to what the Taliban did, purging historical artifacts
& monuments because they offend. This takes history out of
the every day world so as to ensure that no one takes offense.
It then becomes accessible only thru media or teachers.
History dies a little..

 

[Revoltingest]

Revoltingest, I suppose since you’re Canadian you aren’t very familiar with monuments like these or their history.

I'm Ameristanian. I was almost a Canuckistanian, but Nixon cancelled
the draft in the nick of time. (I'm a draft dodging coward who saw no
profit in killing godless commies for the lazy ba****ds who wouldn't
do it themselves, but would force others just because they could.)

They were put up with the purpose of lionizing the Confederate cause some time after the Civil War, by people motivated by race-hatred and resentment for the abolishment of slavery. They aren’t neutral expressions of objective history; they’ve always been entirely political.

I suspect that you're attributing expanded motives based upon personal
animosity towards southerners. Nonetheless, whatever their real reasons,
those should become part of interpretative displays of remaining artifacts.

One of my main things (aside from landscaping) is to save historical things
from oblivion. Many go into museums, where their history is made significant
to guests. Presentation & interpretation are everything, & something we discuss
& plan for. Doing that well means the difference between disinterest & history
coming alive for the masses. That is my perspective...save & interpret it.

 

[PureX]

There is a very long history of public sculptures representing the political propaganda and ideology of those who pay to have them installed. And of their later being destroyed by those who disagree with those ideals. No work of art lasts forever, nor should it.

I think a few of the most heinous examples of this sort of slave-era propaganda should be sent to a national museum for the purpose of education and historical significance. The rest can be destroyed as all things of no further use to anyone, should be.

I say this as an artist, myself.

 

[columbus]

In the South in not only did they put up monuments dedicated to treasonous scum that betrayed flag and country,

Betrayed flag and country?
The Confederation did the same thing that the Founding Fathers did. They seceded from a political entity they no longer wished to be part of. Washington, Franklin, Jefferson, et al, did the same thing in 1776.
There's a reason that the war is most accurately described as "The War of Northern Aggression". The southern Confederation did not attack Philadelphia or Washington DC any more than The Founding Fathers attacked London. They were attacked for seceding, like the Founding Fathers were attacked for seceding from the British Empire.

they dare to put up monuments to perpetuate the myth that slaves loved being slaves and love their masters.

Then as now, groups as large a racial groups are rarely monolithic. Several generations of abject oppression did result in lots of black people as afraid of their own personal freedom as their owners were afraid of doing without slave labor.
Therefore, the loyal slave really was a thing.

And it's not like the Unionists who trashed the Confederacy were particularly interested in racial equality. No more so than the people who supported Bush era invasions in the Middle East were interested in democratizing Muslims. They got sold a bill of goods by the economic and political elite pursuing their own advantage.
Tom

 

[Revoltingest]

There is a very long history of public sculptures representing the political propaganda and ideology of those who pay to have them installed. And of their later being destroyed by those who disagree with those ideals. No work of art lasts forever, nor should it.

I think a few of the most heinous examples of this sort of slave-era propaganda should be sent to a national museum for the purpose of education and historical significance. The rest can be destroyed as all things of no further use to anyone, should be.

I say this as an artist, myself.

National museums are useful only to the few who go there.
If in a museums, let them be abundant & easily accessible.
But I prefer my history more in your face.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

My view is to use a few for educational purposes as part of the Reconstruction era, lost cause movement and other backlashes to the Civil War and change in America. Those items will not longer be used endorse those views in the public but as part of history for the public. More so I would hammer home the point of how many of the Southern masses were used to keep the elite rich with the statues being the legacy of a giant con. Think of Auschwitz minus the memorial part. Open the rest to sale. Those that do not sell are marked destruction and/or recycling depending on material used. Outside some sort of museum structure I see no reason why these need to remain in the public square.

I am kinda in agreement with you

 

[Revoltingest]

When travelling in the south a few years ago, we visited some plantations.
There were wonderful (not in the sense of glorifying) exhibits about the
slavery aspect of them. I didn't have to go to some national museum
where everything is sanitized to be inoffensive. They were local to where
we were. And we saw horrible living conditions in the hovels for slaves.
Was it wrong for us to view such things?

 

[PureX]

National museums are useful only to the few who go there.
If in a museums, let them be abundant & easily accessible.
But I prefer my history more in your face.

I prefer contemporary art to be "in our face" rather than some plantation era propaganda. The past belongs to the past. Put that stuff in a museum for the past, and throw the rest away. Make room for some new "in your face" art.

 

[Duke_Leto]

I'm Ameristanian. I was almost a Canuckistanian, but Nixon cancelled
the draft in the nick of time. (I'm a draft dodging coward who saw no
profit in killing godless commies for the lazy ba****ds who wouldn't
do it themselves, but would force others just because they could.)

Whoops. I apologize; I've been gone from the forum for too long. I must have confused you with someone else.

I suspect that you're attributing expanded motives based upon personal
animosity towards southerners. Nonetheless, whatever their real reasons,
those should become part of interpretative displays of remaining artifacts.

One of my main things (aside from landscaping) is to save historical things
from oblivion. Many go into museums, where their history is made significant
to guests. Presentation & interpretation are everything, & something we discuss
& plan for. Doing that well means the difference between disinterest & history
coming alive for the masses. That is my perspective...save & interpret it.

I'm a southerner myself. The motive for these monuments is well-known. This isn't conjecture.

 

[Shad]

I am kinda in agreement with you

Just to add I would include the fact that a lot of slave owners gave their slaves to the military to avoid the draft and general impressment of freed slaves in the South and capture of people in the North as per Gettysburg putting them into Southern slavery.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I have no problem with moving the monuments into museums. Destroying them? no. I also think the old historic plantations should be preserved. I've toured one as a kid, and it is important to know about them in combination with other information. When you have been to a plantation its different than if its just something in a book. History can, yes, repeat itself.

 

[Shad]

I have no problem with moving the monuments into museums. Destroying them? no. I also think the old historic plantations should be preserved. I've toured one as a kid, and it is important to know about them in combination with other information. When you have been to a plantation its different than if its just something in a book. History can, yes, repeat itself.

There a few plantations preserved within the same vein towards education of history.

There is no reason the statues need to be all over the public square.

 

[Brickjectivity]

There a few plantations preserved within the same vein towards education of history.

There is no reason the statues need to be all over the public square.

I agree there. They can be moved into museums, stored in the back and occasionally brought out like the other 100,000 items the museums have. Most everything spends most of its museum life on a shelf. In a hundred years people may still want to see these things or touch them to know they are real.

 

[Shad]

I agree there. They can be moved into museums, stored in the back and occasionally brought out like the other 100,000 items the museums have. Most everything spends most of its museum life on a shelf. In a hundred years people may still want to see these things or touch them to know they are real.

Yup I know from experience regarding backroom curation.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

Just to add I would include the fact that a lot of slave owners gave their slaves to the military to avoid the draft and general impressment of freed slaves in the South and capture of people in the North as per Gettysburg putting them into Southern slavery.

What do you think about the Confederate flag officially being display by local and state governments?

 

[Shad]

What do you think about the Confederate flag officially being display by local and state governments?

The state flags like Mississippi or the Confed flag itself?

 

[The Reverend Bob]

The state flags like Mississippi or the Confed flag itself?

The flag itself for starters