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the Sins of Youth

how will it go?

  • damned if I did......and I did

    Votes: 1 50.0%
  • I did....but expect to have the slate wiped clean

    Votes: 1 50.0%
  • expect to be retrained

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    2

Thief

Rogue Theologian
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven
and ALL of the stupid things we have done will be held against us

after all....
I do not expect to be held in high regard as I cross the Threshold of Heaven
for that matter.....
They might not be willing to let me in....not one step

So …..are we held accountable?
every little jot and tittle?
 

MikeDwight

Well-Known Member
You don't look that young... What, so internalizing rather than externalizing? That's psychology 101
 

Debater Slayer

Vipassana
Staff member
Premium Member
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven [...]

Then I expect to see a damn big list of RF threads in Heaven.
 

MikeDwight

Well-Known Member
th
th
th
th

You mean at the Zoroastrian orgy party of the ecumenical council of the Orthodox in Nicea? There will be women yesss yess and this guy, he's a goat.
 

MikeDwight

Well-Known Member
The PCUSA got the Methodists and Baptists, the Church of Scotland got the Anglicans, the Church of Australia and Canada got the Anglicans, African Presbyterians got genocide, and Korea's got Kim Jung il , plus Woodrow Wilson, so, let the final schism begin! Bulgarian orthodox approves . ecumenical patriarch Constantinople says (whatever). The last time there was a Church federation as cool as orthodoxy etc etc etc
 

dianaiad

Well-Known Member
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven
and ALL of the stupid things we have done will be held against us

after all....
I do not expect to be held in high regard as I cross the Threshold of Heaven
for that matter.....
They might not be willing to let me in....not one step

So …..are we held accountable?
every little jot and tittle?

If we don't repent, yep.

"Repent,' means regretting the stupid/nasty/evil stuff, wishing you hadn't BEEN that idiotic, learning from it and a: ceasing to do the dumb stuff and starting to do the smart, kind, good stuff.

Repenting is good. It' better, probably, if you don't have to repent of EVERYTHING you did when you were young, but we all did stupid stuff, so we all have some repenting to do.

It's called 'growing up."
 

JJ50

Well-Known Member
I have done a lot of crazy things in my life and continue to do so, even though I hit 70 next January.:rolleyes: Apart from breaking the speed limit from time to time in my youth when driving, I have done nothing illegal.

I think the word 'sin' is a misnomer, when attributed to the Bible it often includes things which no decent person would consider wrong, like homosexuality and sleeping with your partner before marriage in a committed adult relationship.
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
Oof sins of (our) youth?
How long can a post even go on here?

The usual. Drinking, smoking, fighting, lying and driving with above the legal limit of blood alcohol (in my defence, here “P platers” or provisional drivers are restricted to 0.00 until the full license and I had to drive to work the next morning.)
 

JJ50

Well-Known Member
I have never been drunk in my life, or taken illegal drugs.

My crazy activities started in childhood, like kicking a live grenade around when I was ten, found in the attic of my childhood home which I was forbidden to enter.:eek: The Germans who occupied our island during WW2 had left that and other ammunition in our house in which 13 of them were living, when they escaped before the Brits kicked them out.
 

Howard Is

Lucky Mud
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven
and ALL of the stupid things we have done will be held against us

after all....
I do not expect to be held in high regard as I cross the Threshold of Heaven
for that matter.....
They might not be willing to let me in....not one step

So …..are we held accountable?
every little jot and tittle?

Forgive me for repeating a joke, but it is so appropriate to this thread.


A recently deceased soul arrives at the gates of Eternity.

He is met by St Peter, who asks “What did you do in your earthy life to earn entry into eternal paradise ?”

He replies “Whoa ! Wait ! How do I know this isn’t a dying man’s hallucination ?”

From behind the gate comes a shout...”Let him in ! He’s one of us !”
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven
and ALL of the stupid things we have done will be held against us

after all....
I do not expect to be held in high regard as I cross the Threshold of Heaven
for that matter.....
They might not be willing to let me in....not one step

So …..are we held accountable?
every little jot and tittle?

Here's my take (for what it's worth). When you pass you'll stand before a committee and they will ask you one question: "Did you learn anything?"
Your answer will decide what your next duty station will be...
 

dianaiad

Well-Known Member
I have done a lot of crazy things in my life and continue to do so, even though I hit 70 next January.:rolleyes: Apart from breaking the speed limit from time to time in my youth when driving, I have done nothing illegal.

I think the word 'sin' is a misnomer, when attributed to the Bible it often includes things which no decent person would consider wrong, like homosexuality and sleeping with your partner before marriage in a committed adult relationship.

One cannot repent of things one doesn't think one did wrong. One can only change one's mind about whether that was wrong. If you become convinced that it was wrong, then 'repenting' means 'well, I didn't know better then, but I do now so I won't do it."

That's "repenting," too.

The stages of repentance, I have been taught, are these;

First be aware that one has done something wrong...or not done something right. Basically, be aware that one made a bad choice, even if it seemed fine at the time.

Second: regret the bad choice.

Third, if POSSIBLE and appropriate, make restitution and apologize to anybody who was caused harm because of your choice. That may just be you. If your choice harmed you, apologize to yourself, and change whatever needs changing. Forgive yourself.

Fourth: change your life so that you don't make those choices anymore. You may have to do these four things repeatedly until they stick; habits are hard to break.

Now, if one is an atheist or something else, steps one through four are sufficient. If one is a believer in an afterlife and a deity, step five:

Five: Ask God for forgiveness, using whatever prayer or ceremony is appropriate. Make promises to be better.

Six: If your religion does this, do whatever ceremony gets rid of all your sins commited before that ceremony. That's what adult baptism is for. Some faiths allow you to be baptized many times. Others let you get baptized (or whatever) once, but have something else that allows you to get rid of sins. Generally that's something like communion or something.

Seven: honestly work at improving yourself. Even the folks who believe in 'once saved, only saved,' believe in good works; only the motive ascribed to those works changes.

So, if there is an afterlife, that's what you do, according to every theistic belief system I know, and non-believers do steps 1-4. Generally.
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
One cannot repent of things one doesn't think one did wrong. One can only change one's mind about whether that was wrong. If you become convinced that it was wrong, then 'repenting' means 'well, I didn't know better then, but I do now so I won't do it."

That's "repenting," too.

The stages of repentance, I have been taught, are these;

First be aware that one has done something wrong...or not done something right. Basically, be aware that one made a bad choice, even if it seemed fine at the time.

Second: regret the bad choice.

Third, if POSSIBLE and appropriate, make restitution and apologize to anybody who was caused harm because of your choice. That may just be you. If your choice harmed you, apologize to yourself, and change whatever needs changing. Forgive yourself.

Fourth: change your life so that you don't make those choices anymore. You may have to do these four things repeatedly until they stick; habits are hard to break.

Now, if one is an atheist or something else, steps one through four are sufficient. If one is a believer in an afterlife and a deity, step five:

Five: Ask God for forgiveness, using whatever prayer or ceremony is appropriate. Make promises to be better.

Six: If your religion does this, do whatever ceremony gets rid of all your sins commited before that ceremony. That's what adult baptism is for. Some faiths allow you to be baptized many times. Others let you get baptized (or whatever) once, but have something else that allows you to get rid of sins. Generally that's something like communion or something.

Seven: honestly work at improving yourself. Even the folks who believe in 'once saved, only saved,' believe in good works; only the motive ascribed to those works changes.

So, if there is an afterlife, that's what you do, according to every theistic belief system I know, and non-believers do steps 1-4. Generally.
I have been involved in the catholic practice
almost became a priest because of the influence
but 12people showed up at the seminary
for two positions available

apparently there are two other people....holier than me
but no hard feelings

I found ceremony and ritual to be gesture of hand
and there are no works to justify one's self before heaven

so....rogue theologian ….
no religion
no congregation.....I follow no one and no one follows me
no ceremony or ritual
no litany of prayers

I am hoping...for the sake of peace within
a lobotomy dealt be heaven

take the list of stupid things done.....and burn it

hmmmm…..no....wait a minute
ripping the pages out of my book of life …...might hurt a bit

and maybe heaven has no inclination to spare the volume

They might burn the whole.....book
 

TagliatelliMonster

Veteran Member
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven
and ALL of the stupid things we have done will be held against us

after all....
I do not expect to be held in high regard as I cross the Threshold of Heaven
for that matter.....
They might not be willing to let me in....not one step

So …..are we held accountable?
every little jot and tittle?

Doing stupid things is an inevitable part of growing up.
 

JJ50

Well-Known Member
One cannot repent of things one doesn't think one did wrong. One can only change one's mind about whether that was wrong. If you become convinced that it was wrong, then 'repenting' means 'well, I didn't know better then, but I do now so I won't do it."

That's "repenting," too.

The stages of repentance, I have been taught, are these;

First be aware that one has done something wrong...or not done something right. Basically, be aware that one made a bad choice, even if it seemed fine at the time.

Second: regret the bad choice.

Third, if POSSIBLE and appropriate, make restitution and apologize to anybody who was caused harm because of your choice. That may just be you. If your choice harmed you, apologize to yourself, and change whatever needs changing. Forgive yourself.

Fourth: change your life so that you don't make those choices anymore. You may have to do these four things repeatedly until they stick; habits are hard to break.

Now, if one is an atheist or something else, steps one through four are sufficient. If one is a believer in an afterlife and a deity, step five:

Five: Ask God for forgiveness, using whatever prayer or ceremony is appropriate. Make promises to be better.

Six: If your religion does this, do whatever ceremony gets rid of all your sins commited before that ceremony. That's what adult baptism is for. Some faiths allow you to be baptized many times. Others let you get baptized (or whatever) once, but have something else that allows you to get rid of sins. Generally that's something like communion or something.

Seven: honestly work at improving yourself. Even the folks who believe in 'once saved, only saved,' believe in good works; only the motive ascribed to those works changes.

So, if there is an afterlife, that's what you do, according to every theistic belief system I know, and non-believers do steps 1-4. Generally.

If one does something wrong one should be seeking to put it right and asking the person one has wronged for forgiveness. Certainly not the evil Biblical god, which should be asking humans for forgiveness for screwing up so badly, assuming it exists.
 

dianaiad

Well-Known Member
If one does something wrong one should be seeking to put it right and asking the person one has wronged for forgiveness. Certainly not the evil Biblical god, which should be asking humans for forgiveness for screwing up so badly, assuming it exists.


I believe that I addressed that, in step...what...three?

I also mentioned that if one did not believe in a deity or afterlife, steps one through four are sufficient. That is, until one gets to an afterlife and discovered that, just perhaps, one should have continued down the process.

Repenting, frankly, isn't about pleasing God primarily. It's about making oneself a better person. Now I, as a theist, think that doing that pleases God, and He HAS commanded us to do that, but that doesn't mean that non-believers can't have better, more peaceful, lives if they improve their own lives according to their own moral codes, does it?

Personally, if you are worried about pleasing a God you don't like, you have problems with authority I can't speak to. Well, I shouldn't. but I will anyway..

I have a sneaking suspicion that true maturity...and true courage...is the ability to do the right thing even when your opposition takes your action as a win for them.

For instance, if your parents have been pressuring you for years to go to college and major in pre-med, and BECAUSE of that you would prefer to run off to New York and be a puppet master playing a ukulele on the subway, but deep down you really LIKE medicine, then the mature thing is to choose the medicine. Even if your parents want you to.

Or, in a debate, if your opposition scores a point, and deep down you know he's right, you accede to that and admit it. (I have real problems with that one, but I repent as fast and often as I can...)

In other words, if you don't believe in God, or you are just mad at Him, then repent for yourself. He might approve, but that's not your problem, is it?
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
alrighty then.....

this one is aimed right at your heads
and your souls

What if the stupid things we've done.....ANY of them
are kept to a list by heaven
and ALL of the stupid things we have done will be held against us

after all....
I do not expect to be held in high regard as I cross the Threshold of Heaven
for that matter.....
They might not be willing to let me in....not one step

So …..are we held accountable?
every little jot and tittle?


I don't regret anything i have done of my own free will. If some religion wants to pidgin hole that then i am happy to be out of it.
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
I don't regret anything i have done of my own free will. If some religion wants to pidgin hole that then i am happy to be out of it.
no regrets....

I might assume you have errored at some point
but have forgiven yourself
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
no regrets....

I might assume you have errored at some point
but have forgiven yourself

You may assume what pleases you.

Yes i have errored but i was definite in stating "of my own freewill"

The errors i have made did not need forgiveness, they needed correcting

And still no regrets
 
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