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Featured The Second Coming Sham

Discussion in 'Biblical Debates' started by Hubert Farnsworth, Jul 24, 2018.

  1. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    In Scripture I find Nimrod's kingdom as first as per Genesis 10:8-10.
    Babylon became a political capital, and its history was also as a religious center from which their religious influence spread out in many directions from ancient Babylon. That is why we see so many overlapping or similar religious teachings and idea spread out world wide in today's religious world.

    I see a reference from a professor Morris Jastrow, Jr. in his book about the religion of Babylonia and Assyria that in the ancient world reveals the unmistakable influence of Babylonian conceptions .....
    Babylon's religious influence traced eastward to India according to the book 'New Light on the Ancient East' by an archaeologist V Chide.

    I am wondering if you have references to the contrary.
     
  2. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    All the world?!? Your references only cover a rather narrow interpretive Biblical view of the the Middle East from a Biblical Interpretation.
     
  3. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    I find man has a body and a mind besides having life's spirit.
    Notice where God's spirit was located at Job 27:3.
    And how God uses His spirit at Psalms 104:30.
    I have never read about Jesus being Holy Spirit.
    Jesus credits his Father as Creator at Revelation 4:11.
    Besides, the resurrected ascended-to-heaven Jesus still thinks he has a God over him as per Revelation 3:12.
    Elohyim is Not the Tetragrammaton.
    The two (2) LORD/Lord's of Psalms 110 are Not the same LORD/Lord.
    The LORD in all Upper-case letters stands for the LORD God, aka Tetragrammaton (YHWH)
    The Lord in some lower-case letters stands for the Lord Jesus, and the Tetragrammaton is Never applied to Jesus.
     
  4. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Ancient Babylon was just the central or starting point, and as the people left the Middle East they took with them their Babylonian religious ideas and practices and spread them in ' all the world '.
    That is why we see similar religious ideas overlapping in today's religious world.
    Even the swastika and the cross, which were common on stamps and plaques, were ancient Babylonian symbols.
    So, it is Babylonian symbols which spread much further and endured than her political strength.
     
  5. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    This is a Biblical myth. The other cultures of the world like China are not remotely related to Babylonia.

    You neglect the evidence that demonstrates that the text of the Pentateuch has it roots in Sumarian, Babylonian, Canaanite, and Ugarit cuneiform texts on clay ablets. There is absolutely no evidence of any Hebrew scripture before ~700-600 BCE, and the early primitive Hebrew before this is a Canaanite derived text.
     
  6. KenS

    KenS Well-Known Member

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    Agreed

    no, just "another Comforter" like unto him. And the God's Holy Spirit is also the Spirit of Jesus Christ.

    Yet nothing was created without Jesus. John 1 and other scriptures.

    Yes... as man. You always have to understand when it is referring to the Word (God) and when it is referring to The Word made Flesh (man). Yet others understood him as Lord and God and Savior (the Son). john 20:28; Titus 1:3; 2:13; Phil 2:6; not to mention how many time the Father and Jesus are mentioned in the same line giving the same things.

    Just quoting the verse.

    Ps 16:2 I say to the LORD, “You are my Lord; apart from you I have no good thing.” - So is the psalmist talking to two different people?
    Isaiah 1: 24 Therefore the Lord, the LORD Almighty, the Mighty One of Israel, declares: “Ah! I will vent my wrath on my foes and avenge myself on my enemies. Two different people?

    Not to mention "The LORD is my Shepherd" and Jesus is the Good Shepherd.
     
  7. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    As we know originally the Bible was Not written in English.
    I find at John 10:11 that although the KJV translated the word fine as good does Not make it the word good.
    In other words, in the Greek, Jesus is the ' fine ' shepherd.

    At KJV Psalms 110 there are two LORD/Lord's mentioned: ( two different spirit persons )
    (1) The LORD in all Upper-Case letters is Not the same Lord that is printed in some lower-case letters.
    KJV uses ALL Upper-Case 'L-O-R-D' letters where the Tetragrammaton stands for LORD God (YHWH)
    (2) Whereas, the Lord with some lower-case letters stands for the Lord Jesus and Not LORD God.

    So, at Psalms 16:2 the Upper-Case LORD (Tetragrammaton ) is only referring to the LORD God.
    Also, at Isaiah 1:24 I see KJV printed Lord in lower-case letters, But in the Hebrew there is No lower and upper-case being used in the Hebrew Scriptures of which Isaiah is part of the Hebrew.
    So, I find the Hebrew Scriptures Tanach says the word of the Lord (Hashem) ... Mighty One of Israel....
    I find No Scripture calling Jesus the Mighty One of Israel.
    So, that is Not a reference to Jesus but to his God and Father.
    Who is the God of heavenly Jesus according to Revelation 3:12________
     
  8. KenS

    KenS Well-Known Member

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    I disagree...

    kal-os' Adjective
    Definition
    1. beautiful, handsome, excellent, eminent, choice, surpassing, precious, useful, suitable, commendable, admirable
      1. beautiful to look at, shapely, magnificent
      2. good, excellent in its nature and characteristics, and therefore well adapted to its ends
        1. genuine, approved
        2. precious
        3. joined to names of men designated by their office, competent, able, such as one ought to be
        4. praiseworthy, noble
      3. beautiful by reason of purity of heart and life, and hence praiseworthy
        1. morally good, noble
      4. honourable, conferring honour
      5. affecting the mind agreeably, comforting and confirming
    Nowhere is it translated "fine"



    [/QUOTE]
    So, I find the Hebrew Scriptures Tanach says the word of the Lord (Hashem) ... Mighty One of Israel....
    I find No Scripture calling Jesus the Mighty One of Israel.

    Is 1:24 Therefore saith the Lord, the LORD of hosts, the mighty One of Israel, Ah, I will ease me of mine adversaries, and avenge me of mine enemies:

    So... we have Lord (no caps); LORD (big caps). So we have to people as the mighty One of Israel? Or is He declared LORD of Lords and KING of Kings?

    It's there... you just have to look for it

    Is 47:4 Our Redeemer, the LORD of hosts is His name, The Holy One of Israel.
    Isaiah 41:14 "Do not fear, you worm Jacob, you men of Israel; I will help you," declares the LORD , "and your Redeemer is the Holy One of Israel.

    John 6:69 We have believed and have come to know that You are the Holy One of God.”
    1 Peter 1:18 knowing that you were not redeemed with perishable things like silver or gold from your futile way of life inherited from your forefathers, 19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb unblemished and spotless, the blood of Christ.
     
  9. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Yes, the rebel Jews were expecting a political Messiah. They did Not like that Jesus was Not going to free them from the Romans at that time frame. Rejecting Jesus on those grounds, does Not make Scripture as wrong but just makes those un-faithful Jews as wrong.

    I think of Revelation as progressive. The Bible book of Revelation.
    For example: Revelation 11:18 B because God will bring to ruin those ruining the Earth.
    The executional words from Jesus' mouth will remove the wicked - Revelation 19:14-16; Isaiah 11:3-4.
    Only the righteous will remain as per Proverbs 2:21-22.
    Then, God, creation and humanity will be at peace.
    To me that is why we are all invited to pray the invitation of Revelation 22:20 for Jesus to come !
    Come and bring the benefit of healing to earth's nations as mentioned at Revelation 22:2 when mankind will see the return of the Genesis ' tree of life ' on Earth for the healing of earth's nations.
     
  10. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    It's clearly obvious that this was directed at and for people of the day. It's used for retention porpoises today to help keep people sticking around for something that is just not going to happen. It's not like 2000 plus years is going to be any deterrent being this works so well for the starry eyed already.
     
  11. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    I agree that nothing was created without Jesus as taught at Colossians 1:15-16.
    So, the pre-human Jesus is part of the "us' found at Genesis 1:26.
    As John also wrote about Jesus at Revelation 3:14 that pre-human Jesus was the beginning of the creation by God.
    Only God existed before the beginning as per Psalms 90:2.
    So, Jesus did Not exist before the beginning as God existed before the beginning.

    I find the Tetragrammaton appears at Psalms 23 that is why KJV put LORD in all capital letters.
    Psalms 110 mentions two (2) LORD/Lord's.
    The LORD in all capital letters stands for the Tetragrammaton.
    The Lord Not in all capital letters stands for the Lord Jesus.
    So, the capitalized LORD mentioned at Psalms 23 is where the Tetragrammaton stands.
    Whereas, Jesus as Shepherd we do Not find the Tetragrammaton (YHWH)
     
  12. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon Veteran Member
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    It still remains that you are expecting the fulfillment of prophecy only from the independent interpretation of your own scriptures. There are probably more than 100 versions or more withing Christianity that disagree with your interpretation. Many have been disappointed in the past left standing on the mountain in their white robes. This a problem. Your view and all these diverse views need explanation. This was and is a problem Judaism, Islam and other religions that neglect a more universal view where God has a universal relationship with humanity all through out human history.
     
  13. Neuropteron

    Neuropteron Member

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    Absolutely.
     
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  14. URAVIP2ME

    URAVIP2ME Veteran Member

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    Sure, there have been those expecting fulfillment and were disappointed.
    That does Not make the Bible as wrong but makes their expectation as wrong.
    To me, the 'explanation needed' is that we have Not yet reached the ' final signal ' of 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 when ' they ' (powers that be) will be saying, " Peace and Security..."
    Since we are now at the ' final phase ' of Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8 of proclaiming about the good news of God's kingdom of Daniel 2:44 being done on such a vast international scale today shows we are nearing the soon coming ' time of separation ' to take place on Earth as described at Matthew 25:31-33,37,40.
    So, wrong guesses or wrong calculations did Not make the Bible as wrong, but just the guesses or calculations as wrong. The coming saying of "Peace and Security.." is God having a universal relationship with humanity.
     
  15. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe this has no context of the second coming. I believe the Kingdom exists at Pentecost and continues into the second coming.
     
  16. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe it is likely to happen before 2044. My calendar is shot for exactness. A mystery got thrown in that turned things topsey turvy.
     
  17. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe the prophecy hasn't failed so the argument that He is just a man doesn't hold water.
     
  18. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    You seem to have forgotten Jesus's prophecy, particularly this line from it:

    "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom."

    It appears that you are claiming that there are some 2,000 plus year old Jews that you think are still wandering around the Earth.
     
  19. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    But it clearly has. See above post.
     
  20. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    Here’s the thing no one’s mentioned: the gospels have Jesus say this. the gospels were all written after Jesus had died, after most — if not all of the 12 had died. So we have documents written after people had died, saying that Jesus would come again before they died. Why would the texts say that, if they knew it to be false?

    Consider that we’re not talking about history, science or news reporting. Consider that we’re talking about theology and metaphysics (odd, considering we’re talking about the Bible...). Could the statement be speaking about a theological, metaphorical, or metaphysical parousia — one that doesn’t live in linear time, or involve empirical, measurable data? Could it possibly be that the book that begins with the world being created in six days, talking snakes, and a woman made from a man’s rib, could also talk about the parousia in other than literal terms? Just maybe?
     
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