The rise of mass shootings

[Mister Emu]

The number of school shootings has increased dramatically the last three decades, and more than doubled this decade compared to the previous one.
School shootings in the United States - Wikipedia

I'd suggest it is indicative of a society that has its community, morality, and hope assailed by isolation, nihilism, and despair.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

The number of school shootings has increased dramatically the last three decades, and more than doubled this decade compared to the previous one.
School shootings in the United States - Wikipedia

I'd suggest it is indicative of a society that has its community, morality, and hope assailed by isolation, nihilism, and despair.

Certainly seems most youths perpetrating these crimes feel they are outsiders to society.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Certainly seems most youths perpetrating these crimes feel they are outsiders to society.

I also have to wonder if the increasing political partisan divide in the US has much of a role in this.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I also have to wonder if the increasing political partisan divide in the US has much of a role in this.

Only indirectly I would guess. A society with less room for grey would seem more isolating for those who are different, I'm supposing.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

Only indirectly I would guess. A society with less room for grey would seem more isolating for those who are different, I'm supposing.

That too. I was thinking more of the different "sides" and their "us vs. them" attitude, and the dehumanising rhetoric around them. It's much easier to shoot someone you've been taught not to see as a full person, for whatever reason. Again, I wouldn't suggest that this is THE reason, just one of many potential contributing factors.

Sadly, I don't think this situation is going to be fixed like a problem in Star Trek, where the single root cause is identified and removed in an hour minus ads.

 

[Mindmaster]

This discussion is about the possible reasons why mass shootings are happening.

I wonder where it all went wrong?

Back during and before the 1980's. It was common for people to leave their doors and windows unlocked or open. It was common even to have gun racks in pickup trucks with 2-3 guns in them loaded 24 hours per day. I knew as a child not to use them without a parent around.

Mass shootings were uncommon in those days and gun control laws were extremely loose compared to what it is today. So what has happened since then? Gun control has become more strict yet shootings continue to happen. So there must be some other reason why people feel the need to go on shooting sprees.

What is your thoughts on the reason why mass shootings have become an issue in the last 30-40years?

The thing that makes all of this happen is the popular social media use among young people which cause them to have no compassion for others. What makes us compassionate? Seeing ourselves in others and sympathizing with their struggles. This generation has nothing - no parents, no actual face to face interaction of any meaningful duration, and worse no feedback loop to tell when they themselves are stepping out of bounds, being unrealistic, or over-emotional. Thus, they over-generalize people and categories and identities become more important than knowing the merit or virtues of an individual. If someone offends them, instead of taking a moment or letting it slide it is a grievous offense to their personal being. The culmination being that any action to whatever extreme is excusable, because the only person they truly care about is themselves. They are completely and utterly broken...

 

[oldbadger]

Certainly seems most youths perpetrating these crimes feel they are outsiders to society.

........ most offenders might feel isolated for various reasons?

The group does tend to victimise and even harass the individual, sometimes psychologically, sometimes even physically.

A person can be estranged even for wearing the wrong footwear, or for a particular hobby, or for any kind of social dysfunction.

We humans do tend to 'group' and 'club' together, but in the case of children and youths this can become very cruel. In the UK many of our teachers don't (have time to?) give a ..... a damn.... about isolation risks of and for the isolated individuals....... We should have better lesson plans and delivery of SOCIAL DISABILITIES and how to support those exposed to such conditions. I wonder what such lessons might be titled?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

........ most offenders might feel isolated for various reasons?

The group does tend to victimise and even harass the individual, sometimes psychologically, sometimes even physically.

A person can be estranged even for wearing the wrong footwear, or for a particular hobby, or for any kind of social dysfunction.

We humans do tend to 'group' and 'club' together, but in the case of children and youths this can become very cruel. In the UK many of our teachers don't (have time to?) give a ..... a damn.... about isolation risks of and for the isolated individuals....... We should have better lesson plans and delivery of SOCIAL DISABILITIES and how to support those exposed to such conditions. I wonder what such lessons might be titled?

Honestly, if this is left to schools, we've failed before we've began.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The number of school shootings has increased dramatically the last three decades, and more than doubled this decade compared to the previous one.
School shootings in the United States - Wikipedia

I'd suggest it is indicative of a society that has its community, morality, and hope assailed by isolation, nihilism, and despair.

And it isn't indicitave of, say, higher ownership rates of semi-automatic rifles or large capacity magazines?

 

[oldbadger]

Honestly, if this is left to schools, we've failed before we've began.

By all means do more, but it needs to be a primary aim and objective in schools to identify at-risk individuals and to be trained to act for the best in as many cases as possible. Psychology pros (and where necessary psychiatrists) should be assigned to groups of schools to deliver pro-care.
I think there should be a lesson in sociology which addesses all of these issues including IT harassment victimisation and bullying, together with IT and other privacy laws.

Surely........ ?

 

[Mister Emu]

I also have to wonder if the increasing political partisan divide in the US has much of a role in this.

Rather, I'd suggest that the increasing partisanship and political discord is another symptom of the rot.

And it isn't indicitave of, say, higher ownership rates of semi-automatic rifles or large capacity magazines?

No, that hasn't changed.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

This discussion is about the possible reasons why mass shootings are happening.

I wonder where it all went wrong?

Back during and before the 1980's. It was common for people to leave their doors and windows unlocked or open. It was common even to have gun racks in pickup trucks with 2-3 guns in them loaded 24 hours per day. I knew as a child not to use them without a parent around.

So - at least in your area - gun owners were not only cavalier about gun safety, but they didn't care about leaving their guns out in the rain to rust?

I don't believe you.

Mass shootings were uncommon in those days and gun control laws were extremely loose compared to what it is today. So what has happened since then? Gun control has become more strict yet shootings continue to happen. So there must be some other reason why people feel the need to go on shooting sprees.

Gun control is a response to gun problems. People don't push for it until gun deaths are so significant that there's a public outcry to do something.

What is your thoughts on the reason why mass shootings have become an issue in the last 30-40years?

Well, you say that things were different back in the day and through the 80s. This happens to perfectly coincide with another event:

1989
Jim Glazier and Karl Lewis of Lewis Machine and Tool Company (LMT), operating a new entity called Eagle Arms, begin producing complete AR-15 rifles for the consumer market. By this time, many of the earlier AR 15 Rifle related patents had expired, thereby opening up the market for complete AR-15 type rifles.

Kidding aside, the AR 15 Rifle has become the most popular general purpose rifle platform since, well, since ever.

AR 15 Rifle - A Brief History & Historical Time Line

When you imagine that truck with a full gun rack in your fantasy of the 1980s, what sorts of guns are on it? Probably bolt-action rifles with small-capacity magazines and double-barrel shotguns, right? Was there a semi-auto rifle or a large-capacity magazine anywhere in sight in your nostalgic vision?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No, that hasn't changed.

Describing AR-15-style rifles:

"The market is saturated. The market is flooded with them," said Stucker. "Everybody ramped up, thinking they were going to be outlawed, and lo and behold they weren't."

In a recent opinion piece in American Rifleman, a publication of the National Rifle Association, NRA President James W. Porter II argued that the ubiquity of the AR-15 rifle in America has essentially made it very difficult to outlaw, as was the case with handguns.

Military-style AR-15 rifles: 'The market is saturated'

That's just one type of semi-auto rifle. Do you think that sales were always "saturated" and this style of weapon was always "ubiquitous?"

As for large capacity magazines: the federal assault weapons ban prohibited magazines with more than a 10-round capacity. It expired in 2004. Are you trying to say it had no effect on the availability of large-capacity magazines?

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

This discussion is about the possible reasons why mass shootings are happening.

I wonder where it all went wrong?

Back during and before the 1980's. It was common for people to leave their doors and windows unlocked or open. It was common even to have gun racks in pickup trucks with 2-3 guns in them loaded 24 hours per day. I knew as a child not to use them without a parent around.

Mass shootings were uncommon in those days and gun control laws were extremely loose compared to what it is today. So what has happened since then? Gun control has become more strict yet shootings continue to happen. So there must be some other reason why people feel the need to go on shooting sprees.

What is your thoughts on the reason why mass shootings have become an issue in the last 30-40years?

I'd say two factors in particular combine to make America the developed world's shooting gallery.

• American culture glorifies not just gun ownership, but gun usage - the shooter as hero or defender of core values. This goes back to fictitious characters played by the likes of Charles Bronson, Clint Eastwood, and later, Sylvester Stallone, Steven Segal and Arnold Schwartzenegger

• Americans are wound tighter each decade now, being continually stoked to feel fear, resentment, and anger.

So, an angry American wants to show the world that nobody will tread on him - he's not taking guff from anybody - and he takes out the school or country music concert or night club.

 

[Mister Emu]

So - at least in your area - gun owners were not only cavalier about gun safety, but they didn't care about leaving their guns out in the rain to rust?

I don't believe you.

Gun racks are traditionally inside the truck.

Do you think that sales were always "saturated" and this style of weapon was always "ubiquitous?"

I think that semi automatic weapons have been widely available for a long time, longer than the period of drastic increase in school shooting incidences.

As for large capacity magazines: the federal assault weapons ban prohibited magazines with more than a 10-round capacity. It expired in 2004. Are you trying to say it had no effect on the availability of large-capacity magazines?

Certainly, a law passed in 1994 did not have an effect on availability of 11+ round magazines before that date. Also, the increase in shootings happened throughout the period of the weapons and magazine regulations of 1994.

 

[dfnj]

Regulating shots per minute should solve the problem and a maximum of 6 bullets per magazine should be enough for people to protect themselves.

There's no reason for machine guns to be legal. You pro-gun types know if stinger missiles were legal we would not have an airline industry. How is having machine guns legal any different?

 

[Curious George]

I'd say two factors in particular combine to make America the developed world's shooting gallery.

• American culture glorifies not just gun ownership, but gun usage - the shooter as hero or defender of core values. This goes back to fictitious characters played by the likes of Charles Bronson, Clint Eastwood, and later, Sylvester Stallone, Steven Segal and Arnold Schwartzenegger

• Americans are wound tighter each decade now, being continually stoked to feel fear, resentment, and anger.

So, an angry American wants to show the world that nobody will tread on him - he's not taking guff from anybody - and he takes out the school or country music concert or night club.

I think there is a lot to this. I think there is more psychological factors in the mix, and also the infamy granted to mass shooters. They are societies trolls. They see the notoriety given to others who commit mass acts of violence and decide they would like to follow suit.

 

[Revoltingest]

Regulating shots per minute should solve the problem and a maximum of 6 bullets per magazine should be enough for people to protect themselves.

There's no reason for machine guns to be legal. You pro-gun types know if stinger missiles were legal we would not have an airline industry. How is having machine guns legal any different?

With the tight regulation of machine guns,
their use in crimes (after the 1930s) is rare.
How big a problem do you think this is?

 

[Mister Emu]

Regulating shots per minute should solve the problem and a maximum of 6 bullets per magazine should be enough for people to protect themselves.

Trained officers hit their targets around 15-25% of the time. That isn't even taking into consideration suppressive fire. Thanks, but I'll keep my three 30rd mags for the AR and two 14rd for the .40. Now, if that isn't enough I'll concede I'm in a real bad spot.

There's no reason for machine guns to be legal. You pro-gun types know if stinger missiles were legal we would not have an airline industry. How is having machine guns legal any different?

Machine guns are heavily restricted. Semi-automatic AR-15s are not machine guns.

 

[tytlyf]

More guns = more gun violence.
More people with guns = more irresponsible people with guns
More irresponsible people with guns = more guns being stolen/purchased privately
A lot of people purchase guns privately with cash, no ID necessary. There is no way the seller knows the background of the person buying.

If the country is awash with weapons, the probability and ease of obtaining a weapon increases.
People don't lock their weapons up and utilize responsible behavior.