1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured The religion you would choose if you realized you're gay

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Remté, Feb 8, 2019.

  1. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    Messages:
    23,815
    Ratings:
    +7,817
    Spirit has many definitions that aren't supernatural -uality is just an, can't think of the right grammar word, ending that fluctuates the meaning in relation to context.

    Dictionary aside, please. It's highly contextual. When I meditate, I have the spirit or sense of reflection or self-actualization and through that spirit or the latter, I can live my morals and go on with life that makes me feel whole.

    No one needs to call it spirituality. The point is, it has many negative connotations and needs to be defined by context. I wasn't raised religious nor "spiritual" if you like, so my views are very neutral. Now I know what people are talking about after a lot of observation and experience and I just think it's a language/bias problem more than anything else. Religious words have that affect depending on where one is from and of course their experiences associated with a said word.
     
  2. youknowme

    youknowme Whatever you want me to be.

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,468
    Ratings:
    +627
    With the way you write you are in no position to be handing out writing critiques. . . .

    I think my sentence is easy enough to understand and I have no intention of rewriting it for you and if you are following the one true God then you are already being led astray and yes I did that on purpose.
     
  3. jfietsam

    jfietsam Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    58
    Ratings:
    +14
    Religion:
    Don't worry about it
    Well I guess it's a good thing I'm most likely not following the One True God then. Instead I'm seeking an understanding of Him, so I can follow Him. I appreciate your concern though. For all I know, God could be the Santa clause for adults. Like when do we find out He's not real? I don't know though, and I'd rather go my whole life played for a fool believing than go my whole life played for a fool not believing...
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    49,601
    Ratings:
    +15,854
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    It's usually considered bad manners to create a wall of text on a forum. I gave that specific example because there is a thread going on about, and it's current.
    You also haven't addressed the countless schisms in Christianity, which pretty much makes it impossible to state any denomination is more accurate or correct over another. God has thus far failed to address this to clarify things for us.
     
  5. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    49,601
    Ratings:
    +15,854
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    It does. But to say spirituality applies to everyone is no different than a Muslim claiming everyone is by birth a Muslim. It's not that the word has negative connotations, it's that it doesn't apply to everyone.
     
  6. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    Messages:
    23,815
    Ratings:
    +7,817
    If we used self-actualization, wouldn't that be a concept everyone can relate to as a human trait (as commonly thought of at the time)?
     
  7. Deeje

    Deeje Deeje
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    8,585
    Ratings:
    +4,372
    Religion:
    Christian JW
    Your eyes are open! Not many will acknowledge that. Nationalistic pride usually prevents them from seeing the truth. The Bible explains why the world is in such a mess....and in direct decline as they relinquished more and more power to this world's real ruler...the one pulling all the strings. (1 John 5:19; 2 Corinthians 3:3-4) In this world, there are no good guys in power.....just better liars. :(

    Solomon, as you probably know, was the son of David and Bathsheba. This woman and King David would have been put to death under Israel's laws because David desired her and took another man's wife in adultery. When she became pregnant, David orchestrated the return of her husband from battle so that she could claim the child was his, but this noble man would not leave his men to indulge in marital pleasure with his wife, so David placed him at the front lines of battle where he would surely be killed....essentially orchestrating his murder. Jehovah sent his prophet Nathan to reprove David and to see if he would repent over this gross sin...not hidden from his God. (2 Samuel 12:1-14) David repented and God forgave him.But David's life was never without conflict from that time onward. He lost the blessing of his God.

    Solomon was a good man, but not sent from heaven.....Jesus was. You make no mention of Jesus as the son of God or the fact that he was with his Father in heaven before being born as a human child. Have you done no study on this or are you avoiding it because its a touchy subject?

    The new covenant never went away...it was just never enjoined on the people of Christendom....the fake Christians that Jesus likened to "weeds" sown in the same field as the wheat.....but they are identified in the harvest time and gathered up and thrown in the oven to be disposed of, before Jesus gathers the wheat. These are the ones he rejects as those he "never knew". He never considered them Christians in the first place, despite their excuses.

    What you are seeing is the steady decline in the conduct of humanity alienated from God and disobedient to his laws. The world is falling apart.....we can all see it. All those institutions we thought we could trust were never trustworthy to begin with.....they just got more and more greedy.The Bible tells us where it all ends so that we can make the right decisions.

    The Bible is about Jews primarily. Under the Patriarchal system, men like Abraham and Job led their extended families in the worship of Jehovah. Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were the forefathers of the nation of Israel, true to God's promise that Abraham's offspring would produce the 'seed' who would save the world.

    But after their release from Egypt under the leadership of Moses, God formed his people into a proper nation and gave them his laws exclusively. Their numbers had increased significantly in Egypt so it necessitated dividing them up into tribes.....the 12 sons of Jacob became the 12 tribes of Israel. This is why God kept them separated from the nations and why he punished them for excursions into false worship. He was recording their actions and his reactions in what would become our scripture as an instruction manual.

    Gentiles were any person NOT Jewish by birth. It was a broad term for non-Jews. All of the ones Jesus called as apostles were Jewish....not from the educated class, but humble, uneducated (by Jewish standards) fishermen. Matthew was a hated tax-collector. Paul was a former Pharisee but he was not one of the 12. His was a special ministry to take God's message to the nations. Paul was a tentmaker by trade, but his education, Roman citizenship and former place in Jewish society were used by Jesus to take the good news into new territories and to give him more credibility before governors and the Jewish hierarchy. He was educated at the feet of Gamaliel, a highly respected man in Jewish religious society.

    It was actually Peter who was directed to the home of Cornelius, a Roman centurion who became the first Gentile convert to Christianity. He had received holy spirit even before baptism to indicate God's blessing on this new aspect of the preaching work, now to include both Jews and Gentiles. Previously people of the nations had to convert to Judaism, but now they could become Christians by submitting to water baptism.

    We have a body of elders who all share the work of caring for the each congregation. We are told to be in subjection to them and they in turn are subject to Jesus. (Hebrews 13:17) They will answer to Jesus for the role that they are assigned. Like the apostles, they are as imperfect as the rest of us and must humbly acknowledge their own faults to God. They can only help us if we co-operate with their Bible based counsel, which is always based on the scripture, not on their own opinions. They will never tell you what to do, but will guide you to scripture that will help you make any necessary choices.

    They have always been a great help to me. A newly baptized person would never be assigned to study with you. We have to study the Bible for quite some time before we would be considered ready for baptism or to conduct a study. Baptism a serious commitment for us, not one to be entered into lightly.

    Let us know how you fare.....all the best.
     
  8. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    49,601
    Ratings:
    +15,854
    Religion:
    God is in the Rain
    I personally wouldn't use the term for a generally application as there a handful of other needs that first must be met before self-actualization is achieved.
     
  9. jfietsam

    jfietsam Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    58
    Ratings:
    +14
    Religion:
    Don't worry about it
    Well I mean, I'm still trying to decide if I believe the New Covenant is the Everlasting Covenant or not. I'm going to attend some Kingdom Hall meetings to dig deeper on it. For all I know, Jehovah's Witnesses may have it right, or for all I know, all organized religions could all hold a piece of the puzzle. Again, I don't blame anyone for being a little closed off to outsiders' views though. There's always people who have to ruin it for others. I know that I've crossed Judaism, Islam, and atheism off the radar undoubtedly. I even consider myself agnostic a lot of times, because I don't believe God proves Himself to be real any more. I'm honestly not a fan of most Christians I've met, but that doesn't mean all Christians are bad. I mentioned earlier how I feel Christians have terrorized this world with no remorse, and they judge others for doing the same things they did to different groups.

    When was the last time a Christian felt remorse when celebrating Thanksgiving? These people welcomed Christians with open arms, but greed and ambition drove the Christians to kill Native Americans and force them to live on the worst parts of the land. Oh and they also killed off their special buffalo unnecessarily as well. I don't go around making blanket assumptions and judgments about Christians though, because there are plenty who do good I'm sure. The ones who do good don't notice those who do wrong either, because they're too busy not judging them to notice, so why should I ruin that for them? Ignorance is bliss.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. jfietsam

    jfietsam Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    58
    Ratings:
    +14
    Religion:
    Don't worry about it
    Well by saying Solomon, I automatically make a blanket statement that Jesus is the son of God, because God said the very same words about Solomon as He did Jesus or very close. This will be My son, and I will be his Father and that His Favor rests on him. It's been a while since, I've read the words, but I believe it's at the beginning of 2 Kings.

    Everyone always talks about the Jews as if they're in the Old Testament, but they aren't called Jews until after the Babylonian invasion. The Jews are a very small remnant of the Israelites. 10 of the tribes of Israel are lost, and no one knows what happened to them. I don't know if Gentile was a term used in the Old Testament to be honest. I could also find no scriptural evidence that the apostles were Jews rather than Romans or perhaps Persians even.

    Before Jesus came, the Jews were invaded by the Babylonians and taken captive. Then King Cyrus of Persia freed them from exile, and they returned to Jerusalem and built the second temple during the reign of King Darius after being persecuted by King Xerxes and King Artaxerxes. Then there's a gap in the testaments, and the New Testament starts off with them under the rule of Caesar. Now the Jews were so happy they didn't have to pay taxes to the Persian government, because the King recognized the God of Israel. Caesar however did not recognize the God of Israel, so the Jews had to pay double taxes which is why they hated the tax collectors. It was my understanding that under the Torah, the priests ran the government, and there was no separation of church and state.
     
  11. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2014
    Messages:
    23,815
    Ratings:
    +7,817
    Religions like Buddhism has the "needs to be met first" others it's spontaneous. Some people feel they get to that moment by realizing they are on a journey without destination. Others feel that having a destination or direction puts a perspective on the journey they are walking. It highly depends on the person. The word spirituality can be religious, such as a mystic experience or self "actualization" whether it takes many lifetimes, one reflection, or just finding meaning of being in a family, community, or so have you.

    I personally don't know how a person can live without some form of self-actualization. I don't use spirituality too much myself; but, regardless, it makes sense in context. It's more personal preference than the word needing to be one-strict-definition to which many English words don't have.
     
  12. Deeje

    Deeje Deeje
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    8,585
    Ratings:
    +4,372
    Religion:
    Christian JW
    Yes, I mentioned that Solomon's reign actually pictured the world under the rulership of Jesus Christ, God's appointed King. This is the new world that we are waiting for.....(2 Peter 3:13; Revelation 21:2-4)

    Yes, we say Jews mostly because the term Hebrew or Israelite is not used so much, but you are right.
    If you read the closing words of Ezekiel, you will see that Israel's 12 tribes and their territories were well established before their exile in Babylon.

    The history of the division and wars between the two factions is a sad and sorry tale.
    Bible Book Number 11—1 Kings — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

    Between Persia and Rome was Greece under Alexander the Great. Daniel prophesied that Alexander the Great would be broken and four weaker rulers would take his place. True to that prophesy, Alexander died at a young age and his empire was broken into four territories and rule over by four of his generals.

    Here is a brief history of Rome just FYI.

    Rome — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY

    In ancient times Jehovah himself was the government for his people. He was usually represented by an appointed mediator, like Moses. When Israel complained that they wanted a human king like the other nations, Jehovah warned them about what it would cost them to have a human king.....but they didn't listen.....so he appointed Kings for them.....they often led the people astray. Jehovah had his prophets to try and keep order but the people were so disobedient. They either ignored or silenced the prophets by killing them. Jesus lamented this. (Matthew 23:37-39)

    In Jesus day, under Roman domination the Jews were under the yoke of this foreign power with its foreign deities and they had little in the way of autonomy. They were chafing and the radicals among the Jews were planning a revolt. (You've read about Masada?)

    Rome allowed the Jews to take care of their own business up to a point but they had no real judicial power which is why they needed Pilate's co-operation to execute Jesus. They were a subjugated nation under the authority of a power they could not fight. With no military at that stage and no real borders to protect because of the diaspora....they were virtually powerless. This is why they wanted their Messiah to be a political Liberator....Jesus he was such a disappointment because of their erroneous expectations, that he is still rejected by them even down to this day.
     
  13. blü 2

    blü 2 Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2017
    Messages:
    3,863
    Ratings:
    +2,291
    Religion:
    Skeptical
    I'm not clear what that might mean, or imply, but I don't think of myself as 'religious' ─ or in any supernatural sense 'spiritual'. Not that it matters here ─ just thinking out loud.

    Thanks for your reply.
     
  14. oldbadger

    oldbadger Skanky Old Mongrel!

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2012
    Messages:
    13,959
    Ratings:
    +3,777
    Religion:
    deist
    DEISM !! :)

    .... and I am a Deist already.

    The most powerful presence in this Deist World is Nature, Mother Nature if you like, and Mother Nature produces and offers the chance of life to so many sexualities and individualities that I wouldn't need to change my ideas about religion no matter what my sexuality or individualities.

    :)
     
  15. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Riboflavin
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2007
    Messages:
    53,651
    Ratings:
    +12,616
    Religion:
    None (atheist)
    The UUs still proclaim Jewish and Christian teachings as some of the sources for their "living tradition," so I wouldn't say they're entirely supportive of LGBTs.
     
  16. jfietsam

    jfietsam Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2019
    Messages:
    58
    Ratings:
    +14
    Religion:
    Don't worry about it
    I'd like to know about Masada, and I'll look into Rome some time after work today, and yes, most of that was rather difficult to figure out. However, I still managed to learn it one way or another.

    If we're waiting on a rule like King Solomon's, then won't we be waiting for the terms of the Old Covenant to come back into effect? To me, that's the only way God truly protects the weak(by destroying the wicked). I mean sure we can live in Disney World and Never Land all we want hoping God will just be nice to everyone, but it does not line up. It's said that if you worship falsely, God will just wipe your society from the face of the Earth and leave a small remnant remaining. That sounds like the "end times" to me. I slept on this Old/New Covenant thing, and I'm sorry, but I'm leaning towards you guys being kind of confused.

    However, your church was started decades ago, and I don't know how much has changed in the church over time. Just as God caught the Jews off guard, He is probably going to catch the Christians off guard as well, and it's left to those who seek truth to figure it out. I don't know, I could be right, but you guys could be right as well. I'm still on the fence, but I'm leaning on the Old Covenant still. I've seen far too much Old Testament stuff happen in my search for truth that I can't turn my back on God, and what I believe He is. I'm just too scared worshipping the god of the New Testament would be worshipping a false god, so I'd rather be safe than sorry. After all, it was Jehovah from the Old Testament who declared Himself perfect in all His ways.
     
  17. DavidMcCann

    DavidMcCann Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2014
    Messages:
    2,549
    Ratings:
    +1,422
    Religion:
    Hellenic Polytheist
    They are in the UK
    What we stand for | Unitarians
     
  18. 9-10ths_Penguin

    9-10ths_Penguin 1/10 Riboflavin
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2007
    Messages:
    53,651
    Ratings:
    +12,616
    Religion:
    None (atheist)
    ... while still being generally supportive of the Bible... i.e. the scripture held up as the motivation for nearly every act of anti-LGBTQ violence in the West for the past 2000 years.

    It's akin to a group that holds Mein Kampf in high regard saying that they're supportive of Jews. Regardless of their actions, we have to ask where the limit of their support is if they're going to uphold that.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  19. DavidMcCann

    DavidMcCann Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2014
    Messages:
    2,549
    Ratings:
    +1,422
    Religion:
    Hellenic Polytheist
    You're committing the old fallacy of Falsus in uno, falsus in omnibus. But then experience of this forum teaches one atheists will commit any fallacy they can get away with in order to attack any religion. The site I pointed to says
     
  20. Riders

    Riders Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2015
    Messages:
    4,614
    Ratings:
    +1,051
    Religion:
    Unitarian Universalism,Pagan,Zen
    They are not Christian Jewish its false, they now have CUUP coven if UU Pagan churches some of which claim to be Wiccan churches some Pagan some are Buhddists some are Atheists.

    However even if they were all Christian and Jewish there are many liberal tolerant Jewish and Christian congregations.

    I personally can speak personally for every UU in the Dallas Fort worth area, they all sponsor Gay Pride day and everyone do volunteer stuff for Gay Pride day. UU is pro GLBT
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
Loading...