The Problem of Dualism in Atheism and Theism

[Fool]

so obviously self is a part of the All, Absolute, Nature, Universe. it exists within and not without.

obviously if self is conscious, then the universe, nature, all, absolute is conscious because self exists in this observation.


the problem arises from the self as an observer believing self is separate from the nature inherent. nothing can exist apart from it. this is literally maya and lila at work. god, love is mind that takes a myriad forms and yet has no exclusive form


what is the problem NOW? got something on your mind? going to deny consciousness?


spirituality is literally a synonym for mentality.


ring the bells hell hath no fury like a woman scorned

 

[epronovost]

Dualism is a largelly abandon philosophical position outside of theology. Today, emergent materialism seems to be the most popular ontological categorisation.

 

[Fool]

Dualism is a largelly abandon philosophical position outside of theology. Today, emergent materialism seems to be the most popular ontological categorisation.

i don't have a problem with that philosophy either. consciousness is not exclusively a material thing as it an energy, physical thing.

it's like the E in E=m(c*c), or einstein stating they were both the same thing too.


but that still doesn't dismiss that the universe is conscious because consciousness isn't exclusive to humans.


and all consciousness is part of the universe, nature.

 

[epronovost]

but that still doesn't dismiss that the universe is conscious because consciousness isn't exclusive to humans.

The fact that consciousness isn't exclusive to humans doesn't mean that anything and everything can be conscious. The only things with consciousness that were observed are animals and possess a neural system. We can say the universe contains stuff that is conscious, but claiming that the universe itself has a consciousness is going against everything we know about consciousness and minds.

PS: energy is material.

 

[Fool]

The fact that consciousness isn't exclusive to humans doesn't mean that anything and everything can be conscious. The only things with consciousness that were observed are animals and possess a neural system. We can say the universe contains stuff that is conscious, but claiming that the universe itself has a consciousness is going against everything we know about consciousness and minds.

PS: energy is material.

ps I already said energy is material. Einstein said it about his equation. Matter is energy.

And just like a human consciousness varies at different levels in different forms, but the universe is conscious. No human is necessary.

If you destroyed every human, consciousness would still exist.

How Your Brain Is Like the Cosmic Web

The universe is made up of the electromagnetic spectrum.

 

[Left Coast]

If you destroyed every human, consciousness would still exist.

Do you have any demonstration of this? Any demonstration that consciousness exists apart from a brain?

 

[Fool]

Do you have any demonstration of this? Any demonstration that consciousness exists apart from a brain?

The problem is simple. Your brain isn't separate from the universe.

The answer is self evident

Does the Human Brain Resemble the Universe? - Neuroscience News

 

[Left Coast]

The problem is simple. Your brain isn't separate from the universe.

My brain is irrelevant. You imagined a world without human brains, or brains at all. Show me the consciousness.

 

[Fool]

My brain is irrelevant. You imagined a world without human brains, or brains at all. Show me the consciousness.

as @epronovost said a neural network is necessary. I've shown you a neural network that isn't consider a brain but is an electromagnetic structure that could be conscious.

If your brain is irrelevant then your dualistic thinking is irrelevant

Universe works like a cosmological neural network, argues new paper

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

obviously if self is conscious, then the universe, nature, all, absolute is conscious because self exists in this observation.

Obviously if there's at least one blue thing in my house, my house must be blue.

 

[Fool]

Obviously if there's at least one blue thing in my house, my house must be blue.

Unfortunately there are more than a few conscious things in the universe with a neural network

And your whole body is a neural network


Human Brain and Cosmic Web: Remarkably Similar

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Unfortunately there are more than a few conscious things in the universe with a neural network

... though all of them that we know of are all on this planet, plus a handful in low earth orbit.

And your whole body is a neural network

Not really, but it's irrelevant since there's much more to the universe than me.

 

[Fool]

... though all of them that we know of are all on this planet, plus a handful in low earth orbit.


Not really, but it's irrelevant since there's much more to the universe than me.

then your comments and thinking are irrelevant.

just because you have limitations of seeing like a second density creature to a third, doesn't mean consciousness doesn't exist at higher level.

We know lower animals have neural networks


Neuroscience for Kids - Invertebrate Nervous System.

just means self wears it's ego on it's sleeve and is pretentious

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

then your comments and thinking are irrelevant.

just because you have limitations of seeing like a second density creature to a third, doesn't mean consciousness doesn't exist at higher level.

If you're going to argue that the universe is conscious, then go ahead and argue it. The argument in your OP - i.e. that the universe is conscious because there are conscious things in it - is nonsense.

We know lower animals have neural networks

Neuroscience for Kids - Invertebrate Nervous System.

We also know that 99.999999...% of the universe is not made up of animals.

just means self wears it's ego on it's sleeve and is pretentious

Funny - seems to me that the pretentious position is yours.

Do you have any reason to think that the universe is conscious besides "consciousness is important to me, therefore it must be important to the entire universe?"

 

[Fool]

If you're going to argue that the universe is conscious, then go ahead and argue it. The argument in your OP - i.e. that the universe is conscious because there are conscious things in it - is nonsense.


We also know that 99.999999...% of the universe is not made up of animals.


Funny - seems to me that the pretentious position is yours.

Do you have any reason to think that the universe is conscious besides "consciousness is important to me, therefore it must be important to the entire universe?"

you're the one who claims to be irrelevant. so yours is irrelevant dualistic thinking having any thought on the subject at all


i'm not claiming to be the most conscious thing in the world and irrelevant at the same time.


i'm an aspect of the universe and the universe is in me; so then part, my part, is conscious on some level of the consciousness spectrum

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

i'm an aspect of the universe and the universe is in me; so then part, my part, is conscious on some level of the consciousness spectrum

This gets back to what I said at thd beginning: there are some blue things in my house, therefore my house itself must be blue.

 

[Fool]

This gets back to what I said at thd beginning: there are some blue things in my house, therefore my house itself must be blue.

you're claiming that your body and brain is irrelevant; so why are your thoughts relevant if your thoughts arise from your brain/body?


something from nothing?

 

[ChristineM]

obviously if self is conscious, then the universe, nature, all, absolute is conscious because self exists in this observation.

I am not that egotistical to consider i have any baring on on the universe

 

[Fool]

I am not that egotistical to consider i have any baring on on the universe

then why are you commenting about it; if you don't have anything to consider?


your humility seems feigned

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

you're claiming that your body and brain is irrelevant;
so why are your thoughts relevant if your thoughts arise from your brain/body?

Don't mistake the argument you've imagined that I'm making for what I'm actually saying.

something from nothing?

"How could there possibly be blue things in my house unless my house is blue, too?!"