The Most “Post-Christian” Cities in America

[blü 2]

The debate boards are open for debate, and there are other boards that aren't. That's how this site works.

And someone has to keep you rascals honest.

 

[Road Warrior]

Strong atheists assert that there is no God, but most atheists simply withhold belief pending evidence. Most atheists have no beliefs. They just lack a particular belief.
Would you explain the difference, then? These are overlapping sets.

When you say "atheist," unmodified, it's assumed you're referring to atheism in its essential or definitive sense.
A definition involves a unique feature, common to all examples of the category. In atheism this feature is lack of belief. It's the single feature common to all the various forms of atheism.
If you need to refer to some other flavor of atheism, such as one asserting that God does not exist, you should add a modifier.
Where's the hypocrisy? They're just making an incompletely supported claim.
I claim the sun will rise tomorrow. This is incompletely supported, but based on strong historical evidence. I don't see it as hypocrisy.

Close, but no cigar. They're not quite equally wrong. There is better support for one assertion over the other.

63 genders. LOL

 

[Road Warrior]

No, no need to bring that up. Now you have only demonstrated that you do not understand how to use a dictionary.

Tell me, who gets to define what a Christian is? What is your best source? Who gets to define what a Buddhist is? Do you ask some cracker from Alabama what a Sikh is or how to even pronounce it?

You make a false claim then fail to prove why your opinion is true. Why? What definition are you disagreeing with?

FWIW, Merriam-Webster doesn't have a definition of of "agnostic atheist", but Urban Dictionary does: Urban Dictionary: agnostic atheist

Off hand, it's a person who doesn't have the balls to claim they are an atheist and seeks to hedge their bets.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You make a false claim then fail to prove why your opinion is true. Why? What definition are you disagreeing with?

FWIW, Merriam-Webster doesn't have a definition of of "agnostic atheist", but Urban Dictionary does: Urban Dictionary: agnostic atheist

Off hand, it's a person who doesn't have the balls to claim they are an atheist and seeks to hedge their bets.

You just confirmed my claim. You also dodged the questions I asked. That is an indication that you know that you are in the wrong.


There are many times that dictionaries fail. For example, it is extremely foolish to use dictionaries for technical terminology. You are trying to redefine what an atheist is and none of the atheists here are accepting that.

 

[Road Warrior]

You just confirmed my claim. You also dodged the questions I asked. That is an indication that you know that you are in the wrong.....

You are free to believe as you wish and I strongly doubt there is anything I can say which will change your opinion of me.

....There are many times that dictionaries fail....

LOL So you make up your own. Awesome.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You are free to believe as you wish and I strongly doubt there is anything I can say which will change your opinion of me.


LOL So you make up your own. Awesome.

No, I can still define atheism with a dictionary. I just have to find one with the correct definition. You seem to have a false definition of what atheism is. You don't seem to realize that when it comes to religion many writers let their personal beliefs interfere. It is not as bad now, but look at a definition of Islam or Buddhism from a dictionary that is more than fifty years old. The definitions are quite often wrong. For atheism they used to be behind the times too. But I just checked and Merriam Webster appears to be spot on with their first defintion:

Definition of ATHEISM

Definition of atheism


1a: a lack of belief or a strong disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods
b: a philosophical or religious position characterized by disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods

Neither of those definitions say that they state that god or gods do not exist,

Let's look at some others for fun:

This was the first definition in my search:

What is Atheism? | American Atheists

Atheism is one thing: A lack of belief in gods.
Atheism is not an affirmative belief that there is no god nor does it answer any other question about what a person believes. It is simply a rejection of the assertion that there are gods. Atheism is too often defined incorrectly as a belief system. To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.

Of course American Atheists is going to have a definition that I agree with.

How about the third in my Google search:



atheism | Definition, Philosophy, & Comparison to Agnosticism

Atheism, in general, the critique and denial of metaphysical beliefs in God or spiritual beings. As such, it is usually distinguished from theism, which affirms the reality of the divine and often seeks to demonstrate its existence. Atheism is also distinguished from agnosticism, which leaves open the question whether there is a god or not, professing to find the questions unanswered or unanswerable.

Oh so close. They almost got it right.

And the fourth entry and the last that I will post:

Atheism - Wikipedia

Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence of belief in the existence of deities.[1][2][3][4] Less broadly, atheism is the rejection of belief that any deities exist.[5][6] In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[1][2][7][8] Atheism is contrasted with theism,[9][10] which, in its most general form, is the belief that at least one deity exists.

And that was quite accurate too. It seems that most sources agree with the definition of atheism that I use. So I may have to take back my claim. Though again a fifty year old dictionary would almost certainly get it wrong.


Since you dodged the questions I asked you I will tell you that the best person to define Buddhism is a Buddhist, the most qualified person to define Christianity is a Christian, the most qualified person to define Islam is a Muslim, and the one best qualified to define atheism will probably be an atheist.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

.

The Barna group, a Christian polling firm, has released its latest list of the most “post-Christian” cities in the country. It’s meant to serve as a warning, but it nicely doubles as a map of places you wouldn’t mind moving to one day. (Notice the lack of cities in the Deep South.)

To qualify as “post-Christian,” individuals must meet nine or more of our 16 criteria (listed below), which identify a lack of Christian identity, belief and practice. These factors include whether individuals identify as atheist, have never made a commitment to Jesus, have not attended church in the last year or have not read the Bible in the last week. These kinds of questions — compared to ticking the “Christian” box in a census — get beyond how people loosely identify themselves (affiliation) and to the core of what people actually believe and how they behave as a result of their belief (practice). These indicators give a much more accurate picture of belief and unbelief in America.​

In other words, these are the cities where religion is most likely to be considered an afterthought. 20 of them have a post-Christian “score” of 50% or greater — only 10 cities fit that description two years ago — and many are found in the Northeast and West Coast.

That list of criteria makes for a nice checklist, too. What’s your score?!

Do not believe in God
Disagree that faith is important in their lives
Have not prayed to God (in the last week)
Have never made a commitment to Jesus
Disagree the Bible is accurate
Have not donated money to a church (in the last year)
Have not attended a Christian church (in the last 6 months)
Agree that Jesus committed sins
Do not feel a responsibility to “share their faith”
Have not read the Bible (in the last week)
Have not volunteered at church (in the last week)
Have not attended Sunday school (in the last week)
Have not attended religious small group (in the last week)
Bible engagement scale: low (have not read the Bible in the past week and disagree strongly or somewhat that the Bible is accurate)
Not Born Again

But at least it gives Godless Americans a goal. The highest market on the list, Springfield-Holyoke, Massachusetts, only has a score of 66%. That includes 87% of people who haven’t read the Bible in the past week, 65% who haven’t attended a Christian church in the past six months, and 47% who haven’t prayed to God in the past week.
source​

.

Aww...can they do us?
Melbourne could get a pretty good score.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Anyone else see the irony in self-righteous atheists clamoring about being free of self-righteous Christians?

You might want to watch out who you're pegging as what. I guess people don't always fit a preconception.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Umm, that's not it as exemplified by the posts of "atheists" on this forum including your own post that includes "ghosts".

Sure it is.

The word ATHEISM speaks to one single issue. That being, whether god(s) exist or not. That. Is. All. It speaks to nothing else.
The only thing you know for sure about a person who identifies as an atheist, is that they lack a belief in god(s). That is the only thing all atheists all share in common. Lack of belief, of course, is not a belief.

Outside of god claims, atheists, theists, deists, and anybody else in the world can and do believe all kinds of other things not relating to god(s).

Does that make it clear?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Translation: I want to be cool, but I'm not sure what I believe.

ROFL. Thanks for the chuckle!

Uh no.

My atheism speaks to my lack of belief in god(s).
My agnosticism speaks to my lack of knowledge about god(s).

I'm both.

Are you looking to insult people, or are you looking to have a genuine discussion?

 

[SkepticThinker]

When a person uses the Royal "We", I question their veracity.

You're claiming there is nothing beyond the physical without evidence. It's like claiming "There is no other life except that on Earth". As far as evidence proves, that's correct.

Atheists are a group of people who don't believe in god(s).
That's. Not. A. Claim.

 

[BilliardsBall]

The debate boards are open for debate, and there are other boards that aren't. That's how this site works.

And someone has to keep you rascals honest.

Who appointed you my judge, especially since you don't know the holy scriptures you claim to be able to refute?

 

[blü 2]

Who appointed you my judge,

Whoever wrote the rules of debate, which incidentally is about judging arguments, not people. That person also appointed you my judge on the same basis. What do you think debate is about, just a group hug?

especially since you don't know the holy scriptures you claim to be able to refute?

I know a number of them reasonably well, approaching them as I'd approach any other ancient document.

A difference between you and me is that it appears you like to live inside the story and believe in magic, and I like to look at the story critically from the outside, and I have no reason to think magic is real. By all means correct me if you think that's unfair.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Atheists are a group of people who don't believe in god(s).
That's. Not. A. Claim.

Actually it is a claim about atheists

 

[Road Warrior]

No, I can still define atheism with a dictionary. I just have to find one with the correct definition. You seem to have a false definition of what atheism is. You don't seem to realize that when it comes to religion many writers let their personal beliefs interfere. It is not as bad now, but look at a definition of Islam or Buddhism from a dictionary that is more than fifty years old. The definitions are quite often wrong. For atheism they used to be behind the times too. But I just checked and Merriam Webster appears to be spot on with their first defintion:

Definition of ATHEISM

Definition of atheism


1a: a lack of belief or a strong disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods
b: a philosophical or religious position characterized by disbelief in the existence of a god or any gods

Neither of those definitions say that they state that god or gods do not exist,

Let's look at some others for fun:

This was the first definition in my search:

What is Atheism? | American Atheists

Atheism is one thing: A lack of belief in gods.
Atheism is not an affirmative belief that there is no god nor does it answer any other question about what a person believes. It is simply a rejection of the assertion that there are gods. Atheism is too often defined incorrectly as a belief system. To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.

Of course American Atheists is going to have a definition that I agree with.

How about the third in my Google search:



atheism | Definition, Philosophy, & Comparison to Agnosticism

Atheism, in general, the critique and denial of metaphysical beliefs in God or spiritual beings. As such, it is usually distinguished from theism, which affirms the reality of the divine and often seeks to demonstrate its existence. Atheism is also distinguished from agnosticism, which leaves open the question whether there is a god or not, professing to find the questions unanswered or unanswerable.

Oh so close. They almost got it right.

And the fourth entry and the last that I will post:

Atheism - Wikipedia

Atheism is, in the broadest sense, the absence of belief in the existence of deities.[1][2][3][4] Less broadly, atheism is the rejection of belief that any deities exist.[5][6] In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.[1][2][7][8] Atheism is contrasted with theism,[9][10] which, in its most general form, is the belief that at least one deity exists.

And that was quite accurate too. It seems that most sources agree with the definition of atheism that I use. So I may have to take back my claim. Though again a fifty year old dictionary would almost certainly get it wrong.


Since you dodged the questions I asked you I will tell you that the best person to define Buddhism is a Buddhist, the most qualified person to define Christianity is a Christian, the most qualified person to define Islam is a Muslim, and the one best qualified to define atheism will probably be an atheist.

...and that differs from what I said in what way?

Disagreed that the best person to define Nazism is a Nazi and the best person to describe mass murder is a mass murderer.

 

[Road Warrior]

Atheists are a group of people who don't believe in god(s).
That's. Not. A. Claim.

I'm a Panentheist Zen Gnostic Christian Secular Democrat Republican Constitutionalist and all around nice guy.

 

[Road Warrior]

Sure it is.

The word ATHEISM speaks to one single issue. That being, whether god(s) exist or not. That. Is. All. It speaks to nothing else.
The only thing you know for sure about a person who identifies as an atheist, is that they lack a belief in god(s). That is the only thing all atheists all share in common. Lack of belief, of course, is not a belief.

Outside of god claims, atheists, theists, deists, and anybody else in the world can and do believe all kinds of other things not relating to god(s).

Does that make it clear?

Awesome. So by that definition, we're all atheists. Congrats!

 

[Road Warrior]

You might want to watch out who you're pegging as what. I guess people don't always fit a preconception.

Why do they care what I think? Should they care?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Actually it is a claim about atheists

 

[SkepticThinker]

Awesome. So by that definition, we're all atheists. Congrats!

Nope.

What is it that you aren't getting here?