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The Missing Passover

Discussion in 'Scriptural Debates' started by Ben Masada, Apr 8, 2009.

  1. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    The Missing Passover

    We are starting Passover here in Israel. But since the wheels of the Truth cannot stop rolling, I want to bring to your attention the Passover of the year 30 CE. It was supposed to be the last one that Jesus would partake of, and he missed it.

    According to John 19:31, that Sabbath was a solemn Sabbath, which is what we call in Hebrew a Shabbaton. That's when a festival falls on the Sabbath. The KJV brings: "For that Sabbath day was a high day."

    That Sabbath was the 14th of the month of Nissan; the first day of Passover. The beginning of it is celebrated with the Passover Supper at the evening of the previous day, or Friday in that year. That's what we call the Seder Meal.

    In the year 30 CE, the Passover Supper was held on the evening of that Friday. No wonder, everyone somehow connected with the events taking place on the Calvary that day, had to leave it in a hurry to prepare themselves and their houses for the Passover Supper.

    Jesus missed that Passover Supper because he was on the cross, and soon afterwards, in the tomb. But then again, how to understand that he celebrated his Passover Supper on the evening of Thursday, which was the 13th of Nissan? He didn't. In Israel, no Jew would celebrate Passover in a different day alone or in a small group when everyone else would be doing it next day.

    This discrepancy is perhaps due to the fact that the gospel writer, writing somehwere in the world, and realizing that the Jews in the Diaspora would celebrate every festival in two days, thought he could have Jesus celebrate the Passover Supper on the 13 of Nissan. It would have worked if Jesus was a Diaspora Jew; but in Israel there is no such a thing.

    There is an option in Judaism to celebrate the Passover later, even a month later, if the person was not for some reason ready for it; but NEVER before. It means that, definitely, Jesus missed that Passover celebration, because his reported "Last Supper" did not have anything to do with the Passover Supper.

    The gospel writer had either no idea what he was writing about or simply thought we would never find out about his blunder.

    Ben
     
    #1 Ben Masada, Apr 8, 2009
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2009
  2. jtartar

    jtartar Well-Known Member

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    Ben,
    Could it be that it is you who are a little mixed up on the dates??
    Jesus was born around 1BC. The Bible tells us that Jesus was about thirty when he came to John to be baptized in the Jordan River, Luke 3:23. The date of Jesus baptism was 29CE on Nisan 14, which was after sundown on what is now, Thursday evening, then Friday.
    Remember, in those days the day started at sundown and ran to the next sundown. In those days, Jesus was put to death on Friday, and they had to take his body down before the evening of that day, because at sundown started the Sabbath, which was Saturday, but we celebrate the Sabbath on Sunday.
    If you notice John 2:13, you will see the first Passover that Jesus celebrated after being anointed at his baptism. Jesus celebrated two more Passovers, and on the third Passover Jesus was put to death by the Jewish leaders, even though they used the Romans to do the actual murder of Jesus.
    Jesus was put o death on Nisan 14 of the year 33CE, which was Friday morning to them, and was taken down from the stake before sundown, because sundown started the Sabbath, Saturday, then.
    This date was called a Great Sabbath because the date of Passover of Nisan 14, 33CE fell on a regular Sabbath day, John 19:31. Jesus was nailed to the stake around 9:00 oclock in the morning. Around Noon darlness fell over the area. About 3:00 oclock Jesus died. They had to remove Jesus before sundown, because sundown started the Sabbath.

    It is very interesting that Daniels prophecy about the coming of the Messiah points to the date of Jesus being baptized as 29CE, exactly when it occurred. This prophecy is at Dan 9:24-27, about the 70 weeks. In verse 25 it tells about the going forth of the word to rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah would be 7weeks and 62 weeks. These weeks actually amounted to Years, not days. 7 weeks = 49years, 62 weeks =434 years = 483 years. History tells us that the twentieth year of Artaxerxes was the date that the word went out to rebuild Jerusalem, Neh 2:1-6. When we take into account that there was no 0 year, and that the 20th year of Artaxerxes was 455BC, we come to 29CE, the exact date that Jesus was baptized.
    Jesus then taught for 31/2 years and died on Nisan 14, of the year 33CE. Jesus never missed a Passover. It was against the Mosaic Law Covenant for a male to miss any Passover.
     
  3. Charity

    Charity Let's go racing boys !

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    Hello Ben!
    This is an interesting thread but I have the same dates listed that jtartar has listed in his post. When looking these up the references appeared to coincide with his dates.
    How are you doing? Do you still like cookies? I hope this finds you well and blessed.
    I will return and see how you counter these dates..I know you will come up with some good information that we haven't uncovered.
    Have a blessed passover......
     
  4. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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  5. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    Shalom Charity,

    I am doing fine thanks the memory of your cookies. That's what I have been having lately since you have done a disappearing on me. Believe me, when I wrote this thread, I thought to myself: I will post at the Religious Forums to find out where is Charity. Bingo! There you are, and I am glad to hear from you.

    Now, regarding the numbers that Tartar has listed, if you are referring to the prophecy of Daniel 9:24-27, I found them all wrong. All pure assumptions that have nothing to do with Jesus. There is no logic for people of a different religion to plagiarize the prophecy of another and interpret it according to themselves. There is no light in them. (Isa. 8:20)

    Ben: :drool:
     
  6. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    To which gospel do you refer here?
     
  7. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    Anyone. I quoted John because he is the only one to remind us that the Sabbath after the crucifixion was a solemn or high holiday. In Hebrew, a Shabbaton, which is when a festival falls on the Sabbath.

    Ben: :rainbow1:
     
  8. sojourner

    sojourner Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006

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    No. "Any one" won't do. Since John is the only one that reminds us of the Shabbaton, then it's specifically John we need to deal with. I'll have to reread it and get back to you.
     
  9. fisherman1

    fisherman1 fisherman

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    Hello Ben,
    It is interesting that you breached the subject of the Jesus celebrating (or not) the Passover on Thursday and not Friday. I've been doing a little study on the events that took place that evening. Jesus had told his disciples to go and prepare for the Passover(Matt 26:18,19) for the Day of Unleavened Bread arrived and the Passover must be killed (MK 14:12,Luke 22:7).After the disciples make the necessary arangements, Jesus sits with the disciples in the evening to eat the Passover (Matt 26:20,Mark 14:17). I believe that Jesus did eat the passover that night because he had to fulfill the law perfectly and to neglect such an important event would be breaking God's commandment. After the supper ended (John 13:2-3) Jesus washed the disciples feet (John 13:4-13:11). Jesus then returned to the table and sat down (John 13:12). Jesus then predicted His betrayal (John 13:18,21,Matt 26:21,Mark 14:18, Luke 22:21,22). He then makes known His betrayer(Matt 26:23-25,Mark 14:20,21, John 13:26,27 and Luke 22:21). Now when Jesus gave Judas the sop to eat, could that have been the unleavened bread dipped into the bitter herbs?
    Jesus then served communion which is the Christian passover. Jesus broke the bread which was representative of His body and gave it to His disciples then gave them the wine which was his blood. He Himself was the passover lamb which the disciples were figuratively eating. He had said earlier in the Gospel that "unless you eat the flesh of the son of man and drink his blood you have no life in you". This is how I read the events and interpret them at the Last Supper.
     
  10. Charity

    Charity Let's go racing boys !

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    It is good to hear from you Ben......Peace and Blessings to you...I will go back and look at these dates again....Thank you I figured you would set me straight...:D
     
  11. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    Don't take too long! :drool:
     
  12. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    Please, do it.
     
  13. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    Sorry Fisherman, but your little study on the events of that evening was not good enough. According to Judaism, the Passover Feast of Unlevened Bread cannot be celebrated before the 14th of Nisan, which that year fell on the Sabbath. So, the evening for that celebration was Friday night when Jesus was already in the Tomb.

    There is an option in Judaism to celebrate the Passover Feast even a month or so later, in case one is for some reason impeded
    to celebrate with everyone at the same time, but NEVER before the 14th of Nisan.

    The day the gospel writers set Jesus with his disciples celebrating that Passover Feast was Thursday evening, which was the 13th of Nisan. That's a no, no.

    If you ask me, that private Passover Feast never happened. The gospel writers committed a terrible blunder by reporting something that never happened. Therefore, Jesus missed the Passover that year.
     
  14. S-word

    S-word Well-Known Member

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    Herod who died sometime in April of 4B.C., after a failed suicide attempt, knew from the wise men that Jesus was about two years old, and that it was according to the information that he received from the wise men as to the time that they had first sighted the star that had heralded the birth of Jesus, that he determined the age of the boys who were to be slaughtered as two years and below, which means that Jesus was born about 6B.C.,or seven B.C., when there were conjunctions between Jupiter, saturn and Mars, which preceded the arrival of the comet in 5 B. C., with a huge tail that remained visible in the night sky for some 70 days, which led the wise men to Galilee where they found the two year old Jesus.
     
    #14 S-word, May 2, 2009
    Last edited: May 2, 2009
  15. smitten508

    smitten508 Member

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    It is interesting that you seem to have a deep rooted dislike of Christians... I love the Jewish culture, it birthed and developed into its evelution of Christianity. The Passover isn't really an issue is it? It's obvious that you don't believe in messiah, so why take SO much time and effort to discredit those of us who serve God of Israel?
     
  16. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    If anyone got it right it was probably John, but raising this to the level of "terrible blunder" seems a bit much ...
     
  17. S-word

    S-word Well-Known Member

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    You are correct in assuming that the gospel according to the written words of John the beloved disciple who was the only one of the four authors of the gospels to have walked and talked with Jesus is the only account that is correct. And according to John, the last supper was simply that, the last supper, that Jesus had with his closest friends, before the day of Preparation to the Passover, the day on which the Paschal lambs of which Jesus was the reality, were slaughtered.

    Quote... Ben masada...Therefore, Jesus missed the Passover that year.

    Wrong Ben, that year, Jesus was the Paschal Lamb who was slaughtered on the day of Preparation to that Passover.
     
    #17 S-word, May 5, 2009
    Last edited: May 6, 2009
  18. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    How about the other Jews who were crucified just like Jesus, were they less than Paschal Lambs? You speak of Jesus' crucifixion as if he was the only Jew to be crucified by the Romans. Read Josephus.
     
  19. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    Reporting something that never happened is worse than a blunder. It's scholastic dishonesty.
     
  20. Ben Masada

    Ben Masada Well-Known Member

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    I have nothing against Christians but everything against Christianity for promoting a distorted image of Judaism to the world, as if there is room in Judaism for Hellenistic innovations.

    There is no natural link between Judaism and Christianity, but only human fabrications.

    I do believe in the Messiah, but the collective Messiah, which is taught by the Prophet Isaiah.

    You are mistaken about serving the God of Israel. Christians serve the god of Paul. The God of Israel was served by Jesus, whose Faith was Judaism.
     
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