metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
OK, whenever you do something like the above, it usually means I screwed up somewhere, so then I have to figure out where? Can't find it. OK, I give-- what gives?
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The Messiah. Has he come? When will he come? Was it Jesus?
- Thread starter Domenic
- Start date
Kolibri
Well-Known Member
Jesus, according to scripture, has two duties in his current life. He is King of God's Kingdom and a Priest in the manner of Melchizedek. The legal right to the kingship comes from a bloodline to Jesus' adoptive father Joseph. His Priestly duties do not come from a bloodline, but by direct appointment.
I am sorry I should have broken down my thought more.
For the Christains and Muslims he came as Jesus (pbuh) , for Jews not yet .
Btw we the Muslims called the Christians in Arabic , المسيحين Al-Messiheen , which mean in English the Messiah-followers or the Messiahains for exemple :America , Americans ...etc
Scott C.
Just one guy
No, he hasn't. Yes, he will. No, it wasn't Jesus.
But y'all are free to have your own messiah, and he can whomever you want.
I have a question sir, as I honestly do not know the answer. Here you go:
The Old Testament prophesies of a Messiah. Christians believe that some prophesies were filled in the life of Jesus. Other Messianic prophesies will be fulfilled through the second coming of Jesus. Jews recognize the same OT prophesies (I think), but do not believe that any of them were fulfilled in Jesus. If a Christian and a Jew sat down together to review the OT prophesies of the Messiah, which neither believe have yet been fulfilled, would there be similarities in their expectations for the Jesus who will return (Christian idea) and the Messiah who has not come yet (Jewish view)?
Proxy bloodline? Yeah right. The order of Melchizedec applies to any human. IOW you are your own Priest without needing another's family bloodline. But people need Jesus to fulfill their voids of life and they use the Bible to prove it. Why not use proof outside the Bible?
truthofscripture
Active Member
The messiah has, according to scripture, come, been killed, and sat upon his throne. He sat on that throne when the Gentile times ended. Doing the math in the scriptures, as they indicate that Jerusalem was destroyed in October 607 B.C., and that Jesus would take his throne 2520 years later, the Gentile times ended and Jesus took his throne in 1914 in October. "He comes who has the right".
truthofscripture
Active Member
What do you mean by "do we need one at all?" The messiah coming has nothing to do with whether or not we need one, even though it's the best method of handling the question of sacrifices for forgiveness of sin. It has more to do with what God purposes for us. We cannot affect God's purposes.
truthofscripture
Active Member
Remember Jesus saying religions are false? And Revelation saying they will be destroyed? That includes them all, including Judaism, which was created AFTER the death of Jesus who WAS the messiah and the son of God the Almighty. It's important also to keep in mind that all theological schools are extremely biased, and almost all translations of the scriptures and all the concordances are falsely translated to guide the reader to a predetermined conclusion. In order to arrive at an accurate understanding of the word of God, one must locate and study an ACCURATE translation and use an ACCURATE concordance if one wishes to get to the truth of the matter. The scriptures say there is only one path to God, not many.
Kolibri
Well-Known Member
What proof do you have in mind?
Domenic
Active Member
The Tanakh is a forgery. It is called the Traditional Hebrew Text. It was taken from the Septuagint, and changed by the Mosoretes, a branch of Samaritans. These are the false Jews. The Tanakh (traditional Hebrew Text) should match the Septuagint if it is only a copy…it does not. In all Christian Bibles, the Hebrew section is taken from the Tanakh. Thus the Hebrew section in all Christian Bibles are a copy of a forgery.
I understand spending years seeking the truth. I understand along the line somewhere, one has to draw a line. We both understand what God say is true today, true tomorrow, and true forever…he is not a changing God…that we can trust.
God would have no need to update scriptures, change his plans, change anything he gave to man, not any symbols he gives, or used. The 7 candlestick he gave to his people. It is in the Bible. No place in the Bible, or scrolls did God replace that with what some call, the Star of David. This was the star taken from Egyptian false Gods by Solomon when he got into black magic. Today this star is on the flag flying over the Holy Land. Some have made up a story, the star is fron David’s shield…there is no record of that…it is a lie.
From what you wrote, you sound like you believe in God a lot. God holds nothing from his people. Go to him. Ask him to show you the truth…he will.
Domenic
Active Member
DITTO.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
I've done the homework for almost 40 years now, including sources that deal with the Hebrew and Koine Greek texts. Even some Christian theologians, including one who I took a three-day seminar with, know that Jesus cannot be declared the Messiah at this time since he didn't fulfill all or even most of the prophecies. They tend to believe he will with his second coming, but until then...
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
More nonsense.
Yes, there would be some similarities. But the Christian idea has developed into something that is far different than the Jewish one. (And, just for the record, the "Old Testament" is a Christian book, translated by Christians, with Christian ideas. Our canon is the Tanakh, and is neither "old" nor replaceable.)
And then there's the problem is with the idea that fulfilling only some of the requirements means anything.
There have been many people, both before and after Jesus, who have fulfilled some of the requirements. The messiah will must fulfill all of the requirements in his lifetime, if he fails to do so he is a false messiah. It's all or nothing when it comes to the messianic prophecies.
roger1440
I do stuff
The Gospels don't seem to know anything about "a Priest in the manner of Melchizedek". I guess they forgot. With all the stoning going on and being chased by fellow Jews, they were kind of busy. Yeah, that's it.
Domenic
Active Member
1914 is a JW thing. They have names many times when the end would come. When he didn't come in 1914, they said he was invisible. Jesus said all people would see him when he returned. Nobody saw him?
truthofscripture
Active Member
King of ancient Salem and “priest of the Most High God,” Jehovah. (Ge 14:18, 22) He is the first priest mentioned in the Scriptures; he occupied that position sometime prior to 1933 B.C.E. Being the king of Salem, which means “Peace,” Melchizedek is identified by the apostle Paul as “King of Peace” and, on the basis of his name, as “King of Righteousness.” (Heb 7:1, 2) Ancient Salem is understood to have been the nucleus of the later city of Jerusalem, and its name was incorporated in that of Jerusalem, which is sometimes referred to as “Salem.”—Ps 76:2.
After Abram (Abraham) defeated Chedorlaomer and his confederate kings, the patriarch came to the Low Plain of Shaveh or “the king’s Low Plain.” There Melchizedek “brought out bread and wine” and blessed Abraham, saying: “Blessed be Abram of the Most High God, Producer of heaven and earth; and blessed be the Most High God, who has delivered your oppressors into your hand!” At that Abraham gave the king-priest “a tenth of everything,” that is, of “the chief spoils” he had acquired in his successful warfare against the allied kings.—Ge 14:17-20; Heb 7:4.
Kolibri
Well-Known Member
Through the centuries, scribes meticulously copied these books. During the Middle Ages, a group of Jewish scribes known as the Masoretes carried on that tradition. The oldest complete Masoretic manuscript is the Leningrad Codex, which dates from 1008/1009 C.E. However, in the middle of the 20th century, some 220 Biblical manuscripts or fragments were discovered among the Dead Sea Scrolls. Those Biblical manuscripts were more than a thousand years older than the Leningrad Codex. A comparison of the Dead Sea Scrolls with the Leningrad Codex confirms a vital point: While the Dead Sea Scrolls contain some variations in wording, none of those variations affect the message itself. - A3 How the Bible Came to Us — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
*** w95 5/15 pp. 27-28 What Is the Masoretic Text? ***
Where the Masoretes felt that the text had been altered or copied incorrectly by previous generations of scribes, instead of changing the text, they made notes in the side margins. They noted unusual word forms and combinations and the frequency with which these appeared within an individual book or within the entire Hebrew Scriptures. Additional comments to help copyists in cross-checking were also noted. A system of abbreviated “codes” was developed to record this information with extreme brevity. In the top and bottom margins, a type of miniconcordance listed parts of related verses that were commented on in the notes in the side margins.
The most renowned system was perfected by the Masoretes in Tiberias, by the Sea of Galilee. The families of Ben Asher and Ben Naphtali of the ninth and tenth centuries C.E., possibly Karaites, became particularly prominent. (About the year 760 C.E., a Jewish group known as the Karaites called for stricter adherence to the Scriptures. Rejecting the authority of the rabbis, the “Oral Law,” and the Talmud, they had greater reason to guard the Bible text systematically. Certain families from this group became expert Masoretic copyists.) Although differences existed between the pronunciation methods and notes of these two schools, the consonants of their texts differ in fewer than ten places in the entire Hebrew Scriptures.
I am still awaiting your reveal @Domenic, at the end of your condensing your notes in the other thread on this matter.
Kolibri
Well-Known Member
You are correct, the 4 Gospel accounts do not elaborate on Jesus role as a priest. In the Christian Greek Scriptures, Melchizedek is only mentioned in the book of Hebrews. (Heb 5:6,10; 6:20; 7:1,10,11,15,17) Jesus and his anointed followers are mentioned to be priests/future priests in more than Paul's letters though. (Re 5:10; 20:6)