"THE LORD'S DAY IS THE SABBATH DAY NOT SUNDAY ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURES

[3rdAngel]

Rev 1:10, is with respect to the "Lord's Day", which would the day of the Lord's rest, which would be the Sabbath. It would a weekly sabbath which foreshadows the millennium, when the "dragon" is thrown into the pit, and the earth will rest from chaos for a thousand years. Right now, the "deceiver"/"dragon"/"devil" is the ruler of the world. (John 14:30), and his authority is put on the "beast" (Rev 13:4), and "all who dwell on the earth will worship him" (Rev 13:8), and the "woman"/"Babylon the Great" will sit on the beast. Keep in mind that the Gentile churches are harlot daughters of the "woman". (Rev 17:5).

Did look into that @2ndpillar, the wrong Greek words are being used and the context is to the presence of Jesus in the Heavenly Sanctuary (seven golden candlesticks) so cannot be the day of the Lord or the second coming.

 

[3rdAngel]

Since his accusation was false on all levels, and also against the rules of the forum, I don't see why I would be good at it.

What accusations were not true? You already told us that you were a Christian turned Atheist right? Is that not true now? Happy to post the evidence again and eat the popcorn if you like. You are the one making the false claims and accusations. You were a Christian right and now your an atheist right who spends most of your time arguing about God and the bible?

 

[3rdAngel]

I would disagree with you. The intent is clear. I am not adding any. An excessively literal approach is an abuse of exegesis. And let's say that you are right. Does that still excuse you and 3rd's bad behavior? 3rd would get angry because I would not play his little game when it came to supporting my claims. Instead I just repeated the questions that he dodged again and again and again until he finally had to answer them. Now there are definitely more posts than I can count on the fingers of one hand that have examples of him running away from questions. I thought that it was much better to actively show him guilty of what I claimed that he was doing rather than doing the near impossible, quoting all of the posts where he did not answer those questions. There is more than one way to support one's claims and when someone is not doing something it can be all but impossible to prove it with quotes. It was much better to catch him in the act again and again.

lol, you are projecting again, I am not angry at all just enjoying the show

 

[3rdAngel]

I have used his same techniques on him just to see how he operates and he reacted just as I predicted that he would

Did you now lets test your claims and accusations and see if there is any truth in them....

ignored answering the specific questions I asked him as though he didn’t see them;

I think your projecting. Please post me the links to the specific questions you believe I have not answered and lets discuss them and prove your claims. If you cannot all you are doing is copying your friend who does not address any of my post and scripture content that is in disagreement with Him, then projects what other people are saying to him making false claims and accusations that he is not able to prove and than when challenged runs away from the discussion. Are you copying your friend Soapy or is your friend copying you. Can you prove your claims? Or are you projecting and simply not telling the truth? If you believe I have missed something lets discuss it and post me the link please.

claiming that I didn’t answer him when it is clear that I did because I explicitly stated an answer

Replying to a post is not the same as addressing the content in the post that is in disagreement with you. For example, you have been provided many posts showing how you simple did not respond to any of the content in the posts you were responding to. Evidence was provided to you with some examples proving that you did not respond to the post content you were responding to. Post # 1152 is the latest example of you not responding to the post content and the scriptures in them that are in disagreement with you for which you had no response. While other examples were already posted in post # 942 linked, showing the same thing. Your second claim is also proven to be a false one.

used ‘flooding’ as a means of covering himself by scattering his footprints and then claiming quite rightly that I didn’t read all of his post (too right, I know why he wrote so much!!)

This is great. Thank you. You have just proved my point. You do not read my posts and do not respond to the post and scripture content that proves why you are in error. Thank you for this - case closed. You just proved to everyone that everything I have been saying about you is true

 

[3rdAngel]

Speaking of questions (qu?),

SZ said: There are questions that you have not answered. That is how you run away. How do I prove this? By continually asking the same questions.
SAM. said: Good advice. Let’s try this out; let’s see if it works.
1. SZ, you accused me of repeating false personal attacks with no evidence.
I responded: “False personal attacks? In my post above?” Where?
SZ runs away.

2. How can anyone have a serious discussion with someone who :--
a Is unable to provide one shred of evidence for accusative statements he has made?
b Pretends he is not answering honestly because the person he has accused falsely is not debating honestly!
c Runs away because he is afraid to admit that he has no evidence.
?
SZ runs away again.

3. Where did 3rdAngel distort what SZ?
SZ runs away.

Do you see? To prove my case I only need to ask the questions that you run away from.

This right there above says it all.... Popcorn time.

 

[3rdAngel]

Nope, nope, nope. Sorry that just won't do. You are supposed to be my acolyte.

Yes, yes, thankyou we are in agreement here. Soapy and you have the exact same styles in discussion. I will not call it debating because it is not. It is more like ignoring a discussion, project, and deflect with false claims and accusations you cannot prove and than run away when challenged to prove your claims

 

[3rdAngel]

Oh yea @Soapy. I did not forget you dear friend lets have a discussion. I will need to spread my response to your last post to me over a few posts. I hope you are able to have a discussion with me to see if your claims in your post are true or not true. I will address all your post section by section and scripture by scripture to see if what you are saying is true or not true. I hope you can extend me the same courtesy. If I am wrong in what I am sharing with you than I certainly want to know it. I hope if you are wrong you feel the same way. So lets start....

3rdAngel said: ↑ I see so there is a flood of scripture that disagree with your teachings. Does this not worry you? It should.

Your response here...

Of course there would be scriptures that appear to disagree with me… Goodness, even the Jews claimed against Jesus Christ!!!

Lets talk detail and bring everything to the light of Gods Word. We should not be afraid to test what we believe to be true because if what we believe the scriptures teach should not be in contradiction to the scriptures because the bible does not contradict itself so if we are holding on to a belief that is in contradiction to other scriptures on subject matter we can know that perhaps this might be a red flag that perhaps what we believe in regards to scripture might be in error. I will address your post here with a detailed scripture response. I hope in good faith if you disagree with anything that I have posted you might address my post content, nor providing false claims and accusations you are not able to prove but do what I do with you, providing evidence to show why I am in disagreement with you. Our mindset therefore should be to believe and follow what Gods Word says because our word unsupported by the scriptures is only our words in disagreement with Gods' when only God's Words are true (Romans 3:4) and we should believe and follow them (Acts 5:29).

3rdAngel said: ↑I see so your agreeing with me you have no scripture that says Gods' 4th commandment has now been abolished as we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest in honor of the resurrection of Jesus?

Your response here...

A crafted statement from you. Firstly, you are asking for direct proof of statement that could not possibly have existed when the scriptures were written. You know that and that is why you persist in asking for proof. That is deceitful. That shows your colours right off the bat!

For context you are responding to my post # 1081 linked that provided a lot of scripture that is in contradiction to your view that the Sabbath is any day of the week for which you never provided any scripture support for your view. In this section of your post instead of addressing any of the scriptures which are not my words but Gods' Word that is in disagreement with you all you do is deflect the scriptures with claims of false accusations you are unable to prove. You were provided scripture in the linked post proving you were in error. You also admitted that there was no scripture in the bible that says Gods' 4th commandment of the 10 commandments that says Gods' 4th commandment "seventh day" Sabbath has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day of rest. Then your response is "I cam deceitful for asking you to prove your claims with scripture when you did not provide any? The evidence to our discussion here is scripture and you have not provided any accept your words in disagreement with Gods' Word which are the scriptures that are in disagreement with you. - So your argument here dear friend is with God not me because you are unable to prove your claims with the scriptures.

more to come...

 

[3rdAngel]

Next, I showed you that Jesus stated that ‘IN TIME TO COME’ worship would no longer be …. In Jerusalem. You seem to shudder in fright at this revelation since you do not even reference it as being TRUTH!! So, again you are living in a deceitful state of being regarding what you think you are saying.

Your comments here had nothing to do with the post you were responding to earlier. So what? Where does it say in Jesus conversation to the woman at the well that Gods' 4th commandment has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday worship as a holy day of rest in honor of the resurrection of Jesus? - It doesn't. Furthermore where does it say in the teachings of Jesus we are now free to keep the Sabbath any day of the week? - There is no scripture. Finally, what does the scripture say is the Sabbath day? We read in Exodus 2:8-11 which is God's 4th commandment in Exodus 20:10 But the SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH OF THE LORD YOUR GOD! No these dear friend according to the scriptures are Gods' Words not my words and you say NO Gods Sabbath is now any day of the week. Where is your scripture evidence to support your view. You have none do you. Therefore all you have is your words denying and arguing with Gods' Word that is in disagreement with you. When do you think you will start addressing any of the scriptures in the post you are quoting from that are in disagreement with you. So far you have simply ignored everything from scripture that shows why you are in error.

‘In time to come…’ Gentiles became part of God’s family along with Jews.

No not exactly. You mean gentile believers are grafted in to Christ becoming Gods' true Israel with Jewish believers. According to the scriptures, God never made the new covenant promise with gentiles (unbelievers). God new covenant promise was only ever made with Gods' true Israel (see Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Hebrews 8:10-12). According to Paul in Romans 11:13-26 gentile believers are now grafted into Christ with Jewish believers and we are all now one in Christ through faith in Gods' Word (see Romans 9:6-8; Romans 2:28-29; Galatians 3:28-29; Ephesians 2:11-13; Colossians 3:11; Romans 10:11-13).

Finally, it is not irreverent to worship God n ANY DAY ONE CHOOSES… God said to keep the Sabbath Day holy…. If YOUR SEVENTH DAY is NOT the Jewish SEVENTH DAY (Friday sun-down to Saturday sun-down) because you are NOT a follower of first century Jewish traditions THEN who is going to demand that you should follow first century jewish traditions anymore than a gentile can be demanded to have his make child circumcised. What was the Sabbath day established for? Was it not to REST from every day work and WORSHIP GOD and DO GOOD? If you keep Tuesday as your Sabbath, if you do good, rest from work, and worship God…. are you ‘breaking the law’?

Now lets discuss the detail of your words and claims here and compare it to what the bible says. You claim here and elsewhere that we can keep God's Sabbath on any day of the week we choose. Now where in all the bible does it say that we can now keep God's Sabbath on any day of the week that we choose when God says in the 4th commandment of His 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken according to Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and that if we break anyone on them we stand before God in sin in James 2:10-11, says that the Sabbath is the SEVENTH DAY OF THE WEEK in Exodus 20:10? Your words here are simply your words unsupported by any scripture, while the very scriptures from Gods' Word are in disagreement with what you are claiming and saying. As posted earlier, there is no such thing as a Jewish Sabbath. There was no Jew and no Israel when God created the Sabbath for all mankind. There was only Adam and Eve (see Genesis 2:1-3). Of course the bible Sabbath starts from sunset Friday to sunset Saturday our time. This is bible time as given in Hebrew time re-conning which comes from Genesis 1:1-31. According to the scriptures the Sabbath day was established by God in Genesis 2:1-3 as a holy day of rest as a memorial of creation and a celebration of God being the creator of heaven and earth in Gods' 4th commandment (see Exodus 20:8-11). It has nothing to do with resting every day of the week according to the scriptures. Jesus says it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath day in Matthew 12:1-12 and there is nothing that you have provided here from the scriptures that support your view that we can keep the Sabbath any day of the week. Gods Word in disagreement with your words says that the Sabbath day is the seventh day of the week and it is a holy day of rest and a memorial of creation in Exodus 20:8-11 that Jesus says was made for all mankind in Mark 2:27. There is a lot of scripture in disagreement here with you. Does this not concern you? It should.

3rdAngel said: ↑ So tell me are you not worried when Jesus says if we follow man-made teachings and traditions like Sunday worship that leads many to break Gods' 4th commandment that they are not worshiping God in Matthew 15:3-9? You should be if breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments is sin (see James 2:10-11) and practicing known unrepentant sin after God gives us a knowledge of the truth brings us into the danger of the judgement to come (see Hebrews 10:26-31).

Your response here...

It was Jesus who brought in the new covenant between God and man, since if the first covenant had been sufficient there would be no need to bring in another. See Hebrews 8:6-8.

You do not know what these scriptures are talking about do you. Tell me what you think they mean? You do know that the old covenant includes all the ceremonial laws, Levitical Priesthood, the earthly Sanctuary, the laws of animal sacrifices and sin offerings that all pointed to Jesus as God's sacrifice for the sins of the world and the role of Jesus as our true great High Priest of God who now sits in the presence of God in the heavenly Sanctuary that the Lord pitched and not man who ever makes intercession for us based on better promises in the new covenant (see Hebrews 7:1-25; Hebrews 8:1-13; Hebrews 9:1-27 and Hebrews 10:1-22). On the other hand we see that everyone of Gods' 10 commandments are repeated all through the new covenant and Gods' new covenant promise to be written on the heart to love in Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. You do err dear friend not knowing the scriptures. Gods' 10 commandments have the same role they always had in the old covenant and that is to give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing when obeyed) and evil (moral wrong doing when disobeyed); sin (moral wrong doing when disobeyed) and righteousness (moral right doing when obeyed) see Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172 and according to James if we break anyone of them we stand guilty before God of breaking all of God's law including God's 4th commandment which is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken.

more to come...

 

[3rdAngel]

3rdAngel said: ↑ Jesus and all the Apostles kept the Sabbath which was their custom (see Luke 4:16; Acts 17:2) and Gods' people continued keeping the Sabbath well after the death of the Apostles. There is not such thing as "a Jewish Sabbath" there was no Jew when God made the Sabbath for all mankind according to the scriptures (see Genesis 2:1-3; Mark 2:27).

Your response here...

A Jew is a transition title out of the Israelites and priorly just Hebrews. And does your timeframe for this debate only extend to the limits of what is in the scriptures in regard to this debate….. I’m pretty sure with the seeming confidence you put out, you can’t be afraid to extend your cause to contemporary times and ‘the time that has come’ that Jesus referred to??? Yes, that was a silly attempt at a nothing claim since it’s the only way you can think to claim against me…. Bad form, 3rdAngel!!!

Sorry I am having a giggle here if I am being honest with you Soapy as this section of your post does not make any sense and neither is it responding to what you are quoting from. Did you want to have another try? As posted earlier to you, Jesus and all the Apostles kept the Sabbath which was their custom (see Luke 4:16; Acts 17:2) and Gods' people continued keeping the Sabbath well after the death of the Apostles for many centuries latter. This is simply more evidence against your claims here that you have also ignored and not addressed.

3rdAngel said: ↑ No that is not true at all. Matthew 15:3-9 was about Gods' people making man-made teachings and traditions that led many away from Gods' Word to break the commandments of God with Jesus telling these people they were not worshiping God in doing this. Like those today who follow follow man-made teachings and traditions that lead us away from God and His Word to break the commandments of God. Jesus says we are not worshiping God if we do this....

• MATTHEW 15:3-9 [3], But he answered and said to them, WHY DO YOU ALSO TRANSGRESS THE COMMANDMENT OF GOD BY YOUR TRADITION? [4], For God commanded, saying, Honor your father and mother: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death. [5], But you say, Whoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatever you might be profited by me; [6], And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. THUS HAVE YOU MADE THE COMMANDMENT OF GOD OF NONE EFFECT BY YOUR TRADITION. [7], YOU HYPOCRITES, WELL DID ESAIAS PROPHESY OF YOU, SAYING, [8], THIS PEOPLE DRAWS NEAR TO ME WITH THEIR MOUTH, AND HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS; BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR FROM ME. [9], BUT IN VAIN THEY DO WORSHIP ME, TEACHING FOR DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENTS OF MEN. - The scriptures disagree with you here.

Your response here...

Again, you have attempted to deceive. Matthew 15:3-9 IS NOT a set of verses that come into the debate here. You have picked these verses and the theme of it to furnish your own deceitful ends. Did you forget that you were trying to show that the SABBATH law has not been superseded - what does ‘Honoring your mother and Father’ have to do with Sabbath day? You must think your distraction techniques work with me…. Nah!!!

I see so you have no response to the scriptures you are quoting from that have been provided as evidence in disagreement with you so because your unable to address the post content that is in disagreement with you from the scripture, you put out a false accusation saying I am being deceitful by showing you scripture that is in disagreement with you? - Here let me help you. Matthew 15:3-9 is showing like I have always said from the beginning that Jesus says in Matthew 15:3-9 if we choose to believe and follow man-made teachings and traditions that lead us away from Gods' Word to break the commandments of God than we are not worshiping God by doing so. Here is the connection as you seemed to have missed it. God's seventh day Sabbath of God's 4th commandments is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4. Sunday worship as a day of rest in honor of the resurrection of Jesus is a man-made tradition and teaching that has led many away from God and His Word to break Gods' 4th commandment just like those who broke Gods' 5th commandment. Jesus is saying if we choose to follow man-made teachings and traditions that leads us away from Gods' Word to break the commandments of God we are not worshiping God. It seem the scriptures shared with you here simply went right over your head.

little more to come....

 

[3rdAngel]

3rdAngel said: ↑ Sorry your post here absolutely makes no sense at all. What are you even talking about here?

Your response here...

So you are still at it…. You cannot help writing “Your” when you have been shown it is incorrect and should be appropriately “You are” or “You’re” just as you cannot help to claim you do not understand what someone is saying to you when they are actually showing to the truth… Well, that is not uncommon: Can the darkness abode the light…. No! I third from it just as you are hiding here claiming you don’t understand what I was talking about!!! I mean, like, you do not even stats what it is you do not understand …. You don’t even attempt to ask for clarification …. Hint hint….!!!!!

I do not know if English is your (ownership) first language but your (ownership) post here made me laugh a little. Instead of responding to the post content that is in disagreement with you as a distraction you want to play Mr Grammarly? Well here let me help you with that. When you are responding to my post that says "your (ownership) post" it means ownership of as in you the owner of the post. You cannot use you're or you are. That would make no sense at all. How does your (ownership) recommendation sound when your telling me that my post should read like this "Sorry you are post here absolutely makes no sense at all. What are you even talking about here?" Your (ownership) recommendation does not make any sense now does it. Perhaps you need to go back to English class.

3rdAngel said: ↑ Once again prove your claims show me the scripture that says you can make any day your Sabbath. - There is none. According to the scriptures "the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God" - Exodus 20:10. You do err not knowing the scriptures.

Your response here...

Jesus says that in time to come worship would be in Spirit and in truth. This means personal worship WHEN EVER AND WHERE EVER WAS REVERENT TO DO SO. But you are not after a proof - you are just kneejerking. You really are not clever at all.

So that is a no than you cannot provide me with a single scripture that says that we can now make any day the Sabbath. This is what the post you were responding to was asking you. So you have no scripture evidence to support your view now do you. Just be honest and say so.

3rdAngel said: ↑ According to the scriptures God made the Sabbath for ALL MANKIND (Mark 2:27), There were no Jews when God made the Sabbath for ALL mankind. There was only Adam and Eve that God created on the 6th day of the creation week according to Genesis 1:26-31. After God finished His work of creation in 6 days of the week he rested on the "seventh day" of the week and blessed the "seventh day" of the week for all mankind as a memorial of creation (see Exodus 20:8-11). God set aside the "seventh day of the week aside from all the other day of the week for a holy day of rest as a memorial and celebration of God as the creator of heaven and earth. God made it one of His 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of good (moral right doing when obeyed) and evil (moral wrong doing when disobeyed); sin (moral wrong doing when disobeyed) and righteousness (moral right doing when obeyed) see Exodus 20:8-11; Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and Psalms 119:172. Jesus taught it was lawful to do good on the Sabbath day in Matthew 12:1-12. There was no Jew when God made the Sabbath for all mankind (see Genesis 2:1-3).

Your response here...

God gave the sabbath day law to the Israelites (since you insist!) God did not give the sabbath day law to the Egyptians, nor the Philistines, nor the Amorites nor the Roland, nor the Greeks nor any other nation of people. Please quote me a verse stating that the SABBATH was given to all mankind from the book of Exodus.! Jesus saw how this law that was given to the israelites (now called Jews) was becoming a millstone around the necks of those who held to it… Therefore the people were effectively SLAVES TO THE LAW…. Gentiles did not follow the laws of the Jews and so it was not a millstone around their necks.

You simply quoted from my post while ignoring it and not addressing it. Go figure. Anyhow lets address your claims here if it might be helpful. Yes God give his Word to His people that he names Israel because it was a name given by God to all those who choose to believe and follow what Gods' Word says. The other nations did not choose to follow the God of creation. They chose to reject the only true God of creation in order to worship other false gods and ignore Gods' Words so they chose not to believe and follow what Gods' Word says. Now to your question. According to the scriptures Jesus says in Mark 2:27 that the Sabbath was made for "man". The Greek word used here for "man" is ἄνθρωπος (ánthrōpos | G444) Derivation: from G435 and ὤψ (the countenance; Strong's: from G3700); and means mankind or human being. The Sabbath was made by God on Genesis 2:1-3 where it is written; " 1, Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2, And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. 3, And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made. Now pay attention. Genesis 2:1-3 is the seventh day of the creation week just after God created man (Adam and Eve) on the 6th day of the week in Genesis 1:26-31. Notice when God blessed and set aside the "seventh day" as a holy day of rest for all mankind there was no Jew, no Israel, no Moses. Only Adam and Eve (the beginning of mankind ἄνθρωπος (ánthrōpos) agreeing with what Jesus says in Mark 2:27 "The Sabbath was made for man not man for the Sabbath. These scrptures also prove you wrong dear friend. Open your eyes to all the scripture that is in disagreement with your opinions that you are unable to support with scripture or respond against all the scriptures that are in disagreement with you. - Something for you to at least pray about if you cannot respond to all these scriptures that are in disagreement with you here.

3rdAngel said: ↑ Gentiles are not Gods' people so do not believe and follow Gods' Word.

Your response here...

…. Ooohhhh. You’ve fallen out of your pram on that!!
What does the scriptures say about it:Galatians 3:28 says…. Jesus was sent firstly to the Jews to bring them back to God. But the Jews rejected Jesus and do the children of God is now opened up to all peoples of all nations - anyone - everyone - who calls upon the name of God and Jesus Christ in true sincerity

Once again you were corrected from your earlier post. God did not make His new covenant promise to gentiles (see Hebrews 8:10-12). Gentiles do not believe and follow Gods' Word. Gentile believers however are grafted in to Christ through faith into Gods' Israel and we are all now one in Christ with Jewish believers (see Romans 11:13-27; Romans 9:6-8; Romans 2:28-29; Galatians 3:28-29; Ephesians 2:11-13; Colossians 3:11; Romans 10:11-13) Once again you lose not knowing the scriptures that are in disagreement with you. It looks like the pram comment is referring to you.

3rdAngel said: ↑ No circumcision is not the same argument. Circumcision was a shadow law pointing to a new heart by faith for all those who walk in God's Spirit in the new covenant promise (see Acts 15:1-2). It has nothing to do with not keeping Gods' 10 commandments. This is why Paul says in 1 Corinthians 7:9 to the Corinthian gentile believers, "Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD.

Your response here...

You are obviously struggling with the scriptures and how they dovetail with each other theme to theme.

You are a funny one I will give you that even though there is nothing truthful in anything you say. You have been posted nothing but scripture all through our discussion as evidence that you are in error. All you provide is your words arguing against Gods Word that are in disagreement with you. You were provided scripture showing that Acts 15 was talking about the Mosaic shadow law of circumcision being a requirement for salvation of new gentile believers. Which according to Acts 15 circumcision from the law of Moses (not Gods 10 commandments) is not a requirement for new gentile believers. Then you were shown after the Jerusalem decision in Acts 15 that Paul says to the gentile believers in Corinthians that circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing but the KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD is what is important (1 Corinthians 7:9) which is in disagreement with you. Your response was to simply ignore the scriptures in disagreement with your words that disagree with Gods' Word (the scriptures). Once again you lose. Now if you disagree with what has been shared from the scriptures here in any of my posts I challenge you to address my posts section by section addressing the posts content and prove from the scriptures why you are in disagreement. If you cannot dear friend why not simply receive Gods' correction and be blessed?

Take Care...

 

[Subduction Zone]

None are so blind as those who do not want to see was a quote from you I think earlier. More than one person have all told you the same things but it seem you do not want to see it. Why get mad and throw out false claims and accusations at @samtonga43 when she is simply making the same observations about your bad behavior here? You are projecting again against everyone who is simply trying to help you here..

Yes, and that quote describes you to a T. And please. In this case "more than one" only consists of you and Sam. You two hardly count since you both run away from offers of a polite and proper debate. It is you two that won't leave your past losses in the past. And false charges has always been the case for you two. How long did it take to get you to address the questions that I had to continually rub your noses into?

And then you still failed.

Can we get back on topic or are you doing this just because you know that you have lost if we go into a proper debate?

 

[Subduction Zone]

lol, you are projecting again, I am not angry at all just enjoying the show

Once again you use a term that you do not understand.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes, yes, thankyou we are in agreement here. Soapy and you have the exact same styles in discussion. I will not call it debating because it is not. It is more like ignoring a discussion, project, and deflect with false claims and accusations you cannot prove and than run away when challenged to prove your claims

Oh my! He does not understand sarcasm. Maybe I should have used a sign:

 

[3rdAngel]

Oh my! He does not understand sarcasm. Maybe I should have used a sign:

You mean like this one?

 

[3rdAngel]

Yes, and that quote describes you to a T. And please. In this case "more than one" only consists of you and Sam. You two hardly count since you both run away from offers of a polite and proper debate. It is you two that won't leave your past losses in the past. And false charges has always been the case for you two. How long did it take to get you to address the questions that I had to continually rub your noses into?

And then you still failed.

Can we get back on topic or are you doing this just because you know that you have lost if we go into a proper debate?

Why be dishonest and project what you do onto people that do not do what you falsely claim? Everyone can see it. Just own it (Myself @samtonga43 and @YoursTrue). There is no shame in learning from your mistakes. Its only bad when you continue doing them when others have tried to help you.

 

[3rdAngel]

Once again you use a term that you do not understand.

Its ok I thought you would start projecting and deflecting again.

 

[Brian2]

Your response here...

The Royal law according to the scriptures is God's law and the same law that Jesus says on these two commandments of love to God and love to our fellow man hang all the law and the prophets. Therefore, love to God and man is not separate from Gods' law it is expressed in obedience to what Gods' law says and is how love is expressed. To say we can now love our neighbor as our self and do not need to obey Gods' 10 commandments is a contradiction of the scriptures. For example how can we say we love our neighbour and then go and break Gods' 6th or 7th commandment and go out and murder your neighbor or go out and commit adultery with your neighbors spouse? - No, love therefore is expressed in obedience to Gods' law not by going out and disobeying what Gods law says. This is why James says in....

• JAMES 2:8-12 [8] IF YOU FULFILL THE ROYAL LAW ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE, YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF [Sums up our duty of love in the 10 Commandments Romans 13:9] , you do well: [9], But if you have respect to persons, you commit sin, and are convicted of the law as transgressors. [10], FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW, AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE IS GUILTY OF ALL. [11], FOR HE THAT SAID, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, SAID ALSO, DO NOT KILL. NOW IF YOU COMMIT NO ADULTERY, YET YOU KILL, YOU ARE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF THE LAW. [12], So speak, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

That is loving our neighbour as our self is simply summing up our duty of love God our neighbour as revealed in Gods' 10 commandments which is why James is saying in James 2:10-11 if we keep the whole law and break one of Gods 10 commandments we stand guilty before God of sin and condemned by the law. In fact Paul is also showing in Romans 13:8-10 that love to our neighbour is expressed in obedience to Gods' 10 commandments here...

• ROMANS 13:8-10 [8], OWE NO MAN ANYTHING, BUT TO LOVE ONE ANOTHER: FOR HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW. [9], FOR THIS, YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, YOU SHALL NOT KILL, YOU SHALL NOT STEAL, YOU SHALL NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS, YOU SHALL NOT COVET; AND IF THERE BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, IT IS SUMMED UP IN THIS SAYING, NAMELY, YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF. [10], Love works no ill to his neighbor: therefore, LOVE IS THE FULFILLING [DOING] OF THE LAW.

This is what Jesus is saying when he agrees with both James and Paul when he says in Matthew 22:36-40...

• MATTHEW 22:36-40 [36] Master, which is the great commandment in the law? [37], Jesus said to him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind. [38], This is the first and great commandment. [39], And the second is like to it, You shall love your neighbour as yourself. [40], ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS HANG ALL THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS.

So according to the scripture love to God and our fellow man is expressed in obedience to Gods law not by breaking Gods law. Breaking Gods' law is only a sign that we do not know God (see 1 John 2:3-4).

The Royal Law is to love our neighbour as ourselves. You want to make that equivalent to keeping the 10 Commandments.
When Jesus said that the greatest commandment is to love God with our whole being and the second is to love our neighbour as ourselves, and that the whole law and prophets hang on these, it means that if we keep those 2 commandments we have fulfilled the whole law and prophets.
Romans 2 tells us that even gentiles who may not even know about the law or Sabbath can keep the law.
The Sabbath was for the Jews and was made for man, so that we have a break and recharge physically and spiritually. Nothing in the New Testament tells us to keep the Sabbath, you are inferring that but it does not say that.
Acts 15 tells us that the gentiles should not be told to keep the law, and that law includes the Sabbath.
Paul tells us that the law has been taken out of the way, being nailed to the cross, those in the New Covenant are not under law for righteousness, which comes from the obedience of faith in Jesus shed blood.
1John 2:3-4 is speaking about loving and about the commands Jesus gave, not obeying all the precepts of the law. Read on in the chapter and you will see that.
John 14:23
Jesus replied, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word. My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him.
John 15:10
If you keep My commandments, you will remain in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and remain in His love.
2 John 1:6
And this is love, that we walk according to His commandments. This is the very commandment you have heard from the beginning, that you must walk in love.
But I am not saying that setting aside time for resting and worship is something that should not be done am I, even though I am saying that the day we rest is not as important as you make out.
1John 5:3 In fact, this is love for God: to keep his commands. And his commands are not burdensome, 4 for everyone born of God overcomes the world.
So we are to obey God's Commands but that cannot include the Sabbath when that is something given for the Jews in the Mosaic Covenant and we are not under that covenant even though we learn from what God commanded the Jews in that Covenant.
It also cannot include the Sabbath because Paul said that for some people all days are the same.
Jesus lived as a Jew in obedience to the Law and we live in obedience to His Law, not following the letter, which kills but following the Spirit which gives life.
We just have a different understanding of the gospel it seems and it is good if you want to keep the Saturday Sabbath but it is not good of you to be judging others for those things they have freedom in before the Lord.
Once you start saying that someone must keep the Sabbath to be a Christian you are crossing a line that you should not cross imo.

According to the scriptures "we are saved by Gods grace through faith it is a gift of God and not of works lest any man should boast." - Ephesians 2:8-9. No one is saved by the law because all the law does is give us the knowledge of what sin is *see Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and shows us that everyone of us has sinned against God and in need of God's forgiveness and salvation from sin. Therefore, the law is our teacher that leads us to Christ that we might receive Gods' forgiveness through faith *Galatians 3:22-25. Therefore our salvation comes as we receive Gods' gift of grace through faith in Gods' Word. Faith according to Paul does not abolish the law it establishes the law in those who by faith believe and follow what Gods' Word says. So to say we no longer need to obey Gods' law is only a sign that we do not have genuine saving faith when it is written in the scriptures...

• ROMANS 3:31 31, DO WE THEN MAKE VOID THE LAW THROUGH FAITH? GOD FORBID: YEA, WE ESTABLISH THE LAW.

and again...

• ROMANS 8:1-4 1, THERE IS THEREFORE NOW NO CONDEMNATION TO THEM WHICH ARE IN CHRIST JESUS, WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT. 2, For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 3, For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin,1 condemned sin in the flesh: 4, THAT THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF THE LAW MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US, WHO WALK NOT AFTER THE FLESH, BUT AFTER THE SPIRIT.

We are to fulfill the righteousness of the Law, not the letter of the Law. We follow the Spirit who teaches us to love and we listen to the written Word of God and learn from it.
The Law is established but that does not mean we obey the letter of the Law.
2Cor 3:4 And we have such trust through Christ toward God. 5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God, 6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Paul did not want anyone to go back to the letter of the Law, but to be free from the Law and obey the Spirit.

No one can claim to know God or love God therefore by breaking anyone of God's 10 commandments including Gods' 4th commandment which is one of Gods' 10 commandments according to the scriptures because love to God and our fellow man are expressed in obedience to Gods' law as we have faith in Gods' promises and have been born again to walk in Gods' Spirit (see also Romans 6:1-23)

• 1 JOHN 2:3-4 3, AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. 4, HE THAT SAITH, I KNOW HIM, AND KEEPS NOT HIS COMMANDMENTS, IS A LIAR, AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM.

This is why Jesus says if you love me KEEP my commandments in John 14:15 and again those who love Him keep His commandments in John 15:10 and why John says in 1 John 5:3-4 for this is the love of God that we keep his commandments. No one can claims to know or love God therefore by living in disobedience to Gods law.

According to the scriptures Jesus tells us to " Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment." - John 7:24. None of us are righteous therefore we cannot judge each other (see Romans 2:1-11). The only standard of "righteous judgement" therefore is Gods' Word because it is the standard of what is right and what is wrong. We as God's people we are to make judgement according to what is right and what is wrong as revealed in the scriptures. Doing good deed on the Sabbath according to the scriptures according to Jesus is not breaking Gods law it is obeying Gods law according to Jesus in Matthew 12:1-12. So we cannot break God's law in times of priorities. That is I cannot now go our and commit adultery with my neighbors wife because I feel it is a priority to because I am feeling lonely. Sin according to the scripture is the transgression or the breaking of anyone of God's 10 commandments and not believing and following what Gods Word says (see 1 John 3:4; James 2:10-11; Romans 14:23). If we knowingly sin before God we stand guilty before God and in need of Gods' forgiveness (see Hebrews 10:26-31). No one therefore can claims to know God Brian if they are knowingly and willfully breaking anyone of Gods' 10 commandments. This includes Gods 4th commandment seventh day Sabbath which is one of Gods' 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken (Romans 3:20).

You like the 4th Commandment but as I said we are not under the Law and the letter brings death. When we want to revive the letter of the Law we revive sin in us and that can kill us, but maybe you just love the Sabbath and keeping it and keeping it according to the Spirit, but don't accuse others, your brothers, when we stand or fall before the Lord and your opinion does not matter. (Romans 14:4)
And when you make the keeping of the Sabbath a necessity for being a Christian you are heading into the realm of cult when it comes to the gospel.

 

[samtonga43]

Nope, nope, nope. Sorry that just won't do. You are supposed to be my acolyte. You do not appear to be using exactly the same methods that I use.

You are still missing the point, SZ. Soapy does not have to use the same ‘methods’ to be an acolyte. I assume you do know the meaning of the word...

Okay, personally as an ex-Christian I can still see value in the Bible. People that abuse it as 3rd has still irk me. He has to lecture and preach instead of discussing because he seems to realize that he cannot have a proper discussion and defend his beliefs.

What value do you see? And why are you annoyed when
someone's interpretation is different to yours?
Oh, I would be really interested in knowing which Christian denomination you were part of when you were a Christian?
I hope you don't mind my asking.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You are still missing the point, SZ. Soapy does not have to use the same ‘methods’ to be an acolyte. I assume you do know the meaning of the word...

What value do you see? And why are you annoyed when
someone's interpretation is different to yours?
Oh, I would be really interested in knowing which Christian denomination you were part of when you were a Christian?
I hope you don't mind my asking.

Really? You have to ask.? That implies that you do not see any value in the Bible and you only are one because you were born into the faith.

But if you need some answers some of the teachings of Jesus are very worthwhile. Some of the myths can still evoke an emotional response..

When it comes to Christians, the Bible can make some better people. Others it makes worse. The least moral Christians tend to be literalists. They adopt the false belief of once saved always saved and use that to irrationally decide that they are saved and that they can do no wrong.

 

[samtonga43]

Really? You have to ask.? That implies that you do not see any value in the Bible and you only are one because you were born into the faith.

Are you really saying that my asking about the value you see in the Bible implies that I see no value in the Bible?
Wow! Your mind operates in a weird way! Of course I see value in the Bible, SZ. I am a Christian.

But if you need some answers some of the teachings of Jesus are very worthwhile. Some of the myths can still evoke an emotional response..

Can you tell us which of Jesus’ teachings you find to be worthwhile? And which of the myths still evoke an emotional response in you? Thanks!

When it comes to Christians, the Bible can make some better people. Others it makes worse. The least moral Christians tend to be literalists. They adopt the false belief of once saved always saved and use that to irrationally decide that they are saved and that they can do no wrong.

Is this the group you were a part of?