The Lord's Day, is it really Sunday?

[rstrats]

sojourner,
re: "I suppose you didn’t know that the first Christians went to synagogue on Saturday, because they were observant Jews. then, they also celebrated the Resurrection on the first day of the week (according to the Bible, the day of the Resurrection)."

Actually, scripture is silent with regard to anyone celebrating the resurrection on the first day of the week.



re: "There is scripture that alludes to Sunday as the Lord’s day."

I'm not aware of any scripture which does that. What do you have in mind?

 

[Iymus]

Q. WHAT DAY IS THE "LORD'S DAY" ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE?

A. MATTHEW 12:8 [8], For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Which day is the Lord's Day? THE SABBATH DAY (MATTHEW 12:8; MARK 2:27-28)

God's WORD says that the SABBATH DAY IS THE LORD'S DAY!

There is NO scripture that says Sunday or the FIRST DAY of the week is the Lords Day. God's Word says the Lord's day is the Sabbath day. This is the day God rested on, he set apart and made a Holy day at the completion of the creation week and made a memorial for all mankind (Genesis 2:1-3; Exodus 20:8-11). Jesus is the God of creation and he is the Lord of the Sabbath day (Matthew 12:8; Mark 2:27-28)

Can you show from the scriptures alone that Sunday is "THE LORDS DAY" if not why not? If we cannot are we following man made teachings that break the commandments of God that JESUS warns us about in Matthew 15:3-9?

May God bless you all as you seek him through his Word.

We are or can often be creatures of conditioning and habit.

Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

The Sabbath is on the 7th day of the week but the world has made it more convenient thru various ways to keep it on the 1st day of the week which is unbiblical unless a high holy day.

their is mention of enemy changing times and laws.

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

 

[3rdAngel]

We are or can often be creatures of conditioning and habit.

Mat 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

The Sabbath is on the 7th day of the week but the world has made it more convenient thru various ways to keep it on the 1st day of the week which is biblical unless a high holy day.

their is mention of enemy changing times and laws.

Dan 7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Hello lymus nice to meet you here and welcome .

Indeed Daniel 7:25 is very relevant. It is a prophecy on relation to the change of Gods 4th commandment Sabbath from the "seventh day" of the week to the "first day" of the week. Revelation 14:12 is also a relavant scriptures which defines God's true people as keeping all the commandments of God (not some of them).

Perhaps this is the reason for the OP. Sunday worship is a man made tradition and teaching handed down to Christianity by Catholocism that has lead many to ignorantly or knowingly break the commandments of God. JESUS warns us of this in Matthew 15:3-9.

blessings

 

[sojourner]

Actually, scripture is silent with regard to anyone celebrating the resurrection on the first day of the week

There is scriptural reference to worship on the first day of the week. Additionally, your assertion that “scripture is silent” isn’t important. It happened, because it’s a matter of historical record.

I'm not aware of any scripture which does that. What do you have in mind?

Revelation 1

 

[sojourner]

Sunday worship is a man made tradition and teaching handed down to Christianity by Catholocism

Patently false. Except for the man-made part. But then, ALL religious traditions are man-made.

 

[rstrats]

sojourner,
re: "There is scriptural reference to worship on the first day of the week."

I didn't say that there isn't. And you even quoted what I did say in response to your assertion, i.e., "...that the first Christians... celebrated the Resurrection on the first day of the week..." I merely pointed out that scripture doesn't mention such a practice just in case there may be some looking in who might think that it does.

But since you bring it up, as far as scripture is concerned, there are only 2 times mentioned where anyone got together on the first day of the week and neither time is worship stated as the reason.




re: "Additionally, your assertion that 'scripture is silent' isn’t important. It happened, because it’s a matter of historical record."

Actually it is important if there are those who think that scripture says that folks celebrated the resurrection on the first day of the week.



re: "It happened, because it’s a matter of historical record."

Just so it's understood that scripture doesn't say that it happened.




re: "Revelation 1"

Nowhere in Revelation 1 is anything said with regard to Sunday being the Lord's Day.

 

[3rdAngel]

re: "Revelation 1" Nowhere in Revelation 1 is anything said with regard to Sunday being the Lord's Day.

Yep nice to see someone else studying the scriptures for themselves. Well said rstats!

 

[3rdAngel]

Patently false. Except for the man-made part. But then, ALL religious traditions are man-made.

According to JESUS in MATTHEW 15:3-9 we are warned that those who follow the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God we are not following God

MATTHEW 15:3-9
[2], WHY DO YOUR DISCIPLES TRANSGRESS THE TRADITION OF THE ELDERS? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
[3], But he (JESUS) answered and said to them, WHY DO YOU ALSO TRANSGRESS THE COMMANDMENT OF GOD BY YOUR TRADITION?
[4], For God commanded, saying, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death.
[5], But you say, Whoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatever you might be profited by me;
[6], And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. THUS HAVE YOU MADE THE COMMANDMENT OF GOD OF NONE EFFECT BY YOUR TRADITION.
[7], You hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
[8], THIS PEOPLE DRAWS NEAR TO ME WITH THEIR MOUTH, AND HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS; BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR FROM ME.
[9], BUT IN VAIN THEY DO WORSHIP ME, TEACHING FOR DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENTS OF MEN.

For me I believe the scriptures and what Peter and the Apostles also repeat in ACTS in relation to the teachings and traditions of men that go against the Word of God we must obey God rather than men if what we are asked to do does against the Word of God.

ACTS 5:29 [29], Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, WE OUGHT TO OBEY GOD RATHER THEN MEN.

I believe the scriptures are very clear here teaching if we follow the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God we are not following God. The is also emphasised by JESUS in JOHN 10:26-27 when JESUS says those who are his people are only those who believe and follow God's Word and in MATTHEW 7:22-26 where JESUS tells those who practice sin to depart from him and only those who do the Word of God are his people.

blessings

 

[sojourner]

According to JESUS in MATTHEW 15:3-9 we are warned that those who follow the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God we are not following God

MATTHEW 15:3-9
[2], WHY DO YOUR DISCIPLES TRANSGRESS THE TRADITION OF THE ELDERS? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
[3], But he (JESUS) answered and said to them, WHY DO YOU ALSO TRANSGRESS THE COMMANDMENT OF GOD BY YOUR TRADITION?
[4], For God commanded, saying, HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death.
[5], But you say, Whoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatever you might be profited by me;
[6], And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. THUS HAVE YOU MADE THE COMMANDMENT OF GOD OF NONE EFFECT BY YOUR TRADITION.
[7], You hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
[8], THIS PEOPLE DRAWS NEAR TO ME WITH THEIR MOUTH, AND HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS; BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR FROM ME.
[9], BUT IN VAIN THEY DO WORSHIP ME, TEACHING FOR DOCTRINES THE COMMANDMENTS OF MEN.

For me I believe the scriptures and what Peter and the Apostles also repeat in ACTS in relation to the teachings and traditions of men that go against the Word of God we must obey God rather than men if what we are asked to do does against the Word of God.

ACTS 5:29 [29], Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, WE OUGHT TO OBEY GOD RATHER THEN MEN.

I believe the scriptures are very clear here teaching if we follow the teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God we are not following God. The is also emphasised by JESUS in JOHN 10:26-27 when JESUS says those who are his people are only those who believe and follow God's Word and in MATTHEW 7:22-26 where JESUS tells those who practice sin to depart from him and only those who do the Word of God are his people.

blessings

I’m sorry; I thought we were done.

 

[3rdAngel]

I’m sorry; I thought we were done.

I guess it seem you are. Wish you all the best

 

[Ebionite]

Q. WHAT DAY IS THE "LORD'S DAY" ACCORDING TO SCRIPTURE?

A. MATTHEW 12:8 [8], For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

"Lord of the sabbath" isn't the same as "Lord's day". The "Lord's Day" is a title used by the RCC.

According to catholic.com:

Sunday should not be called “the Sabbath”; rather, it is the Lord’s Day, the first day of the week, when Christ rose from the dead. Each and every Sunday is a commemoration of that first Easter Sunday.

 

[3rdAngel]

"Lord of the sabbath" isn't the same as "Lord's day". The "Lord's Day" is a title used by the RCC.

According to catholic.com:

Sunday should not be called “the Sabbath”; rather, it is the Lord’s Day, the first day of the week, when Christ rose from the dead. Each and every Sunday is a commemoration of that first Easter Sunday.

Hi Theo, nice to see you here. Actually the Sabbath is only defined in the scriptures as the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week. Mark 2:27-28 is in reference to God's 4th commandment that has it's origin in the "SEVENTH DAY" of the creation week in GENESIS 2:1-3 where God set apart the "SEVENTH DAY" from all the other days of the week and "BLESSED" the "SEVENTH DAY" and made it a "HOLY DAY". This is further defined in God's 4th commandment where is reads...

EXODUS 20:8-11 [8], REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY, TO KEEP IT HOLY [Made Holy at creation GENESIS 2:3]. [9], Six days shall you labor, and do all your work: [10], But THE SEVENTH DAY [ Genesis 2:1-3] IS THE SABBATH OF THE LORD YOUR GOD : in it you shall not do any work, you, nor your son, nor your daughter, your manservant, nor your maidservant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger that is within your gates: [WHY?] [11], FOR IN SIX DAYS THE LORD MADE HEAVEN AND EARTH, THE SEA, AND ALL THAT IS IN THEM IS, AND RESTED THE SEVENTH DAY; WHEREFORE THE LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH DAY AND MADE IT HOLY. [Refering to GENESIS 2:1-3]

"THE LORDS DAY" some people try and teach is in reference to "SUNDAY" is from a reference found in REVELATION 1:10 despite there being no connection to Sunday and when JESUS specifically says he is the LORD of the "SABBATH DAY" MATTHEW 12:8. The question is simply anwered by the scriptures alone...

Q. WHAT DAY IS "THE LORDS DAY"?

A. MATTHEW 12:8 FOR THE SON OF MAN IS LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY

Hope this is helpful

 

[Ebionite]

Hi Theo, nice to see you here. Actually the Sabbath is only defined in the scriptures as the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week.

Hi 3rdAngel, thanks for the welcome. Keeping the sabbath is a sign:

Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am YHWH that doth sanctify you.
Exodus 31:13

The name of the "Lord" is ambiguous, eg Isaiah 45:23 vs Romans 14:11 vs Philippians 2:10

 

[3rdAngel]

Hi 3rdAngel, thanks for the welcome. Keeping the sabbath is a sign:

Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am YHWH that doth sanctify you.
Exodus 31:13

The name of the "Lord" is ambiguous, eg Isaiah 45:23 vs Romans 14:11 vs Philippians 2:10

Hi Theo thanks for your post. Indeed, the SABBATH according to the scriptures is defined as the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week which God blessed and made a Holy day at the end of the creation week. The "SEVENTH DAY" Sabbath is also a sign to the people of God that it is God who saved (sanctifies) them *EXODUS 31:13 that you posted above.

The Hebrew words used for "LORD" is יהוה ; yehôvâh H3068 and means (the) self Existent or eternal; Jehovah. The Greek word used is G2962 κύριος; kurios From κῦρος kuros (supremacy); supreme in authority, that is, (as noun) controller ; by implication Mr. (as a respectful title): - God, Lord, master, Sir.

So putting all this together we have the eternal, self existent one, who is supreme in authority - GOD "RESTED" and "BLESSED" the "SEVENTH DAY" of the week which his people to keep as a "HOLY DAY OF REST". This is the "LORDS DAY" as defined in MATTHEW 12:8 FOR THE SON OF MAN IS LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY.

God owns all the days of the week but there is only one that he has BLESSED and made a HOLY DAY of REST and has commanded his people to REMEMBER and keep *GENESIS 2:1-3; EXODUS 20:8-11

ISAIAH 58:13 If you turn away your foot from the SABBATH, from doing your pleasure on MY HOLY DAY [God's ownership of the day]; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honorable; and shall honor him, not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor speaking your own words:

EXODUS 31:12-18 [12] Then the Lord said to Moses, [13] Say to the Israelites, You must observe MY SABBATHS. This will be a sign between me and you for the generations to come, so you may know that I am the Lord, who makes you holy.

WHICH DAY IS THE LORDS DAY OR THE DAY?

MATTHEW 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

MARK 2:27-28 [27], And he said to them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:[28], Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

The term "Lord's day" used in Revelation 1:10 is not linked to μία των which is used in the NEW TESTAMENT Greek which means FIRST DAY (or Sunday).

In Revelations 1:10 "LORDS DAY κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ does not link to any scripture reference in the NEW TESTAMENT to μιά των σαββάτων (the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK- Sunday).

κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ used in Revelations 1:10 is in reference to the Lord's (God's) ownership of the day. It does not say that this day is in reference to μιά των σαββάτων which means the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK - Sunday.

The Lord's day is the Sabbath day *MATTHEW 12:8 which is in reference to God's 4th commandment of the 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken. *EXOUDUS 20:8-11; ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; 1 JOHN 3:4.

Hope this is helpful.

 

[rstrats]

3rdAngel,
re: "In Revelations 1:10 "LORDS DAY κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ does not link to any scripture reference in the NEW TESTAMENTto μιά των σαββάτων (the FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK- Sunday)."

re: "κυριακῇ ἡμέρᾳ used in Revelations 1:10 is in reference to the Lord's (God's) ownership of the day."


Any particular reason for adding an "s" at the end of Revelation?

 

[sooda]

Hello lymus nice to meet you here and welcome .

Indeed Daniel 7:25 is very relevant. It is a prophecy on relation to the change of Gods 4th commandment Sabbath from the "seventh day" of the week to the "first day" of the week. Revelation 14:12 is also a relavant scriptures which defines God's true people as keeping all the commandments of God (not some of them).

Perhaps this is the reason for the OP. Sunday worship is a man made tradition and teaching handed down to Christianity by Catholocism that has lead many to ignorantly or knowingly break the commandments of God. JESUS warns us of this in Matthew 15:3-9.

blessings

Daniel 7:25 is about Antiochus.. He tried to turn them into Greeks... one people in religious customs. He forbid worship on the Sabbath and circumcision.

 

[3rdAngel]

Daniel 7:25 is about Antiochus.. He tried to turn them into Greeks... one people in religious customs. He forbid worship on the Sabbath and circumcision.

Actually no it is not. Although it is about Rome and what comes out of it

 

[sooda]

Actually no it is not. Although it is about Rome and what comes out of it

Everyone knows that Antiochus IV Epiphanes (God manifest) was Seleucid king when Daniel was written. He forbid circumcision on pain of death, sacrificed a pig in the Temple etc..

Titus was the prince of the people to come.. The Jews didn't destroy Jerusalem.. The Romans and the foreign garrisons that fought with them in 70 AD destroyed Jerusalem.

Antiochus IV Epiphanes | Seleucid king | Britannica
www.britannica.com/biography/Antiochus-IV-Epiphanes
Antiochus IV Epiphanes, (Greek: “God Manifest”) Seleucid king of the Hellenistic Syrian kingdom who reigned from 175 to 164 bc.

As a ruler he was best known for his encouragement of Greek culture and institutions.

 

[3rdAngel]

Everyone knows that Antiochus IV Epiphanes (God manifest) was Seleucid king when Daniel was written. He forbid circumcision on pain of death, sacrificed a pig in the Temple etc..

Titus was the prince of the people to come.. The Jews didn't destroy Jerusalem.. The Romans and the foreign garrisons that fought with them in 70 AD destroyed Jerusalem.

Antiochus IV Epiphanes | Seleucid king | Britannica
www.britannica.com/biography/Antiochus-IV-Epiphanes
Antiochus IV Epiphanes, (Greek: “God Manifest”) Seleucid king of the Hellenistic Syrian kingdom who reigned from 175 to 164 bc.

As a ruler he was best known for his encouragement of Greek culture and institutions.

Nonsense. Antiochus died about 170 years before Christ was born, while this was a power that was to compass Jerusalem with armies at a period still future, when Christ spake the words we are considering. Of course it could not refer to a power which had ceased to be, two hundred years before. It is therefore certain that the 2300 days in the eighth of Daniel, unto which this abomination was to continue, since they referred to this abomination, could not have been fulfilled in Antiochus. Since, therefore, they refer to the Romans, they must have denoted years, instead of literal days, as many claim; and since the time appointed reaches to the end of indignation, when the sanctuary shall be cleansed, the 2300 days must measure the time of pagan and papal Rome, at the end of which the Ancient of days shall come, with his fiery flame, and his wheels of burning fire, and the body of the beast shall be slain and given to the burning flame. Thus shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

 

[sooda]

Nonsense. It is normally those who oppose the truth that the coming of Christ is near, that tell us that the abomination of desolation spoken of by Daniel was Antiochus Epiphanes, and that the prophetic periods in Daniel had their fulfilment in him, and of course can have no reference to the present time. But Antiochus died about 170 years before Christ was born, while this was a power that was to compass Jerusalem with armies at a period still future, when Christ spake the words we are considering. Of course it could not refer to a power which had ceased to be, two hundred years before. It is therefore certain that the 2300 days in the eighth of Daniel, unto which this abomination was to continue, since they referred to this abomination, could not have been fulfilled in Antiochus. Since, therefore, they refer to the Romans, they must have denoted years, instead of literal days, as many claim; and since the time appointed reaches to the end of indignation, when the sanctuary shall be cleansed, the 2300 days must measure the time of pagan and papal Rome, at the end of which the Ancient of days shall come, with his fiery flame, and his wheels of burning fire, and the body of the beast shall be slain and given to the burning flame. Thus shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

Antiouch IV was Greek.. He forbid the Jews to worship on the Sabbath, He was killed in 164 BC during the Maccabean Revolt.. He had defiled the Temple with a pig sacrificed to Zeus.

This act of sacrilege left the Temple defiled, requiring that the Temple be purified and rededicated to God.

After God enabled the Jewish people to defeat Antiochus, they purified the Temple and decided to enact a new celebration to remember the Temple’s restoration: The Feast of Dedication, as it is called in John 10:22, or Hanukkah, as it is called today.
Hanukkah and the Desecration of the Temple Chosen People ...
www.chosenpeople.com/site/hanukkah-and-the-destruction-of-the-temple/