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Featured The irony in the Baha'i faith

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Sirona, Dec 22, 2019.

  1. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    I'd agree.

    Denigrate? Careful, this might be fulfilling what the OP is saying.

    But, if Baha'u'llah has infallible knowledge of anything he wants to talk about, why didn't he? It's almost like he wasn't all that concerned about what Hindus would think.

    Yes, Adrian, and other Baha'is are only "defending" their Faith from slander and misinformation? It sure seems like that is what Hindus are doing too, at least about the misinformation part.
     
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  2. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
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    It shows the founders to be significantly errant in their vision and understanding. That is an important point in my consideration of the value of the revelation.
     
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  3. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    Here's a quote:
    Baha’u’llah envisioned a time in the future when the peoples of the world will live together in peace and unity as members of one faith. Universal justice will be established based on adherence to the law of God. A new civilization based on spiritual values will come into being. He referred to this as the Most Great Peace.​
    That sounds to me like Baha'is would rule the world.
     
  4. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
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    Well, yes that is the plan and prophesy.

    But part of that prophesy is that the people of the world will willingly to almost a complete extent embrace this new faith and order and form a theocracy. It will be formed through overwhelming popular support. The question of any dissent is not anticipated nor well addressed.
     
  5. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg World Citizen
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    The key here is that the Most Great Peace was offered, it was rejected. Mankind fell well short of what they can be. The Most Great Peace is now to me, a distant future.

    What is now on the Table is the 'Lesser Peace'. This peace will be built by the Governments of the world, but only when they submit to what Baha'u'llah revealed, as required for a Lesser Peace.

    Thus we face this prophecy, "The world is in travail, and its agitation waxeth day by day. Its face is turned towards waywardness and unbelief. Such shall be its plight, that to disclose it now would not be meet and seemly. Its perversity will long continue. And when the appointed hour is come, there shall suddenly appear that which shall cause the limbs of mankind to quake. Then, and only then, will the Divine Standard be unfurled, and the Nightingale of Paradise warble its melody."

    I see that is what will be required for humanity to even consider the Lesser peace, let alone the "Most Great Peace". I expect that from what we are to bring upon ourselves, the will of humanity will be raised to pursue another path, another way.

    It is recorded in a bit more detail as to how all this will unfold and the signs that will accompany that change. If you are interested CG, I will try to find the quotes.

    Regards Tony
     
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  6. adrian009

    adrian009 Well-Known Member
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    Its an interesting perspective. I have served on Baha’i Assemblies for the last 20 years and currently serve on the Institutional of the Counsellors as an assistant for protection so I’m certainly very involved with the Baha’i community. In all honesty the possibility of most of the world becoming Baha’i or a Baha’i world government never gets mentioned. I don’t doubt there are a few older veteran Baha’is that still think that way.

    It seems plausible that as per the paragraph from Shoghi Effendi the Baha’i Faith will become much larger than it is today. I can’t see it happening anytime soon but we can’t predict the future. The world is rapidly changing along with the communities we live in. Like most people I live in the here and now.
     
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  7. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg World Citizen
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    I see that we view this Faith in the confines of the world we live in. It is a rare vision that can see beyond the conditions of the time and see what the future can be.

    Personally as a Baha'i of the early 80's, I never had the vision of the world becoming Baha'i, but I do have a vision where it will emerge from obscurity to the stage where many from orthodoxy will arise to add slur to the noble intent. It is a complex quandary, because many that have done and will soon offer that blurred vision of the Baha'i Faith, do in their own Faith, wish to acheive the same noble goal of the unity and peace of all humanity.

    Regards Tony
     
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  8. adrian009

    adrian009 Well-Known Member
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    That is not a quote from the Baha’i writings of course but from Kenneth E Bowers. Admittedly the article says he serves on a national governing body but his opinion carries no more weight than anyone else’s. Let’s say what he says is true. Its a little light on specifics isn’t it?
     
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  9. loverofhumanity

    loverofhumanity Well-Known Member
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    It’s God, the Lord of all Religions Who makes all these judgements. We Baha’is accept whatever He decrees.
     
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  10. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    Slander? Really? How so?

    1. the action or crime of making a false spoken statement damaging to a person's reputation.
      "he is suing the TV network for slander"

      Similar:
      defamation
      defamation of character
      character assassination
      misrepresentation of character
      calumny
      libel
      scandalmongering
      malicious gossip
      muckraking
      smear campaigning
      disparagement
      denigration
      derogation
      aspersions
      vilification
      traducement
      obloquy
      backbiting
      scurrility
      lie
      slur
      smear
      untruth
      false accusation
      false report
      insult
      slight
      mudslinging
      bad-mouthing
      contumely
      h
      Opposite:
      acclamation
      praise
      • a false and malicious spoken statement.
        plural noun: slanders
        "I've had just about all I can stomach of your slanders"
    verb
     
    #150 Vinayaka, Dec 24, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2019
  11. adrian009

    adrian009 Well-Known Member
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    It seems really easy to me. For Baha’is Hinduism is a religion of Divine origins. Hindus each have their beliefs about what Hinduism is or isn’t.

    As I understand both Baha’is (with an interest in Hinduism) and Hindus believe in Sanātana Dharma. Beyond that if we examine the structure of the universe there is diversity of beliefs in regards God or gods. Some branches of Hinduism are monotheistic. Some schools of thought will see Shiva, Vishnu and Brahma as difference aspects of the Divine. Hinduism sees itself as being able to accept diversity of beliefs. The biggest barrier is an aversion some Hindus have to the God of Abraham and many Abrahamics have to the many gods of Hinduism.

    The Baha’i Faith is well established in India and in most parts of the world where significant communities of Indian descent reside.

    I think I see the problem.

    It is for Hindus to define for themselves how they define their god or Gods. For Baha’is it is clear. For Baha’is who also identify as Hindu let’s see what evolves. Unfortunately we don’t have any Baha’is here, to my knowledge, who grew up Hindu and then accepted Bahá’u’lláh.

    Baha’is and Christians both have their diverse beliefs about the Bible and how to interpret and understand it. There is a great deal in common but also some important differences, for example some Christians insist on a Triune God and a literal resurrection.

    I’m sure there is an abundance of Hindu scriptures such as the Bhagavad Gita that is mostly consistent with Baha’i theology. There will be diversity of interpretations from both Baha’is and Vashnava. Same deal with other sects of Hinduism and with Suttas in Buddhism.

    That is how I see it but admittedly my knowledge of Buddhism and Hinduism is sketchy.
     
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  12. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    I am saying, Bahais believe that, Original spiritual teachings of Jesus had been faded after thousands of years, and God renewed it through Bahai Faith.
    Resurrection of Jesus, can be understood physically or metaphorically. The Authors of Bible did not say, they meant a physical resurrection. So, in Bahai view, the Bahai Writings in this case is just teaching what the Authors meant, by claiming that, Bahai Writings are divine revelation.
    When Jesus came, The Authors of Bible interpreted many of the verses of the Old Testament differently than most Jews had understood over centuries. Did Christian bible replaced old testament or, did it correct the misinterpretations of jews?
     
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  13. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    I'll come back in a bit. This stood out at me because this is what many on this board is kind of getting at.

    ...but bahai sees Hindu and Bahai source aligned with each other, so we wouldn't need to talk with a Hindu/Bahai.

    A lot of their terms that define their god are in Sanskrit and totally in a language and mythology I don't understand. But I can kind of understand bahai because I'm familiar with abrahamic religions. Since bahai is saying both religions have one god, can you describe the god in which both Hindu and Bahai believe in?
     
  14. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    I think the others are barriers, the definition of hindu god and abrahamic god are sources (they are the foundations to which all barriers on both sides rely); and, since they are so different (diverse?) that it's not really colors of a rainbow. It is a whole other rainbow altogether.

    I know each Hindu (and bahai etc) have different spin on their respective faiths; but, we at least got to give every one a benefit of the doubt when they speak of their own source(s) they are speaking for (and defending) their own beliefs.

    Two Hindus (christian for that matter) don't need to follow the same incarnation to defend their beliefs in similar languages. For example, some christians believe jesus is god and others do not, but they both understand the existence of a creator so they can speak for more than one christian despite their differing perspective "of their own" religions.

    I bought a bible to honor my deceased family. Since I'm not christian, I don't use it for spiritual purposes but I do value that most my family are christian and that I don't need to separate myself from that history while at the same time not following it.

    We can respect each other's scriptures etc, even learn from them, etc., but to say they must have some of my beliefs in the bible because I haven't read all the scriptures (and history etc) based on them...?

    That's a totally different animal there.

    Anyway. The other short post was my main focus.
     
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  15. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    Please quote from Scriptures, where it says Kalki comes 432000 years, or as you calculated 426879 years.
     
  16. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    Yes, Bahai Faith claims it has renewed the Original Truth, that previous Manifestations taught. It claims that the reason Jesus said, He comes again, is to renew and teach the Truth again. Of course, many Christian's may not agree. But did not Bible say, false teachers rise? Or the Buddha, did He not say His teachings will be lost, and someOne else come to restore it again? Or did not Muhammad say, after Him, the Mahdi comes to teach Islam again?
     
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  17. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    I meant that you were only defending Hinduism against misinformation. Did it sound like I was saying that you were slandering the Baha'is? You know that ain't right. That's my job... according to some Baha'is that is. Sorry if that's how it came out.
     
  18. loverofhumanity

    loverofhumanity Well-Known Member
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    For me personally, I feel people here are mostly fair and tolerant and I really appreciate it.
     
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  19. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    If you said that Baha'u'llah has come to bring the truth about God and what God wants... and that all the other religions have it wrong, I think I'd have less disagreements with the Baha'i Faith. But as soon as they throw in "original" teachings, it blows everything. They don't exist.
     
  20. CG Didymus

    CG Didymus Well-Known Member

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    After Baha'is saying that some of us are "anti-Baha'i"... we have a "vendetta" against the Baha'is... we are biased against the Baha'is and so on... you and I think maybe Adrian were the only Baha'is that said that you appreciated the questions. This is a great opportunity for Baha'is. You've got Hindus right here, right now. If the Baha'is can't make friendships with Hindus, what hope is there for Baha'is uniting any of the other religions. I don't think it gets much more tolerant than that.
     
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