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The idea of evil, being the ability to know of both good and evil...

Scarlett Wampus

psychonaut
No I think good is the side God is on, that problem with us trying to be too good is that we will screw it up, which makes both good and bad a curse for us, cause we can't manage either one properly enough to continue on either side. It is our faulty reasoning that prevents this, and this is the reason I say humans as we are, knowing good and evil is part of a broader part of evil.

Also, it is why I say God can exist knowing both good and evil and never do evil, which simply denotes our need to be part of him :shrug:

Knowing good and evil is part of a broader part of evil... That is a strange thing to say.

The more we know about the world the greater our appreciation for how complex & interconnected it is. Consequently our increase in understanding of it comes with an overall loss of certainty.

Applying the above to good & evil, the more we know about good & evil the less certain we our that our actions are ultimately good or evil. Would you agree with this? (and is this the broader evil you speak of?)
 

Just_me_Mike

Well-Known Member
Applying the above to good & evil, the more we know about good & evil the less certain we our that our actions are ultimately good or evil. Would you agree with this? (and is this the broader evil you speak of?)
I am not sure applying an absolute position or even a majority position would be accurate.
I believe that some can posses great amounts of discernment, and manage that knowledge well. Though never perfectly. Then I am sure there are plenty that posses great amounts of the same discernment, but can't manage their life to reflect what they know to be true.
So, your assertion might fail under the greater complexities of the matter. Still it is an interesting notion to contemplate, and if true, yes it would seem to be part of the broader part of evil.
 
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Scarlett Wampus

psychonaut
Well, JmM, I am speaking from my experience so what I spoke of was my position. It might be a minority position too, but I'd like to suggest that lacking certainty about the goodness or evilness of one's actions does not change the capacity to act in accordance with personal discernment. For example, I act as true to my judgment as I ever did, I am just less certain nowadays that I am always right. ;)
 

Just_me_Mike

Well-Known Member
Well, JmM, I am speaking from my experience so what I spoke of was my position. It might be a minority position too, but I'd like to suggest that lacking certainty about the goodness or evilness of one's actions does not change the capacity to act in accordance with personal discernment. For example, I act as true to my judgment as I ever did, I am just less certain nowadays that I am always right. ;)
I agree with the above...

More comments on the following:
The more we know about the world the greater our appreciation for how complex & interconnected it is.
Agreed.
Consequently our increase in understanding of it comes with an overall loss of certainty.
Why?

Applying the above to good & evil, the more we know about good & evil the less certain we our that our actions are ultimately good or evil.
Why would this be the case?
Would you agree with this? (and is this the broader evil you speak of?)
Not sure yet... Please answer the above...
 

Scarlett Wampus

psychonaut
Why would an increase in understanding of the world lead to an overall loss of certainties? Because the world becomes much BIGGER than we previously thought - the horizons stretching out further and further beyond our grasp.

In relation to the goodness of our actions, seeing greater complexity & interconnectedness makes it harder to be certain of the consequences of what we do. At least, that's my experience. Righteous pride has given way to best guesses.
 

Just_me_Mike

Well-Known Member
Why would an increase in understanding of the world lead to an overall loss of certainties? Because the world becomes much BIGGER than we previously thought - the horizons stretching out further and further beyond our grasp.
Can you do me a favor.
Try for a moment to counter your position on said topic.
Is there no argument that the more we know about this huge expanse and complex system the easier it is to understand things in a way we never have before.

I understand your experience says otherwise, but if you had to argue the other side for assignment sake, what might you say?
 

Scarlett Wampus

psychonaut
Is there no argument that the more we know about this huge expanse and complex system the easier it is to understand things in a way we never have before.
Oh yes, we could learn a remarkable amount - understand much that was previously confusing & obscure such that we could be truly illuminated relative to our previous awareness of how things are.

Only, the history of human discovery has so far been unrelenting in then unfolding even larger & more complex layers of reality. For argument's sake I could drop this last point and I will if you want because I'm curious as to what you might suggest next.
 

Valor

Active Member
See, evil requires an imagination. Without this, it would fizzle. It is fueled by imagination and is promoted by imagination. Evil requires a conscious mind to initiate. So before we begin, which im a bit to late for, we must acknowledge that without the human mind, evil can't exist.
 

tigrers99

Member
The Bible teaches that moral evil is the result of going against God's nature. This would involve even one's thought process. If this supernatural being (what Webster's dictionary calls evil- cosmic evil force... Evil) called Satan did not exist, humanity would function as it should not as it does. We would behave as we have been properly trained to behave. If we objectively study our history, we can only conclude that we are being influenced by something without...not from within. Ultimately, it is not our imagination that causes our downfall, it is what starts, guides, and fuels the imagination. The New Testament word for carnal in it's original language is (sarkikos) which means animal nature . Animals can be trained extremely well. But if there is an outside force influencing it, it can never be counted on to be properly trained. So it is with humanity. It does not do what it 'ought' to do, and does what it 'ought not' do.
 
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