The Four Horsemen

[nPeace]

Who hasn't heard of the four horsemen of the apocalypse?

Spoiler: Revelation 6:1-8

(Revelation 6:1-8) 1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder: “Come!” 2 And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest. 3 When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say: “Come!” 4 Another came out, a fiery-colored horse, and it was granted to the one seated on it to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another, and he was given a great sword. 5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say: “Come!” And I saw, and look! a black horse, and the one seated on it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 I heard what sounded like a voice in the midst of the four living creatures say: “A quart of wheat for a denarius and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the olive oil and the wine.” 7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say: “Come!” 8 And I saw, and look! a pale horse, and the one seated on it had the name Death. And the Grave was closely following him. And authority was given them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with a long sword and with food shortage and with deadly plague and by the wild beasts of the earth.

Of course the book of Revelation is written in signs, or symbolic language, so even though we don't actually see these horsemen riding literally, can we not agree that they are indeed riding?

Can we see evidence of the white horse riding?

According to the Bible, he is the first rider - the one who went forth, first - to be followed after, by the riders of the red, pale and black horse.
So that alone is evidence that the rider of the white horse has been given a crown, and a bow, and he is riding toward his goal of conquest.

Christians believe that this rider represent Jesus as crowned king of God's kingdom, riding forth to complete his conquest as mentioned in Daniel 2:44, 45
This evidence shows that Christ has begun ruling, as promised, and agrees with the signs he told his followers to look for. Matthew 24

The rider of the red horse, is given a large sword, with which to take away peace from the earth. Seems evident to Christians, that this has occured since 1914, starting with the great war.

Since WWI - the great war, involving the whole world, there has been no peace. The world is again on the brink of another major war.
What can we expect from that?
Already there is talk of rising prices on primary necessities.
Which means move food shortages, and diseases and death.
The riders of the pale horse, and the black horse fittingly describe these world events.

The pandemic, which we are still facing, was/is like a plague of death, from pestilence.

This to me is like clear evidence, of fulfillment of one of the end-time prophecies.
Who does not agree, and why not?

 

[viole]

This to me is like clear evidence, of fulfillment of one of the end-time prophecies.

Do you think those things happened today for the first time in history?

Ciao

- viole

 

[danieldemol]

.
Christians believe that this rider represent Jesus as crowned king of God's kingdom, riding forth to complete his conquest as mentioned in Daniel 2:44, 45...
...
Who does not agree, and why not?

If Jesus, Putin, Trump or any other theocratic tyrant want to conquest us they can shove it/take turns buggering each other.

In my opinion.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Who hasn't heard of the four horsemen of the apocalypse?

Spoiler: Revelation 6:1-8

(Revelation 6:1-8) 1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder: “Come!” 2 And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest. 3 When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say: “Come!” 4 Another came out, a fiery-colored horse, and it was granted to the one seated on it to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another, and he was given a great sword. 5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say: “Come!” And I saw, and look! a black horse, and the one seated on it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 I heard what sounded like a voice in the midst of the four living creatures say: “A quart of wheat for a denarius and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the olive oil and the wine.” 7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say: “Come!” 8 And I saw, and look! a pale horse, and the one seated on it had the name Death. And the Grave was closely following him. And authority was given them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with a long sword and with food shortage and with deadly plague and by the wild beasts of the earth.

Of course the book of Revelation is written in signs, or symbolic language, so even though we don't actually see these horsemen riding literally, can we not agree that they are indeed riding?

Can we see evidence of the white horse riding?

According to the Bible, he is the first rider - the one who went forth, first - to be followed after, by the riders of the red, pale and black horse.
So that alone is evidence that the rider of the white horse has been given a crown, and a bow, and he is riding toward his goal of conquest.

Christians believe that this rider represent Jesus as crowned king of God's kingdom, riding forth to complete his conquest as mentioned in Daniel 2:44, 45
This evidence shows that Christ has begun ruling, as promised, and agrees with the signs he told his followers to look for. Matthew 24

The rider of the red horse, is given a large sword, with which to take away peace from the earth. Seems evident to Christians, that this has occured since 1914, starting with the great war.

Since WWI - the great war, involving the whole world, there has been no peace. The world is again on the brink of another major war.
What can we expect from that?
Already there is talk of rising prices on primary necessities.
Which means move food shortages, and diseases and death.
The riders of the pale horse, and the black horse fittingly describe these world events.

The pandemic, which we are still facing, was/is like a plague of death, from pestilence.

This to me is like clear evidence, of fulfillment of one of the end-time prophecies.
Who does not agree, and why not?

Another war, another christian claiming it's a sign of the end times.
This has been going on for 2000 years now.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Do you think those things happened today for the first time in history?........

I find Revelation 6:8 ties in with what Jesus instructed to complete at Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8.
Never before in history have we seen Luke 21:11 on such a global international scale as with Revelation 6:8.
Modern technology has now made possible to reach people living even in remote areas with the 'good news' message about God's kingdom (Daniel 2:44) as it is now being done on such a vast earth-wide scale.
Thus, we are nearing the ' final phase ' of what Jesus instructed to do at Matthew 24:14.
This means we are nearing the ' final signal ', so to speak, found at 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3
When the powers in charge will be saying, " Peace and Security...." prior to the outbreak of the great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9 before we will see divine involvement into mankind's affairs by Jesus as found at Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-15.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Another war, another christian claiming it's a sign of the end times. This has been going on for 2000 years now.

No, Not just another war (please see Revelation 6:8) but combined with Luke 21:11 and coupled with what Jesus said would be accomplished on a vast international scale as is now being done today as never before in history.
The good news of God's kingdom government is now proclaimed internationally just as Jesus said - Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8

 

[URAVIP2ME]

If Jesus, Putin, Trump or any other theocratic tyrant want to conquest us they can shove it/take turns buggering each other. In my opinion.

I think we need to keep in mind there is a BIG difference in biblical theocracy and the theocratic tyrant (aka clergy class) such as was by the Ayatollah Khomeini.
In other words, the 'modern' definition of theocracy is: rule or to govern by clergy or clergy class.
Whereas, biblical theocracy is God's kingdom of a thousand years in the hands of Christ Jesus -1 Corinthians 15:24-26.
While on Earth, the powerful works Jesus performed were for the good of humanity.
Jesus demonstrated on a small scale what he will be doing for humanity on a grand-global scale.
Can anyone point to any tyrant thing Jesus did ____________

 

[Sheldon]

The claims quoted in the OP are vague and predictions of war are obviously not worth treating with any credulity, since wars always happen and always have happened. the subjective interpretations are also pretty meaningless, as they don't represent anything more than subjective opinion.

Putin is an just another in a long line of autocrats. One might think that after years of decrying atheism as evil because of the cold war, that the fact Russia is now being run a far right Christian dictator, who is behaving just as appallingly, might give some people some pause, and the sense to realise that autocracy and totalitarianism are what is evil. Rather than rushing to seek to fulfil fanciful revelations that could fit any number of conflicts throughout history.

I hope the world finally wakes up now and realises, albeit a little late, to just how much of a threat Putin is to the free world. Sadly having enabled his autocracy for over two decades, and ignored the plight of ordinary Russians, we are now going to pay a heavy price, but we must deal with him, and not with the kind of grubby financial dealings that so many in the west have benefitted from to their shame, like Trump, who was bragging him up to the west just a couple of years ago.

 

[danieldemol]

I think we need to keep in mind there is a BIG difference in biblical theocracy and the theocratic tyrant (aka clergy class) such as was by the Ayatollah Khomeini.
In other words, the 'modern' definition of theocracy is: rule or to govern by clergy or clergy class.

Jesus killing off those who dont follow His religion certainly fits any non overly specified to the point of strawman definition of theocracy.

In fact who the clergy allegedly belong to is irrelevant to your definition, so since Jesus is not seen as God in your religion He is presumably just (allegedly) a member of God's clergy, in which case He fits the modern definition of theocracy as presented by you (without citation i might add) like a hand in a glove.

Can anyone point to any tyrant thing Jesus did ____________

You mean aside from drowning a herd of innocent pigs in a river (asphyxiation is no easy death)?

Besides that its a lame argument, you are essentially arguing its ok for Jesus to do tyrannical things like kill all those who dont believe in Him the second time round just because He allegedly didn't do anything tyrannical the first time around.

Its like saying ask me to dinner twice, I'll be polite and the perfect guest the first time round but I'm not a tyrant even though I'll kill all your family members who refuse to follow my religion the second time round because I was good the first time.

Doesn't make sense.

In my opinion.

 

[CG Didymus]

Who hasn't heard of the four horsemen of the apocalypse?

Spoiler: Revelation 6:1-8

(Revelation 6:1-8) 1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder: “Come!” 2 And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest. 3 When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say: “Come!” 4 Another came out, a fiery-colored horse, and it was granted to the one seated on it to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another, and he was given a great sword. 5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say: “Come!” And I saw, and look! a black horse, and the one seated on it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 I heard what sounded like a voice in the midst of the four living creatures say: “A quart of wheat for a denarius and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the olive oil and the wine.” 7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say: “Come!” 8 And I saw, and look! a pale horse, and the one seated on it had the name Death. And the Grave was closely following him. And authority was given them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with a long sword and with food shortage and with deadly plague and by the wild beasts of the earth.

Of course the book of Revelation is written in signs, or symbolic language, so even though we don't actually see these horsemen riding literally, can we not agree that they are indeed riding?

Can we see evidence of the white horse riding?

According to the Bible, he is the first rider - the one who went forth, first - to be followed after, by the riders of the red, pale and black horse.
So that alone is evidence that the rider of the white horse has been given a crown, and a bow, and he is riding toward his goal of conquest.

Christians believe that this rider represent Jesus as crowned king of God's kingdom, riding forth to complete his conquest as mentioned in Daniel 2:44, 45
This evidence shows that Christ has begun ruling, as promised, and agrees with the signs he told his followers to look for. Matthew 24

The rider of the red horse, is given a large sword, with which to take away peace from the earth. Seems evident to Christians, that this has occured since 1914, starting with the great war.

Since WWI - the great war, involving the whole world, there has been no peace. The world is again on the brink of another major war.
What can we expect from that?
Already there is talk of rising prices on primary necessities.
Which means move food shortages, and diseases and death.
The riders of the pale horse, and the black horse fittingly describe these world events.

The pandemic, which we are still facing, was/is like a plague of death, from pestilence.

This to me is like clear evidence, of fulfillment of one of the end-time prophecies.
Who does not agree, and why not?

I hope one of the Baha'is has the courage to stand up for their prophet. He claimed he was the return of Christ, and Baha'is say that he has fulfilled all the prophecies. Including what it says in Revelation, that he will come with a new name, and come in the "Glory" of the Father, and that he is the third "Woe" in Revelation 8:13. And that was more than 150 years ago.

But I'm sure you don't believe that. But then who was he, and how does he fit into Revelation? Either way, it just shows that Revelation can be made to say anything and prove anything you want it to.

 

[savagewind]

Who hasn't heard of the four horsemen of the apocalypse?

Spoiler: Revelation 6:1-8

(Revelation 6:1-8) 1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seven seals, and I heard one of the four living creatures say with a voice like thunder: “Come!” 2 And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him, and he went out conquering and to complete his conquest. 3 When he opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say: “Come!” 4 Another came out, a fiery-colored horse, and it was granted to the one seated on it to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another, and he was given a great sword. 5 When he opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say: “Come!” And I saw, and look! a black horse, and the one seated on it had a pair of scales in his hand. 6 I heard what sounded like a voice in the midst of the four living creatures say: “A quart of wheat for a denarius and three quarts of barley for a denarius; and do not harm the olive oil and the wine.” 7 When he opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say: “Come!” 8 And I saw, and look! a pale horse, and the one seated on it had the name Death. And the Grave was closely following him. And authority was given them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with a long sword and with food shortage and with deadly plague and by the wild beasts of the earth.

Of course the book of Revelation is written in signs, or symbolic language, so even though we don't actually see these horsemen riding literally, can we not agree that they are indeed riding?

Can we see evidence of the white horse riding?

According to the Bible, he is the first rider - the one who went forth, first - to be followed after, by the riders of the red, pale and black horse.
So that alone is evidence that the rider of the white horse has been given a crown, and a bow, and he is riding toward his goal of conquest.

Christians believe that this rider represent Jesus as crowned king of God's kingdom, riding forth to complete his conquest as mentioned in Daniel 2:44, 45
This evidence shows that Christ has begun ruling, as promised, and agrees with the signs he told his followers to look for. Matthew 24

The rider of the red horse, is given a large sword, with which to take away peace from the earth. Seems evident to Christians, that this has occured since 1914, starting with the great war.

Since WWI - the great war, involving the whole world, there has been no peace. The world is again on the brink of another major war.
What can we expect from that?
Already there is talk of rising prices on primary necessities.
Which means move food shortages, and diseases and death.
The riders of the pale horse, and the black horse fittingly describe these world events.

The pandemic, which we are still facing, was/is like a plague of death, from pestilence.

This to me is like clear evidence, of fulfillment of one of the end-time prophecies.
Who does not agree, and why not?

Riding just means going somewhere. Fact!

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Jesus killing off those who dont follow His religion certainly fits any non overly specified to the point of strawman definition of theocracy.
In fact who the clergy allegedly belong to is irrelevant to your definition, so since Jesus is not seen as God in your religion He is presumably just (allegedly) a member of God's clergy, in which case He fits the modern definition of theocracy as presented by you (without citation i might add) like a hand in a glove.
You mean aside from drowning a herd of innocent pigs in a river (asphyxiation is no easy death)?
Besides that its a lame argument, you are essentially arguing its ok for Jesus to do tyrannical things like kill all those who dont believe in Him the second time round just because He allegedly didn't do anything tyrannical the first time around.
Its like saying ask me to dinner twice, I'll be polite and the perfect guest the first time round but I'm not a tyrant even though I'll kill all your family members who refuse to follow my religion the second time round because I was good the first time. Doesn't make sense. In my opinion.

Would it make sense to have violent people kill off all the righteous people _____________
( Besides other damage, lots of tire slashings in our area, No one yet caught )
Jesus nor his 1st-century followers killed people. Nor did Jesus teach that anyone should live by the sword.
False clergy have used the pulpit as a recruiting station so parents would sacrifice their young on the Altar of War as if that is the same thing as the Altar of God which it is Not.
Their pulpit was for the political purpose and Not for Jesus.

Since the Jews did Not eat pork, does make one wonder why a Jew would be a pig farmer.
Please notice at Isaiah 11:3-4 it is the ' sword-like words ' from Jesus' mouth that will rid the earth of wicked/violent people - Revelation 19:14-15. In other words their end will be swift.

As far as family members: Remember: Rahab
Because of her actions Rahab saved (delivered/rescued) not only herself but also her family !

To me what would Not make sense would be to let the wicked/violent outnumber upright people.
Man's history has proven that man (Not God) has dominated man to man's hurt, man's injury.
This is why God is going to have Jesus step in to rid the Earth of wicked people. - 2 Peter 3:9

 

[nPeace]

Do you think those things happened today for the first time in history?

Ciao

- viole

When your mom sent you to school, and she told you to catch the school bus, did you think it was the only bus passing your home?

 

[nPeace]

Another war, another christian claiming it's a sign of the end times.
This has been going on for 2000 years now.

The sign was seen from 1914, not this war.
This war along with all the others that have been (since the great war), or ever will be, is only an ongoing process, until the finale.
Things continue to advance from bad to worst.
However, the time will come when there will be calm before the storm, according to 1 Thessalonians 5:3

 

[nPeace]

I find Revelation 6:8 ties in with what Jesus instructed to complete at Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8.
Never before in history have we seen Luke 21:11 on such a global international scale as with Revelation 6:8.
Modern technology has now made possible to reach people living even in remote areas with the 'good news' message about God's kingdom (Daniel 2:44) as it is now being done on such a vast earth-wide scale.
Thus, we are nearing the ' final phase ' of what Jesus instructed to do at Matthew 24:14.
This means we are nearing the ' final signal ', so to speak, found at 1 Thessalonians 5:2-3
When the powers in charge will be saying, " Peace and Security...." prior to the outbreak of the great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9 before we will see divine involvement into mankind's affairs by Jesus as found at Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-15.

That's a very good point URAVIP2ME.
The global preaching work, is actually part of the sign - never has it been seen before. Like the great war, and pestilences, on a scale never seen before. Earthquakes, like never seen before... etc.
Midwestern States Are Having Big Earthquakes Like Never Before
... now Greff does worry about earthquakes. He's felt dozens in the last four years. "An earthquake sounds like a sonic boom," he told BuzzFeed News. "There's a noise and then a crumpling sound. You think something hit your house."

Oklahoma is not alone. A slew of unexpected earthquakes in the heartland — in Oklahoma, Texas, Kansas, and Arkansas, in particular — has triggered calls from state and federal scientists to quiet the rumbles, collateral damage from the U.S. boom in unconventional oil drilling.

The jump in quake numbers in Oklahoma is particularly stark.

 

[nPeace]

I hope one of the Baha'is has the courage to stand up for their prophet. He claimed he was the return of Christ, and Baha'is say that he has fulfilled all the prophecies. Including what it says in Revelation, that he will come with a new name, and come in the "Glory" of the Father, and that he is the third "Woe" in Revelation 8:13. And that was more than 150 years ago.

But I'm sure you don't believe that. But then who was he, and how does he fit into Revelation? Either way, it just shows that Revelation can be made to say anything and prove anything you want it to.

I was going to say I am sure you know that is not true, but considering that so many seem to be fooling themselves, I would say, I don't believe you are aware of the faulty reasoning you present here.

One can make claims, as we are all aware, but there are always ways to determine if those claims are true. It's no different where the Bible is concerned.
The Bible is harmonious, just as they describe String Theory and the Dance of Creation.

Everything must therefore harmonize with the string, running through the Bible from Genesis to Revelation.
If any cord is out of sync, the string does not harmonize, and the dance is just a disater waiting to happen.

So, you haven't shown anything you claim, only that you have a very foggy view, about the Bible, which doesn't help you much, sadly.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

The sign was seen from 1914, not this war.
This war along with all the others that have been (since the great war), or ever will be, is only an ongoing process, until the finale.
Things continue to advance from bad to worst.
However, the time will come when there will be calm before the storm, according to 1 Thessalonians 5:3

Sure it is.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

No, Not just another war (please see Revelation 6:8) but combined with Luke 21:11 and coupled with what Jesus said would be accomplished on a vast international scale as is now being done today as never before in history.
The good news of God's kingdom government is now proclaimed internationally just as Jesus said - Matthew 24:14; Acts 1:8

Translation: Yeah but THIS time it is different! THIS time it is REALLY the end!

Yawn.

 

[Left Coast]

@Trailblazer @loverofhumanity @InvestigateTruth I'd be fascinated to hear your thoughts here.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Translation: Yeah but THIS time it is different! THIS time it is REALLY the end! Yawn.

No, Not Yawn, but Wake Up Be Alert ! ( or as I have heard the world needs more Lerts )
Jesus was forewarning us at Luke 21:11 & Revelation 6:8 so that we would be forearmed.
Luke 21:11 also ties in with Jeremiah 15:2-3; Ezekiel 14:21; Ezekiel 22:27.
Before the world wars there were No world wars. Wars caused food shortages.
The Spanish Flu killed millions (1out of 3) then the millions dead from small pox.
Lives now cut short by AIDS/HIV/STD's and TB besides COVID-19 and add Cancer to the mix.
Premature death, un-timely death due to the above, and by the growing violent use of weapons.
Brand new technology and antibotics (supposed to be miracle drugs) are now No match for super organisms.
Never before in history have we seen the above coupled along with the international declaring about God's Kingdom (Daniel 2:44) reached such a world-wide scale just as Jesus said it would be done, is now being done - Matthew 24:14.
Modern technology has made possible rapid Bible translation even in earth's remote areas, so people in those remote areas can now have Scripture in their own mother tongue or native languages as never before in history.
So, yes the now international time it is different !
When the powers in charge (1 Thessalonians 5:2-3) are saying, " Peace and Security...." this 'rosy' saying is really the 'final signal' so to speak, before the outbreak of the great tribulation of Revelation 7:14,9.
When we heed what Jesus said we can come through the great tribulation and be here to see calendar Day One of Jesus governing over Earth for a thousand years.
This is why we are all invited to pray to God for Jesus to come ! - Rev. 22:20
Come and undo all the damage Satan and Adam brought upon humanity - Revelation 22:2