The Exclusivity of Christianity: Myth or Reality

[Muffled]

How do you know that it's not the other way around?

One person's "reality" is another person's "nonsense". In the arena of religion, one cannot categorically prove another person wrong, nor can they categorically prove themselves right. Beliefs are just beliefs-- not absolute facts.

I believe there are two reasons 1. I am well exercised and knowledgible in the rules of logic 2. I have the mind of Christ.

I believe this is impossible. It is like saying black can be white or one can be two.

I believe in general that is true but in particular proofs can be made based on the evidence. What perhaps is harder to ascertain is the validity of the evidence.

I believe if that were so there would be no facts. I believe one plus one equals two. My belief is a fact not just a belief.

 

[Dawnofhope]

It depends on what you mean by exclusive. Job was not a Jewish person, Melchizedek was not, God may work many and surprising ways

By exclusive I mean only the Faithful believers in Christ going to heaven and everyone else going to hell.

Another key biblical figure was Cyrus the great, the Persian King who ordered the rebuild of the Jewish temple and Jerusalem. Isaiah referred to him as the anointed one of God. Yet he was not a Jew, and some scholars would argue he was Zoroastrian. Would he be saved according to your Christian theology?

But the Bible does speak of people being saved if and only if they have their names in the lamb's book of life and are in the new Jerusalem if they had their robes washed in the blood of the lamb

The book of Revelation is of course highly symbolic and has the focus of much wild speculation. There is much metaphor around the events described and unless you want to believe that a new city called Jerusalem literally descends from heaven, I would be a little cautious about how to interpret the lamb's (presumably the returned Christ) book of life.

 

[crowfeather]

Some Christians belief that there is only one way to God and that is through Jesus.
This could mean only Christians make it to heaven and people of all other faiths are destined for hell.
One of the most commonly quoted passages from the bible to justify this view is: John 14:6
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."
What's the best way of looking at this passage?
Is their reasonable justification for Christians' claims that only their faith can save? Is there a better way of understanding salvation?

Jesus, as an enlightened being, was not speaking from his human identity. He did not mean himself as being the only way.
The enlightened being discovers what God is, and that he has become God, being One with God. Which the human mind rejects as crazy.

The religious put aside their rejection of this, and consider: "What-if?"
By achieving what Jesus had achieved, through enlightenment, others might achieve, too. This was his message.
Unfortunately, it was no more likely then, than it is now.

Enlightenment is for the vanishingly few.
The rest either become inspired by it, or reject it completely.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Jesus, as an enlightened being, was not speaking from his human identity. He did not mean himself as being the only way.
The enlightened being discovers what God is, and that he has become God, being One with God. Which the human mind rejects as crazy.

The religious put aside their rejection of this, and consider: "What-if?"
By achieving what Jesus had achieved, through enlightenment, others might achieve, too. This was his message.
Unfortunately, it was no more likely then, than it is now.

Enlightenment is for the vanishingly few.
The rest either become inspired by it, or reject it completely.

I like your perspective here because it is considering a deeper spiritual reality of both the words Jesus used, but also His spiritual reality.

 

[Dawnofhope]

I believe Christianity is best suited for these end times which is why we didn't get it sooner. I believe Baha'ism is just as archaic as Judaism and Islam. I believe most people have trouble telling their left hand from their right. Not only that they believe their nonsense makes sense.

Which religion is the most archaic? Christianity or the Baha'i Faith?

Baha'i principles:

One God
Oneness of humanity
Oneness of religion
Abolition of extremes of wealth and poverty
Universal compulsory education
Democracy
Equality of men and women
Abolition of slavery
Promotion of peace and tolerance
Universal axillary language
International government

Your turn to list the Christian principles:

Oh well then KYAGB because you don't qualify.

What is KYAGB and what are the criteria for who qualifies?

 

[wizanda]

What's the best way of looking at this passage?

As a fabrication, that sounds nothing like Yeshua, written by the Sanhedrin of what they thought he was sounding like.

Is their reasonable justification for Christians' claims that only their faith can save?

Not in the slightest, Christians are the Anti-Christ directly contradicting Yeshua by following John, Paul, and Simon; proving they're hypocrites, and that they don't follow Yeshua's teachings.

Is there a better way of understanding salvation?

Yes, Yeshua's name mean salvation, and there is a massive tapestry of prophecy, that when understood properly reveals how we will receive salvation...

Yet for the right reasons by our discernment, for acceptance of moral standards, and by actually showing we've spent the time to understand Yeshua's teachings.

 

[whirlingmerc]

Romans also says 'in Adam all [mankind] die and in Christ all [ believers] shall be made alive"
which sounds kinda exclusive to me

The end of the sermon on the mount Jesus is seated at judgement and the issue for the
lost if 'I never knew you' Exclusive? In a sense yes

 

[Muffled]

Which religion is the most archaic? Christianity or the Baha'i Faith?

Baha'i principles:

One God
Oneness of humanity
Oneness of religion
Abolition of extremes of wealth and poverty
Universal compulsory education
Democracy
Equality of men and women
Abolition of slavery
Promotion of peace and tolerance
Universal axillary language
International government

Your turn to list the Christian principles:



What is KYAGB and what are the criteria for who qualifies?

I believe it is Baha'i. Christianity is always contemporary.

I believe it is absence of sin. (it is the only one that counts)

Kiss your a** goodbye. I believe in order to get into the Kingdom of God one must be without sin and that can only happen if Jesus is Lord and Savior.

 

[allfoak]

Some Christians belief that there is only one way to God and that is through Jesus.

This could mean only Christians make it to heaven and people of all other faiths are destined for hell.

One of the most commonly quoted passages from the bible to justify this view is: John 14:6

"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

What's the best way of looking at this passage?

Is their reasonable justification for Christians' claims that only their faith can save? Is there a better way of understanding salvation?

Who is this Jesus of whom we speak?
Is it possible that Jesus could be the center of all faiths?
Make a list of all of the things that Jesus is and we could be describing the God of many religions.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Who is this Jesus of whom we speak?

Jesus of Nazreth.

Is it possible that Jesus could be the center of all faiths?

The God that inspired Jesus could have been. Jesus Himself? How would that work? You could argue that Jesus was the return of all the Great Founders of religion before Him and that the Founders after Jesus were His return. There would be some biblical evidence to support that, given that John the Baptist was the return of the OT prophet Elijah.

Make a list of all of the things that Jesus is and we could be describing the God of many religions.

You are assuming that Jesus and God are one and the same. There are problems with that theology and that's another discussion to be had.

 

[Dawnofhope]

I believe it is absence of sin. (it is the only one that counts)

Arguing that Jesus was without sin is one thing, and it is an assumption as we know little of His early life. There is no evidence to support that the followers of Christ are any better or worse that people of other faiths, let alone without sin.

Kiss your a** goodbye. I believe in order to get into the Kingdom of God one must be without sin and that can only happen if Jesus is Lord and Savior.

KYAGB ? That's what I thought you meant.

So how will Christians get into the Kingdom of God, as they are sinners along with the rest of us?

 

[Muffled]

Arguing that Jesus was without sin is one thing, and it is an assumption as we know little of His early life. There is no evidence to support that the followers of Christ are any better or worse that people of other faiths, let alone without sin.



KYAGB ? That's what I thought you meant.

So how will Christians get into the Kingdom of God, as they are sinners along with the rest of us?

I believe I am the evidence of it. And that is even before the concept of no attributed sin. Most Christians that are born again fall under the latter category. Nominal Christians are most likely sinners. It is easy to lump everyone together or to reason from one particular case to the whole (a fallacy) but it is not the rational approach.

I believe it is a Biblical statement.

I believe there are two basic requirements: 1. Believe that all your sins are washed away by the blood of Jesus and from His end attribution of no sin to the person who believes it. 2. Have a personal relationship with Jesus by receiving Him as Lord and Savior.

 

[RESOLUTION]

Some Christians belief that there is only one way to God and that is through Jesus.

This could mean only Christians make it to heaven and people of all other faiths are destined for hell.

One of the most commonly quoted passages from the bible to justify this view is: John 14:6

"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

What's the best way of looking at this passage?

Is their reasonable justification for Christians' claims that only their faith can save? Is there a better way of understanding salvation?

I am not sure where you get that belief from. You see you could obey the whole of the law of Moses.
It is believed by the Jews that anyone who does what God declares to be right is acceptable to God.
Christ's way for man to come to God has been seen by God using a man like Moses to bring them to know him by doing his will.
Abraham, God accepted as righteous because he believed him. We had to have high priest to perform sacrifices for the peoples sins.
Because thought they had the law they broke it.
Christ became both the sacrifice and the high priest who entered the Holy Place once and for all, so no further sacrifices needed.
Man can believe in Christ dying and their sins forgiven.


Christians are not saying that only their way can save. Never have done.
What Christ is saying is that instead of man having to trust in just obeying the law and the high priest making the sacrifices that God has taken away the sin and those who want to know
him and love and serve him by accepting Christs sacrifice for forgiveness of sins and also the baptism of the Spirit which enables the person to live the life God has for them.
The Jewish Faith eliminates all religions and gods but YHWH and declares that the only way to know God is to obey him. People are destined for hell because of their sin regardless of
their religion. The Jews knew that God had promised a New Covenant as mentioned in Jeremiah 31:31-34

Jeremiah 31:31-34
31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


God isn't just saying believe in Jesus and sins forgiven. He is saying he has given them a New Covenant unlike the old one. A covenant where people who come to him won't have to question the right or wrongs of it, because they will know the truth because they will have the law in their inward parts written in their hearts. Love God and Love your neighbour.
It is wrong to look at faith in Christ as being about exclusion. When in truth is includes everyone and anyone who choses to believe it.
If the religion does not do as it says on the tin, then there is really no use in that religion. God includes only man excludes.

 

[omega2xx]

I believe there are two reasons 1. I am well exercised and knowledgible in the rules of logic 2. I have the mind of Christ.

I believe this is impossible. It is like saying black can be white or one can be two.

I believe in general that is true but in particular proofs can be made based on the evidence. What perhaps is harder to ascertain is the validity of the evidence.

I believe if that were so there would be no facts. I believe one plus one equals two. My belief is a fact not just a belief.

Let me quibble a bit---You don't believe 1 +1 = 2, you know it does.

 

[omega2xx]

Arguing that Jesus was without sin is one thing, and it is an assumption as we know little of His early life. There is no evidence to support that the followers of Christ are any better or worse that people of other faiths, let alone without sin.



KYAGB ? That's what I thought you meant.

So how will Christians get into the Kingdom of God, as they are sinners along with the rest of us?

WE don't get into heaven by what we do, we get into heaven by what we believe.


Cynicism and skepticism are the crudest form of quasi-intellectualism... Let the cynic become cynical of his cynicism and the skeptic skeptical of his skepticism and join the battle. R.C. Sproul

 

[omega2xx]

I believe I am the evidence of it. And that is even before the concept of no attributed sin. Most Christians that are born again fall under the latter category. Nominal Christians are most likely sinners. It is easy to lump everyone together or to reason from one particular case to the whole (a fallacy) but it is not the rational approach.

I believe it is a Biblical statement.

I believe there are two basic requirements: 1. Believe that all your sins are washed away by the blood of Jesus and from His end attribution of no sin to the person who believes it. 2. Have a personal relationship with Jesus by receiving Him as Lord and Savior.

This must be my day for quibbling, but only # 2 is necessary. When we accept Jesus our sins are washed away by the washing of regeneration and the renewing of the Holy Spirit---Titus 3:5)

After our conversion, we must confess our sins.

 

[omega2xx]

Some Christians belief that there is only one way to God and that is through Jesus.

This could mean only Christians make it to heaven and people of all other faiths are destined for hell.

One of the most commonly quoted passages from the bible to justify this view is: John 14:6

"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

What's the best way of looking at this passage?

Take it for what it says.

Is their reasonable justification for Christians' claims that only their faith can save? Is there a better way of understanding salvation?

Actually it is not our faith that saves us, it is God's grace---Eph 2:8.

Cynicism and skepticism are the crudest form of quasi-intellectualism... Let the cynic become cynical of his cynicism and the skeptic skeptical of his skepticism and join the battle. R.C. Sproul

 

[RESOLUTION]

Let me quibble a bit---You don't believe 1 +1 = 2, you know it does.

Well explain how the two become one?

2 = 1.

 

[omega2xx]

Well explain how the two become one?

2 = 1.

One in spirit

 

[moorea944]

WE don't get into heaven by what we do, we get into heaven by what we believe.


Cynicism and skepticism are the crudest form of quasi-intellectualism... Let the cynic become cynical of his cynicism and the skeptic skeptical of his skepticism and join the battle. R.C. Sproul

What makes you think that when someone dies they go to heaven? Never understand that one... Is there a verse that says, "when you die you go to heaven"? Then you must believe in an immortal soul?

I'm trying to look at Jesus's life and what he taught. Don't see heaven going there at all. What I do see is, waiting for the resurrection. Just curious.......